Law of Moses Dissected: Extracting the Moral Law

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Sep 4, 2012
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#21
How many times does the NT say that no liar will inherit eternal life/see the kingdom of heaven ???

Look it up and you will see it as well as others are still stated in the NT including in Revelation, and that of being a liar is the 9th commandment.
Your threatenings and accusations don't bother me because I know that they are simply a response to your not being able to refute that THE MORAL LAW is a man-made contrivance.
 
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KennethC

Guest
#22
The law can't be divided, as James said if you fail to keep one point you have broken all.
We have died with Christ (who are in Christ) to that system and are under the New Covenant...an unconditional one.
James is talking about the Perfect law of liberty through Christ, not the Mosaic written ordinances.

James 1:25 confirms this !!!
 
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KennethC

Guest
#23
Your threatenings and accusations don't bother me because I know that they are simply a response to your not being able to refute that THE MORAL LAW is a man-made contrivance.
What threat and accusation are you talking about, I asked you a question ???

Asking questions is not threatening or accusing so to try and spin this around to me do something I didn't do is an unedifying attitude. Please refrain from doing this please and keep it respectful !!!
 
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KennethC

Guest
#24
I hear people error by interpreting Ephesians 2:8,9 like this - saved by grace through faith "and good works" just not works of the law. Faith is faith and works are works and we cannot dissect good works from the moral aspect of the law and then teach we are saved by "these" works, just not "those" works.
Nobody is saying a person is saved from good works !!!
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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#25
James is talking about the Perfect law of liberty through Christ, not the Mosaic written ordinances.

James 1:25 confirms this !!!
You are so far off course it isn't funny. James is contrasting the law of liberty (the way we should conduct ourselves) with the Mosaic...

James 2:9-12 (KJV)
9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
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#26
Nobody is saying a person is saved from good works !!!
Saved "from" good works? I've heard plenty of people "add" certain works to salvation through faith and imply that we are saved by these good works, but just not by works of the law. We are saved FOR good works and not by good works (Ephesians 2:8-10).
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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#27
Saved "from" good works? I've heard plenty of people "add" certain works to salvation through faith and imply that we are saved by these good works, but just not by works of the law. We are saved FOR good works and not by good works (Ephesians 2:8-10).
And especially FROM good works :)
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#28
I hear people error by interpreting Ephesians 2:8,9 like this - saved by grace through faith "and good works" just not works of the law. Faith is faith and works are works and we cannot dissect good works from the moral aspect of the law and then teach we are saved by "these" works, just not "those" works.
Amen Paul answers this in his letter to titus.

it was not by works of righteousness which we have done, but by his mercy.

We are not saved by the spirit, and perfect that salvation by works (the flesh) thot who teach that Paul calls fools.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#29
James is talking about the Perfect law of liberty through Christ, not the Mosaic written ordinances.

James 1:25 confirms this !!!
False.

James 2:10
For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all.

He is not talking about anything other than the law of moses. He wrote this letter to Children of Israel who had been dispersed because of sin, and have come to find Christ, He is speaking to them in their language, not NT religious language invented much later.

 
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KennethC

Guest
#30
You are so far off course it isn't funny. James is contrasting the law of liberty (the way we should conduct ourselves) with the Mosaic...

James 2:9-12 (KJV)
9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

I am not far off because like I showed James 1:25 and even in your response of giving James 2:12 shows that it is the law of liberty through Christ.

He says he who looks into and continues in the perfect law of liberty this one will be blessed in all that he does. This means there are standards to continue to obey in this law of liberty through Christ, and those standards is what Jesus laid out to us in the gospel books.

James is a convicting book for believers as he goes through showing to us the difference between a true faith and a false profession (dead faith).

James is not well liked by believers and is why some churches do not even teach on it because it makes us face our faults and correct them.
 
Sep 4, 2012
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#31
Nobody is saying a person is saved from good works !!!
Spin it however you want. It's clear that you teach a saved person will do good works (of law), and if they don't do the good works (of law), they are not really saved. Correct?
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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#32
I am not far off because like I showed James 1:25 and even in your response of giving James 2:12 shows that it is the law of liberty through Christ.

He says he who looks into and continues in the perfect law of liberty this one will be blessed in all that he does. This means there are standards to continue to obey in this law of liberty through Christ, and those standards is what Jesus laid out to us in the gospel books.

James is a convicting book for believers as he goes through showing to us the difference between a true faith and a false profession (dead faith).

James is not well liked by believers and is why some churches do not even teach on it because it makes us face our faults and correct them.
Okay, live on eggshells. Just remember under your so called law of liberty, if you break just one point you are guilty of all...if that's your idea of liberty.
 

MarcR

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2015
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#33
The OT makes mention of many covenants, of God; several of which were made with specific individuals.

There are two eternal general covenants still in force; but we must choose between them; because one can't be in both at the same time:

If you want to try to earn your own Salvation, there is the Covenant of Deut Chapter 29 (also mentioned in numerous other places); but, if you want Salvation given to you, there is the covenant of Jeremiah 31. These covenants are distinct and separate; they do not mix and match. I choose the Covenant of Jeremiah 31:31.

The guiding principles by which God wants me to live are written on my heart and I have no need of a rule book.

1 Cor 6:12
12 All things are lawful unto me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any.
KJV
 
Feb 1, 2015
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#34
OK, keep the law if you are disobedient and unruly (can't quote those two adverbs, best my memory can do).

Any law kills/chokes out the life of Christ in me, and it turns the fountain of Grace and Gods presence off in our lives. ������ ;)
 
Sep 4, 2012
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#35
Okay, live on eggshells. Just remember under your so called law of liberty, if you break just one point you are guilty of all...if that's your idea of liberty.
I guess this is how law keepers don't live on eggshells. They lower the bar so that sin doesn't appear to be sin.

By the Spirit we are given a better easier set of standards to uphold that the Holy Spirit will help us to continue in because of the fruit that He will work in us to abide by.
 
Feb 1, 2015
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#36
Only Jesus kept the law, unless the need of man, took priority.

Paul said (and I paraphrase), which law neither we nor our fathers were able to keep. :)
 

BenFTW

Senior Member
Oct 7, 2012
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#37
Not. The Law cannot be divided into categories, and certainly not into categories which makes some laws obligatory and others optional, some laws permanent and others temporary, or some laws more important that others. Paul tells us that if one desires to be under the law it necessitates "abiding by all things written in the Book of the Law" (Gal. 3:10), and of being "obligated to keep the whole Law" (Gal. 5:3). James also understood that the Law could not be partitioned for "whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles in one point, he has become guilty of all" (James 2:10). IOW, no slicing and dicing is allowed. If you want to be under the Law, you are under all of it.
Awesome answer. So then, can anyone explain what the Law of Christ is and how we go about obeying it? If we are not under this "moral law", that is isolated from the Law of Moses, some are going to worry about licentiousness and lawlessness; so can you address this idea of licentiousness and reveal to them the fruit of grace and how it affects our walk?

PS: Anyone may elaborate on this, what is the Law of Christ? How does us not being under this "moral law" not lead to licentiousness or lawlessness? Also, how does grace affect our walk through liberty and yet does not lead to sin?
 
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FreeNChrist

Guest
#38
How many times does the NT say that no liar will inherit eternal life/see the kingdom of heaven ???

Look it up and you will see it as well as others are still stated in the NT including in Revelation, and that of being a liar is the 9th commandment.
"Liar" is an identity. And it's not the identity of Christians. A liar is not a liar because they lie, a liar lies because they are a liar. Kenny gets that backwards, as he does most things.

*Kenny is ignoring me, and I kind of like it. It sure makes it easier for me.
 
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zzz98

Guest
#39
You have done away with obeying Christ, now there are no morals??????