Tongues???
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You know what? People with all kinds of genuine gifts can do wrong things and make mistakes. Do you mean that if someone glorifies himself by what he says in tongues is false? How would you know if he did that? If you know from the interpreter, why would you assume the fault is with the speaker in tongues and not the interpreter?
Show one bit of historical evidence for your accusation here. If you do a bit of research about the Azusa Street revival, you will find accounts about those who came into the meetings, and recognized their own language being spoken 'in tongues' That was said to be one of the things that drew crowds there in that international city.
I had a look at your article. You make assumptions not hinted at at the text. You assume there should be some kind of fear of a child of God getting a demon if he desires spiritual gifts and exercises them. That's contrary to the thrust of I Corinthians when it comes to the topic of spiritual gifts. Paul is very careful to encourage their enthusiasm about spiritual gifts while correcting their misunderstandings and misuse of speaking in tongues.
I had a look at your article. You make assumptions not hinted at at the text. You assume there should be some kind of fear of a child of God getting a demon if he desires spiritual gifts and exercises them. That's contrary to the thrust of I Corinthians when it comes to the topic of spiritual gifts. Paul is very careful to encourage their enthusiasm about spiritual gifts while correcting their misunderstandings and misuse of speaking in tongues.
I saw the bad eisegesis, how you read stuff into the text, and how you were working under a different set of assumptions in interpreting I Corinthians than Paul did when writing it. (For Paul, spiritual gifts are good, not something to make Christians afraid of being demonized.)
Don't blame that stuff of God. Did God actually tell you to write this? Did you receive an extra-Biblical revelation to write this document? If not, don't blame God.
Don't blame that stuff of God. Did God actually tell you to write this? Did you receive an extra-Biblical revelation to write this document? If not, don't blame God.
Why would you assume the interpreter gave the correct interpretation, if no one heard in his own dialectos?
Many years ago a group of Dallas Theological Seminary students attended the largest Charismatic Church in Dallas one Sunday. One of those students had memorized the 23rd Psalm in Hebrew, and after a couple people spoke in tongues, and the man with the gift of interpretations stood and gave the Interpretations, then that one student stood and quoted the memorized Psalm 23. Sure enough that same interpreter stood and gave a very Biblical sounding interpretation; however, NO ONE WORD OF IT WAS OUT OF THE 23rd PSALM.
I ask again: Why would you assume the interpreter gave the correct interpretation, if no one heard in his own dialectos?
Many years ago a group of Dallas Theological Seminary students attended the largest Charismatic Church in Dallas one Sunday. One of those students had memorized the 23rd Psalm in Hebrew, and after a couple people spoke in tongues, and the man with the gift of interpretations stood and gave the Interpretations, then that one student stood and quoted the memorized Psalm 23. Sure enough that same interpreter stood and gave a very Biblical sounding interpretation; however, NO ONE WORD OF IT WAS OUT OF THE 23rd PSALM.
I ask again: Why would you assume the interpreter gave the correct interpretation, if no one heard in his own dialectos?
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That is purely your opinion based entirely on your personal experience and feelings.
Since when are we supposed to use experience and feelings to interpret Scripture?
The devil can manipulate both of them.
I used the Berean method of interpretation:
Acts 17:11 (NIV)
[SUP]11 [/SUP] Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true.
I put the Charismatic experiences and feelings to the test of Scripture and they FAILED THE TEST.
Since when are we supposed to use experience and feelings to interpret Scripture?
The devil can manipulate both of them.
I used the Berean method of interpretation:
Acts 17:11 (NIV)
[SUP]11 [/SUP] Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true.
I put the Charismatic experiences and feelings to the test of Scripture and they FAILED THE TEST.
Wow micro aggression much?
What makes you so certain that the voice you hear is the Lords? Show me one place in scripture where the Holy Spirit operates outside of Gods word, just one will suffice. No, according to scripture the Holy Spirit never acts apart from what the Father has given to Him.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
What makes you so certain that the voice you hear is the Lords? Show me one place in scripture where the Holy Spirit operates outside of Gods word, just one will suffice. No, according to scripture the Holy Spirit never acts apart from what the Father has given to Him.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
It cannot work if God if no longer bringing new prophecy.
Tongues are of God they are after no man
As long as God is no longer working bringing any new revelation ,the manner of prophecy tongues, has ceased. You could say you cannot have one without the other.
One person posted ....Interestingly that prophesies shall fail
It’s what false prophecy does.
Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away. 1Co 13:8
Because all new prophecy will fail seeing God would no longer be adding to it . Today we now have his perfect/complete word with no laws missing by which we could know Him more intimately.
Because tongues will and have ceased we understand that tongues was a manner of the prophecy of God and is after no man as an outward sign..The Sign of tongues are for those who rebel .Prophecy for those who have the faith of Christ as it is written Therefore the idea of new knowledge will vanish .Remember at the time Corinthians was written, the prophecy was not completed. It was done away with when we received the last chapter (Revelation)
No such thing as an outward sign gift. It’s what the Jews required before they would believe.
Tongues are of God they are after no man
As long as God is no longer working bringing any new revelation ,the manner of prophecy tongues, has ceased. You could say you cannot have one without the other.
One person posted ....Interestingly that prophesies shall fail
It’s what false prophecy does.
Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away. 1Co 13:8
Because all new prophecy will fail seeing God would no longer be adding to it . Today we now have his perfect/complete word with no laws missing by which we could know Him more intimately.
Because tongues will and have ceased we understand that tongues was a manner of the prophecy of God and is after no man as an outward sign..The Sign of tongues are for those who rebel .Prophecy for those who have the faith of Christ as it is written Therefore the idea of new knowledge will vanish .Remember at the time Corinthians was written, the prophecy was not completed. It was done away with when we received the last chapter (Revelation)
No such thing as an outward sign gift. It’s what the Jews required before they would believe.
P
A personal observation-----
It seems that those who believe in tongues place more importance on tongues than any other thing.
They seem to believe that they are more spiritual than those who do not. That they are closer to God.
They seem to believe that those who do not speak in tongues are some how missing a great blessing.
They seem to believe that the prayer life of those who do not speak in tongues is lacking. That God does not here them.
They seem to be seeking MORE from God than He has already blessed them with.
It seems it is always more about ME whan it should be about Jesus.
As I have said before-----
The Holy Spirit is present in my life 24/7.
The Holy Spirit never leaves me.
There is nothing I can do that would bring Him closer.
When I pray, He is always there and says "I know your needs, you do not have to say a word".
As for me, I have no need to speak in tongues and see no advantage in anyone speaking in tongues.
It seems that those who believe in tongues place more importance on tongues than any other thing.
They seem to believe that they are more spiritual than those who do not. That they are closer to God.
They seem to believe that those who do not speak in tongues are some how missing a great blessing.
They seem to believe that the prayer life of those who do not speak in tongues is lacking. That God does not here them.
They seem to be seeking MORE from God than He has already blessed them with.
It seems it is always more about ME whan it should be about Jesus.
As I have said before-----
The Holy Spirit is present in my life 24/7.
The Holy Spirit never leaves me.
There is nothing I can do that would bring Him closer.
When I pray, He is always there and says "I know your needs, you do not have to say a word".
As for me, I have no need to speak in tongues and see no advantage in anyone speaking in tongues.
Follow after charity, and desire spiritual gifts, but rather that ye may prophesy. 2For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but UNTO GOD: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries. 3But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort. 4He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church. 5I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.
Paul is not saying in any way that tounges are selfish or not a gift of the spirit, He is saying that Prophecy is better than tongues because everyone understands it. He also says tongues is of value with interpretation << another Gift of the spirit. there is nothing in the bible to say any gift of the spirit is over, infact the bible says Gods Gifts and callings are irrevocable.
tongues is not only a sign for others to believe it is a heavenly language communicating directly with God in some higher form of spiritual language. I have never received the gift of tongues , but that doesnt lead me to tell others that its wrong or isnt possible or God doesnt want people to use the gift. its difficult when we fix on one verse and then interpret that One verse.
Paul is not saying in any way that tounges are selfish or not a gift of the spirit, He is saying that Prophecy is better than tongues because everyone understands it. He also says tongues is of value with interpretation << another Gift of the spirit. there is nothing in the bible to say any gift of the spirit is over, infact the bible says Gods Gifts and callings are irrevocable.
tongues is not only a sign for others to believe it is a heavenly language communicating directly with God in some higher form of spiritual language. I have never received the gift of tongues , but that doesnt lead me to tell others that its wrong or isnt possible or God doesnt want people to use the gift. its difficult when we fix on one verse and then interpret that One verse.
The Holy Spirit is the interrupter. When Peter spoke the Spirit of Christ interpreted into there own language, as prophecy.
Tongues is a work of God it is after no man. No new prophecy. Tongues have ceased.
Why in the world would a person seek after something that does not come from them to begin with if it is a free gift and not of ourselves lest any man boast in false pride.
What the purpose for tongues today?
Tongues is a work of God it is after no man. No new prophecy. Tongues have ceased.
Why in the world would a person seek after something that does not come from them to begin with if it is a free gift and not of ourselves lest any man boast in false pride.
What the purpose for tongues today?
And adding something that is no longer possible ? Whose work is that? Who sends the strong delusion of those who go above that which is written now that we have the complete ? Why would a person desire more that He gives . To show they have the fullness of the Spirit.
Are tongues of God or after men?
2Th 2:9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
2Th 2:10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
2Th 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
2Th 2:12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in
Are tongues of God or after men?
2Th 2:9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
2Th 2:10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
2Th 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
2Th 2:12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in
The Purpose of Tongues was to confirm to unbelieving Jews that the N.T. was as much the Word of GOD as the O.T. was.
Mark 16:20 (NKJV)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] And they went out and preached everywhere, the Lord working with them and confirming the word through the accompanying signs. Amen.
1 Corinthians 1:22 (KJV)
[SUP]22 [/SUP] For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:
1 Corinthians 14:22 (ASV)
[SUP]22 [/SUP] Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to the unbelieving: but prophesying is for a sign, not to the unbelieving, but to them that believe.
1 Corinthians 14:21 (ESV)
[SUP]21 [/SUP] In the Law it is written, “By people of strange tongues and by the lips of foreigners will I speak to this people, and even then they will not listen to me, says the Lord.”
And just like Jesus did not continue to confirm His resurrection by continuing to appear to each new Believer, HE STOPPED after it had been confirmed by a sufficient number of people, Tongues once the N.T. was confirmed to a sufficient number of unbelieving Jews, it too CEASED.
The difference between what Apostles did and what the modern day ecstatic utterances that they call tongues actually are, is sufficient to validate, it is psychological phenomena that only imitates the Genuine Apostolic TONGUES.
Mark 16:20 (NKJV)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] And they went out and preached everywhere, the Lord working with them and confirming the word through the accompanying signs. Amen.
1 Corinthians 1:22 (KJV)
[SUP]22 [/SUP] For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:
1 Corinthians 14:22 (ASV)
[SUP]22 [/SUP] Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to the unbelieving: but prophesying is for a sign, not to the unbelieving, but to them that believe.
1 Corinthians 14:21 (ESV)
[SUP]21 [/SUP] In the Law it is written, “By people of strange tongues and by the lips of foreigners will I speak to this people, and even then they will not listen to me, says the Lord.”
And just like Jesus did not continue to confirm His resurrection by continuing to appear to each new Believer, HE STOPPED after it had been confirmed by a sufficient number of people, Tongues once the N.T. was confirmed to a sufficient number of unbelieving Jews, it too CEASED.
The difference between what Apostles did and what the modern day ecstatic utterances that they call tongues actually are, is sufficient to validate, it is psychological phenomena that only imitates the Genuine Apostolic TONGUES.
D
An old friend of my hubby was (may still be) a missionary in Kenya. Something about Africa today that is different than North America. The gifts are as evidential there as they were in The Acts of the Apostles. People are being healed at astonishing rates. And, and the funny thing is this old friend was a cessationist. One day two of the guys in her service started yelling in tongues. NOT COOL! What should he do to silence them?
He was still thinking that out when someone in the back began to interpret. Ends up the two guys shouting were speaking in a tribal tongue from another part of the continent. The truth was also they didn't speak that language. The guy in the back did, so he translated. Yup. It was a word of encouragement to both the church and the guy in the back visiting.
Don't believe in tongues or do. Just know what you believe doesn't change what God does.
He was still thinking that out when someone in the back began to interpret. Ends up the two guys shouting were speaking in a tribal tongue from another part of the continent. The truth was also they didn't speak that language. The guy in the back did, so he translated. Yup. It was a word of encouragement to both the church and the guy in the back visiting.
Don't believe in tongues or do. Just know what you believe doesn't change what God does.
the thing is though, the idea that it isnt possible, isnt in scripture, its unbelief and thinking beyond the word. this is just my belief, when we have to figure out something that isnt in the word, we get off track. the scriptures you are referring to dont connect at all with spiritual gifts. we Know what God gave because He said it in His word, if He revoked, he would say that is my firm belief. anytime there isnt scripture clearly saying things, it just means it isnt true. " Lobve of the truth" is Love of Jesus who is the truth. when we read things Like " walking in the truth" its no different from saying walking by the spirit, or following the way. the truth is Jesus not like we would say " thats not the truth" He uis the truth referred to in the n.t.
H
So why do you pray? You want something? You seem to think you are all these things BC you don't 'ask' for more but you do ask BC you said you pray.... self righteous.. Praying and asking are all over the Bible.. As well as receiving.. if you don't want, cool.. Sit with what little you think is best.. I'll take up everything He rose for..