Fear Is The Beginning Of Wisdom

[Depleted]

Maybe it's the word fear itself that needs to be removed from the Bible and replaced with a word such as reverence or respect. God knows I do not cower before Him out of fear, I did back when I thought God and Jesus and the Holy Spirit were all different entities. The catholic church had me tripping on the trinity for over ten years and I wasn't even raised catholic.

It would be reverence and respect if that's what it meant.

Try making it those words in these verses and not noticing it's a bit past that anyhow.
Luke 12:[FONT=&quot]12:4-5 "I tell you, my friends, do not be afraid of those who kill the body and after that can do no more. But I will show you whom you should fear: Fear him who, after the killing of the body, has power to throw you into hell. Yes, I tell you, fear him.[/FONT]

 

[Depleted]

God wills that every man be saved. Is it possible that man and mankind are two different races of humans, and that mankind was designed after man but is not man.... duh duh duh! Dare I use the term 'nephilim' There are sons of satan and sons of God that dwell on this earth together. If it weren't so it would not be written. The wheat has been growing with the chaff ever since the beginning. God is patient however and is faithful to let them grow together until the harvest. Nobody knows God's entire plan except God, but I can have faith in knowing that my Father is only good and long-suffering as He has shown me. God keeps His promises as well, another thing that has been proven to me.

How about starting with your opening premise is wrong instead? If God wills every man be saved, then every man is saved. What God wills gets done. He is God after all. Nothing stopping him from getting his will. God always, always gets his will.

And we do know his plan. His plan is to have himself a people who will worship and adore him eternally. He's getting it. He got it. He will get it. God is eternal, so it's a done deal outside of time and space. We're simply in time and space so don't see the whole other than God promises.

 

[Depleted]

Luther called it filial fear, which carries the idea of family. The fear that a child has for their father, who they have great love and respect for, and who they want to please. It is not being afraid of the father, but a fear of displeasing the father they love.

I tend to picture it more like The Big Show is my dad, except even bigger than him. When I say, "My dad can beat up your dad," I really mean it. He won't be beating me up, and yet, I really am less inclined to give him lip just because of who he is. God's wrath is a very real thing. It is frightening. Just because it's not aimed at me, doesn't make it not-frightening anymore. I do fear God. I also love him.

My husband is a big guy. (Not Big Show big, but he'd only look like a normal-sized guy next to him.) One time, a guy at work pinched my butt. I hauled off and clocked him, which surprised him enough that he never pinched my butt again. Had I told hubby that story, that guy wouldn't be able to pinch anything for the rest of his life. I truly love my husband. He would never hurt me. But I also truly understand the wrath love can cause.

God truly is someone to fear. Let's not bring him down to Mr. Rogers in his neighborhood. He is who he is.

 

[Sac49]

The word "fear" is used a few different ways in the Bible. The definition used for each placement depends on context.

Servile fear which is between slave and master.
Philial fear which is respect or reverance.
Fear use in the way of "to be afraid of".

In refering to God we are to have a healthy bit of each type of fear. There cannot be too much "fear" of God or we just shy away from God because we are afraid of Him. But we must have a touch of that fear.
We have to have a servile fear of God as He is Sovereign and we are not.
When we have a philial fear of God is when the begining of wisdom comes into play. Because of our respect and reverance of God we can begin to learn and understand His Word and hear the Holy Spirit speaking to us.

Without respect and reverance of God we cannot learn as we think "we know it all". God cannot teach a heart that is closed in this way towards Him. (Yes God could change that in someones heart if He so pleases).

So when we read the word "fear" in the Bible we must understand in which context it is being used. "The fear of the Lord" is a fasinating study. It really opens up how we are to "view" God in our relationship with Him.

 

[FreeNChrist]

I tend to picture it more like The Big Show is my dad, except even bigger than him. When I say, "My dad can beat up your dad," I really mean it. He won't be beating me up, and yet, I really am less inclined to give him lip just because of who he is. God's wrath is a very real thing. It is frightening. Just because it's not aimed at me, doesn't make it not-frightening anymore. I do fear God. I also love him.

My husband is a big guy. (Not Big Show big, but he'd only look like a normal-sized guy next to him.) One time, a guy at work pinched my butt. I hauled off and clocked him, which surprised him enough that he never pinched my butt again. Had I told hubby that story, that guy wouldn't be able to pinch anything for the rest of his life. I truly love my husband. He would never hurt me. But I also truly understand the wrath love can cause.

God truly is someone to fear. Let's not bring him down to Mr. Rogers in his neighborhood. He is who he is.

“There is one effect that cannot be the result of a direct application of force, and that is the maintenance of a relationship between free persons. If my child chooses not to cooperate with me, if my wife chooses not to live with me, there is no right-handed power on earth that can make them toe the line of relationship I have chosen to draw in the sand. I can dock my son’s allowance, for example, or chain him to a radiator; or in anger at my wife, I can punch holes in the Sheetrock or beat her senseless with a shovel. In short, I can use any force that comes to hand or mind, and yet I cannot cause either of them, at the core of their being, to stop their wrongs and conform to my right. The only power I have by which to do that is left-handed power – which for all practical purposes will be indistinguishable from weakness on my part. It is the power of my patience with them, of my letting their wrong be – even if that costs me my rightness or my life – so that they, for whose reconciliation I long, may live for a better day of their own choosing." - Robert Farrar Capon

 

[Stephen63]

The Lord takes no pleasure in the death of the wicked......some would have him laughing maniacally while rubbing his hands together as a lost man slips into eternity.......

I've never heard of anyone who's a christian ever saying such things. Where do you get such stuff?

 

[Stephen63]

There are many words in the Bible I simply know better than to read in their 21st Century meaning. I think trying to apply the 21st Century to much of the Bible, when those parts were never meant to be seen in such a manner, is one thing that leads to so many misunderstandings of Scripture.

I find that very true..... but it was already pretty bad in the 20th century (1997)

 

[dcontroversal]

I've never heard of anyone who's a christian ever saying such things. Where do you get such stuff?

The first part is a direct quote from the bible.....the second part-->go figure out yourself exactly why I would say that........geesh!

 

[Stephen63]

I did read that about him and that most of these "converts" didn't stay in the church a few years later.

There is a difference to having a healthy fear of God before we become His child and this "healthy fear" brings us to Christ. Once we are in Christ - to continue to preach this fear-based so called gospel is nothing but spiritual abuse.

We are to grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ - not grow in being afraid of Him. Religion is just so stupid and it ends up teaching it's adherents the complete opposite of the kingdom of God.

There's something that really needs to be brought up here.... every revival, regardless of who was preaching it & when it was & what country had exactly the same results..... great revival for a few years, then backsliding afterwards. What folks don't understand is, no matter how many get saved, only a few will endure to the end. That's from real converts.

The very same thing happened to Jesus..... less than 3 years into His ministry, many of His "disciples" walked out on Him.

Does that mean Jesus wasn't right either?

 

[Stephen63]

I think people must often forget that it will be Jesus who comes on the Day of the Lord, that it will be Him who judges the nations, and that every knee will be bent down to Him. He shares the attributes of God with God. Yes He is compassionate and merciful, and yes He has a wrath and will punish wickedness.

And I fear God, even in the last book of the Bible we are told to fear God. I dont believe that it is impossible to both fear Him and love and trust Him, and I dont believe that He ever used the word "fear" to many anything but fear.
We are told that we would be given dominion over animals, and that they would be filled with a fear of us in Genesis 9-

" 2 The fear and dread of you will fall on all the beasts of the earth, and on all the birds in the sky, on every creature that moves along the ground, and on all the fish in the sea; they are given into your hands."

Our pets obey us because they fear us, but they also trust us and know we wont do anything against them unless they do wrong.

I have a fear of the One who can both create our world and completely destroy it. But I trust that His will is not to destroy us.

Amen!......

 

[Dan58]

More often than not, fear as used in the old testament is better defined as revere. The Hebrew word "yare" means fearing in a morally reverent fashion, holding God in reverence. It doesn't mean to be afraid or scared to death, but better describes a term of respect for the power and authority of God. (Strong's Concordance Hebrew ref.#3372)

 

[Stephen63]

the second part-->go figure out yourself exactly why I would say that........geesh!

some would have him laughing maniacally while rubbing his hands together as a lost man slips into eternity.......

I guess a few wicked religious maniacs in the world..... like the kind that blast people in the BDF for the fun of it.

 

[PeterJens]

The Lord takes no pleasure in the death of the wicked......some would have him laughing maniacally while rubbing his hands together as a lost man slips into eternity.......

Have I any pleasure in the death of the wicked, declares the Lord God, and not rather that he should turn from his way and live? But when a righteous person turns away from his righteousness and does injustice and does the same abominations that the wicked person does, shall he live? None of the righteous deeds that he has done shall be remembered; for the treachery of which he is guilty and the sin he has committed, for them he shall die.
Ezek 18:23-24

Fear is a good thing is you rebel against the living God.

This attempt to miss-construe the nature of the Father is not wise, and demonstrates
something seriously wrong in people who claim to know the living God.

 

[gb9]

Have I any pleasure in the death of the wicked, declares the Lord God, and not rather that he should turn from his way and live? But when a righteous person turns away from his righteousness and does injustice and does the same abominations that the wicked person does, shall he live? None of the righteous deeds that he has done shall be remembered; for the treachery of which he is guilty and the sin he has committed, for them he shall die.
Ezek 18:23-24

Fear is a good thing is you rebel against the living God.

This attempt to miss-construe the nature of the Father is not wise, and demonstrates
something seriously wrong in people who claim to know the living God.

2nd Peter chapter 3. written by someone who walked with Jesus. N.T. view please , not plucking out verses about Israel.

 

[PeterJens]

2nd Peter chapter 3. written by someone who walked with Jesus. N.T. view please , not plucking out verses about Israel.

I see you believe God changes depending on who He is talking to.
Odd that you throw out God dealings with man and His conditions of blessing.

Eternity does not change yet Jesus eternal words quoting Jonah and the Psalms
are not valid because they are before the cross, yet Peter is valid after the cross.

that scoffers will come in the last days with scoffing, following their own sinful desires.
For they deliberately overlook this fact, that the heavens existed long ago, and the earth was formed out of water and through water by the word of God, 6 and that by means of these the world that then existed was deluged with water and perished. 7 But by the same word the heavens and earth that now exist are stored up for fire, being kept until the day of judgment and destruction of the ungodly.
2 Peter 3:3-7

Fear of judgement is a very wise thing, and Peter is reminding us of this
judgement and the consequences at the time of Noah and the end of the
world.

 

[pottersclay]

Did ya know there are no scripture in the bible that say children love your parents?

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

Have I any pleasure in the death of the wicked, declares the Lord God, and not rather that he should turn from his way and live? But when a righteous person turns away from his righteousness and does injustice and does the same abominations that the wicked person does, shall he live? None of the righteous deeds that he has done shall be remembered; for the treachery of which he is guilty and the sin he has committed, for them he shall die.
Ezek 18:23-24

Fear is a good thing is you rebel against the living God.

This attempt to miss-construe the nature of the Father is not wise, and demonstrates
something seriously wrong in people who claim to know the living God.

DC's post that you quoted was not misconstruing God's nature...I don't see that in his post...

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

2nd Peter chapter 3. written by someone who walked with Jesus. N.T. view please , not plucking out verses about Israel.

The verse Peter quotes actually is in agreement with NT. The apostle said, why do you condemn them when you do the same things? This is a deeper subject than it might appear to be.

 

[PeterJens]

DC's post that you quoted was not misconstruing God's nature...I don't see that in his post...

DC was attempting to say God does not condemn the wicked to death with delight,
which is true, but he will cause their final defeat with just judgement with a passion.

The Lord examines the righteous, but the wicked, those who love violence, he hates with a passion.
Psalm 11:5

Read this from revelations

----------
I saw heaven standing open and there before me was a white horse, whose rider is called Faithful and True. With justice he judges and wages war. 12 His eyes are like blazing fire, and on his head are many crowns. He has a name written on him that no one knows but he himself. 13 He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God. 14 The armies of heaven were following him, riding on white horses and dressed in fine linen, white and clean. 15 Coming out of his mouth is a sharp sword with which to strike down the nations. “He will rule them with an iron scepter." He treads the winepress of the fury of the wrath of God Almighty. 16 On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written:

king of kings and lord of lords.

17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun, who cried in a loud voice to all the birds flying in midair, “Come, gather together for the great supper of God, 18 so that you may eat the flesh of kings, generals, and the mighty, of horses and their riders, and the flesh of all people, free and slave, great and small.”
rev 19:11-18
----------

This is truly gruesome, the judgement of God on mankind, the day of wrath.

For good reason we should fear the judgement of the Living God.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

DC was attempting to say God does not condemn the wicked to death with delight,
which is true, but he will cause their final defeat with just judgement with a passion.

The Lord examines the righteous, but the wicked, those who love violence, he hates with a passion.
Psalm 11:5

Read this from revelations

----------
I saw heaven standing open and there before me was a white horse, whose rider is called Faithful and True. With justice he judges and wages war. 12 His eyes are like blazing fire, and on his head are many crowns. He has a name written on him that no one knows but he himself. 13 He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God. 14 The armies of heaven were following him, riding on white horses and dressed in fine linen, white and clean. 15 Coming out of his mouth is a sharp sword with which to strike down the nations. “He will rule them with an iron scepter." He treads the winepress of the fury of the wrath of God Almighty. 16 On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written:

king of kings and lord of lords.

17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun, who cried in a loud voice to all the birds flying in midair, “Come, gather together for the great supper of God, 18 so that you may eat the flesh of kings, generals, and the mighty, of horses and their riders, and the flesh of all people, free and slave, great and small.”
rev 19:11-18
----------

This is truly gruesome, the judgement of God on mankind, the day of wrath.

For good reason we should fear the judgement of the Living God.

Okay. It sounded like you were saying he unwisely misconstrued God's character. I think because you quoted him and then said what you did, I assumed you were talking to him and about his post.