Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer
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Paul-->Romans-->Saved and justified before God by faith and faith alone void of works
James-->James-->The invisible faith that saves and justifies before God void of works SEEN by MEN by our works
No one has denied that a believer will produce fruit or works.....the works are the result of the faith and salvation that one already possesses in Christ...even creation teaches this....
Apple tree
a. Is an apple tree from the moment it sprouts (born)
b. Is an apple tree the first couple of years of growth (does not bear fruit yet)
c. After years of growth and maturity will produce fruit...some just one apple some so many the branches break
Even Jesus said a cup of cold water I his name unto another believer would not go unnoticed and or rewarded......ONE piece of fruit or work identifies the tree.....
Well we are moving onto the topic of Election (which I believe in), but then that will move this topic into a whole new direction. We are on the same page on faith alone saving. But let me say it again - if it bears no fruit (just like the fig tree which was cursed by Jesus), then this is evidence of NO FAITH. And thus no salvation.
God gives three servants talents. What happens to the servant who buried his talents? Was that SERVANT operating in faith nor not when he buried the talents?
God gives three servants talents. What happens to the servant who buried his talents? Was that SERVANT operating in faith nor not when he buried the talents?
We can take any scripture out of it's context and make it say what we want.
The bible is the most beautiful book in the world or the most dangerous one.
It's all in the lens we use when we read it. Read it through the lens of the finished work of Christ and then we will see the true heart and love of the Father for His beloved children.
God no more sends His beloved children to hell after they are saved by grace through faith in what Christ has done when they heard the message of Him and were sealed with the Holy Spirit ( Eph. 1:13 ) - then Daffy Duck and Donald Duck are the 2 witnesses in the book of Revelation.
The bible is the most beautiful book in the world or the most dangerous one.
It's all in the lens we use when we read it. Read it through the lens of the finished work of Christ and then we will see the true heart and love of the Father for His beloved children.
God no more sends His beloved children to hell after they are saved by grace through faith in what Christ has done when they heard the message of Him and were sealed with the Holy Spirit ( Eph. 1:13 ) - then Daffy Duck and Donald Duck are the 2 witnesses in the book of Revelation.
[h=3]Sin and the Child of God[/h][SUP]4 [/SUP]Whoever commits sin also commits lawlessness, and sin is lawlessness. [SUP]5 [/SUP]And you know that He was manifested to take away our sins, and in Him there is no sin. [SUP]6 [/SUP]Whoever abides in Him does not sin. Whoever sins has neither seen Him nor known Him.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous. [SUP]8 [/SUP]He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has sinned from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil. [SUP]9 [/SUP]Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous. [SUP]8 [/SUP]He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has sinned from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil. [SUP]9 [/SUP]Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.
Let me ask a question....
The Corinthian brother who was fornicating....Paul said to put him out of the church for the destruction of the flesh that the spirit may be saved in the day of Christ....
HOW would you describe his works?
It is obvious he was saved based upon the last clause!
The Corinthian brothers who had works of wood, hay and stubble that were burnt to a crisp yet they were saved as like one escaping through the fire.
How would you describe their works?
The Corinthian brother who was fornicating....Paul said to put him out of the church for the destruction of the flesh that the spirit may be saved in the day of Christ....
HOW would you describe his works?
It is obvious he was saved based upon the last clause!
The Corinthian brothers who had works of wood, hay and stubble that were burnt to a crisp yet they were saved as like one escaping through the fire.
How would you describe their works?
John also states, "IF we say that we have no sin we are deceived and the truth is not in us".....
so which is it....?
BOTH
It is the spirit that has been born of incorruptible seed, the spirit is eternally saved, sealed and does not sin
The spirit is still bound in a lost, fallen dead body of sin that is weak.
Paul covers this as well......and concludes that when he does things contrary it is not him doing it, but SIN that dwells in him (his flesh)
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True, True faith produces works.. No one has EVER argued that, and the fact over and over in here people say we are is getting old.
With that said,, That does not mean a person is going to be saved, and became like the apostle paul. If that was required, Few if any, would make it.. Including probably everyone in this roo.
thus we are relegated, and the workers must prove, If lack of works cause loss of salvation, what is the minimum amount of work one must do to be saved.. So please. I will await your reply on what this amount is,, If I can lose salvation, I need to know how much I must do to be saved.. Else I fail to live up to that standard.
And yes, He does judge his children by their works, And they will receive reward, Gold silver precious stone. Sadly, some will see their work bunt up, but they too will be saved, even as through fire (they had nothign to show for their life as it was all burnt up)
The non child of God will be judge by their work to, and be lacking, Because they did not have th eone and only thing which could save them. The blood of Christ.
So a person, MR X, becomes a true believer. Then as time goes by he slacks off concerning the pursuit of the things of God. He doesn't read his bible anymore, doesn't worship, and helps nobody. This slide (backslide) happens over a period of 20 years). The is then led away through desire and enticed, and this brings forth sin. He rapes little children (paedophile) in his old age.
Now, doe this believer, who committed his life to the Lord as a young man, end up in heaven?
Now, doe this believer, who committed his life to the Lord as a young man, end up in heaven?
Its a very simple answer to this one. The Christian brother had refused to repent, and the church had asked Paul about dealing with this brother. The destruction of the flesh is sickness or disease which would ravage this brother until the point of death. The point being that whilst this brother was still alive (but dying), he would repent of his sinful works so that his soul may be saved. However if that fornicating brother did not repent, then the future is hell.
Would have, could have and what if's never lay the truth bare bro.......
The story of Jonah ends with him peeved at God over saving Nineveh...does that change the fact that he was holy and used of God?
Our conscience can be seared with a hot iron and we can forget that our sins have been purged.....that does not change the fact that we are the children of God......
The story of Jonah ends with him peeved at God over saving Nineveh...does that change the fact that he was holy and used of God?
Our conscience can be seared with a hot iron and we can forget that our sins have been purged.....that does not change the fact that we are the children of God......
Yes, he will. As long as he repents and asks God's forgiveness. 
In fact if we are to believe other posters here, the first sinners prayer was all that was needed to ask for forgiveness. Since they cannot lose salvation anymore, there is no more need to ask forgiveness. See how silly this starts to sound.