Must Christians Ask For Forgiveness Every Time They Sin?
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Want to see another conundrum about 1 John 1? Prepare to be baffled.
1 John 1:7 King James Version (KJV)
7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
How does the blood of Jesus Christ cleanse us from all sin if we are walking in the light? What sin is there to be cleansed if we are in the light? Do you see it? How can we be cleansed of sin if walking in the light is walking righteously? There wouldn't be any sin to cleanse!
So then, what do we see here? A parallel of light and darkness. Saved and unsaved, that is key to understanding 1 John 1. If we see that a person is being invited into the fellowship ("that we have with the Father and His Son Jesus Christ"), told to admit their sinfulness (and not deny it, calling God a liar), and God will forgive them of all sin we can see, ever so clearly, an invitation is being made to recognize one's own sinfulness which in turns requires their acknowledgement of Christ as Savior.
To make a doctrine of sin confession for forgiveness out of 1 John 1:9 would contradict what Jesus accomplished on our behalf. Even in the Old Testament saints of ole confessed their sin and their iniquity was forgiven them, but we must understand we are under a new covenant. A covenant where our righteousness is one of faith, and our forgiveness through the shed blood of Jesus. To suggest that our forgiveness is through any other means than faith in the Son of God is to trample underfoot the Son of God and treat His blood as unholy (within the covenant) and common (Hebrews 10:29).
If we must confess our sins in order to be forgiven Christ would have to get back on the cross, for the penalty for sin is death and He is that very sacrifice that is sufficient to be the propitiation for our sins (Hebrews 9:26). Without the shedding of blood is no remission of sin. This is why Christ died once, and for all. His blood sufficient for all sin, with an eternal priesthood. He is able to save us completely (Hebrews 7:25).
The implications of sin confession for forgiveness (as a doctrine) is that Christ failed His mission of reconciliation, once again placing a barrier between God and man (the very veil Jesus tore "in twain"). No, the blood of Jesus Christ cleanses us from all sin and we are reconciled to God. This is the truth, and there is no condemnation in Jesus Christ.
1 John 1:7 King James Version (KJV)
7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
How does the blood of Jesus Christ cleanse us from all sin if we are walking in the light? What sin is there to be cleansed if we are in the light? Do you see it? How can we be cleansed of sin if walking in the light is walking righteously? There wouldn't be any sin to cleanse!
So then, what do we see here? A parallel of light and darkness. Saved and unsaved, that is key to understanding 1 John 1. If we see that a person is being invited into the fellowship ("that we have with the Father and His Son Jesus Christ"), told to admit their sinfulness (and not deny it, calling God a liar), and God will forgive them of all sin we can see, ever so clearly, an invitation is being made to recognize one's own sinfulness which in turns requires their acknowledgement of Christ as Savior.
To make a doctrine of sin confession for forgiveness out of 1 John 1:9 would contradict what Jesus accomplished on our behalf. Even in the Old Testament saints of ole confessed their sin and their iniquity was forgiven them, but we must understand we are under a new covenant. A covenant where our righteousness is one of faith, and our forgiveness through the shed blood of Jesus. To suggest that our forgiveness is through any other means than faith in the Son of God is to trample underfoot the Son of God and treat His blood as unholy (within the covenant) and common (Hebrews 10:29).
If we must confess our sins in order to be forgiven Christ would have to get back on the cross, for the penalty for sin is death and He is that very sacrifice that is sufficient to be the propitiation for our sins (Hebrews 9:26). Without the shedding of blood is no remission of sin. This is why Christ died once, and for all. His blood sufficient for all sin, with an eternal priesthood. He is able to save us completely (Hebrews 7:25).
The implications of sin confession for forgiveness (as a doctrine) is that Christ failed His mission of reconciliation, once again placing a barrier between God and man (the very veil Jesus tore "in twain"). No, the blood of Jesus Christ cleanses us from all sin and we are reconciled to God. This is the truth, and there is no condemnation in Jesus Christ.
Lets look at another verse in 1 John 2, and how it seemingly contradicts previous verses (that we interpret to mean we must confess sins in order to be forgiven as a believer).
1 John 2:12 King James Version (KJV)
12 I write unto you, little children, because your sins are forgiven you for his name's sake.
Wouldn't this be presumptive of John to think he knows the audience has confessed their sin and are now forgiven? How would he know if one of the people present still needed to confess their sin to be forgiven and here he is telling them that their sins are forgiven them? He would be giving them a false comfort, not knowing their standing with God (based upon sin confession for forgiveness). A little careless, don't you think?
Or, just maybe, we can conclude that sin confession for forgiveness is not a New Covenant application and forgiveness is through the Son of God (by His blood, having faith in Jesus Christ). This is what it appears John is saying at the beginning of 1 John 2.
1 John 2:1-2 King James Version (KJV)
2 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
There is no seeking or asking of forgiveness here. We have our Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. Our High Priest. Our mediator. There is no condemnation in Jesus Christ, per the will of the Father (since He sent the Son). Forgiveness then is ours.
Ephesians 4:32 King James Version (KJV)
32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.
1 John 2:12 King James Version (KJV)
12 I write unto you, little children, because your sins are forgiven you for his name's sake.
Wouldn't this be presumptive of John to think he knows the audience has confessed their sin and are now forgiven? How would he know if one of the people present still needed to confess their sin to be forgiven and here he is telling them that their sins are forgiven them? He would be giving them a false comfort, not knowing their standing with God (based upon sin confession for forgiveness). A little careless, don't you think?
Or, just maybe, we can conclude that sin confession for forgiveness is not a New Covenant application and forgiveness is through the Son of God (by His blood, having faith in Jesus Christ). This is what it appears John is saying at the beginning of 1 John 2.
1 John 2:1-2 King James Version (KJV)
2 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
There is no seeking or asking of forgiveness here. We have our Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. Our High Priest. Our mediator. There is no condemnation in Jesus Christ, per the will of the Father (since He sent the Son). Forgiveness then is ours.
Ephesians 4:32 King James Version (KJV)
32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.
We need to see the entire verse in order to understand that phrase.
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. (Rom 8:1 KJV)
So what about those Christians who walk after the flesh, or according to the flesh, or controlled by the flesh (Q) Here is the answer:
For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation [condemnation] to himself, not discerning the Lord's body. For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep (die). For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged. But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world. (1 Cor 11:29-32)
And what if a Christ fails to repent, confess, and ask for forgiveness (Q) Here is the answer:
If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it. All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death. (1 Jn 5:16,17)
If there is a *sin unto death* it simply corroborates what Paul has said about many who *sleep* (die prematurely).
Ben, you have simply ignored every Scripture which refutes your false doctrine. But you fail to understand that a person who insists on holding on to his false ideas is actually resisting the Holy Spirit, and also hurting those who are either new to the faith, or are not familiar with the Scriptures.
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. (Rom 8:1 KJV)
So what about those Christians who walk after the flesh, or according to the flesh, or controlled by the flesh (Q) Here is the answer:
For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation [condemnation] to himself, not discerning the Lord's body. For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep (die). For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged. But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world. (1 Cor 11:29-32)
And what if a Christ fails to repent, confess, and ask for forgiveness (Q) Here is the answer:
If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it. All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death. (1 Jn 5:16,17)
If there is a *sin unto death* it simply corroborates what Paul has said about many who *sleep* (die prematurely).
Ben, you have simply ignored every Scripture which refutes your false doctrine. But you fail to understand that a person who insists on holding on to his false ideas is actually resisting the Holy Spirit, and also hurting those who are either new to the faith, or are not familiar with the Scriptures.
Matthew 13 " .....16But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear. 17For verily I say unto you, That many prophets and righteous men have desired to see those things which ye see, and have not seen them; and to hear those things which ye hear, and have not heard them.
Matthew 18 " Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times? 22Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.
23Therefore is the kingdom of heaven likened unto a certain king, which would take account of his servants.24And when he had begun to reckon, one was brought unto him, which owed him ten thousand talents. 25But forasmuch as he had not to pay, his lord commanded him to be sold, and his wife, and children, and all that he had, and payment to be made. 26The servant therefore fell down, and worshipped him, saying, Lord, have patience with me, and I will pay thee all.
27Then the lord of that servant was moved with compassion, and loosed him, and forgave him the debt.
28But the same servant went out, and found one of his fellowservants, which owed him an hundred pence: and he laid hands on him, and took him by the throat, saying, Pay me that thou owest. 29And his fellowservant fell down at his feet, and besought him, saying, Have patience with me, and I will pay thee all. 30And he would not: but went and cast him into prison, till he should pay the debt.31So when his fellowservants saw what was done, they were very sorry, and came and told unto their lord all that was done.
32Then his lord, after that he had called him, said unto him, O thou wicked servant, I forgave thee all that debt, because thou desiredst me: 33Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee? 34And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, till he should pay all that was due unto him.
35So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses."
remember the Man couldnt pay the debt to begin with, and Being tormented i cant imagine How He is going to pay the great debt.......Note it is based on the fact that the Man received Mercy first for His great debt. and then He goes out after receiving the forgiveness of His debt, and refuses to treat the Man who owes Him little.
after He does this, He is then recalled to the Lord and the Lord reinstates His debt all based on the fact that He would Not forgive as He was forgiven.
Judge Not, Lest Ye be Judged, forgive and you will be forgiven, By the same measure you use, it will be measured to you again, shaken and stirred and over running."
Be not deceived a Man reaps what He sows"
sow Mercy, in Light of the fact Mercy saved you. and clearly, it matters to Jesus whether we forgive others when they sin against us. He is the Lord, its His blood that purchased forgiveness, and it is By Hos word, His statements that we receive anything of God including forgiveness. theres No grounds to make it Not necassary, it clearly is necassary. thats what the parable is teaching. " if you forgive those who sin against you, your father in Heaven will forgive you your sins, if you do not forgive others Niether will your Father forgive you" ( Matthew 614-15)
we can see that 2 ways. either Jesus is the Lord, His words will never change or pass away so therefore, if i have a grudge in me...i need to forgive Now. or....we can say " well Paul said its By Grace, so then that Means what i do doesnt apply to anything and what Jesus said, Just doesnt apply to His disciples. christians.
its Not against us because we May have a grudge to condemn us, He is teaching us so that we can opurge the things from Our Lives that will be Just as He says they will be. No matter what Jesus teaches all of it will be forever exactly as He said it will be. so when We face Judgement, why Not Make sure, we Have taken the Words of the Judge to Heart? theres No fear in that Heck, if a christian has an issue, with forgiving anyone, its Hard to then state they are following the spirit which forgave the world for its abominations. we Have to take Heed of Jesus, He is the North of the compass. should we debate whether the Judge Knows what He is saying? or should we Just understand " He is the Lord of all creation.....what He says is the right belief to Keep. seems simple.......
Matthew 18 " Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times? 22Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.
23Therefore is the kingdom of heaven likened unto a certain king, which would take account of his servants.24And when he had begun to reckon, one was brought unto him, which owed him ten thousand talents. 25But forasmuch as he had not to pay, his lord commanded him to be sold, and his wife, and children, and all that he had, and payment to be made. 26The servant therefore fell down, and worshipped him, saying, Lord, have patience with me, and I will pay thee all.
27Then the lord of that servant was moved with compassion, and loosed him, and forgave him the debt.
28But the same servant went out, and found one of his fellowservants, which owed him an hundred pence: and he laid hands on him, and took him by the throat, saying, Pay me that thou owest. 29And his fellowservant fell down at his feet, and besought him, saying, Have patience with me, and I will pay thee all. 30And he would not: but went and cast him into prison, till he should pay the debt.31So when his fellowservants saw what was done, they were very sorry, and came and told unto their lord all that was done.
32Then his lord, after that he had called him, said unto him, O thou wicked servant, I forgave thee all that debt, because thou desiredst me: 33Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee? 34And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, till he should pay all that was due unto him.
35So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses."
remember the Man couldnt pay the debt to begin with, and Being tormented i cant imagine How He is going to pay the great debt.......Note it is based on the fact that the Man received Mercy first for His great debt. and then He goes out after receiving the forgiveness of His debt, and refuses to treat the Man who owes Him little.
after He does this, He is then recalled to the Lord and the Lord reinstates His debt all based on the fact that He would Not forgive as He was forgiven.
Judge Not, Lest Ye be Judged, forgive and you will be forgiven, By the same measure you use, it will be measured to you again, shaken and stirred and over running."
Be not deceived a Man reaps what He sows"
sow Mercy, in Light of the fact Mercy saved you. and clearly, it matters to Jesus whether we forgive others when they sin against us. He is the Lord, its His blood that purchased forgiveness, and it is By Hos word, His statements that we receive anything of God including forgiveness. theres No grounds to make it Not necassary, it clearly is necassary. thats what the parable is teaching. " if you forgive those who sin against you, your father in Heaven will forgive you your sins, if you do not forgive others Niether will your Father forgive you" ( Matthew 614-15)
we can see that 2 ways. either Jesus is the Lord, His words will never change or pass away so therefore, if i have a grudge in me...i need to forgive Now. or....we can say " well Paul said its By Grace, so then that Means what i do doesnt apply to anything and what Jesus said, Just doesnt apply to His disciples. christians.
its Not against us because we May have a grudge to condemn us, He is teaching us so that we can opurge the things from Our Lives that will be Just as He says they will be. No matter what Jesus teaches all of it will be forever exactly as He said it will be. so when We face Judgement, why Not Make sure, we Have taken the Words of the Judge to Heart? theres No fear in that Heck, if a christian has an issue, with forgiving anyone, its Hard to then state they are following the spirit which forgave the world for its abominations. we Have to take Heed of Jesus, He is the North of the compass. should we debate whether the Judge Knows what He is saying? or should we Just understand " He is the Lord of all creation.....what He says is the right belief to Keep. seems simple.......
if you really actually Look at the chapter you get the message clearly, for Just that verse, you then need to understand " what does it Mean to be in christ" john 15
romans 8 " For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. 6For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. 8So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.Control by the Spirit
(Galatians 5:16-26)9But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. 10And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 11But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
12Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. 13For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
"therefore" what He has Been saying, He is summarizing its Meaning Here. its about the "deeds of the Body" to live afterthe flesh, is to follow the desires of the flesh that paul speaks in galatians 5 and ephesians 5, its to follow sin, things Like adultery, covetousness, greed.... to Live after the flesh is to feed those things partaking of them, to "Mortify" is to make something as dead. or put to death something"
Put to death the deeds of the Body and you will Live"
to Be in Christ is to abide in His teachings again John 15, the same teachings Jesus calls " The spirit, and the Life" to understand Paul, One has to go to Jesus first or His use of phrases and terms Has no foundation. many have no idea How to Hear from the Holy ghost, what He might say, what it is to Live by the spirit" because people try to see Paul without Jesus as the foundation.
all He says about the spirit and flesh Began with the gospel. " the flesh counts for Nothing, the spirit gives Life" .." it is the spirit that Quickens, the words i speak to you are spirit and Life."
all of Pauls wroitings are Lijke that without the Words Jesus speaks they dont makes any sense. Jesus has to Be the foundation, and the Mediation between a Believer and God it cant Be paul alone. He carried a Message thats what we Need. and it Begins with the Son of God whom paul was Preaching.
AMEN a hard overwhelming fight at times. But He always delivers according to His word. and when a believer steps out in faith and begins doing what He says to do, you then begin to see the truth and be set free. its as if a blindfold is being slowly removed. theres always the day you look at the waves and sink, and all you need do is call out Like Peter " Lord save me" and He is there as He promises to restore us, set us Back in the Boat, and continue instructing us gently " Oh you of Little faith...why did you doubt".....
when we really understand who Jesus is and His power, we see a glimpse of why Peter said " Lord if it is you call me out on the water and i will come"....Jesus says " It is I , come" and peter Leaps out of the Boat and walks on the water with Jesus for a Moment until the waves and winds distract His veiw Looking at Jesus.....for a Moment He forgets Jesus Power, But even in doubt,,,,He doesnt forget Jesus Mercy and abilityto save
it really is about walking, even if its a first step , its about the change of Mind toi commit to following the Lord, because thats what He said and Like He said " anyone who will choose to do Gods will, will understand of My doctrine that it comes from God and Not Man" thats true and its Life changing and faith building like nothing else. even if were sinking, He is there for those who follow after Him. He will never forsake us. but you are absoilutely correct its the fight of Our lives....eternally its a good thing God sent the commander with the Battle plan and instructed His people so well and prepared us for the enemies assault
Yet your soul shall be saved,would you agree?So then the spirit was made perfect and that Is the part of us that GOD sees but In the flesh we are In the process of renewing our minds so that we can prove the good and acceptable and perfect will of GOD and thats the part of us that will suffer the consequences of disobedience,right?
A
Yet your soul shall be saved,would you agree?So then the spirit was made perfect and that Is the part of us that GOD sees but In the flesh we are In the process of renewing our minds so that we can prove the good and acceptable and perfect will of GOD and thats the part of us that will suffer the consequences of disobedience,right?
Sin is defined by the Law.
Salvation is defined by Christ Jesus.
Yes the body is what suffers the consequences of sin. However can your body suffer and your soul and spirit stay unaffected?
One of the most powerful statement in the bible is "Jesus wept"
I believe our soul weeps when we sin and rejoices when we turn back to the Light and walk again with His holy spirit.
A
I believe the confession of sin is like pulling up a weed from the garden of your heart.
Some weeds are new and little and easily pulled. Some have grown a really long time and have roots around New seedlings God has growing within you.
You can cut off the stalk but if you don't carefully work out the roots it grows back. If you yank out the whole plant it uproots the good plants.
For example, making money....in itself is not a bad thing but often it becomes an idol, we think our job or our work is what provides for us not seeing God's hand in our lives and how it is actually Him giving us opportunity to work, good health that we can work, etc.
You have to take away the idolatry and relance on money, but keep the good work effort,
Not sure that makes any sense.
Anyway as for your question..,I would refer to the verses that say God begins a good work in you and is able to finish it.
We may not be sinless but we can strive to be mature and able to discern good from evil by exercising our senses. God grants wisdom to those who ask with a pure heart,
Jesus died to wash us clean and restore our relationship with God who then teaches us to live godly lives, part of that is teaching us what sins we need to uproot from our hearts. This is a process because we have spiritual strongholds that war against the knowledge of God's healing truth and love.
Some weeds are new and little and easily pulled. Some have grown a really long time and have roots around New seedlings God has growing within you.
You can cut off the stalk but if you don't carefully work out the roots it grows back. If you yank out the whole plant it uproots the good plants.
For example, making money....in itself is not a bad thing but often it becomes an idol, we think our job or our work is what provides for us not seeing God's hand in our lives and how it is actually Him giving us opportunity to work, good health that we can work, etc.
You have to take away the idolatry and relance on money, but keep the good work effort,
Not sure that makes any sense.
Anyway as for your question..,I would refer to the verses that say God begins a good work in you and is able to finish it.
We may not be sinless but we can strive to be mature and able to discern good from evil by exercising our senses. God grants wisdom to those who ask with a pure heart,
Jesus died to wash us clean and restore our relationship with God who then teaches us to live godly lives, part of that is teaching us what sins we need to uproot from our hearts. This is a process because we have spiritual strongholds that war against the knowledge of God's healing truth and love.
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N
welp the truth has been said already here in detail....
but not by those who lie (even if unknowingly) about Gods character and the gospel
im washing my hands of this thread
those who desire to remain under the law are pretty much blind to reproof it seems
too desperate to establish their own righteousness
ignoring the sacrifice of Jesus
romans 9
30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;
33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
Romans 10
10 Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.
2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above
but not by those who lie (even if unknowingly) about Gods character and the gospel
im washing my hands of this thread
those who desire to remain under the law are pretty much blind to reproof it seems
too desperate to establish their own righteousness
ignoring the sacrifice of Jesus
romans 9
30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;
33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
Romans 10
10 Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.
2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above
N
welp the truth has been said already here in detail....
but not by those who lie (even if unknowingly) about Gods character and the gospel
im washing my hands of this thread
those who desire to remain under the law are pretty much blind to reproof it seems
too desperate to establish their own righteousness
ignoring the sacrifice of Jesus
romans 9
30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;
33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
Romans 10
10 Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.
2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above
but not by those who lie (even if unknowingly) about Gods character and the gospel
im washing my hands of this thread
those who desire to remain under the law are pretty much blind to reproof it seems
too desperate to establish their own righteousness
ignoring the sacrifice of Jesus
romans 9
30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;
33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
Romans 10
10 Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.
2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above
last bump to tear down that typical strawmen
Well said.
I don’t want to derail the thread but just so you would knowI was looking at the line where you had said that one of the most powerful statements In the bible Is JESUS wept.
I see what you mean when you say that the body Is also affected but I would say It In a different way and say that your body shows what can be seen by men.
I don’t want to derail the thread but just so you would know
I was looking at the line where you had said that one of the most powerful statements In the bible Is JESUS wept.I see what you mean when you say that the body Is also affected but I would say It In a different way and say that your body shows what can be seen by men.