Stave Two of "A Christmas Carol"

For some reason, probably user error, I could not italicize the title of the novella in the title to this thread. Anyway, if anyone had time to read the second stave, here is the thread to discuss it. A few things stand out upon this rereading:

1. The Ghost of Christmas Past tells Scrooge he has come for Scrooge's welfare. Scrooge thinks to himself that a good night's sleep might be more conducive to his welfare. The Ghost says "Your reclamation then!" Reclamation is not a pleasant experience.

2. The scene of Belle's house with her children could be lifted out of the 1840s and placed squarely in 2016, beautifully written piece of domesticity.

3. I like the way the Ghost of Christmas Past is depicted as sometimes a creature with one leg, sometimes one arm, etc. I think Dickens means that our memories are sometimes piecemeal and not 100% accurate.

He could of fallen apart after 7 years...

What do you mean? Specify 'he' if you would be so kind.

The "Reclamation" bit caught my eye too. I wonder what he meant? Scrooge reclaiming himself or somebody/somebodies else reclaiming Scrooge?

I should think it is God reclaiming Scrooge. I suppose it could be debated whether or not Dickens was a Christian, but I believe him to have been. If it were left to Scrooge, he would most certainly not reclaim himself. He was content to go on being a covetous old sinner.

Even if Dickens was not a believer, the cultural context would make him prone to word it that way.

Yes, of course. I don't know why I am not getting e-mail notifications to this thread. I did not realize you had replied. Since you are a Calvinist, the story seems to go along with predestination in a way, because Scrooge certainly was not spiritually minded in the least. He is given this experience against his will.

I've seen so many versions of this story that I meld them all together, lol.

My favorite versions are, The Muppets and the one Rich Little made in the 80's, he played all the characters as famous people and it was really funny.

Sorry to distract from the original post.

No, that's quite alright. I am a little surprised Desdichado responded. I thought everyone probably forgot to read the second stave. I have a warm place in my heart for the musical with Albert Finney, Scrooge. I know a lot of people dislike it. Alec Guinness is a hilarious Marley. I haven't seen the Rich Little one.

What can I say? I'm a man of my word.

I should hope so, since you ARE a man of the cloth.

Yes, I would say it does. At that particular period in history, elements of Calvinist thought were more fashionable among Christians. The overall scope of the story does not appear to be intentionally Calvinist, but definitely intentionally Christian.

What I found most interesting (and it clashes with all the films I have seen) was Fezziwig's party. Most films tend to embellish young Scrooge's enjoyment of the party. What I saw was a kernel of the lonely man he would become.

How did you see the young Scrooge being lonely? The part talked about his good friend and how attached he was, and what a good time Fezziwig gave them. The main thing about the party that stands out and no film really addresses, is that the party was given for all of the servants that are kind of misused by Fezziwig's business neighbors.

I would say that Scrooge's reclamation is due to his free will at the end of the story, but I am jumping ahead.

Or what appears to be free will to our limited understanding. This is actually a point of contention among Calvinists.

I guess I'll table discussing Stave 4 for Stave 4 and just maintain it's a well-written redemption story that relies on no particular hermeneutic

Hmmm. I must have missed that. Dang. I suppose I was taken more by present Scrooge's reaction to the whole affair and the lack of pro-longed attention paid to his younger self.

I doubt Dickens had any doctrinal opinions in mind while writing it, other than redemption. I can see where Scrooge is lonely as a child at school, but seemed to be well adjusted as a young man. So, perhaps he reverted to his childhood loneliness as an older adult.

I don't have to read the book I've had it read to me since before I could remember every year at Christmas. The two things that stuck out to me this read-through was (speaking of the book in it's entirety) How Dickens is lauded for his realism, and yet, it is a book dealing greatly with the supernatural!! What the...? The second thing specific to Stave Two is Scrooge's reaction to Fezziwig.Who doesn't want to know Fezziwig? he's a great character and Scrooge's reaction is surprising to say the least. He actually defends his generosity, showing some of the first signs of softening.

I think the realism comes into the descriptions of the Cratchitts and their home life, as well as the description of Belle's homelife with her children. The domestic scenes are very realistic. So much so, they can pretty much be transferred over into the present day. I love the bit about the family being momentarily startled that the baby may have swallowed a toy turkey. I think we've all experienced that in our families.

That's fantastic that you have it read to you every year. That's a lovely tradition.

Thank God he didn't. Consciously attempted theological allegories are typically lame pieces of writing. The beauty of Scrooge's ultimate redemption is that it's fantastical, but entirely relatable. The reader is left to assume it's a salvation story no matter what their theological persuasion and there is nothing to get hung up on.

That interpretation fits very well with much of Dickens' writing. He placed a great importance on childhood events. I didn't even think of that.

I think Dickens probably place so much importance on childhood because of his own being so tumultuous. As Wordsworth says, "the child is the father of the man". This tends to be true, for better or worse.

Yes, I totally agree that he writes VERY realistically. My point was kind of from a literary standpoint, a lot of lit. junkies don't believe in the supernatural, and yet THEY are the ones that laud Dickens for his realism. I have always wondered how he gets away with the sticky-sweet morals in his stories...and does it with style! They're SO real. (I also love the part where the baby was thought to have swallowed the toy turkey...brilliant! )