Salvation is a Free Gift.

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

FollowerofShiloh

Well-known member
Jan 24, 2024
2,985
503
113
Is the gospel that you preach a spiritual gospel? If so, no one that has not been born spiritually cannot understand you.
Jesus Christ Lived, Died, Buried, Resurrected, and at the Right hand of God now is my Gospel.
 

rogerg

Well-known member
Jul 13, 2021
3,334
489
83
Actually, it was you who provided the Scripture of Jesus telling us He is obeying the Will of the Father.
And I am saying He is doing it by Choice not because He is forced to do it.
You're now asking for a functional breakdown of the composition of the Godhead.

This was your question :" How do you define the Trinity? "
And at this point, I'm done.
 

FollowerofShiloh

Well-known member
Jan 24, 2024
2,985
503
113
You're now asking for a functional breakdown of the composition of the Godhead.

This was your question :" How do you define the Trinity? "
And at this point, I'm done.
I said Jesus chose to obey and you went off onto the trinity tangent about me claiming other gods.

It was you who created this rabbit trail.
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
12,918
5,186
113
Look at Galatians that you quote.

we believe that we might be justified.
That is what Paul is saying by working out your salvation.

Thanks for confirming my verses (y)
He also quoted that Gods work in us is that we will and do of his good pleasure

seems god still has a lot of work to do to get some to the point to Will and do of zgods good pleasure and will the Will comes first and many seem dead set against lifting even a pinky lol
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
12,918
5,186
113
All should be brought to scripture, and see what scripture says.
what principle do you see here ?

“And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?

Whosoever cometh to me, and heareth my sayings, and doeth them, I will shew you to whom he is like: he is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock.

But he that heareth, and doeth not, is like a man that without a foundation built an house upon the earth; against which the stream did beat vehemently, and immediately it fell; and the ruin of that house was great.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭6:46-49‬ ‭KJV‬‬

does it sound anything like this ?

“Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls. But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.”
‭‭James‬ ‭1:21-22‬ ‭KJV‬‬

We want to build on the foundation of the rock
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
56,328
26,356
113
@Magenta

But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

- 2 Thessalonians 2:13-15 (KJV)
Yes exactly: chosen. Not left to your own devices to let you decide whether you will believe or not even if you are not chosen. You said yourself that chosen equals elect, and that all who believe are elect. Given that definition, it is not possible to have someone choose to believe who was not elected in the first place.
 

PaulThomson

Well-known member
Oct 29, 2023
2,047
266
83
Show where Judas was drawn by the Father.
New International Version
“No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them, and I will raise them up at the last day.

New Living Translation
For no one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them to me, and at the last day I will raise them up.

English Standard Version
No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.

Berean Standard Bible
“No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day.

Berean Literal Bible
No one is able to come to Me unless the Father, the one having sent Me, draws him, and I will raise him up in the last day.

King James Bible
No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Judas came to Jesus amd became one of His twelve disciples. Jesus said this was only possible if the Father drew Him.
 

PaulThomson

Well-known member
Oct 29, 2023
2,047
266
83
Wait - I just realized you said co-equal to God instead of Him just being God. Do you believe there is more than one God?
God is the ever-existing divine government of three ever-existing Persons. Each of those three Persons are ever-existing. Each of the three Persons are co-equally in their ever-existence.
 

FollowerofShiloh

Well-known member
Jan 24, 2024
2,985
503
113
I didnt see where he claimed such a thing. Let him speak for himself.
Why am I not surprised about that after reading a conglomerate series of posts made by you so I could understand your stance on such topics?

I am more than convinced that if Jesus Christ introduced my side of the discussion as fact that you would oppose Him as well.
 

FollowerofShiloh

Well-known member
Jan 24, 2024
2,985
503
113
He also quoted that Gods work in us is that we will and do of his good pleasure

seems god still has a lot of work to do to get some to the point to Will and do of zgods good pleasure and will the Will comes first and many seem dead set against lifting even a pinky lol
Agreed 100% with that assessment (y)
 

GRACE_ambassador

Well-known member
Feb 22, 2021
2,991
1,418
113
Midwest
op: Salvation is a FREE Gift?

Absolutely! Amen!! Hallelujah!!! Praise The Lord's Holy Name!!!!:

"Salvation: The Qualifications

A long time ago a man asked the question, “What must I do to be saved?” (Acts 16:30).
First of all, God saves the following kind of people: “sinners” (Rom. 3:23), “ungodly”
(Rom. 4:5), those “without strength” (Rom. 5:6), His “enemies” (Rom. 5:10).


If you do not think that you are any of the above, you cannot be saved. If you still think
you’re good enough, you cannot be saved. God does not save good people, or people
trying to earn their way to heaven. You must come to God God’s way.


Salvation: The Basis

“For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; being
Justified Freely By His Grace Through The Redemption that is
In Christ Jesus(Rom. 3:23-24).
God saves sinners on this basis:

1). Freely. It does not cost the sinner anything. It is free. You can’t earn salvation by
being good, and you cannot lose salvation by being bad. God does not require any works
from a sinner. Good works do not make it easier, and bad works do not make it harder
to get saved. It is FREE, FREE, FREE! God justifies the sinner freely. Justification is the
act whereby God declares a person righteous, even though that person in himself is not
righteous.


2). By His Grace. That means that it comes from the heart of God without finding
anything in the recipient that would draw out His grace. Grace is all that God is free
to do for the undeserving sinner because Christ paid for our sins on the Cross. If we
have to work for our salvation, then salvation is not “by His grace.” If we can earn it,
why did He die?


3). Through the Redemption that is in Christ Jesus. Salvation is free to the sinner,
but it cost God everything! Free is not cheap. As a matter of fact, salvation is the
most expensive thing that has ever been paid. The cost of salvation was that
Almighty God had to become a man and die in the sinner’s place. The cost was
infinite! Webster defines “redemption” as follows:
“The act of procuring the deliverance of persons or things from the
possession and power of captors by the payment of an equivalent.”
Sin against an infinite God requires an infinite payment. No man or church or works
of any kind can pay this debt. The debt has been Fully Paid for by the Lord Jesus
Christ. It would be the highest insult to offer to God your good works or religion
in view of the fact that His Own Son suffered on the Cross to pay for your sins.
So to answer the question, “What must I do to be saved?” Stop making excuses, and
place yourself in the “Qualifications” category, and receive the gift of salvation God
has provided.


“Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou Shalt Be Saved”
(Acts 16:31).
“I declare unto you The Gospel…by which also ye Are Saved…
Christ died for our sins…was buried, and…rose again the third
day” (I Cor. 15:1-4)."

(D Sheridan from Bible Study Articles)

a b c GRACE.png
Amen! Hallelujah!! Praise The Lord Jesus Christ Forevermore!!!
 

PaulThomson

Well-known member
Oct 29, 2023
2,047
266
83
Yes, and a spiritually dead person cannot spiritually "heareth". Notice that only by Jesus "speak(ing)" specifically to someone are
they able to hear His words. He does not speak those words to everyone.

[Jhn 10:27 KJV] 27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
The Greek word akouO can mean either to hear or to listen. Do you think their is any difference in meaning between hear and listen?

What is the difference in meaning between
[Jhn 10:27 KJV] 27" My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me",
AND
[Jhn 10:27 KJV] 27 "My sheep listen to my voice, and I know them, and they follow me" ?
 

PaulThomson

Well-known member
Oct 29, 2023
2,047
266
83
You shouldn't use man's standards for assessing/comparing God's gifts - totally inappropriate.
As I said previously, the gift is spiritual life from spiritual death. A spiritually dead person, just as a
physically dead person, cannot give to themselves spiritual life, neither are they able to comprehend anything at all - they are completely at the mercy of God in order for them to be MADE alive, along with being given a renewed mind. Until and unless that happens, they remain dead.
That's the problem with Calvinism. Any time the plain sense of some biblical text or concept contradicts calvinism, the calvinist rejects the plain sense for their calvinist system/gnosis.
 

PaulThomson

Well-known member
Oct 29, 2023
2,047
266
83
Where do you read that they didn't receive the Holy Spirit. I read that they didn't know about the Holy Spirit -
that they didn't know about Him - that doesn't mean He hadn't indwelled them, only that they didn't know that He did - that's different.
That is a fair and interesting point. Does it say that after Paul prayed for them they were filled with, or they received, the Holy Spirit ? It says "The holy Spirit came upon them and they spoke in tongues and prophesied." So it seems they were filled, and they could have had the Holy Spirit already, I guess.
 

rogerg

Well-known member
Jul 13, 2021
3,334
489
83
That is a fair and interesting point. Does it say that after Paul prayed for them they were filled with, or they received, the Holy Spirit ? It says "The holy Spirit came upon them and they spoke in tongues and prophesied." So it seems they were filled, and they could have had the Holy Spirit already, I guess.
Yes, being indwelled is a different thing, I believe. The coming upon them was manifested in their speaking in tongues
and prophesying. Being indwelled manifests in someone being born-again and receiving the fruits of the Spirit.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
12,428
4,096
113
This is true, yet some silly person has given you a thumbs down. If a person cannot even understand and believe this fundamental truth, they are surely lost.
Some here apply human rationale to Salvation, and in some magical way, if you accept Salvation, it means you worked for it. LOL.
It is the most foolish thing I have ever heard. They have no biblical proof other than that they said it.

Salvation is a Supernatural Gift; therefore, Human reasoning, rationality, and secular understanding can't make sense of it, no more than they can fully know God's Divine Nature.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
12,428
4,096
113
My story? I was saved by God and not by me.

that the problem n one is saying they saved themselves. That is a FALSE NARRATIVE. Accepting a free GiFT is not a work
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
12,428
4,096
113
Can a spiritually dead person "receive" a spiritual gift? No, just as a physically dead person cannot "receive" a
physical gift. A dead person cannot receive anything. They must be made spiritually alive, but then being made alive, that gift is therefore already in their possession.

[Eph 2:1 KJV] 1 And you [hath he quickened], who were dead in trespasses and sins;

[Col 2:13 KJV] 13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
can a spiritually Dead Person hear the Gospel? can a Dead person have faith through grace? Your reasoning is unbiblical.