The Pharisee's
- Thread starter Monnkai
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
The leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees is still alive today in our midst. Jesus said to beware of them and their teaching.
These are the "works" salvation mindset. These mindsets clash with Jesus and in His finished work of grace for the believer. They have the "appearance" of godliness but deny the power as they rely on themselves and what "they" do to maintain salvation and position before men. ( these are the very mindsets that Jesus was forever battling against as they refused His grace and Person )
Matthew 16:6 (NASB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] And Jesus said to them, "Watch out and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees."
Matthew 16:12 (NASB)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] Then they understood that He did not say to beware of the leaven of bread, but of the teaching of the Pharisees and Sadducees.
We are saved by grace through faith alone and in the security of that trust in our Lord, His life flows in and through us to do His good works to help a hurting and dying world as well as our fellow brethren.
These are the "works" salvation mindset. These mindsets clash with Jesus and in His finished work of grace for the believer. They have the "appearance" of godliness but deny the power as they rely on themselves and what "they" do to maintain salvation and position before men. ( these are the very mindsets that Jesus was forever battling against as they refused His grace and Person )
Matthew 16:6 (NASB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] And Jesus said to them, "Watch out and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees."
Matthew 16:12 (NASB)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] Then they understood that He did not say to beware of the leaven of bread, but of the teaching of the Pharisees and Sadducees.
We are saved by grace through faith alone and in the security of that trust in our Lord, His life flows in and through us to do His good works to help a hurting and dying world as well as our fellow brethren.
ISBE is always a good resource to go to > Pharisees - International Standard Bible Encyclopedia
On that point only do I agree
Most dont touch on the teaching of the Sadducees
Mat 16:6 Then Jesus said unto them,
Take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.
The leaven being their doctrine
Mat 16:12 Then understood they how that he bade them not beware of the leaven of bread,
but of the doctrine of the Pharisees andof the Sadducees.
These say there is no resurrection
Mat 22:23 The same day came to him the Sadducees, which say that there is no resurrection, and asked him
Not adressing the Pharisees so much as they confess what the Sadducees deny
Acts 23:8 For the Sadducees say that there is no resurrection, neither angel, nor spirit:
but the Pharisees confess both.
So to beware of the leaven of the Sadducees would be to beware of their particular doctrine which is like leaven and will leaven the whole lump
Of which leaven (or doctrine) could easily creep back into the church (after Christ's resurrection) even as Paul points out that same is being said by some of among them already
1Cr 15:12... how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead?
As Jesus said to beware of it, Paul addresses that same (among them).
Just as Hymenaeus and Philetus in 1 Ti 2:18 similarly
1 Ti 2:13 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.
A bit different but as it pertains to the resurrection (past already) is just another way of saying no up and coming one, and so "no resurrection" even there (as is how I would regard what is being pointed out here)
Given both are often shown trying to entangle Jesus in his talk and erring its good to put some sort of difference between them, in this one moreso the Sadducees as opposed to the scribes and Pharisees who sit in the seat of Moses Mat 23:2 whose leaven is hypocricy (which say but do not) Luke 12:21 & Mat 23:3 as both are shown. Although you hear some of the sect of the Pharisees believed (not much of anything on the Sadducees doing so) but of the Pharisees (of which Paul was one) later teaching the brethren that they needed to be circumcised and keep the law Acts 15:5 which did not go out from the apostles to the Gentiles as James writes in Acts 15:19-24.
The whole post not directed to you but off your one point in the above where I can agree
Most dont touch on the teaching of the Sadducees
Mat 16:6 Then Jesus said unto them,
Take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.
The leaven being their doctrine
Mat 16:12 Then understood they how that he bade them not beware of the leaven of bread,
but of the doctrine of the Pharisees andof the Sadducees.
These say there is no resurrection
Mat 22:23 The same day came to him the Sadducees, which say that there is no resurrection, and asked him
Not adressing the Pharisees so much as they confess what the Sadducees deny
Acts 23:8 For the Sadducees say that there is no resurrection, neither angel, nor spirit:
but the Pharisees confess both.
So to beware of the leaven of the Sadducees would be to beware of their particular doctrine which is like leaven and will leaven the whole lump
Of which leaven (or doctrine) could easily creep back into the church (after Christ's resurrection) even as Paul points out that same is being said by some of among them already
1Cr 15:12... how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead?
As Jesus said to beware of it, Paul addresses that same (among them).
Just as Hymenaeus and Philetus in 1 Ti 2:18 similarly
1 Ti 2:13 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.
A bit different but as it pertains to the resurrection (past already) is just another way of saying no up and coming one, and so "no resurrection" even there (as is how I would regard what is being pointed out here)
Given both are often shown trying to entangle Jesus in his talk and erring its good to put some sort of difference between them, in this one moreso the Sadducees as opposed to the scribes and Pharisees who sit in the seat of Moses Mat 23:2 whose leaven is hypocricy (which say but do not) Luke 12:21 & Mat 23:3 as both are shown. Although you hear some of the sect of the Pharisees believed (not much of anything on the Sadducees doing so) but of the Pharisees (of which Paul was one) later teaching the brethren that they needed to be circumcised and keep the law Acts 15:5 which did not go out from the apostles to the Gentiles as James writes in Acts 15:19-24.
The whole post not directed to you but off your one point in the above where I can agree
P
I agree that you can definitely see there is a difference between the 3 groups that Jesus was dealing with.
I think that the leaven ( teaching ) of the Sadducees are still around today as the link that ember gave had this to say. There are many today that deny the existence of the spiritual world happening and try to nullify the work of the Holy Spirit with His gifts. So, anything that is of the "spiritual" nature is thrown out to them. It's the mindset of a modern day Sadducee. There is still to this day the mindset of the 4 examples below especially in the realm of #1 below.
Quote from ember's link on the Pharisees and Sadducees.
1. They were extremely self-sufficient to the point of denying God's involvement in everyday life.
2. They denied any resurrection of the dead (Matthew 22:23; Mark 12:18-27; Acts 23:8).
3. They denied any afterlife, holding that the soul perished at death, and therefore denying any penalty or reward after the earthly life.
4. They denied the existence of a spiritual world, i.e., angels and demons (Acts 23:8).
I think that the leaven ( teaching ) of the Sadducees are still around today as the link that ember gave had this to say. There are many today that deny the existence of the spiritual world happening and try to nullify the work of the Holy Spirit with His gifts. So, anything that is of the "spiritual" nature is thrown out to them. It's the mindset of a modern day Sadducee. There is still to this day the mindset of the 4 examples below especially in the realm of #1 below.
Quote from ember's link on the Pharisees and Sadducees.
1. They were extremely self-sufficient to the point of denying God's involvement in everyday life.
2. They denied any resurrection of the dead (Matthew 22:23; Mark 12:18-27; Acts 23:8).
3. They denied any afterlife, holding that the soul perished at death, and therefore denying any penalty or reward after the earthly life.
4. They denied the existence of a spiritual world, i.e., angels and demons (Acts 23:8).
They were members of different sects of Jews around the time of Christ. There were also Essenes, which John the Baptist was purportedly a member. The Essenes were early sort of monks, who tried to keep pure and keep the laws of Moses by separating themselves from society. They also supposed kept the scrolls safe, and the ones discovered at Qum'ran are supposed to be sacred scrolls that they hid and kept safe.
The Pharisees, on the other hand, also tried to keep the law, but were very involved in the running of the Sanhedrin and hung out in the temple. They tended, according to Jesus, to be very self-righteous legalists. They kept the law strictly, down to tithing on mint and dill, but played money games by giving their parents subsistance money, when the laws of Moses said to care for aging parents. Hypocrites would also fit the definition of some, but not all of them.
Joseph of Arimathea was a Pharisee, but humble enough to seek out the Rabbi Jesus and to ask questions about the way to be saved. He also gave Jesus his tomb, after he was crucified. Modern Jewry is descended from the Pharisees, meaning they look at the laws of Moses in a similar way to the NT Pharisees. Except, they added so much to the word of God in their commentaries or Talmud, which really had not much to do with the Books of Moses. At one point there is a command to not boil and young goat in his mother's milk. From that small passage, all the Jewish kosher laws about combining milk and meat happened. (Deut. 14:1)
The Sadducees were sad, you see! Because they didn't believe in a resurrection or angels or heavenly beings. Paul was a Pharisee, and when he went on trial for no reason, he said it was because he believed in the resurrection, and he was on trial for that. In other words, he was accusing the Sanhedrin and the ruling authorities of putting his Jewsh beliefs on trial, because he was preaching that Jesus was risen from the dead.
"Now when Paul perceived that one part were Sadducees and the other Pharisees, he cried out in the council, “Brothers, I am a Pharisee, a son of Pharisees. It is with respect to the hope of the resurrection of the dead that I am on trial.” 7 And when he had said this, a dissension arose between the Pharisees and the Sadducees, and the assembly was divided. 8 For the Sadducees say that there is no resurrection, nor angel, nor spirit, but the Pharisees acknowledge them all. 9 Then a great clamour arose, and some of the scribes of the Pharisees' party stood up and contended sharply, “We find nothing wrong in this man. What if a spirit or an angel spoke to him?” 10 And when the dissension became violent, the tribune, afraid that Paul would be torn to pieces by them, commanded the soldiers to go down and take him away from among them by force and bring him into the barracks." Acts 23:6-10
After the fall of Jerusalem, the Saducees disappeared from the world. That is why today, we only hear about Pharisees, not Sadducees.
There was also a fourth group, the zealots, who had as its goal to overthrow Rome and to restore the throne of David in Jerusalem. It obviously didn't happen in the natural, and sadly, this group missed the the fact that Jesus did fulfill the prophecy and sits on the throne of David.
Finally, today, being called a Pharisee is an insult. It means being legalistic and not have a relationship with Christ. The other groups are just names of sects, no insults are associated with them.
The Pharisees, on the other hand, also tried to keep the law, but were very involved in the running of the Sanhedrin and hung out in the temple. They tended, according to Jesus, to be very self-righteous legalists. They kept the law strictly, down to tithing on mint and dill, but played money games by giving their parents subsistance money, when the laws of Moses said to care for aging parents. Hypocrites would also fit the definition of some, but not all of them.
Joseph of Arimathea was a Pharisee, but humble enough to seek out the Rabbi Jesus and to ask questions about the way to be saved. He also gave Jesus his tomb, after he was crucified. Modern Jewry is descended from the Pharisees, meaning they look at the laws of Moses in a similar way to the NT Pharisees. Except, they added so much to the word of God in their commentaries or Talmud, which really had not much to do with the Books of Moses. At one point there is a command to not boil and young goat in his mother's milk. From that small passage, all the Jewish kosher laws about combining milk and meat happened. (Deut. 14:1)
The Sadducees were sad, you see! Because they didn't believe in a resurrection or angels or heavenly beings. Paul was a Pharisee, and when he went on trial for no reason, he said it was because he believed in the resurrection, and he was on trial for that. In other words, he was accusing the Sanhedrin and the ruling authorities of putting his Jewsh beliefs on trial, because he was preaching that Jesus was risen from the dead.
"Now when Paul perceived that one part were Sadducees and the other Pharisees, he cried out in the council, “Brothers, I am a Pharisee, a son of Pharisees. It is with respect to the hope of the resurrection of the dead that I am on trial.” 7 And when he had said this, a dissension arose between the Pharisees and the Sadducees, and the assembly was divided. 8 For the Sadducees say that there is no resurrection, nor angel, nor spirit, but the Pharisees acknowledge them all. 9 Then a great clamour arose, and some of the scribes of the Pharisees' party stood up and contended sharply, “We find nothing wrong in this man. What if a spirit or an angel spoke to him?” 10 And when the dissension became violent, the tribune, afraid that Paul would be torn to pieces by them, commanded the soldiers to go down and take him away from among them by force and bring him into the barracks." Acts 23:6-10
After the fall of Jerusalem, the Saducees disappeared from the world. That is why today, we only hear about Pharisees, not Sadducees.
There was also a fourth group, the zealots, who had as its goal to overthrow Rome and to restore the throne of David in Jerusalem. It obviously didn't happen in the natural, and sadly, this group missed the the fact that Jesus did fulfill the prophecy and sits on the throne of David.
Finally, today, being called a Pharisee is an insult. It means being legalistic and not have a relationship with Christ. The other groups are just names of sects, no insults are associated with them.
I don't know that the sadducees were atheist. They just did not believe in the additional oral instruction the pharisees believed in.
The sadducees and pharisees had no problem working together when it suited their purpose (their concerted effort to get rid of Messiah). Yet in Acts 23 Paul used the dissension between the sadducees and Pharisees at his trial.
The sadducees and pharisees had no problem working together when it suited their purpose (their concerted effort to get rid of Messiah). Yet in Acts 23 Paul used the dissension between the sadducees and Pharisees at his trial.
the Sadducees were a Priestly Class that were mainly concerned with the Temple. The Chief Priest was always a Sadducee. They also tended to come from the main ruling families. When the Temple was destroyed in 70ad they ceased to exist.
They were not Athiests. They only recognised the first five books of the OT as being the word of God. As a result they
Didn't believe in an afterlife because none is mentioned in them.
The Pharisees were a group that formed a large part of the Sanhedrin. This was what could be called a Parliament.
In modern Israel the Knessit is based on the Sanhedrin. The Pharisees believed in all the Scriptures but also followed a large body of oral teachings given by various Rabbis. This oral teaching was supposed to have been originally given by God to Moses and was added to down the centuries. It was eventually written down to preserve it during times of persecution. Today it is still the central part of the Jewish faith and is known as the Talmud. Modern Judaism stems
from the teachins and practices of the Pharisees.
They were not Athiests. They only recognised the first five books of the OT as being the word of God. As a result they
Didn't believe in an afterlife because none is mentioned in them.
The Pharisees were a group that formed a large part of the Sanhedrin. This was what could be called a Parliament.
In modern Israel the Knessit is based on the Sanhedrin. The Pharisees believed in all the Scriptures but also followed a large body of oral teachings given by various Rabbis. This oral teaching was supposed to have been originally given by God to Moses and was added to down the centuries. It was eventually written down to preserve it during times of persecution. Today it is still the central part of the Jewish faith and is known as the Talmud. Modern Judaism stems
from the teachins and practices of the Pharisees.
The Pharisees were the religious leaders of Israel,that is why Jesus went so boldly against them,for they should of known better.
The Pharisees are an example of one who is worldly,claiming to follow God,and they liked attention,and their high positions of power,which the Bible said,they loved the praises of men,more than the praises of God.
The world suffers with what I call cribitis,or the baby crib syndrome.Even though they left the baby crib,they still carry that attitude with them throughout their life,wah,notice me,give me attention,and when we are saved we are to give up the baby crib syndrome,for John the baptist said,I must decrease,but Jesus must increase,for it is about giving glory to God,and not the attention to us,in wanting attention for our self.
Mat 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Our righteousness must exceed that of the Pharisees,and we are not to give glory to our self for living for God,like the Pharisees,wanting people to think we are something special for living for God,apart from what God said of us being special,for He made us special,which the Pharisees had that attitude,but Jesus said they have their reward,for if we give glory to God we will live for eternity,but if we give glory to our self wanting people to think we are special,for living for God,than we have our reward for that attitude,and we cannot be with God.
We have to abandon the baby crib,and not carry it around with us anymore,which although the world left the baby crib,they still carry the baby crib attitude with them,wah,notice me,give me attention,for the world never truly leaves the baby crib.
The Pharisees are an example of one who is worldly,claiming to follow God,and they liked attention,and their high positions of power,which the Bible said,they loved the praises of men,more than the praises of God.
The world suffers with what I call cribitis,or the baby crib syndrome.Even though they left the baby crib,they still carry that attitude with them throughout their life,wah,notice me,give me attention,and when we are saved we are to give up the baby crib syndrome,for John the baptist said,I must decrease,but Jesus must increase,for it is about giving glory to God,and not the attention to us,in wanting attention for our self.
Mat 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Our righteousness must exceed that of the Pharisees,and we are not to give glory to our self for living for God,like the Pharisees,wanting people to think we are something special for living for God,apart from what God said of us being special,for He made us special,which the Pharisees had that attitude,but Jesus said they have their reward,for if we give glory to God we will live for eternity,but if we give glory to our self wanting people to think we are special,for living for God,than we have our reward for that attitude,and we cannot be with God.
We have to abandon the baby crib,and not carry it around with us anymore,which although the world left the baby crib,they still carry the baby crib attitude with them,wah,notice me,give me attention,for the world never truly leaves the baby crib.