A little food for thought.

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massorite

Junior Member
Jan 3, 2015
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#21
Do you think Satan drowned?
Of course not but even though Satan was cast down to the earth he was never changed to flesh like the fallen angels were and neither were the angels who fallowed after Satan who were also cast down to the earth from heaven were changed to have bodies of flesh and bone. In fact Satan even today still has limited access to heaven.
Job 1:6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them.
Job 1:7 And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
Job 2:1 Again there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them to present himself before the LORD.

Job 2:2 And the LORD said unto Satan, From whence comest thou? And Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
 

massorite

Junior Member
Jan 3, 2015
544
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#22
It could be one of Noah's sons wives had that DNA in her and we know that after the flood it speaks of all 3 sons and their genealogy that were different ethnic groups.

Gen 10:2 The sons of Japheth; Gomer, and Magog, and Madai, and Javan, and Tubal, and Meshech, and Tiras.

Gen 10:6 And the sons of Ham; Cush, and Mizraim, and Phut, and Canaan.

Gen 10:21 Unto Shem also, the father of all the children of Eber, the brother of Japheth the elder, even to him were children born.
Gen 10:22 The children of Shem; Elam, and Asshur, and Arphaxad, and Lud, and Aram.

All 3 sons all had children that covered different ethnic groups.

But if all came from Adam and Eve then where did the different ethnic groups come from unless they were all in Adam and Eve.

Unless at the tower of Babel where God confounded their language and gave them different languages He also changed their DNA to produce the different ethnic groups so they would not come together as one to try to do their own thing going against the operation of God on earth hindering it.

Goliath was 6 cubits which a cubit is 1.5 feet so he was 9 feet tall.

The tallest person recorded which they say is irrefutable is Robert Wadlow at 8 feet 11.1 inches.

Which the 10 tallest people are all over 8 feet.

But it would seem like the giants back then would be healthier and like a normal person at their height and normal body function than the things that cause people to be tall today.
There is no scriptural proof that any of Noahs son's wives had any DNA from the giants.
Sorry but I disagree because there is no scriptural proof that any of the fallen angels survived the flood. Otherwise the Word of God would have told us. To say that some of the fallen angels survived the flood is to make an assumption about the Word of God with absolutely no scriptural proof.
Gen 6:1 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,
Gen 6:2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.
Gen 6:3 And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.
Gen 6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
Gen 6:5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
Gen 6:6 And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.
Gen 6:7 And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

Gen 6:8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD.
These verses above are the only verses that speak on the subject of the Giants until after the flood and there is not one single mention about any of the fallen angels or giants surviving the flood.
I can prove to you that the Anakims were not descendants of any giants that lived before the Flood came and killed every air breathing soul on the face of the earth. One reason is that the giants as a tribe with a name is never mentioned in the above verses I quoted. So we have no idea if they even were a "tribe" and there is no blood line recorded in scripture to fallow. But we do know that the word Nephilim in the Hebrew is speaking about "fallen angels"
The Giants mentioned in the Word Of God after the flood were not the descendants of the giants from before the Flood they were the descendant of someone who simply appears in scripture just once and is never mentioned again. His name was Arba.
Jos 14:15 And the name of Hebron before was Kirjatharba; which Arba was a great man among the Anakims. And the land had rest from war.

Jos 15:13 And unto Caleb the son of Jephunneh he gave a part among the children of Judah, according to the commandment of the LORD to Joshua, even the city of Arba the father of Anak, which city is Hebron.
Jos 21:11 And they gave them the city of Arba the father of Anak, which city is Hebron, in the hill country of Judah, with the suburbs thereof round about it.

This person just suddenly appears in scripture from no where with no birth date and no family or kin folk mentioned, no father, no brothers or sisters, no mother and so on. Yet the above scriptures quoted tell us that this person Arba was the Father of Anak who had sons who were giants who became known as the tribe of the Anakims.
As for the word "come" in Num.13:33 the word "come" speaks of the present verses the word "came" which speaks of the past. If Num. 13:33 was referring to the giants of Genesis it would be using the word "came" to tell us clearly that the giants of the book of Joshua were the descendant of the giants of Genesis.
Num 13:33 And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.
There is no scriptural proof that Arba ever lived on the earth before the flood. But we know he lived on the earth after the flood.
If we look at the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah we can see that the men in the town were trying to reach the angels to have intercourse with them. The fact that they were so nonchalant about it goes to show that we can argue it was not uncommon in those days to see angels.

This is open for discussion but the first giants was born from intercourse between mankind and fallen angels so maybe it happened the same way the second time.
Great point. I believe that it is possible that there were more angels that did fall after the flood. We know for sure that Arba gave birth to Anak who gave birth to the Anakims. But that is just my opinion because there is no scriptural proof of such an event.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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#23
A little food for thought.
If there were giants in the earth in Genesis 6 and the flood came and killed every air breathing creature on the face of the earth except for the animals in the ark and the 8 souls of the family of Noah. Where did the Giants come from in the book of Joshua if Giants in Genesis 6 all died in the flood???
Look to the Bible for answers. When the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men. Angels are sons of God, having sexual relations with women. Their offspring were giants. After the flood, these giants pop up again. More perversion. They will pop up again in the tribulation before the return of the King.

Genesis 6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
18,975
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#24
Gen 7:7 And Noah went in, and his sons, and his wife, and his sons' wives with him, into the ark, because of the waters of the flood.
There is no record of anyone else entering the Ark except for what is spoken of in Gen 7:7. No in-laws or any other extended family recorded.
Did you not understand that one of Noah's family may have had ancestors who were?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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#25
Worrying about how things such as this are possible is the result if one insists on interpreting the Bible literally, as if a reporter was there taking down events and reporting them as history. There's much deeper meaning to much of what is written in Genesis in my opinion.
it's still literally true.
but it's not written as 'history' -- that's not the primary purpose of the book. it's a book that reveals God to man. so it's literal history, not fables, but it's not written in order to communicate history' it's written to communicate God. it is written to testify of Christ. yes, much deeper meaning. yes, metaphor and analogy. yes, literal, actual events and absolute truth. what's given, and what's left out, isn't recorded or left out in order to teach us about history. it's recorded to teach us about Christ, and it's left out because it's unnecessary to teach us about Christ. that is the 'deeper meaning' -- HE is the deeper meaning.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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#26
Look to the Bible for answers. When the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men. Angels are sons of God, having sexual relations with women. Their offspring were giants. After the flood, these giants pop up again. More perversion. They will pop up again in the tribulation before the return of the King.

Genesis 6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
so what were men doing in Sodom, and Gibeah, and what was in Jericho? why were these places and everyone, men, women, children and animals, utterly destroyed?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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#27
The same place the antedeluvial giants did?

Corrupted angels survived the flood.
we can make the connection here:

For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit, by whom also He went and preached to the spirits in prison, who formerly were disobedient, when once the Divine longsuffering waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water.
(1 Peter 3:18-20)
could be that 'the spirits in prison' who were disobedient in the days of Noah are the very corrupted angels to whom Christ preached, having been imprisoned by God since that time because of what they did. i've heard that preached -- if that's the case, then no they didn't drown lol, but the knowledge of what they did could have been kept through Noah's family, or even revealed again. you might not necessarily need angels to produce giants - and Goliath may not really be on the same level as what things walked the earth before the flood.
this whole line of thought would explain something puzzling about Sodom - how the whole city came out to surround Lot's house, nephew of Abraham, who had the most powerful military in the region ((he'd rescued the whole city not all too long before, remember)). did they do this sort of thing for every single man that happened by the city? or was there something about two angels that was very desirable to them? Jesus says in the last days ((as @John146 was alluding to)) it will be as the days of Noah and as the days of Lot. so He puts these two together, the things man did in Sodom and the things man did before the flood. great wickedness. not simple homosexuality.


a lot of supposition, but something to think about :unsure:
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
31,524
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#28
Gen 7:7 And Noah went in, and his sons, and his wife, and his sons' wives with him, into the ark, because of the waters of the flood.
There is no record of anyone else entering the Ark except for what is spoken of in Gen 7:7. No in-laws or any other extended family recorded.
his son's wives would be 'daughters in-law' ;)

that's who the finger is typically pointed out, when one takes the tack that nephilimism is a genetic trait. at least one of them, it's thought, must have carried the supposed gene. mother of Canaan ((re: Genesis 9:25)) is a favored guess
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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#29
so what were men doing in Sodom, and Gibeah, and what was in Jericho? why were these places and everyone, men, women, children and animals, utterly destroyed?
They were “sodomites,” homosexual. They wanted to have sex with the angels. The whole place had been perverted.

Yes?
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
12,429
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#30
we can make the connection here:
For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit, by whom also He went and preached to the spirits in prison, who formerly were disobedient, when once the Divine longsuffering waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water.
(1 Peter 3:18-20)
could be that 'the spirits in prison' who were disobedient in the days of Noah are the very corrupted angels to whom Christ preached, having been imprisoned by God since that time because of what they did. i've heard that preached -- if that's the case, then no they didn't drown lol, but the knowledge of what they did could have been kept through Noah's family, or even revealed again. you might not necessarily need angels to produce giants - and Goliath may not really be on the same level as what things walked the earth before the flood.
this whole line of thought would explain something puzzling about Sodom - how the whole city came out to surround Lot's house, nephew of Abraham, who had the most powerful military in the region ((he'd rescued the whole city not all too long before, remember)). did they do this sort of thing for every single man that happened by the city? or was there something about two angels that was very desirable to them? Jesus says in the last days ((as @John146 was alluding to)) it will be as the days of Noah and as the days of Lot. so He puts these two together, the things man did in Sodom and the things man did before the flood. great wickedness. not simple homosexuality.


a lot of supposition, but something to think about :unsure:
Yes, the last kingdom is iron mixed with miry clay. These giants pop up again prepared to do battle with the returning King.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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#31
There is no scriptural that Arba ever lived on the earth before the flood. But we know he lived on the earth after the flood.
i like your reasoning :)

i wanted to say, it's possible, however, that Arba refers to someone before the flood. the Hebrew ((i'm told)) doesn't have a word for 'grandfather' or 'great grandfather' etc -- and generations are sometimes telescoped. so by saying Arba was the father of Anak, it *could* mean that Arba was many generations removed from Anak - the thing that is primarily being stressed is that Anak was descended from Arba.

who knows? maybe Ham's wife was a daughter of Arba?

no proof. but there's not disproof -- there's possibility, and inference.

in agreement with your reasoning tho -- i don't need to know. everything necessary for me to know about these things is written here. what is written is enough for me to gain the knowledge of God that is the purpose of these things being recorded. it's comprised of history, but not written in order to be history.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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#32
They were “sodomites,” homosexual. They wanted to have sex with the angels. The whole place had been perverted.

Yes?
yes. but is that all?

i mean, there's sodomy in practically every city in America today. there's been sodomy all over Europe for centuries, for thousands of years in some places. why haven't any of these been utterly destroyed by fire, yet?

i've listened to a lot of different preachers talk about Sodom. 50, more. maybe 75. i don't count. it seems that it occurs to almost none of them that there is anything more to be learned here than 'homosexuality is terrible bad' -- but i think, seriously?? Sodom & Gomorrah is a local extinction event. Gibeah is the extinction of almost the entire tribe of Benjamin. the flood is a world-wide extinction event. homosexuality is wickedness, but there is something incredibly evil happening in these places, and they are definitely linked together in scripture. in Judges 19-21, the people of Israel see parts of the body of a woman and immediately know they have to completely obliterate everything in the place it happened. they say nothing has been seen like this since before they came out of Egypt. do you think there was no homosexuality any of them had ever heard about before whatever it was in Gibeah? i don't think that's what they are recognizing has happened -- not by seeing a piece of a dead woman. does not fit.

((IMO))

God is patient. you could tell me, God is just being very merciful & patient. i can't - and won't even try to - argue with that :)
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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#33
yes. but is that all?

i mean, there's sodomy in practically every city in America today. there's been sodomy all over Europe for centuries, for thousands of years in some places. why haven't any of these been utterly destroyed by fire, yet?

i've listened to a lot of different preachers talk about Sodom. 50, more. maybe 75. i don't count. it seems that it occurs to almost none of them that there is anything more to be learned here than 'homosexuality is terrible bad' -- but i think, seriously?? Sodom & Gomorrah is a local extinction event. Gibeah is the extinction of almost the entire tribe of Benjamin. the flood is a world-wide extinction event. homosexuality is wickedness, but there is something incredibly evil happening in these places, and they are definitely linked together in scripture. in Judges 19-21, the people of Israel see parts of the body of a woman and immediately know they have to completely obliterate everything in the place it happened. they say nothing has been seen like this since before they came out of Egypt. do you think there was no homosexuality any of them had ever heard about before whatever it was in Gibeah? i don't think that's what they are recognizing has happened -- not by seeing a piece of a dead woman. does not fit.

((IMO))

God is patient. you could tell me, God is just being very merciful & patient. i can't - and won't even try to - argue with that :)
I teach a study on the promised seed of Genesis 3:15 and how Satan attacks the seed line through murder or sexual perversion. I believe this to be the case in Sodom. Almost every OT story is linked to the battle over the seed line.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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#34
I teach a study on the promised seed of Genesis 3:15 and how Satan attacks the seed line through murder or sexual perversion. I believe this to be the case in Sodom. Almost every OT story is linked to the battle over the seed line.
personally i think it's related to Genesis 3 ((what isn't? lol)), but by way of trying to defeat death without God, the giver of life. attempting to bypass the tree of life, as though to sneak into the wedding feast without the proper garment. that's definitely where a ton of medical research is attempting to drive towards, today, as always -- but knowledge increases, even while certain knowledge is lost. we, as a people, are getting better at it, inasmuch as we can while denying spiritual realities, narrowly focusing on the flesh. man has for quite a long time tried to extend their own lives artificially, dreaming of living forever in their corruption. :(
 
Mar 28, 2016
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#35
A little food for thought.
If there were giants in the earth in Genesis 6 and the flood came and killed every air breathing creature on the face of the earth except for the animals in the ark and the 8 souls of the family of Noah. Where did the Giants come from in the book of Joshua if Giants in Genesis 6 all died in the flood???
It has to do more with perspectives. Like at times we want to remove a speck for another eyes. All the time having a log in our own.

Some seemed like grasshoppers but God is in the business of changing the perspective.

A person would first have to define giants as those renown. . Giants of faith like David who slew a tall guys that seemed like grasshoppers with a sling shot.. There were superstars as sons of God before and after that procreated with the what was called common people, daughters of faithless men. They did not heed the commandment not to be unevenly yoked. One person was killed for spilling the seed .

Today the spiritual seed of Christ has been fulfilled. The genealogy of the Son of man, Jesus is complete.

On the last day he will destroy the entire corrupted creation .No more floods
 

massorite

Junior Member
Jan 3, 2015
544
108
43
#36
his son's wives would be 'daughters in-law' ;)

that's who the finger is typically pointed out, when one takes the tack that nephilimism is a genetic trait. at least one of them, it's thought, must have carried the supposed gene. mother of Canaan ((re: Genesis 9:25)) is a favored guess
Impossible! First of all the number 8 is the number that represents "A New Beginning" and one of the purposes of the flood was to wipe out the blood line of the giants on earth. Second, where is the scriptural proof that one or more of the wives of the sons of Noah had the blood of the giants in them?? Nowhere is it written in the Word Of God that one of the wives had the blood of a giant running in her veins. And what about God in this equation?? Does anybody think for a minute that God would have allowed a creator he was trying to wipe out slide by Him and get on the Ark to survive the flood, have more giants who would once again start a campaign to destroy men once more???? That would be saying that God does not have control and that Satan is so slick that he was able to out smart God. It would also mean that God doesn't have the ability to know what He allowed to board the Ark. The whole idea that one of the sons of Noah's wives had the blood of the giants in them is simply false with absolutely no scripture to re-enforce that concept.
 

massorite

Junior Member
Jan 3, 2015
544
108
43
#37
Look to the Bible for answers. When the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men. Angels are sons of God, having sexual relations with women. Their offspring were giants. After the flood, these giants pop up again. More perversion. They will pop up again in the tribulation before the return of the King.

Genesis 6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
I agree. As it was in the days of Noah?????
 

massorite

Junior Member
Jan 3, 2015
544
108
43
#38
i like your reasoning :)

i wanted to say, it's possible, however, that Arba refers to someone before the flood. the Hebrew ((i'm told)) doesn't have a word for 'grandfather' or 'great grandfather' etc -- and generations are sometimes telescoped. so by saying Arba was the father of Anak, it *could* mean that Arba was many generations removed from Anak - the thing that is primarily being stressed is that Anak was descended from Arba.

who knows? maybe Ham's wife was a daughter of Arba?
no proof. but there's not disproof -- there's possibility, and inference.


in agreement with your reasoning tho -- i don't need to know. everything necessary for me to know about these things is written here. what is written is enough for me to gain the knowledge of God that is the purpose of these things being recorded. it's comprised of history, but not written in order to be history.
I agree!
 

massorite

Junior Member
Jan 3, 2015
544
108
43
#39
Did you not understand that one of Noah's family may have had ancestors who were?
No I do not understand when folks try to put into scripture that which is not mentioned in scripture. Again I say, There is not one single word in the Bible about how any of the wives of the sons of Noah could have had the blood of the giants running in their veins. So if it is not written in the Word of God, it is not.
Impossible! First of all the number 8 is the number that represents "A New Beginning" and one of the purposes of the flood was to wipe out the blood line of the giants on earth. Second, where is the scriptural proof that one or more of the wives of the sons of Noah had the blood of the giants in them?? Nowhere is it written in the Word Of God that one of the wives had the blood of a giant running in her veins. And what about God in this equation?? Does anybody think for a minute that God would have allowed a creator he was trying to wipe out slide by Him and get on the Ark to survive the flood, have more giants who would once again start a campaign to destroy men once more???? That would be saying that God does not have control and that Satan is so slick that he was able to out smart God. It would also mean that God doesn't have the ability to know what He allowed to board the Ark. The whole idea that one of the sons of Noah's wives had the blood of the giants in them is simply false with absolutely no scripture to re-enforce that concept.
 
Dec 30, 2019
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#40
A little food for thought.
If there were giants in the earth in Genesis 6 and the flood came and killed every air breathing creature on the face of the earth except for the animals in the ark and the 8 souls of the family of Noah. Where did the Giants come from in the book of Joshua if Giants in Genesis 6 all died in the flood???
The flood only effected Noah's world. Today we would call that a biodiverse ecosystem. The only plants and animals on the Ark were from the Middle East. Not the whole world. Science and history goes a long way to help us understand what we read in our Bible. God gives us LOTS of evidence to work with. He wants us to know what HE has done.

There are 32 verses in Genesis 1. Yet a million science books would only begin to explain to us what God did in those 32 verses. This is why John 21:25 tells us: "I suppose the whole world could not contain the books that would be written." The Bible is infinite. One letter, even one stroke of the pen is infinite and every book in the world could not contain the wisdom, knowledge and understanding. They talk about the libraries in Heaven and how big they are and how the angels maintain them for us. So we have an answer for every question and a solution for any problem we will ever have.