Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

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FlyingDove

FlyingDove

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#441
Dec 27, 2017
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#441
preston39 said:
F...,

You are just wrong...baptism is required for completion of the cleansing of sin process....even Christ said so.... What is it of this you do not understand;

"Repent and be baptized in order to receive the Holy spirit".

"Go though out the world and baptize in the name of The Father and The Son and The Holy Spirit....."et al.

Those are directive writings which must be accepted in their own.

This is a new age religion argument that began in the...oh...sixties. Before that it was never questioned. The Bible does not change ...people do. his is an example...for convenience.
Click to expand...
2 Tim 1:14 Refer's to the Holy Spirit as a guard & deposit.

2 Cor 5:5, Eph 1:14 & 2 Cor 1:22. Refer to the Holy Spirit as "the earnest" = Pledge.

Eph 1:13, 2 Cor 1:22 & Eph 4:30 Refer to the Holy Spirit as a seal.

Romans 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
(NOTE: God doesn't go back on His Word)

Ok, salvation is SEALED by the Baptism of the Holy Spirit. Placing one into the Body of Christ. Only Christ can baptise with the Holy Spirit.

Acts 10:44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.

45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,

47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?

(NOTE: These gentiles were baptised into the Body of Christ & SEALED with/by God the Holy Spirit. They get water baptized after they receive the eternal SEAL of salvation)

Supporting salvation SEAL scriptures:

2 Tim 1:14 The Holy Spirit who dwells within us, guard the good deposit entrusted to you
(NOTE: The Holy Spirit dwelling within us. Is God's deposit & guards us until the day of redemption. Also see Ehp 4:30 below. When our corruptible bodies are changed to the incorruptible)

2 Cor 5:5 God, who also hath given unto us the "earnest" of the Spirit
(NOTE: God's Holy Spirit dwelling within us is the earnest. Earnest translated from the Greek word: arrabon. Also means a pledge)

Eph1:14 Which is the "earnest" of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession
(NOTE: God's Holy Spirit dwelling within us is the earnest/pledge. That God's us has made us. Soon Christ will redeem what he purchased on the cross)

2 Cor 1:22 Who hath also "sealed us" & "given the earnest" of the Holy Spirit in our hearts
(NOTE: God has placed His Holy Spirit in the believers heart. As a pledge & a SEAL until the soon coming day of our redemption)

Eph 1:13 salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were "sealed" with that holy Spirit of promise,
(NOTE: As soon as we believed. God sealed up with a promise, His Holy Spirit).

Eph 4:30 grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are "sealed" unto the day of redemption
(NOTE: Believers are SEALED with God's Holy Spirit. It a pomise & a guard the soon Christ will come for us)
 
preston39

preston39

Senior Member
#442
Dec 18, 2017
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#442
FlyingDove said:
2 Tim 1:14 Refer's to the Holy Spirit as a guard & deposit.

2 Cor 5:5, Eph 1:14 & 2 Cor 1:22. Refer to the Holy Spirit as "the earnest" = Pledge.

Eph 1:13, 2 Cor 1:22 & Eph 4:30 Refer to the Holy Spirit as a seal.

Romans 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
(NOTE: God doesn't go back on His Word)

Ok, salvation is SEALED by the Baptism of the Holy Spirit. Placing one into the Body of Christ. Only Christ can baptise with the Holy Spirit.

Acts 10:44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.

45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,

47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?

(NOTE: These gentiles were baptised into the Body of Christ & SEALED with/by God the Holy Spirit. They get water baptized after they receive the eternal SEAL of salvation)

Supporting salvation SEAL scriptures:

2 Tim 1:14 The Holy Spirit who dwells within us, guard the good deposit entrusted to you
(NOTE: The Holy Spirit dwelling within us. Is God's deposit & guards us until the day of redemption. Also see Ehp 4:30 below. When our corruptible bodies are changed to the incorruptible)

2 Cor 5:5 God, who also hath given unto us the "earnest" of the Spirit
(NOTE: God's Holy Spirit dwelling within us is the earnest. Earnest translated from the Greek word: arrabon. Also means a pledge)

Eph1:14 Which is the "earnest" of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession
(NOTE: God's Holy Spirit dwelling within us is the earnest/pledge. That God's us has made us. Soon Christ will redeem what he purchased on the cross)

2 Cor 1:22 Who hath also "sealed us" & "given the earnest" of the Holy Spirit in our hearts
(NOTE: God has placed His Holy Spirit in the believers heart. As a pledge & a SEAL until the soon coming day of our redemption)

Eph 1:13 salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were "sealed" with that holy Spirit of promise,
(NOTE: As soon as we believed. God sealed up with a promise, His Holy Spirit).

Eph 4:30 grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are "sealed" unto the day of redemption
(NOTE: Believers are SEALED with God's Holy Spirit. It a pomise & a guard the soon Christ will come for us)
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F...,

None have relevance to the requirement of baptism.
 
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K

KelbyofGod

Senior Member
#443
Oct 8, 2017
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#443
Baptism (full submersion in water, in the name of Jesus Christ, for remission of sins, by a GOD-ordained minister) is indeed a requirement.

Romans 6:3-5 tells us that Baptism is how we are linked to Jesus' death, and IF so linked to his death are also in expectation of his resurrection.

One way to understand the importance of baptism is to earnestly consider the importance of Jesus' death.

Jesus had sin on him (not that he sinned himself, but was carrying the burden of OUR sins). Death is what removed those sins from him. Jesus went down into death with sin on him...but he came up out of death without sin. That's what baptism (the likeness of Jesus' death) does for us. We go down into the water of baptism with sins...and come up without sins. (a.k.a born or made new)

Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:


Love in Jesus to you all,
Kelby
 
Johnny_B

Johnny_B

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Mar 18, 2017
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Acts 3:18-20 “But what God foretold by the mouth of all the prophets, that his Christ would suffer, he thus fulfilled.19 Repent therefore, and turn back, that your sins may be blotted out,20 that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord, and that he may send the Christ appointed for you, Jesus,”

Acts 4:4 “But many of those who had heard the word believed, and the number of the men came to about five thousand.”

Acts 5:12-15 “Now many signs and wonders were regularly done among the people by the hands of the apostles. And they were all together in Solomon's Portico.13 None of the rest dared join them, but the people held them in high esteem.14 And more than ever believers were added to the Lord, multitudes of both men and women,15 so that they even carried out the sick into the streets and laid them on cots and mats, that as Peter came by at least his shadow might fall on some of them.”

Acts 5:29-32 “But Peter and the apostles answered, “We must obey God rather than men.30 The God of our fathers raised Jesus, whom you killed by hanging him on a tree.31 God exalted him at his right hand as Leader and Savior, to give repentance to Israel and forgiveness of sins.32 And we are witnesses to these things, and so is the Holy Spirit, whom God has given to those who obey him.”

Peter and the apostles told the council what they were preaching with no mention of baptism.

Acts 6:7 “And the word of God continued to increase, and the number of the disciples multiplied greatly in Jerusalem, and a great many of the priests became obedient to the faith.”

The number of disciples multiplied greatly and no mention of baptism.

Acts 8:9-13 “But there was a man named Simon, who had previously practiced magic in the city and amazed the people of Samaria, saying that he himself was somebody great.10 They all paid attention to him, from the least to the greatest, saying, “This man is the power of God that is called Great.”11 And they paid attention to him because for a long time he had amazed them with his magic.12 But when they believed Philip as he preached good news about the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.13 Even Simon himself believed, and after being baptized he continued with Philip. And seeing signs and great miracles performed, he was amazed.”

The first mention of baptism since Acts 2:38, but no mention of being baptized in Jesus name, only that the good news about the kingdom and the name of Jesus and the result they were baptized and Simon believed and was baptized, no mention of baptism being the cause of remission of sins.

Acts 8:16 “for he had not yet fallen on any of them, but they had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.”

The first mention of baptism in Jesus name but it is not associated with the remission of sin with it.

Acts 8:35-37 “Then Philip opened his mouth, and beginning at this Scripture, preached Jesus to him.36 Now as they went down the road, they came to some water. And the eunuch said, “See, here is water. What hinders me from being baptized?”
37 Then Philip said, “If you believe with all your heart, you may.”
And he answered and said, “I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.”

Acts 9:17-19 “So Ananias departed and entered the house. And laying his hands on him he said, “Brother Saul, the Lord Jesus who appeared to you on the road by which you came has sent me so that you may regain your sight and be filled with the Holy Spirit.”18 And immediately something like scales fell from his eyes, and he regained his sight. Then he rose and was baptized;19 and taking food, he was strengthened.

For some days he was with the disciples at Damascus. 20 And immediately he proclaimed Jesus in the synagogues, saying, “He is the Son of God.”…..27 But Barnabas took him and brought him to the apostles and declared to them how on the road he had seen the Lord, who spoke to him, and how at Damascus he had preached boldly in the name of Jesus.28 So he went in and out among them at Jerusalem, preaching boldly in the name of the Lord…..31 So the church throughout all Judea and Galilee and Samaria had peace and was being built up. And walking in the fear of the Lord and in the comfort of the Holy Spirit, it multiplied.

Acts 10:43 “To him all the prophets bear witness that everyone who believes in him receives forgiveness of sins through his name.”

If baptism was for the remission of sins, why did Philip ask the Eunuch before he was baptized, “if you believe with all your heart” Believing is the matter for repentance, baptism is not repentance for remission of sin. If that is what Peter was teach with the 119 standing with him, they would they not have taught the same. Keep reading the book of Acts and there is no mention of baptism for the remission of sins as the emphasis. There is more mention of faith and believing for the remission of sins and salvation.
 
Johnny_B

Johnny_B

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Mar 18, 2017
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#449

Here is the first mention of being baptized in Jesus name, with no mention of remission of sins associated to it and it is Peter doing the teach so if what he said in Acts 2:38 was the true or the way of salvation Peter should of repeated what he taugh in Acts 2:38 especially sense he is bring the Gospel to the Gentiles for the firt time it would be very important that he teach them the true Gospel. So if baptism is the way to receive the remission of sins Peter should of taught that here to the Gentiles.

Acts 10:44-48 “While Peter was still saying these things, the Holy Spirit fell on all who heard the word.45 And the believers from among the circumcised who had come with Peter were amazed, because the gift of the Holy Spirit was poured out even on the Gentiles.46 For they were hearing them speaking in tongues and extolling God. Then Peter declared,47 “Can anyone withhold water for baptizing these people, who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?”48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to remain for some days.”
 
preston39

preston39

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Magenta said:
To fulfill all righteousness. Jesus said so (Matt 3:15) :)
Click to expand...

M...,

You got it.

Key word is ...."us".

Why can't others get the same message...I wonder...?
 
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preston39

preston39

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Dec 18, 2017
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Johnny_B said:

Here is the first mention of being baptized in Jesus name, with no mention of remission of sins associated to it and it is Peter doing the teach so if what he said in Acts 2:38 was the true or the way of salvation Peter should of repeated what he taugh in Acts 2:38 especially sense he is bring the Gospel to the Gentiles for the firt time it would be very important that he teach them the true Gospel. So if baptism is the way to receive the remission of sins Peter should of taught that here to the Gentiles.

Acts 10:44-48 “While Peter was still saying these things, the Holy Spirit fell on all who heard the word.45 And the believers from among the circumcised who had come with Peter were amazed, because the gift of the Holy Spirit was poured out even on the Gentiles.46 For they were hearing them speaking in tongues and extolling God. Then Peter declared,47 “Can anyone withhold water for baptizing these people, who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?”48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to remain for some days.”
Click to expand...
J...,

That is rather finite; What if the translators didn't put it in the right spot/sequence of presentation?
 
Magenta

Magenta

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Jul 3, 2015
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#454
Johnny_B said:

Here is the first mention of being baptized in Jesus name, with no mention of remission of sins associated to it and it is Peter doing the teach so if what he said in Acts 2:38 was the true or the way of salvation Peter should of repeated what he taugh in Acts 2:38 especially sense he is bring the Gospel to the Gentiles for the firt time it would be very important that he teach them the true Gospel. So if baptism is the way to receive the remission of sins Peter should of taught that here to the Gentiles.

Acts 10:44-48 “While Peter was still saying these things, the Holy Spirit fell on all who heard the word.45 And the believers from among the circumcised who had come with Peter were amazed, because the gift of the Holy Spirit was poured out even on the Gentiles.46 For they were hearing them speaking in tongues and extolling God. Then Peter declared,47 “Can anyone withhold water for baptizing these people, who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?”48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to remain for some days.”
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No remission of sins mentioned? Well, back up a few verses, why don't you?

And we are witnesses of all things which He (Jesus) did both in the land of the Jews and in Jerusalem, whom they killed by hanging on a tree. ​
[SUP]
40 [/SUP]Him God raised up on the third day, and showed Him openly,

[SUP]41 [/SUP]not to all the people, but to witnesses chosen before by God, even to us who ate and drank with Him after He arose from the dead. ​
[SUP]
42 [/SUP]And He commanded us to preach to the people, and to testify that it is He who was ordained by God to be Judge of the living and the dead. ​
[SUP]
43 [/SUP]To Him all the prophets witness that, through His name,
whoever believes in Him will receive remission of sins.”​
 
O

oldethennew

Banned
#455
Feb 28, 2016
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#455
for the both of us: we have been led to do what Jesus 'did and his disciples and etc'...
it's really a done deal for us, and really, why would there ever be any argument to the contrary???
why would anyone in their right mind want to 'not do what Jesus did and what He came here
to teach us'???

we have learned through experience and analogy, that one's up-bringing is the KEY...this is so very sad!!!
just take a REAL LOOK around and be honest with yourselves - hard, but doable!!!
 
O

oldethennew

Banned
#456
Feb 28, 2016
11,311
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Magenta said:
No remission of sins mentioned? Well, back up a few verses, why don't you?

And we are witnesses of all things which He (Jesus) did both in the land of the Jews and in Jerusalem, whom they killed by hanging on a tree. ​
[SUP]
40 [/SUP]Him God raised up on the third day, and showed Him openly,

[SUP]41 [/SUP]not to all the people, but to witnesses chosen before by God, even to us who ate and drank with Him after He arose from the dead. ​
[SUP]
42 [/SUP]And He commanded us to preach to the people, and to testify that it is He who was ordained by God to be Judge of the living and the dead. ​
[SUP]
43 [/SUP]To Him all the prophets witness that, through His name,
whoever believes in Him will receive remission of sins.”​
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======================================

we Love this post sister Magenta, but the 'word' 'BELIEVES' entails a life of, as you know,
'total surrender of SELF and ALL that goes along with it', in this 'fallen-world that we are born into'...
 
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Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
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Jul 3, 2015
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oldethennew said:
we Love this post sister Magenta, but the 'word' 'BELIEVES' entails a life of, as you know,
'total surrender of SELF and ALL that goes along with it', in this 'fallen-world that we are born into'...
Click to expand...
The only baptism that is necessary for salvation is that of the Holy Spirit of God.

And this water symbolizes the baptism that now saves you—not the removal of dirt from the body, but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God. It saves you through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, Who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, with angels, authorities, and powers subject to Him. 1 Peter 3:21-22

Please don't interpret that to mean I argue against being water baptized.
You would be very wrong to think such a thing :)
 
DJ2

DJ2

Senior Member
#458
Apr 15, 2017
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#458
Magenta said:
The only baptism that is necessary for salvation is that of the Holy Spirit of God.

And this water symbolizes the baptism that now saves you—not the removal of dirt from the body, but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God. It saves you through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, Who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, with angels, authorities, and powers subject to Him. 1 Peter 3:21-22

Please don't interpret that to mean I argue against being water baptized.
You would be very wrong to think such a thing :)
Click to expand...
Could you explain the Holy Spirit of God baptism?
When does it happen?
How do we know it has happened?
 
preston39

preston39

Senior Member
#459
Dec 18, 2017
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#459
Magenta said:
The only baptism that is necessary for salvation is that of the Holy Spirit of God.

And this water symbolizes the baptism that now saves you—not the removal of dirt from the body, but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God. It saves you through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, Who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, with angels, authorities, and powers subject to Him. 1 Peter 3:21-22

Please don't interpret that to mean I argue against being water baptized.
You would be very wrong to think such a thing :)
Click to expand...

M...,

Not true...not true. If so then show me the scriptures.

Contrar;

[FONT=&quot]John 3:5....... Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and [/FONT]of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Peter 3:21....[FONT=&quot] The like figure whereunto [/FONT]even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:


et al...requires.
 
DJ2

DJ2

Senior Member
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Apr 15, 2017
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#460
Magenta said:
Jesus fulfilled all righteousness for us. Or do you wanna go get crucified, too?
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If Jesus was baptized to fulfill all righteousness, "must" we not do the same?

I have no idea what your "do you wanna go get crucified" comment means.
 
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