Can We be Saved if We Don't Love God/Jesus?

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arthurfleminger

Well-known member
Aug 18, 2021
1,405
771
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#1
Scripture, the Bible tells us that all of God's commandments are fulfilled by love of God and neighbor. John, Cha 14:15 Jesus tells us, “If you love me, you will keep my commandments." And, at the Last Supper, Jesus asked His Disciples, "How can you say you love Me if you don't obey My commandments."

So, can we be saved if we don't love Jesus and show our love by obeying His commandments?
 

arthurfleminger

Well-known member
Aug 18, 2021
1,405
771
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#2
The question at hand is, can you be saved without love for Jesus? Then, how do we show our love for Jesus?

Jesus puts great emphasis on showing our love for Him by living His words. John Cha 14:
Whoever has my commandments and observes them is the one who loves me. And whoever loves me will be loved by my Father, and I will love him and reveal myself to him.” Whoever loves me will keep my word, and my Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our dwelling with him. Whoever does not love me does not keep my words; yet the word you hear is not mine but that of the Father who sent me.
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
11,887
8,701
113
#3
So, can we be saved if we don't love Jesus and show our love by obeying His commandments?
We cannot. His commandments are to love Him and love others:


Matthew 22
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
 

ThewindBlows

Active member
Sep 30, 2019
227
89
28
#4
So, can we be saved if we don't love Jesus and show our love by obeying His commandments?
You put your Faith in The Gospel to be saved, Only the Blood of Jesus can take away sin. Without Faith it is impossible to please God

The question at hand is, can you be saved without love for Jesus? Then, how do we show our love for Jesus?
We Love him because he first Loved us, as to how you show that Love it would depend on the respect you had for the other, How does one show Love to their child or husband or wife, Its relationship is spiritual but you don't show them by doing things they hate, and you shouldn't judge love on performance

Here is the Key "God is Love" 1 John 4:8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.

The important thing is you must be born again, Then you can show the world the love of God through you because Christ is in you, and

Doing his fathers work shows Jesus love

Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

And Believing on Jesus shows his Father Love

The Just shall live by faith, You are free to Express your Love to God but where does your Love Come from

Wherefore I say unto thee, Her sins, which are many, are forgiven; for she loved much: but to whom little is forgiven, the same loveth little.
 
Mar 4, 2020
8,614
3,679
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#5
The question at hand is, can you be saved without love for Jesus? Then, how do we show our love for Jesus?

Jesus puts great emphasis on showing our love for Him by living His words. John Cha 14:
Whoever has my commandments and observes them is the one who loves me. And whoever loves me will be loved by my Father, and I will love him and reveal myself to him.” Whoever loves me will keep my word, and my Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our dwelling with him. Whoever does not love me does not keep my words; yet the word you hear is not mine but that of the Father who sent me.
1 John 4:7-21
7Dear friends, let us love one another, for love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. 8Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love. 9This is how God showed his love among us: He sent his one and only Son into the world that we might live through him. 10This is love: not that we loved God, but that he loved us and sent his Son as an atoning sacrifice for our sins. 11Dear friends, since God so loved us, we also ought to love one another. 12No one has ever seen God; but if we love one another, God lives in us and his love is made complete in us.

13This is how we know that we live in him and he in us: He has given us of his Spirit. 14And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son to be the Savior of the world. 15If anyone acknowledges that Jesus is the Son of God, God lives in them and they in God. 16And so we know and rely on the love God has for us.

God is love. Whoever lives in love lives in God, and God in them. 17This is how love is made complete among us so that we will have confidence on the day of judgment: In this world we are like Jesus. 18There is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love.

19We love because he first loved us. 20Whoever claims to love God yet hates a brother or sister is a liar. For whoever does not love their brother and sister, whom they have seen, cannot love God, whom they have not seen. 21And he has given us this command: Anyone who loves God must also love their brother and sister.
 
P

persistent

Guest
#6
The idea and or act of loving has always been problematic to me. It does seem to me now that I have prayed and meditated somewhat about loving God and neighbor that the actions are certainly vital. i.e. do unto others...In my life I can see I have certainly messed up a lot and like to look and see that others have also done the same. And then it's nice to read the bible and see that it doesn't mince words (depending on translation} when it comes to displaying for us some of the most egregious behavior of our species.
 

arthurfleminger

Well-known member
Aug 18, 2021
1,405
771
113
#7
As Christians we have the virtues of faith, hope, and love. But love is the greatest of all of these:

If I speak in the tongues of men and angels but have not love, I am only a gong or a clanging vymbal. If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have absolute faith so as to move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing.… 1 Corinthians 13

“What no eye has seen, what no ear has heard, and what no human mind has conceived” – the things God has prepared for those who love him ." 1 Corinthians 2
 
Nov 23, 2021
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#8
Scripture, the Bible tells us that all of God's commandments are fulfilled by love of God and neighbor. John, Cha 14:15 Jesus tells us, “If you love me, you will keep my commandments." And, at the Last Supper, Jesus asked His Disciples, "How can you say you love Me if you don't obey My commandments."

So, can we be saved if we don't love Jesus and show our love by obeying His commandments?
We don't much love anyone until we are saved WHEN " the Love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Spirit which is given to us. " Since it is given to us as a received ability He will work those things out in our lives. The Bible is very clear to keep yourselves in the Love of God praying in the Holy Spirit . Lest our hearts become hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. Indeed keep your heart with all diligence for out of it are the issues of life. It is not self-effort it is the love of God shed abroad in our hearts, you keeping yourself in the love of God by keeping your relationship with Him supernatural . He is keeping you by the power of God unto salvation and is committed to the work he began in you. He works in us to will and to do. So in a word yes it is possible to be saved but then being saved were are in covenant In the arm of your flesh and self will and effort . Forget it . Its all Him.
 

arthurfleminger

Well-known member
Aug 18, 2021
1,405
771
113
#9
It is clear that our salvation is dependent on obeying Jesus' commandments:

Jesus Became The Source of Salvation to Those That Obey "And having been made perfect, He became to all those who obey Him the source of eternal salvation..." (Hebrews 5:9).

Pretty clear teaching from the Bible!
 

Dirtman

Well-known member
Jul 19, 2022
1,151
441
83
#10
It is clear that our salvation is dependent on obeying Jesus' commandments:

Jesus Became The Source of Salvation to Those That Obey "And having been made perfect, He became to all those who obey Him the source of eternal salvation..." (Hebrews 5:9).

Pretty clear teaching from the Bible!
Ok, so what are his commands
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
12,803
5,147
113
#11
Scripture, the Bible tells us that all of God's commandments are fulfilled by love of God and neighbor. John, Cha 14:15 Jesus tells us, “If you love me, you will keep my commandments." And, at the Last Supper, Jesus asked His Disciples, "How can you say you love Me if you don't obey My commandments."

So, can we be saved if we don't love Jesus and show our love by obeying His commandments?
“Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us:

and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.

But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?

My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth. And hereby we know that we are of the truth, and shall assure our hearts before him.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭3:16-19‬ ‭KJV‬‬

it is by our deeds that we love it’s important to understand “ Thou shalt not kill “ is not a commandment of how to love “ it’s a commandment of what not to do

it relates to the gospel Gods true command, like this

“For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭13:9-10‬ ‭KJV‬‬

see keeping the law doesn’t mean we love others but doing harm to others proves we aren’t loving them it’s not thou shalt not , but it’s rather the thkngs jesus taught us to do that are his commands

forgiving people when they offend you is his commandment , being merciful to others is his commandment , sharing your plenty with the needy is his commandment if we move to what he told us to do , we won’t be doing anything like killing lying and cheating people because thats not love

it’s really important to know what Jesus said is his commandment not what Moses said

To make a distinction between this

“Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭3:19-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

That can’t save us

but what Christ had to say can save sinners and redeem us rather than executing judgement upon us for sin and holding us guilty

we have to understand who the one and only mediator is

“For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭2:5-6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

a mediator of a covenant is the one the only one who speaks the word of the covenant. He is between two parties that had a broken relationship the mediator is making a reconciliation between the two parties and both are obligated to honor the mediators word of reconciliation of the priorly broken relationship

Christian’s should all understand God became flesh and spoke his own word himself and those are his commandments

So what I’m saying is this is the command of God

“But I say unto you which hear, Love your enemies, do good to them which hate you, bless them that curse you, and pray for them which despitefully use you. And unto him that smiteth thee on the one cheek offer also the other; and him that taketh away thy cloke forbid not to take thy coat also. Give to every man that asketh of thee; and of him that taketh away thy goods ask them not again. And as ye would that men should do to you, do ye also to them likewise.

For if ye love them which love you, what thank have ye? for sinners also love those that love them. But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil.

Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful. Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven: give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall be given into your bosom.

For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭6:27-32, 35-38‬ ‭KJV‬‬

and this was the command of Moses

You can actually see Jesus change it when he says “ but I’m saying to you “ it’s important we understand who it is saying that

“Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:( Moses word )


but I say unto you, ( Gods word ) That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also. And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloke also. And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain. Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away. Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.

But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; that ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭5:38-45‬ ‭KJV‬‬


We need to start accepting the new testsment as Gods commandments the things he himself commanded and taught that’s his real love it’s not love to reaping to an enemy with equal revenge like Moses said eye for an eye tooth for a tooth life for a life “ that’s not love

love is to forgive transgressions , when someone wrongs us , to share with the poor rather than claim they are cursed , to be a good person towards others actually with our actions helping caring about like hey are family like the y sre someone God the father loves just as much as us

your post is a good one to raise but it’s also important to understand who God and what he said when he came as he had promised before

“Incline your ear, and come unto me: hear, and your soul shall live; and I will make an everlasting covenant with you, even the sure mercies of David.”
‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭55:3‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The law had already been given long before this

Hearken unto me, my people; and give ear unto me, O my nation: for a law shall proceed from me, and I will make my judgment to rest for a light of the people.

My righteousness is near; my salvation is gone forth, and mine arms shall judge the people; the isles shall wait upon me, and on mine arm shall they trust.”
‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭51:4-

See after Moses law Godnis through prophecy saying “ I’m going to come and speak my word hear me and live I’ll make my word a light for you and establish salvstion “

we need to hear Jesus word it’s when those promises came to pass

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:24‬ ‭

Jesus gave the commandments to Gods children prepared to receive The Holy Spirit Moses gave commands to hopeless sinners without hope of receiving the spirit of Christ in them

“knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, for whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭1:9-10‬ ‭KJV‬‬

That’s why it keeps telling them “ you better not kill and lie and cheat and steal or else “ that’s who they were and all they knew

we are of the other group being born in the spirit so we need to stay with our testament word and blood and remain in the doctrine of our lord

“Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.

If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:”
‭‭2 John‬ ‭1:9-10‬ ‭KJV‬‬
 

Everlasting-Grace

Well-known member
Dec 18, 2021
5,097
1,567
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#12
Your question is in my view backwards.

You can't LOVE jesus until you are saved.

We love because he first loved us..

so the answer is yes.. Because salvation comes first.
 
Nov 23, 2021
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#13
It is clear that our salvation is dependent on obeying Jesus' commandments:

Jesus Became The Source of Salvation to Those That Obey "And having been made perfect, He became to all those who obey Him the source of eternal salvation..." (Hebrews 5:9).

Pretty clear teaching from the Bible!
OK , I was asked this question So, can we be saved if we don't love Jesus and show our love by obeying His commandments?
The answer is of course YES . We are saved when we don't love Jesus and can't love Jesus. We are saved by obeying the command repent and believe the gospel. Abiding will do with obeying His Commands but we don't do it alone God works in us to will and to do faith which works by love, the Holy Spirit sheds the love of God abroad in our hearts
 

HealthAndHappiness

Well-known member
Jul 7, 2022
8,311
3,442
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Almost Heaven West Virginia
#14
Scripture, the Bible tells us that all of God's commandments are fulfilled by love of God and neighbor. John, Cha 14:15 Jesus tells us, “If you love me, you will keep my commandments." And, at the Last Supper, Jesus asked His Disciples, "How can you say you love Me if you don't obey My commandments."

So, can we be saved if we don't love Jesus and show our love by obeying His commandments?
Works

Nobody here has loved God with all of their heart, soul, strength at all times.
That is something that I strive for as a disciple, but failed many times. There is also a big difference between a disciple and a saved individual.
A true disciple will be saved.
A believer in Christ is saved, but not necessarily a disciple.

You will be saved when you place your faith/ believe on the Son of God. John 3:16.

That doesn't make you perfect. Disciples are not perfect either.
That doesn't mean that you follow the Lord or that you continue in His Word, as are two traits that make a believer a disciple.
Being a disciple requires WORKS.
Salvation excludes Works of any kind.

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast."

Ephesians 2
 
Nov 23, 2021
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#15
I suppose come out of her my people that ye be not partaker of her plagues, could be considered a command. Well you know where that goes, hopefully.
 

Blade

Well-known member
Nov 19, 2019
1,640
579
113
#16
Scripture, the Bible tells us that all of God's commandments are fulfilled by love of God and neighbor. John, Cha 14:15 Jesus tells us, “If you love me, you will keep my commandments." And, at the Last Supper, Jesus asked His Disciples, "How can you say you love Me if you don't obey My commandments."

So, can we be saved if we don't love Jesus and show our love by obeying His commandments?
For me kinda hard to love someone you never met don't know anything about and then He found you. Just LOVE Jesus did we when we were saved? And for me no my salvation is not based on me keeping His word/obeying how ever one wishes to say it. He told the 12 if you love me....when? The 1st day they meet Him? Nope how much time had passed before this? I'd say its a tad different walking living with Him 24/7 that how you and me live today.

So much of this "talk" comes not from those just saved but have been for many years now. So its so easy to say YES we must love JESUS first and keep all His words.. that we never read don't know anything about.. huh? Yeah all these burdens come from man. He found you.. what He not you what He started He will finish. He said it so He has to do it.

And its a personal walk.... He loves you .. walks with you teaches you everything (that we allow Him to).. on and on. Some fall in love fast others it can take years but it happens.
 

HealthAndHappiness

Well-known member
Jul 7, 2022
8,311
3,442
113
Almost Heaven West Virginia
#17
For me kinda hard to love someone you never met don't know anything about and then He found you. Just LOVE Jesus did we when we were saved? And for me no my salvation is not based on me keeping His word/obeying how ever one wishes to say it. He told the 12 if you love me....when? The 1st day they meet Him? Nope how much time had passed before this? I'd say its a tad different walking living with Him 24/7 that how you and me live today.

So much of this "talk" comes not from those just saved but have been for many years now. So its so easy to say YES we must love JESUS first and keep all His words.. that we never read don't know anything about.. huh? Yeah all these burdens come from man. He found you.. what He not you what He started He will finish. He said it so He has to do it.

And its a personal walk.... He loves you .. walks with you teaches you everything (that we allow Him to).. on and on. Some fall in love fast others it can take years but it happens.
True.
What unbelievers actually know God?
How many does He require to love Him before He will save them?
Pastors often mix faith with the works that are throughout the Bible and expect the lost to keep them as requirements for salvation. This is a misunderstanding. When I read 100 verses that it's just faith in Christ and one that seems different, then I should go with the 100 known verses. I probably just don't yet understand that one verse that seems to contradict.

It takes time in His Word to grow in the love for God. That should increase in time, but the Bible shows many exples of the opposite.
The one requirement is to choose to put one's faith in Christ. That requires no works or love.
After salvation, then there are plenty of things God wants of His children. Love is certainly at the top of the list.
 

AndrewMorgan

Active member
Jul 10, 2022
375
81
28
#18
You put your Faith in The Gospel to be saved, Only the Blood of Jesus can take away sin. Without Faith it is impossible to please God



We Love him because he first Loved us, as to how you show that Love it would depend on the respect you had for the other, How does one show Love to their child or husband or wife, Its relationship is spiritual but you don't show them by doing things they hate, and you shouldn't judge love on performance

Here is the Key "God is Love" 1 John 4:8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.

The important thing is you must be born again, Then you can show the world the love of God through you because Christ is in you, and

Doing his fathers work shows Jesus love

Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

And Believing on Jesus shows his Father Love

The Just shall live by faith, You are free to Express your Love to God but where does your Love Come from

Wherefore I say unto thee, Her sins, which are many, are forgiven; for she loved much: but to whom little is forgiven, the same loveth little.

Back to my old point. Is mere "belief" (as in common parlance) enough? Or is more required? - eg - adherence to the cause of Christ, love of God, repentance of sin, works.
There's so much disagreement on these vital issues?
 

arthurfleminger

Well-known member
Aug 18, 2021
1,405
771
113
#19
Back to my old point. Is mere "belief" (as in common parlance) enough? Or is more required? - eg - adherence to the cause of Christ, love of God, repentance of sin, works.
There's so much disagreement on these vital issues?
I think Jesus tells us that there is more to faith than just belief in Matthew Cha 7:

The Two Foundations.

“Everyone who listens to these words of mine and acts on them will be like a wise man who built his house on rock. The rain fell, the floods came, and the winds blew and buffeted the house.s But it did not collapse; it had been set solidly on rock.

And everyone who listens to these words of mine but does not act on them will be like a fool who built his house on sand. The rain fell, the floods came, and the winds blew and buffeted the house. And it collapsed and was completely ruined.”
 

ThewindBlows

Active member
Sep 30, 2019
227
89
28
#20
Back to my old point. Is mere "belief" (as in common parlance) enough? Or is more required? - eg - adherence to the cause of Christ, love of God, repentance of sin, works.
There's so much disagreement on these vital issues?
You can believe what you want it doesn't make it right many believe lies, What is required is you must be born again, A spiritual birth, the new creation in Christ

Sanctification or discipleship however you want to look at it comes after The Blood of Jesus has been applied to them as they are now a child of God and God will work through them, Then the command is to Love and As God is Love Being a born again child of God you can show the love of God to the world

Look If you put your faith in Jesus for the forgiveness of your sins how can you go on and be thankful if you are trying to repent of your sins? are you really believing it or is it because you are in sin? then the argument arises can someone commit the "Sin" of not believing in Jesus after been Born again, well no because they have already put there faith in him, And who really could change there mind and think God or there father doesn't really exist..... and Jeremiah 32:40 says

"And I will make an everlasting covenant with them, that I will not turn away from them, to do them good; but I will put my fear in their hearts, that they shall not depart from me."

And also He who begun a Good work in you will complete it.

So you must be born again is the requirement, then if you can understand Grace and rest there and walk by Faith, Then you can show the Love of God to the world, But discipleship can be hard, imagine Paul getting stoned to death everyone thinking hes dead jumps up shakes it off and carries on, The vital points are to Love God and Love others and you cant put boundaries on them, But again you must be born again and redemption is through the Blood of Jesus because only the Blood of Jesus can take away sin and if you cant see the Love that God showed the world through the cross of Jesus and if that doesn't motivate you Love others then no amount of "Obedience" to any set of rules is going to make you a nicer person no matter how hard you try and force it