Have You Received the Holy Ghost Since You Believed?
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Sorry I'm just getting back after a few days away. I still owe you an explanation regarding "tactics" which I hope to address after I reply here...
You seem to overlook the fact and truth that "in the Apostles time"..specifically at the moment that the Apostles and as many of the 120 disciples as were present in Acts 2:1-4 (who were all accounted worthy of the Holy Ghost) were EACH and EVERY ONE given speaking in tongues as they received the Holy Ghost.
And in the Apostles' time (as it also is today) once a person has received speaking in tongues, it is clear evidence that they have received the Holy Ghost (Acts 10:44-46) and that concept was indeed taught by Peter (kind of the chief apostle of that time) when he used it as the determining proof that these Gentiles were also accounted worthy by God to receive remission of sins (through Baptism in Jesus name in agreement with Acts 2:38,39) saying "Can any man forbid water that these should not be baptized which have RECEIVED THE HOLY GHOST as well as we?".
Love in Jesus to all who hear,
-Kelby
You seem to overlook the fact and truth that "in the Apostles time"..specifically at the moment that the Apostles and as many of the 120 disciples as were present in Acts 2:1-4 (who were all accounted worthy of the Holy Ghost) were EACH and EVERY ONE given speaking in tongues as they received the Holy Ghost.
And in the Apostles' time (as it also is today) once a person has received speaking in tongues, it is clear evidence that they have received the Holy Ghost (Acts 10:44-46) and that concept was indeed taught by Peter (kind of the chief apostle of that time) when he used it as the determining proof that these Gentiles were also accounted worthy by God to receive remission of sins (through Baptism in Jesus name in agreement with Acts 2:38,39) saying "Can any man forbid water that these should not be baptized which have RECEIVED THE HOLY GHOST as well as we?".
Love in Jesus to all who hear,
-Kelby
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Not objecting, just stating that the wind doesn't blow where it wants. If you don't believe that then what can I say, but I'll tell you the reason why I would say that and you don't even have to tell the me reason you canst know whence it cometh, and whither it goeth.
1. The Gospel of Mark (4:39-41)
2. The testimony of the son of David (Eccl. 1:6)
1. The Gospel of Mark (4:39-41)
39 And he arose, and rebuked the wind, and said unto the sea, Peace, be still. And the wind ceased, and there was a great calm.
40 And he said unto them, Why are ye so fearful? how is it that ye have no faith?
41 And they feared exceedingly, and said one to another, What manner of man is this, that even the wind and the sea obey him?
2. The testimony of the son of David (Eccl. 1:6)
The wind goeth toward the south, and turneth about unto the north; it whirleth about continually, and the wind returneth again according to his circuits.
Well, you see in acts 10 ore 19 a proof for your theory. I see in acts 8, 10 and 19 the proof that the Gospel is not alone for the jews, but also for everyone( Samaritians, gentiles and disciples of John the Baptist, which only you his baptism, but nothing about the Holy Spirit.
If you would be right, then today all believers would speaking in tongues. (And we would not have this Discussion
)
And then Paul would not mention that not all will get the gift of speaking in tongues.
If you would be right, then today all believers would speaking in tongues. (And we would not have this Discussion
)And then Paul would not mention that not all will get the gift of speaking in tongues.
I honestly am not sure what you are saying here.
In my post (#442) I said they were ALSO accounted worthy of baptism but should have more directly stated that speaking in tongues was the evidence that Peter used to determine that these Gentiles JUST RECEIVED THE HOLY GHOST. (quote shown here
In my post (#442) I said they were ALSO accounted worthy of baptism but should have more directly stated that speaking in tongues was the evidence that Peter used to determine that these Gentiles JUST RECEIVED THE HOLY GHOST. (quote shown here
None of them knew 1 Cor 15:1-4 that people can be saved by just believing in the death burial and resurrection of Christ.
Peter himself did not preach that to Cornelius, instead he said in Acts 10 that one need to "work righteousness" in order to be accepted, which is in line with what he will later write to Israel in 1 Peter 4:12-19.
Acts 10:34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:
35 But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.
Without Paul's revelations and the completed scriptures, Israel needed signs to believe that someone was saved, so that was a period of time where God confirmed that gentiles can now be saved, without Israel, without the law, thru them speaking in tongues, which astonished all the Jewish believers present.
If you recall the final verse of Mark
20 And they went forth, and preached every where, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following. Amen.
The Lord was confirmed the preached word, or the spoken word, with signs. it was necessary since they did not have the completed scriptures yet.
But once scripture is completed and Paul's revelation of the mystery completely written down, we are no longer to look for signs. We believe one is saved the moment he believes in the death burial and resurrection of Christ.
That is why using Acts for salvation doctrine is so problematic, it was a transitional time period between Israel's program and the program of the Body of Christ.
If you would be right, then today all believers would speaking in tongues. (And we would not have this Discussion )
)
The other main problem (express within your parenthesis) seems to be the incorrect assumption that presenting someone with truth automatically creates belief and agreement.
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
Not long ago you told me that you don't try to convince, but rather try to understand where the other person is coming from. The quoted post is evidence to the contrary.
Second, God STILL confirms his word with signs following. He hasn't stopped doing that. His word "These signs shall follow them that believe" is STILL active and true today, as are all the other promises made to believers.
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
Second, God STILL confirms his word with signs following. He hasn't stopped doing that. His word "These signs shall follow them that believe" is STILL active and true today, as are all the other promises made to believers.
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
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For ONE, I didn't claim he did.
For TWO, he doesn't particularly act to full the passions to be consumed by ANYONE's flesh. <-- That's why he uses it to explain why EVEN BELELIEVERS' prayers go unanswered at times.
Either way I praise God that at least you used some scripture this time.
James 4:1-3 KJV
From whence come wars and fightings among you [the 12 tribes, his brethren]? come they not hence, even of your lusts that war in your members? [2] Ye lust, and have not: ye kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: ye fight and war, yet ye have not, because ye ask not. [3] Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
For TWO, he doesn't particularly act to full the passions to be consumed by ANYONE's flesh. <-- That's why he uses it to explain why EVEN BELELIEVERS' prayers go unanswered at times.
Either way I praise God that at least you used some scripture this time.
James 4:1-3 KJV
From whence come wars and fightings among you [the 12 tribes, his brethren]? come they not hence, even of your lusts that war in your members? [2] Ye lust, and have not: ye kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: ye fight and war, yet ye have not, because ye ask not. [3] Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
Well, I was actually writing it for my own benefit, as well as to others like wolfwint, since I was not involved in that exchange you are having with him.
Whether you are convinced by that or not, I don't worry about that.
As for your second point, I obviously disagree with that, given what Paul stated in 2 Cor 5:7 and 1 Cor 1:22. But yes, I understand you view it differently, given all your posts in this thread.
By the way, the last post https://christianchat.com/threads/h...-ghost-since-you-believed.192632/post-4396092, you are clear I was not referring to the Assyrian foreign language?
Whether you are convinced by that or not, I don't worry about that.
As for your second point, I obviously disagree with that, given what Paul stated in 2 Cor 5:7 and 1 Cor 1:22. But yes, I understand you view it differently, given all your posts in this thread.
By the way, the last post https://christianchat.com/threads/h...-ghost-since-you-believed.192632/post-4396092, you are clear I was not referring to the Assyrian foreign language?
Yes, I understand that you are not suggesting that Acts 2:4 OR 2:6 are either one limited to the Assyrian language EVEN THOUGH you say the original text in Isaiah 28 IS speaking specifically about the Assyrian language.
I would further say that you are not suggesting that Acts 2:4 OR 2:6 are either one using language in a way the hears cannot understand EVEN THOUGH you say the original text in Isaiah 28 IS speaking specifically about the Assyrian language being used in a way NOT understood by the hearers.
Is that an accurate understanding of what you believe?
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
I would further say that you are not suggesting that Acts 2:4 OR 2:6 are either one using language in a way the hears cannot understand EVEN THOUGH you say the original text in Isaiah 28 IS speaking specifically about the Assyrian language being used in a way NOT understood by the hearers.
Is that an accurate understanding of what you believe?
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
But you dodged the question ... "Did I express your beliefs accurately?"
If expressed accurately, perhaps you can say "Yes, you expressed each (or just A or B) accurately."
If expressed inaccurately, perhaps you can say "No, this part right here--> 'xxxxx' is the opposite of what I mean. It should be changed to say 'yyyyyy' to make the statement accurate."
Here are the statements again so you can clarify accuracy or points of specific wrongness:
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
If expressed accurately, perhaps you can say "Yes, you expressed each (or just A or B) accurately."
If expressed inaccurately, perhaps you can say "No, this part right here--> 'xxxxx' is the opposite of what I mean. It should be changed to say 'yyyyyy' to make the statement accurate."
Here are the statements again so you can clarify accuracy or points of specific wrongness:
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
I don't understand, I already stated that both your points are inaccurate expressions of what I was trying to point out, and I offered you what I was actually presenting about my doctrine of tongues.
If you need further clarifications about my view, you can just ask. I cannot read your mind so I cannot be sure whether you understood or not.
If you need further clarifications about my view, you can just ask. I cannot read your mind so I cannot be sure whether you understood or not.