Spiritual Baptism

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Dec 18, 2023
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The subject is the resurrection. The point he was making is that even the ignorant understand there is a resurrection.
I believe you can find baptismal regeneration under every passage.
you can't call baptism regeneration.

You have to call it being saved with the Holy Spirit.
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
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you can't call baptism regeneration.

You have to call it being saved with the Holy Spirit.
Regeneration is a term to connote life. If one isn't saved until baptism, that means they were made alive or regenerated in baptism. Thus, baptismal regeneration.
I don't subscribe to baptismal regeneration, but some here do. That's why I asked you before about Acts 2:37. God has clearly been at work in those who respond. Peter has already been commissioned by Jesus to teach and baptize. It's no surprise then that he would tell them to be baptized.
 
Dec 18, 2023
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Regeneration is a term to connote life. If one isn't saved until baptism, that means they were made alive or regenerated in baptism. Thus, baptismal regeneration.
I don't subscribe to baptismal regeneration, but some here do. That's why I asked you before about Acts 2:37. God has clearly been at work in those who respond. Peter has already been commissioned by Jesus to teach and baptize. It's no surprise then that he would tell them to be baptized.
no such thing it's a catholic terminology that should not be used to debate Christians with.
 

Wansvic

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Nov 27, 2018
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The following is found on GotQuestions.org:

Christian baptism is one of two ordinances that Jesus instituted for the church. Just before His ascension, Jesus said, “Go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age” (Matthew 28:19–20). These instructions specify that the church is responsible to teach Jesus’ word, make disciples, and baptize those disciples. These things are to be done everywhere (“all nations”) until “the very end of the age.” So, if for no other reason, baptism has importance because Jesus commanded it.

We know the disciples would baptize new believers in water and they would lay their hands on the new believers and pray for them to receive the baptism with the Holy Spirit.

We also know there is a baptism with fire according to John the Baptist when speaking about Jesus Christ.

Water = Baptism for our body
Holy Spirit = Baptism for our spirit
Fire = Baptism for our soul (mind, will, emotions)


Don’t mistake the “sealing with the Holy Spirit” with the “baptism with the Holy Spirit” - two different works of the Holy Spirit in a Believer’s life.
According to the word it is one experience.

The Ephesians' scripture says those who hear and believe the word of truth, the gospel of salvation are sealed with the Holy Ghost of promise.

The word of truth, the gospel of salvation was first presented in Acts chapter 2. People who believe in Jesus place their trust in Him as seen in their willingness to repent, and be water baptized in His name. Those willing to do so will receive the Holy Ghost, it is a promise. (Acts 2:36-42, 8:12-18, 9:17-18, 10:43-48, 19:1-6, 22:16)


"Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, WHAT SHALL WE DO?

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.
41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.
42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers." Acts 2:36-42
 
Dec 18, 2023
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well if you said, evil you are in Welsh.

It would sound like you where saying, Doug witty in English 😂
so basically @Cameron143 if some one says evil you are.

You simply say, noooo that would be Doug witty 😋

It's just another way to forgive those instantly, who may suggest your evil.

It's called humouring the situation.

It's the only way I can forgive a brother 77 times
 

Wansvic

Well-known member
Nov 27, 2018
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The subject is the resurrection. The point he was making is that even the ignorant understand there is a resurrection.
I believe you can find baptismal regeneration under every passage.
Actually it should come as no surprise that you reject what I've pointed out. When a person refuses to accept the scriptural evidence that sin is remitted in obedience to water baptism (per God's design) it is inevitable that they cannot bring themselves to acknowledge what is clearly conveyed in that particular scripture.

And for the record, I've never said water baptism ALONE results in a person being born again. What I have said, over and over again, is that both obedience to water baptism in the name of Jesus, AND receiving the Holy Ghost as well are essential elements of the NT rebirth. This truth is confirmed throughout scripture. (Mark 1:1-5, Luke 3:3, Mark 16:15-16, Acts 2:38-41, 8:12-18, 9:17-18, 10:43-48, 19:1-6, 22:16, Rom. 8:9)
 

Cameron143

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Mar 1, 2022
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Actually it should come as no surprise that you reject what I've pointed out. When a person refuses to accept the scriptural evidence that sin is remitted in obedience to water baptism (per God's design) it is inevitable that they cannot bring themselves to acknowledge what is clearly conveyed in that particular scripture.

And for the record, I've never said water baptism ALONE results in a person being born again. What I have said, over and over again, is that both obedience to water baptism in the name of Jesus, AND receiving the Holy Ghost as well are essential elements of the NT rebirth. This truth is confirmed throughout scripture. (Mark 1:1-5, Luke 3:3, Mark 16:15-16, Acts 2:38-41, 8:12-18, 9:17-18, 10:43-48, 19:1-6, 22:16, Rom. 8:9)
I'm aware of what you believe. But if anything more than belief is necessary for salvation, then salvation is not of grace alone. That's why it is necessary to understand the work of God in Acts 2:37.
And it's not that people shouldn't or won't get baptized when they are quickened and made alive by God, it's that they will never understand their need before God until He grants hearing and circumcises their hearts. All of this is spiritual in nature and performed in a person before their wills will ask...men and brethren what shall we do? Once the heart is converted and the mind is renewed, the will always follows.
It's worth noting, sins were paid for at the cross and no other time. What happens in salvation is that God reveals to an individual what He has done on their behalf. Sins were remitted when God accepted Jesus' offering. The remission of their sins is simply made known in time and space.
 

turbosixx

Active member
Sep 16, 2023
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You insert water where it is not stated. Other verses, such as you are saved by grace through faith, not by works,
etc, say nothing of needing to be drenched in physical water to effectuate your salvation. Salvation is by grace
through faith (Romans 3:22, 24, 25, 26, 28, 30; 4:5; Galatians 2:16; Ephesians 2:8-9; Philippians 3:9.)

:)
I commented on this post and you didn't get back with me. If it was by choice, please disregard this reply. If not, please consider what I'm suggesting.
Were the Romans, Galatians, Ephesians and Philippians water baptized when they heard the gospel and believed?

Also, you say salvation is by grace. What does one have to do to receive grace?
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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I commented on this post and you didn't get back with me. If it was by choice, please disregard this reply. If not, please consider what I'm suggesting.
Were the Romans, Galatians, Ephesians and Philippians water baptized when they heard the gospel and believed?

Also, you say salvation is by grace. What does one have to do to receive grace?
Grace is unmerited favour. God made us alive while we were still dead in our trespasses and sins.
He draws us with loving kindness, and makes it possible for us to accept that which we had been
hostile to in our minds before, while we were yet enemies... He circumcises our hearts. Water baptism
is not an act of God, but a pledge of a clear conscious toward God after we repent and believe.
 

turbosixx

Active member
Sep 16, 2023
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Grace is unmerited favour. God made us alive while we were still dead in our trespasses and sins.
He draws us with loving kindness, and makes it possible for us to accept that which we had been
hostile to in our minds before, while we were yet enemies... He circumcises our hearts. Water baptism
is not an act of God, but a pledge of a clear conscious toward God after we repent and believe.
So you're saying by being water baptized that would be merited grace and therefore could earn our salvation?
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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So you're saying by being water baptized that would be merited grace and therefore could earn our salvation?
Uh, not sure how you got that from what I said...

But just to be clear, in answer to that question? No. Not at all.
 

turbosixx

Active member
Sep 16, 2023
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Uh, not sure how you got that from what I said...

But just to be clear, in answer to that question? No. Not at all.
I got it it cause I got skills :)
This is how I came to that conclusion. You said grace is unmerited favor, I agree. People will take that and say baptism is a work and that those who believe baptism is necessary are trying to earn (merit) salvation. As you rightly said, baptism does not earn us salvation. There no amount of works we can do to earn salvation, except obey Christ. Then He gifts us salvation.

You stated God circumcises our hearts. I agree. At what point, in the conversion process, does God circumcise our hearts? There is a verse that tells us.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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I got it it cause I got skills :)
I specifically said that grace was unmerited favor. Your skills need a serious upgrade .:unsure::LOL:

You stated God circumcises our hearts. I agree. At what point, in the conversion
process, does God circumcise our hearts? There is a verse that tells us.
Do tell .:D
 

jamessb

Active member
Feb 10, 2024
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Santa Fe NM
Actually it should come as no surprise that you reject what I've pointed out. When a person refuses to accept the scriptural evidence that sin is remitted in obedience to water baptism (per God's design) it is inevitable that they cannot bring themselves to acknowledge what is clearly conveyed in that particular scripture.

And for the record, I've never said water baptism ALONE results in a person being born again. What I have said, over and over again, is that both obedience to water baptism in the name of Jesus, AND receiving the Holy Ghost as well are essential elements of the NT rebirth. This truth is confirmed throughout scripture. (Mark 1:1-5, Luke 3:3, Mark 16:15-16, Acts 2:38-41, 8:12-18, 9:17-18, 10:43-48, 19:1-6, 22:16, Rom. 8:9)
Don't tell that to the thief on the cross. He wasn't baptized, yet Jesus said, "today you will be with me in paradise".

John 3:16 is perfectly clear: "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life."
 
Dec 18, 2023
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Yes, I do. If water baptism is "being saved with the Holy Spirit", then everyone that John baptized in the Jordan River was saved. Clearly, that is not the case.
Your speaking about a different kind of baptism, and the baptism before the resurrection