The False Teaching (& Truth) of what happens at the Rapture.

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Status
Not open for further replies.

cv5

Well-known member
Nov 20, 2018
22,561
8,109
113
We still are "SNATCHED" (TOGETHER, as ONE ENTITY)... "TO the meeting [noun] of the Lord IN THE AIR" (where NO ONE ELSE will be participating but US, to the meeting OF THE LORD! [THERE!])





[whereas, Israel will be "gathered ONE BY ONE"... "to worship the Lord in the holy mount, AT JERUSALEM" Isa27:12-13[9] / Matt24:29-31 at the "GREAT" trumpet... and gathered by ANGELS "HE SHALL SEND" to do so...]
Jer 3:14
".....I will take you, one from a city and two from a family, and I will bring you to Zion."
 
Jul 23, 2018
12,199
2,775
113
Do you see how this reply comes across as deceptive? The way in which you are replying is making it sound like I believe in PRE TRIB RAPTURE which I don't.

If it isn't intentional please take note,

If it is intentional then I rebuke you in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ.
You attack the brethren over nothing.
You guys can not answer to the pretrib verses.
So you get all emotional and actually spread cursing.

Get a bible.
Get real
Lets go.
Stop all the weirdness.
 
Jul 23, 2018
12,199
2,775
113
I do agree there has been a falling away going on for the past 25 years but I don't wonder why. Look at this subject here. To become a Christian nowadays you have to COME TO ACCEPT that coming and returning are TWO DIFFERENT THINGS, two different events. If those two words can't simply be read to mean what all English speaking people know them to mean, then what are the chances of EVER being able to understand the words of GOD.

NOW add to that - reading the words 'falling away', ACTUALLY means there will be no gathering unto until after a gathering??? unto,
I WOULD RUN AWAY MYSELF.


If common sense and simplicity cant be used, if what is written isn't what is meant, even the most simple verses, then THERE IS NO CHANCE to ever come to any understanding.

Doesn't matter that it goes against EVERY way God teaches us is His truth.

It is the 'falling away' that allows the whole world to worship after Satan. When the INSTEAD OF/ANTI CHRIST deceives the church and the world into believing he is Christ and worship starts going to him instead of OUR FATHER who art in heaven, falling away includes ALMOST everyone. ...with lying signs and wonders.

Those who believe in pre trib will fall for his lies because the 1st supernatural power coming in their belief system is CHRIST. Since Christ doesn't come until AFTER Satan, Satan will be who they believe. It's math, as in it is absolute. Don't be deceived by any man means A DECEIVER is coming first. Now for those who study every day THEY themselves may be able to recognize but to all those not so dedicated all they know is Christ is coming for them. THOSE will not stand a chance. Had they been taught to NOT be deceived that Satan was coming first then they would have stood a chance. BUT we are responsible for every one who does listen to us not just ourselves.
A perfect example of a person deceived via omission of the pretrib rapture verses, then wildly ascribing deception to the other camp.

So silly.
Pot <> Kettle big time.
 
Jul 23, 2018
12,199
2,775
113
Why would I move forward and prove yet something else to you. You won't believe it either. NOW the pre trib rapture theory wants me to believe that 'a falling away' IS A PRE TRIBULATION RAPTURE OF THE CHURCH TO HEAVEN? SERIOUSLY you don't see that as adding to the words of GOD or teaching a doctrine OUT OF NOTHING WRITTEN BY GODS WORDS just conjecture on your part.

Have you ever read the OT?
re read it
" removed/ revealed" is used 3 times in that part of 2thes2.

You know, so as to BE CLEAR???.

3 TIMES.

But no.
I do realize postribbers need "revealed " to actually mean seated, in power, for several years.

A COMPLETE perversion of what that is saying.

Postribbers have such a hard job.
But deception is fueling that doctrine.

It started in the early church. The deception was that they were confused and believed they were in the great tribulation.
 
Dec 29, 2021
1,317
314
83
Jer 3:14
".....I will take you, one from a city and two from a family, and I will bring you to Zion."
CHERRY PICKER!!

Thank God for the Tanakh!

This is about BACKSLIDING, NOT ABOUT THE DEMONIC PRE-TRIB RAPTURE FALSE DOCTRINE BALONEY!

14 Return, backsliding children, says the Lord, for I possessed you, and I will take you, one from a city and two from a family, and I will bring you to Zion.
 

TheDivineWatermark

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2018
10,874
2,111
113
TDW: [whereas, Israel will be "gathered ONE BY ONE"... "to worship the Lord in the holy mount, AT JERUSALEM" Isa27:12-13[9] / Matt24:29-31 at the "GREAT" trumpet... and gathered by ANGELS "HE SHALL SEND" to do so...]
Jer 3:14
".....I will take you, one from a city and two from a family, and I will bring you to Zion."
Nice.

Corresponds also with how Isaiah 24:21-22[23]'s TWO "PUNISH" words are separated by TIME (and the FIRST "PUNISH" word of this passage corresponds with the point in time told about in Rev19:19,21 / 16:14-16 / 20:5 [i.e. Armageddon / His Second Coming TO THE EARTH time-slot]); this means that verse 23 speaks of that intervening TIME PERIOD (aka the earthly MK age), where it says, "... when the Lord of hosts shall reign in mount Zion, and in Jerusalem, and before his ancients GLORIOUSLY" [i.e. Matt25:31-34's (and Matt19:28's) "throne OF HIS GLORY"... which is earthly-located]... same as what Daniel 7:27 refers to (following the specific "time-period" mentioned in v.25 [vv.20-25], and with v.22 there in THAT context corresponding with Rev20:4a [about the STILL-LIVING saints at that point in the chronology / END of Trib-yrs]--whereas Rev20:4b speaks to those who will be "resurrected" for the MK, coz of having been "beheaded"/martyred during the second half of the Trib yrs [but these alone are not the ONLY ONES who will "reign with Christ" in the MK age, they are just the LAST ONES to have been KILLED prior to that])




Oops (EDIT to ADD what I's intended to add):

Gaebelein has this to say about your passage ( (y) ) :

[quoting]

Jeremiah 3:12-18. Here is a message to be proclaimed toward the north, calling on backsliding Israel to return. He promises mercy to them. One hundred years before, the house of Israel had gone northward as captives. The Lord knew where they dwelt and sent them this message of mercy. He knows today where the house of Israel is, the ten tribes, and at some future time the gracious offer given here will be consummated in their return. These verses are prophetic. They speak of the time when the chosen people will return. Then Jerusalem will be called “the throne of the LORD.” Israel will be converted. All the nations will be gathered unto the Name of Jehovah; the house of Judah with the house of Israel will be reunited. That will be when the King our ever blessed Lord comes back. [i.e. His RETURN TO THE EARTH]

[end quoting]


-- https://biblehub.com/commentaries/gaebelein/jeremiah/3.htm
____________




GREAT addition to the thought being covered in this aspect of our present discussion! THANKS, cv5!!




[p.s. NO ONE SAID that verse is the RAPTURE!! HELLO!]
 
Jul 23, 2018
12,199
2,775
113
Attention postribbers.
Drop your workbooks and visors for a second and Read the verses carefully;
2thes 2
for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

Revealed.

Lets look it up in websters
REVE'ALED, participle passive Disclosed; discovered; made known; laid open.

Now start test fitting all scenarios.

Pretrib rapture fits like a glove.
What about your position?
 

TheDivineWatermark

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2018
10,874
2,111
113
This is about BACKSLIDING, NOT ABOUT THE DEMONIC PRE-TRIB RAPTURE FALSE DOCTRINE BALONEY!
[p.s. NO ONE SAID that verse is the RAPTURE!! HELLO!]

Please pay attention to the flow of the convo... @cv5 was addressing what I'd put in the LATTER HALF of my post, which was clearly ABOUT ISRAEL (not "our RAPTURE [IN THE AIR]"<--He/cv5 was NOT saying that Jeremiah 3:14 is a RAPTURE passage, as you incorrectly ASSUMED him to be saying)! :eek:





Try to slow down and attempt reading with a little more care and attention to detail. ;)
 
Dec 29, 2021
1,317
314
83
BACKSLIDING:

Jeremiah 3:
14 Return, backsliding children, says the Lord, for I possessed you, and I will take you, one from a city and two from a family, and I will bring you to Zion.

JUDGEMENT DAY GATHERING: [Notice Verse 13, when they are Gathered, they Prostrate before God, Rapture is Caught up, not Prostrating before God]

Isaiah 27:
12 And it shall come to pass on that day, that the Lord shall gather from the flood of the river to the stream of Egypt, and you shall be gathered one by one, O children of Israel.

13 And it shall come to pass on that day, that a great shofar shall be sounded, and those lost in the land of Assyria and those exiled in the land of Egypt shall come and they shall prostrate themselves before the Lord on the holy mount in Jerusalem.

NONE OF THOSE VERSES MEAN THE FALSE DOCTRINE OF PRE-TRIB RAPTURE!
 
Jul 23, 2018
12,199
2,775
113
CHERRY PICKER!!

Thank God for the Tanakh!

This is about BACKSLIDING, NOT ABOUT THE DEMONIC PRE-TRIB RAPTURE FALSE DOCTRINE BALONEY!

14 Return, backsliding children, says the Lord, for I possessed you, and I will take you, one from a city and two from a family, and I will bring you to Zion.
The kjv says the same thing.

Maybe keep reading;
17 At that time they shall call Jerusalem the throne of the Lord; and all the nations shall be gathered unto it, to the name of the Lord, to Jerusalem: neither shall they walk any more after the imagination of their evil heart.

18 In those days the house of Judah shall walk with the house of Israel, and they shall come together out of the land of the north to the land that I have given for an inheritance unto your fathers.
 
Jul 23, 2018
12,199
2,775
113
BACKSLIDING:

Jeremiah 3:
14 Return, backsliding children, says the Lord, for I possessed you, and I will take you, one from a city and two from a family, and I will bring you to Zion.

JUDGEMENT DAY GATHERING: [Notice Verse 13, when they are Gathered, they Prostrate before God, Rapture is Caught up, not Prostrating before God]

Isaiah 27:
12 And it shall come to pass on that day, that the Lord shall gather from the flood of the river to the stream of Egypt, and you shall be gathered one by one, O children of Israel.

13 And it shall come to pass on that day, that a great shofar shall be sounded, and those lost in the land of Assyria and those exiled in the land of Egypt shall come and they shall prostrate themselves before the Lord on the holy mount in Jerusalem.

NONE OF THOSE VERSES MEAN THE FALSE DOCTRINE OF PRE-TRIB RAPTURE!
We have verses
Your doctrine does not.

Oh well
 
Dec 29, 2021
1,317
314
83
Attention postribbers.
Drop your workbooks and visors for a second and Read the verses carefully;
2thes 2
for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

Revealed.

Lets look it up in websters
REVE'ALED, participle passive Disclosed; discovered; made known; laid open.

Now start test fitting all scenarios.

Pretrib rapture fits like a glove.
What about your position?
Falling Away is Apostasy, which the Pre-Trib Rapture is exactly that, an apostasy to the Truth of God's Word.
And nothing happens until the Man of sin is Revealed.

The Man of sin [is not] Revealed until Tribulation Begins!
 

TheDivineWatermark

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2018
10,874
2,111
113
BACKSLIDING:
Jeremiah 3:
14 Return, backsliding children, says the Lord, for I possessed you, and I will take you, one from a city and two from a family, and I will bring you to Zion.
JUDGEMENT DAY GATHERING: [Notice Verse 13, when they are Gathered, they Prostrate before God, Rapture is Caught up, not Prostrating before God]
Isaiah 27:
12 And it shall come to pass on that day, that the Lord shall gather from the flood of the river to the stream of Egypt, and you shall be gathered one by one, O children of Israel.

13 And it shall come to pass on that day, that a great shofar shall be sounded, and those lost in the land of Assyria and those exiled in the land of Egypt shall come and they shall prostrate themselves before the Lord on the holy mount in Jerusalem.
NONE OF THOSE VERSES MEAN THE FALSE DOCTRINE OF PRE-TRIB RAPTURE!
It is ONLY YOU who has incorrectly assumed that ANYONE has suggested that this passage [or these passages] refers to "Rapture"... when absolutely NO ONE has suggested such a thing!

READ those posts AGAIN.
 
Jul 23, 2018
12,199
2,775
113
Please pay attention to the flow of the convo... @cv5 was addressing what I'd put in the LATTER HALF of my post, which was clearly ABOUT ISRAEL (not "our RAPTURE [IN THE AIR]"<--He/cv5 was NOT saying that Jeremiah 3:14 is a RAPTURE passage, as you incorrectly ASSUMED him to be saying)! :eek:





Try to slow down and attempt reading with a little more care and attention to detail. ;)
Yeah.
He jumped the gun thinking the bible was all perverted. Pulled that " tanak" like a sixgun and missed.
 
Dec 29, 2021
1,317
314
83
It is ONLY YOU who has incorrectly assumed that ANYONE has suggested that this passage [or these passages] refers to "Rapture"... when absolutely NO ONE has suggested such a thing!

READ those posts AGAIN.
These Verses in another Thread were used by the same Posters as Pre-Trib evidence.

I am glad that View has changed!

My Apologies and Thank God those Views have changed towards those Verses.
 
Jul 23, 2018
12,199
2,775
113
That is because the Truth is not a Doctrine, only man made baloney is ever a Doctrine!
Postrib rapture doctrine origin is the early church.
They thought they were in the gt.

So your doctrine is corrupt.
You guys quote the church fathers that were confused.

Comical how you guys BASE YOUR DOCTRINE on men....then virtue signal the daylights out of calling us names.

Comical classic irony.
Too funny
 

TheDivineWatermark

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2018
10,874
2,111
113
That is because the Truth is not a Doctrine, only man made baloney is ever a Doctrine!
The word "DOCTRINE" is a biblical word:

"For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine " - 1 Timothy 1:10


[see its numerous occurrences... some of them referring to POSITIVE / RIGHTEOUS things, depending on CONTEXT] - https://www.blueletterbible.org/search/search.cfm?Criteria=doctrine&t=KJV#s=s_primary_0_1
 
Jul 23, 2018
12,199
2,775
113
That is because the Truth is not a Doctrine, only man made baloney is ever a Doctrine!
Were the church fathers postrib rapture?
You know, where you guys claim high ground on every debate?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.