What is the Biblical Definition of WORK?

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Feb 24, 2022
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#81
Transgression of the Sabbath is not regarded as blasphemy.

Blasphemy, as defined in some religions or religion-based laws, is an insult that shows contempt, disrespect or lack of reverence concerning a deity (wiki)
Don't go down into that rabbit hole, man. Those pharisees were playing politics, they were using the Sabbath law just to derail Jesus's authority. As I said, that was weaponization of the law. If you really argue about Sabbath, you're distrated.
 

Inquisitor

Active member
Mar 17, 2022
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#82
My point is that Lord Jesus was tried for blasphemy, not violating the sabbath. You think the Romans cared about the sabbath?
Jesus was not on trial under the Roman law, Jesus was found guilty by the Jews. But they were unable to execute Him, they had to ask Rome to execute Him.

Jesus definitely violated the Sabbath and claimed to be God.
 

Inquisitor

Active member
Mar 17, 2022
395
85
28
#83
Don't go down into that rabbit hole, man. Those pharisees were playing politics, they were using the Sabbath law just to derail Jesus's authority. As I said, that was weaponization of the law. If you really argue about Sabbath, you're distrated.
Me already gone down the rabbit hole.

Obviously, the Pharisees sought to kill Jesus. The Pharisees had Jesus on two obvious transgressions.

The sabbath transgression was simply what the law stated. The law did not differentiate between good works and bad works, Jesus worked on the Sabbath.
 
Feb 24, 2022
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#84
Me already gone down the rabbit hole.

Obviously, the Pharisees sought to kill Jesus. The Pharisees had Jesus on two obvious transgressions.

The sabbath transgression was simply what the law stated. The law did not differentiate between good works and bad works, Jesus worked on the Sabbath.
The Sabbath law only stated no "customary work" on Sabbath. By the example given in Exodus 16, customary work means what you REGULARLY do for a living in other six days of the week. It never said you can't heal the sick, or respond to certain emergencies, or go to the gym, or any specific stuffs like that. All these restrictions were man made traditions invented by the Rabbis during the Babylonian Captivity.
 

Gideon300

Well-known member
Mar 18, 2021
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#85
Jesus was not on trial under the Roman law, Jesus was found guilty by the Jews. But they were unable to execute Him, they had to ask Rome to execute Him.

Jesus definitely violated the Sabbath and claimed to be God.
John 5:
17But Jesus answered them, “To this very day My Father is at His work, and I too am working.” 18 Because of this, the Jews tried all the harder to kill Him. Not only was He breaking the Sabbath, but He was even calling God His own Father, making Himself equal with God.
 
Dec 9, 2011
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#86
There is only one recorded instance of someone punished for breaking the sabbath. He was collecting firewood. Not manna, not food.
I wanted to like your post but I didn’t see a scripture proving your statement.🙂
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
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#87
It seems like there's a big misconception around the topic of WORK, a lot of folks here follow the Pharisees by having equated work with keeping the Mosaic Law, but nothing could be further from the truth. What exactly is WORK? Let the bible interpret itself. The answer is the fourth commandment:

Remember the Sabbath Day, to keep it holy. Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it. (Ex. 20:8-11)

When it comes to this commandment, usually the focus is all on the Sabbath and any controversy thereof, while WORK is often neglected. Sabbath is the day of the Lord that ought to be kept holy, but before the sabbath, we work six days. This is a basic pattern of life that was set at the beginning for us to follow. God gave this commandment to the Israelites in the wilderness through Moses on Mount Sinai. Now notice that BEFORE the ten commandments were given, Israelites were already being trained to get accustomed with this pattern of life - by gathering manna from heaven in Exodus 16. I'm not gonna throw the entire chapter here, just a few key verses:

And the children of Israel said to them, “Oh, that we had died by the hand of the Lord in the land of Egypt, when we sat by the pots of meat and when we ate bread to the full! For you have brought us out into this wilderness to kill this whole assembly with hunger.” Then the Lord said to Moses, “Behold, I will rain bread from heaven for you. And the people shall go out and gather a certain quota every day, that I may test them, whether they will walk in My law or not. And it shall be on the sixth day that they shall prepare what they bring in, and it shall be twice as much as they gather daily.”(Ex. 16:3-5)

In summary, "will work for food" is the name of the game. Israelites went out every day to gather this bread from heaven, and it was only sufficient for the day. Some tried to gather more and save the extra for the next day, and surprise, surprise, the extra all went spoiled overnight. (16:20) However, on the sixth day, they were ordered to gather twice as much to prepare for the Sabbath day, because there won't be any manna on Sabbath. (16:26) This time, none of it was spoiled (16:24). Some of them didn't listen, they went out on Sabbath, and they found nothing. (16:27) This had become their rhythm, and they did it for 40 long years in the wilderness. In the Lord's prayer, "daily bread" is a subtle reference of this, and everybody in the audience understood it.

So, here are a few bullet points:

- "Work" is what we do to make a living, to put food on the table, roof over the head and clothes on the back. It is NOT associated with salvation, for Jesus is the true bread of life, there's nothing we can do to impress God and earn salvation. The purpose of work is to sustain THIS LIFE, not the next life. "He who does not work, neither shall he eat." (2 Thess. 3:10)
- The fourth commandment sets up a weekly schedule. In order to have the Sabbath day set apart from the work days and dedicated to the Lord, all the secular work must be done in six days. If there's anything left undone, chances are, that piece of work will weigh on my mind, I'll be concerned about it, and I'll be distracted while I'm supposed to be worshipping God. Therefore there's a preparation day before Sabbath to wrap up all the work of the week. That puts more pressure on work instead of diminishing the importance of it.
- Notice that although God as the ultimate Provider fed the Israelites with manna, it did not appear in their tents on their table. This is a key principle - "Seek, and you shall find". The manna is out there, but I have to go out and gather it. The purpose was clearly stated, that it's a test of obedience.
- Although "Work" is referring to our secular work, it is NOT limited to our paid job in the office. Any productive activity is work honored by God. "Whatever you do, whether in word or deed, do it all in the name of the Lord Jesus." (Colossians 3:17) There is no "secular-sacred" divide. God never put ministerial or religious work over other secular works. On the contrary, Pharisees and scribes were harshly criticized by Jesus for virtue signaling through their ministerial and religious work, while all the heavy burdens were put on the shoulders of other people, while they didn't lift a finger. (Matt. 23:3-5)
- Actually, by God's standard, unpaid work that I do voluntarily, either at home or in the community, at the cost of my own time and resources, seeking nothing in return, is more honorable than my regular job, for my job is just what I'm paid to do, unpaid work without anybody asking me to do is what really reflects my character. You can see this in Matt. 5:46-48 - "If you love those who love you, what reward have you? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? And if you greet your brethren only, what do you do more than others? Do not even the tax collectors do so? Therefore you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect."
works in the doctrine when referenced usually is referring to the works or deeds or instructions in the law. Especially when Paul is talking about the contrast between old and new testaments

“knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭2:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

most often biblically paul
Is referencing the works established by Moses in the law

there are also the works of the gospel set before us to actually do

“For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭2:8-10‬ ‭KJV‬

the things Jesus said to do and will save and bless us are the world set before us the works behind are those of Moses law

consider that Paul willed that Christians be constantly reminded to maintain good works , to realize he’s actually not making the claim “ don’t do anything that’s a work of the law “

in a church there should always be some reminding of continuing in doing good works

“This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men.”
‭‭Titus‬ ‭3:8‬ ‭KJV‬‬


Anytime anyone speaks of something Jesus taught us to do though lol someone else comes explaining “ works of the law fallen from Grace “

Grace isn’t there to replace what God said to do in Christ but to sustain us until we start walking upright lives following the lord
 

Gideon300

Well-known member
Mar 18, 2021
2,883
1,780
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#88
I wanted to like your post but I didn’t see a scripture proving your statement.🙂
Numbers 15:

32While the Israelites were in the wilderness, a man was found gathering wood on the Sabbath day. 33Those who found the man gathering wood brought him to Moses, Aaron, and the whole congregation, 34and because it had not been declared what should be done to him, they placed him in custody.

35And the LORD said to Moses, “The man must surely be put to death. The whole congregation is to stone him outside the camp.”

36So the whole congregation took the man outside the camp and stoned him to death, as the LORD had commanded Moses.
 

peldom10

Well-known member
May 22, 2020
2,185
329
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#89
35And the LORD said to Moses, “The man must surely be put to death. The whole congregation is to stone him outside the camp.”

36So the whole congregation took the man outside the camp and stoned him to death, as the LORD had commanded Moses.

  • =====================

...I hope .........and there are folks who don't believe God means what He says about .........baptism!!!
..."for they know not what they do"...

Baptism is Required



Peter 3: 21.... whereunto even baptism doth also now save us...

John 3:5 .......Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.


Acts 2;38-....Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 22;16... And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.


Galations 3:26...... For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

KJV Marrk 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

KJV Matthew 3:14... But John forbad him, saying, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me? 15. Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now, for thus it becometh us to fulfil all rightesousness. Then He suffered Him.

KJV Matthew 28:19..... Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:.

Acts 8:12-18: But when they believed Philip as he preached the things concerning the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, both men and women were baptized.

Acts 19:4 And Paul said, “John baptized with the baptism of repentance, telling the people to believe in the one who was to come after him, that is, Jesus.”

John 3; 22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.
23 And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized.

Quote from Billy Graham that is note worthy;
....Also, to clarify I did not say remission of sin takes place at repentance. Scripture makes it clear that it occurs upon obedience to water baptism in the name of the Lord Jesus. Each is a step of faith, along with receiving the Holy Ghost, in the process of one's spiritual rebirth

.."Paul explains the doctrinal significance of what occurs when one is baptized.His explanation is found in his letter to those who had already been obedient to the command.

Paul tells the Roman Christians what actually occurred when they were/are baptized; they were baptized into His death. Being buried with Jesus into His death resulted in their sin being destroyed.

Even though Paul explains this concept, the NEW AGE RELIGION TEACHING is......... that water baptism is nothing other than a mere public display.......... And that is so far removed from the truth.

.......If you were baptized for some reason other than for forgiveness of sins in order to be saved then you do not have salvation and you are still lost. Who are you going to follow: God or man? As our Lord warns us in Matthew 15:14, "And if the blind lead the blind, both will fall into a ditch." Don't allow someone, who has added to and taken away from God's word, to lead you. Open your eyes and read God's word for yourself. Those who have added to and taken away from God's word will be lost. If you continue to follow them, then you too will be lost.

Keep in mind that Satan knows if he can continue to perpetuate that lie ...... he can keep people from entering the kingdom of God. Thus He has proven scripture which says ...in the end times there will be ...great delusions.....they are here.

Conclusion....teaching that baptism is not necessary is violation of Rev. 22;19.... And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. 20 He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus. (Also two other books of the Bible).
 
Feb 24, 2022
1,346
284
83
#90
works in the doctrine when referenced usually is referring to the works or deeds or instructions in the law. Especially when Paul is talking about the contrast between old and new testaments

“knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭2:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

most often biblically paul
Is referencing the works established by Moses in the law

there are also the works of the gospel set before us to actually do

“For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭2:8-10‬ ‭KJV‬

the things Jesus said to do and will save and bless us are the world set before us the works behind are those of Moses law

consider that Paul willed that Christians be constantly reminded to maintain good works , to realize he’s actually not making the claim “ don’t do anything that’s a work of the law “

in a church there should always be some reminding of continuing in doing good works

“This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men.”
‭‭Titus‬ ‭3:8‬ ‭KJV‬‬


Anytime anyone speaks of something Jesus taught us to do though lol someone else comes explaining “ works of the law fallen from Grace “

Grace isn’t there to replace what God said to do in Christ but to sustain us until we start walking upright lives following the lord
Paul commented on the works of the law in a NEGATIVE sense. The positive kind of work is work of faith, good and profitable unto man. Put that in a real life, that means any productive and creative activity, especially making a very risky move that is contrary to conventional wisdom, past experience and popular opinion, and most importantly, you would pay a heavy price if you're wrong, but you still believe is good and profitable soly based on your faith.
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
6,281
2,129
113
#91
Paul commented on the works of the law in a NEGATIVE sense. The positive kind of work is work of faith, good and profitable unto man. Put that in a real life, that means any productive and creative activity, especially making a very risky move that is contrary to conventional wisdom, past experience and popular opinion, and most importantly, you would pay a heavy price if you're wrong, but you still believe is good and profitable soly based on your faith.
“Paul commented on the works of the law in a NEGATIVE sense. The positive kind of work is work of faith,”

“But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭11:6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Works of faith come from Gods word

“But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report? So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭10:16-17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

you have to hear meaning “ accept “ the word of Jesus Christ in the gospel to have faith. His teachings are what teaches us how to walk by faith it’s when we start looking at what our God was saying taking it as it is it’s this word

“He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.”
‭‭John‬ ‭12:48-50‬ ‭

that is the word of faith whatever Jesus taught
good works comes down to how we treat other people we can say I love everyone but when someone is In need of help and we can help will we love the. In deed and truth ?

“Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren. But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him? My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth. And hereby we know that we are of the truth, and shall assure our hearts before him.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭3:16-19‬ ‭KJV‬‬

We find faith as we learn to repent and walk upright good lives and are always zealous to do good and always resistant to doing evil

we do works every day all day it’s a question of what they are do we lie cheat and steal ? Commit fornications and theft ? Are we greedy and selfish towards others ? Or generous and helpful ?

If we do evil works well be in one of these two groups and if we do good we’ll be on the other group

“But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God; Who will render to every man according to his deeds: to them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life: but unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile; but glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭2:5-10‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Faith is simple we hear what Jesus our lord and savior the God of the uninverse told us when he came and preached the everlasting and unchanging gospel. And we accept it and act upon what God said that’s a work of faith on the other hand these works Will seperate us from our inheritance

“Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭5:19-21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

when we come to Jesus what we do in life starts to really matter more than before we heard the truth Christians should always be looking for the right ways to live taught by the lord that’s where faith exists