The Israel of God
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Sarah - you almost had me. . . .but I did some studying on the word - "everlasting". The Hebrew word is - olam - pronounced owlam - and can be translated thus: long duration, antiquity, futurity, for ever, everlasting, ever more, perpetual, old ancient world - ancient time, for ages and ages, indefinite, long time B. (of future) 1. for ever, always 2. continuous existence, perpetual 3. everlasting, indefinite, or unending, eternity
So we can look at the "everlasting covenant" of the rainbow - just as zone pointed out that will end; there will be a time when the rainbow will not longer be needed - neither in the millennial kingdom nor in the eternal.
The "everlasting covenant" of circumcision - it was said to be everlasting - we know it wasn't - but it was for "an indefinite period of time" or for a "long duration"
The "everlasting possession" of the land - we couldn't chose as a translation "for ever" because others have occupied the land, we couldn't chose as a translation "eternal" because that means without beginning or end and we know that the promise had a beginning and we know that it will end - just as everlasting would mean no end - and we know that the world will end - so it seems the best choice of translation would be "for an indefinite time" or "for ages and ages" or even for a "very long duration".
Of course, "everlasting life", the best choice would be indefinite, unending, eternity.
Thank you for making me have to work!
So we can look at the "everlasting covenant" of the rainbow - just as zone pointed out that will end; there will be a time when the rainbow will not longer be needed - neither in the millennial kingdom nor in the eternal.
The "everlasting covenant" of circumcision - it was said to be everlasting - we know it wasn't - but it was for "an indefinite period of time" or for a "long duration"
The "everlasting possession" of the land - we couldn't chose as a translation "for ever" because others have occupied the land, we couldn't chose as a translation "eternal" because that means without beginning or end and we know that the promise had a beginning and we know that it will end - just as everlasting would mean no end - and we know that the world will end - so it seems the best choice of translation would be "for an indefinite time" or "for ages and ages" or even for a "very long duration".
Of course, "everlasting life", the best choice would be indefinite, unending, eternity.
Thank you for making me have to work!
Sarah - you almost had me. . . .but I did some studying on the word - "everlasting". The Hebrew word is - olam - pronounced owlam - and can be translated thus: long duration, antiquity, futurity, for ever, everlasting, ever more, perpetual, old ancient world - ancient time, for ages and ages, indefinite, long time B. (of future) 1. for ever, always 2. continuous existence, perpetual 3. everlasting, indefinite, or unending, eternity
So we can look at the "everlasting covenant" of the rainbow - just as zone pointed out that will end; there will be a time when the rainbow will not longer be needed - neither in the millennial kingdom nor in the eternal.
The "everlasting covenant" of circumcision - it was said to be everlasting - we know it wasn't - but it was for "an indefinite period of time" or for a "long duration"
The "everlasting possession" of the land - we couldn't chose as a translation "for ever" because others have occupied the land, we couldn't chose as a translation "eternal" because that means without beginning or end and we know that the promise had a beginning and we know that it will end - just as everlasting would mean no end - and we know that the world will end - so it seems the best choice of translation would be "for an indefinite time" or "for ages and ages" or even for a "very long duration".
Of course, "everlasting life", the best choice would be indefinite, unending, eternity.
Thank you for making me have to work!
So we can look at the "everlasting covenant" of the rainbow - just as zone pointed out that will end; there will be a time when the rainbow will not longer be needed - neither in the millennial kingdom nor in the eternal.
The "everlasting covenant" of circumcision - it was said to be everlasting - we know it wasn't - but it was for "an indefinite period of time" or for a "long duration"
The "everlasting possession" of the land - we couldn't chose as a translation "for ever" because others have occupied the land, we couldn't chose as a translation "eternal" because that means without beginning or end and we know that the promise had a beginning and we know that it will end - just as everlasting would mean no end - and we know that the world will end - so it seems the best choice of translation would be "for an indefinite time" or "for ages and ages" or even for a "very long duration".
Of course, "everlasting life", the best choice would be indefinite, unending, eternity.
Thank you for making me have to work!
Sometimes the concepts the writers were trying to make takes going back and forth for to truly understand them more completely.
Fascinating point, except for one problem, the Matt. geneology differs from the Luke one. It's true that the Matt. geneology precludes Jesus reigning on the Davidic throne, being through Jeconiah, which is why the Lukan geneology actually doesn't have Jeconiah in it. There are 2 different Shealtiel's. Matt. has Jeconiah Shealtiel Zerubbabel Abihud, Luke has Melchi Neri Shealtiel Zerubbabel Rhesa Joanan; while both these Shealtiel's have a son named Zerubbabel, they have different fathers, grandfathers and grandsons.
All this to say that evidence points to the fact that the Matt. geneology is from Joseph, while the Lukan geneology is from Mary. Notice in Lk. 3:23 it says, "Jesus, being as was supposed the son of Joseph son of Eli." Luke gives the virgin birth, Joseph was not actually the son of Eli, he was the son of Jacob (cf. Matt), he was the son of Eli by marriage through Mary. So Jesus did not have the curse of Jeconiah in His lineage, therefore He can be an earthly Davidic king.
Jesus couldn't be an earthly priest according to the Mosaic covenant because he wasn't a Levite, and yet clearly Jesus has made the once-for-all sacrifice required of His priestly duties. Jesus being King on earth would not negate His being a heavenly priest, not to mention the fact that we're talking about Jesus here, who is God, and onmipresent, and therefore supersedes the supposed limitation to being a priest while on the earth.
The Jews could not answer because they didn't understand that Messiah was a Son of David and the divine Lord God. Peter quotes Ps. 110 to declare Jesus was Lord, that David wasn't referring to Himself as seated at God's right hand, yet Jesus was. If God's right hand is the throne of David, then when did Jesus fulfill the rest of the Psalm? Let's read, shall we?
5The Lord is at your right hand[SUP]c[/SUP] ;
he will crush kings on the day of his wrath.
6He will judge the nations, heaping up the dead
and crushing the rulers of the whole earth.
7He will drink from a brook along the way,[SUP]d[/SUP]
and so he will lift his head high.
This looks more like the 2nd coming of Jesus, right before He reigns for 1000 years. David did not see Jesus as only reigning over a spiritual kingdom, neither did Peter because he doesn't quote these verses, and neither did Jesus because he didn't correct the disciples when they asked Him if He was then going to restore the physical kingdom of Israel (Acts 1), Jesus just said it was in the future, not for them to know.
All this to say that evidence points to the fact that the Matt. geneology is from Joseph, while the Lukan geneology is from Mary. Notice in Lk. 3:23 it says, "Jesus, being as was supposed the son of Joseph son of Eli." Luke gives the virgin birth, Joseph was not actually the son of Eli, he was the son of Jacob (cf. Matt), he was the son of Eli by marriage through Mary. So Jesus did not have the curse of Jeconiah in His lineage, therefore He can be an earthly Davidic king.
Jesus couldn't be an earthly priest according to the Mosaic covenant because he wasn't a Levite, and yet clearly Jesus has made the once-for-all sacrifice required of His priestly duties. Jesus being King on earth would not negate His being a heavenly priest, not to mention the fact that we're talking about Jesus here, who is God, and onmipresent, and therefore supersedes the supposed limitation to being a priest while on the earth.
The Jews could not answer because they didn't understand that Messiah was a Son of David and the divine Lord God. Peter quotes Ps. 110 to declare Jesus was Lord, that David wasn't referring to Himself as seated at God's right hand, yet Jesus was. If God's right hand is the throne of David, then when did Jesus fulfill the rest of the Psalm? Let's read, shall we?
5The Lord is at your right hand[SUP]c[/SUP] ;
he will crush kings on the day of his wrath.
6He will judge the nations, heaping up the dead
and crushing the rulers of the whole earth.
7He will drink from a brook along the way,[SUP]d[/SUP]
and so he will lift his head high.
This looks more like the 2nd coming of Jesus, right before He reigns for 1000 years. David did not see Jesus as only reigning over a spiritual kingdom, neither did Peter because he doesn't quote these verses, and neither did Jesus because he didn't correct the disciples when they asked Him if He was then going to restore the physical kingdom of Israel (Acts 1), Jesus just said it was in the future, not for them to know.
But remember Jesus NEVER said His was an earthly Kingdom nor that He was going to establish an earthly kingdom. Jesus also said this
Luke 17:20-21 “Now when He was asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, He answered them and said, "The kingdom of God does not come with observation; nor will they say, 'See here!' or 'See there!' For indeed, the kingdom of God is within you.”
Also where in Psalms 110 is there anything about an earthly kingdom? It talks about the day of wrath and judgement. It talks about ruling in the MIDST of the enemies. (Jesus did say the same thing when He said the Kingdom of Heaven is in your MIDST)
Can you show one place where Jesus ever said anything at all about His kingdom being an earthly kingdom? Is there one place in any of the epistles where the apostles say that it's an earthly kingdom? Or did they say things like this
Colossians 1
13 For he has rescued us from the dominion of darkness and brought us into the kingdom of the Son he loves, 14 in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.
Luke 17:20-21 “Now when He was asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, He answered them and said, "The kingdom of God does not come with observation; nor will they say, 'See here!' or 'See there!' For indeed, the kingdom of God is within you.”
Also where in Psalms 110 is there anything about an earthly kingdom? It talks about the day of wrath and judgement. It talks about ruling in the MIDST of the enemies. (Jesus did say the same thing when He said the Kingdom of Heaven is in your MIDST)
Can you show one place where Jesus ever said anything at all about His kingdom being an earthly kingdom? Is there one place in any of the epistles where the apostles say that it's an earthly kingdom? Or did they say things like this
Colossians 1
13 For he has rescued us from the dominion of darkness and brought us into the kingdom of the Son he loves, 14 in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.
And taking it further Jesus said things like this which all point to Jesus being the King NOW
Matthew 11
27 “All things have been committed to me by my Father. No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.
Matthew 28
16 Then the eleven disciples went to Galilee, to the mountain where Jesus had told them to go.17 When they saw him, they worshiped him; but some doubted.18 Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”
John 3
31 The one who comes from above is above all; the one who is from the earth belongs to the earth, and speaks as one from the earth. The one who comes from heaven is above all.32 He testifies to what he has seen and heard, but no one accepts his testimony.33 Whoever has accepted it has certified that God is truthful.34 For the one whom God has sent speaks the words of God, for God[i] gives the Spirit without limit.35 The Father loves the Son and has placed everything in his hands.36 Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on them.
John 13
2 The evening meal was in progress, and the devil had already prompted Judas, the son of Simon Iscariot, to betray Jesus.3Jesus knew that the Father had put all things under his power, and that he had come from Godand was returning to God;4 so he got up from the meal, took off his outer clothing, and wrapped a towel around his waist.5 After that, he poured water into a basin and began to wash his disciples’ feet, drying them with the towel that was wrapped around him.
John 17
After Jesus said this, he looked toward heaven and prayed:
“Father, the hour has come. Glorify your Son, that your Son may glorify you. 2 For you granted him authority over all people that he might give eternal life to all those you have given him. 3 Now this is eternal life: that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.4 I have brought you glory on earth by finishing the work you gave me to do. 5 And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began.
The writer of Hebrews tells us this
Hebrews 2
7 Thou madest him a little lower than the angels; thou crownedst him with glory and honour, and didst set him over the works of thy hands:
8 Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him.
9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
Matthew 11
27 “All things have been committed to me by my Father. No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.
Matthew 28
16 Then the eleven disciples went to Galilee, to the mountain where Jesus had told them to go.17 When they saw him, they worshiped him; but some doubted.18 Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”
John 3
31 The one who comes from above is above all; the one who is from the earth belongs to the earth, and speaks as one from the earth. The one who comes from heaven is above all.32 He testifies to what he has seen and heard, but no one accepts his testimony.33 Whoever has accepted it has certified that God is truthful.34 For the one whom God has sent speaks the words of God, for God[i] gives the Spirit without limit.35 The Father loves the Son and has placed everything in his hands.36 Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on them.
John 13
2 The evening meal was in progress, and the devil had already prompted Judas, the son of Simon Iscariot, to betray Jesus.3Jesus knew that the Father had put all things under his power, and that he had come from Godand was returning to God;4 so he got up from the meal, took off his outer clothing, and wrapped a towel around his waist.5 After that, he poured water into a basin and began to wash his disciples’ feet, drying them with the towel that was wrapped around him.
John 17
After Jesus said this, he looked toward heaven and prayed:
“Father, the hour has come. Glorify your Son, that your Son may glorify you. 2 For you granted him authority over all people that he might give eternal life to all those you have given him. 3 Now this is eternal life: that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.4 I have brought you glory on earth by finishing the work you gave me to do. 5 And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began.
The writer of Hebrews tells us this
Hebrews 2
7 Thou madest him a little lower than the angels; thou crownedst him with glory and honour, and didst set him over the works of thy hands:
8 Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him.
9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
Isaiah 30:20
Although the Lord gives you the bread of adversity and the water of affliction, your teachers will be hidden no more; with your own eyes you will see them.
what's "He will drink from a brook along the way"? an hebraism
and after he did that, did He "lift his head high"?
some people are getting saved. The Lord's friends are joyful He is King on His Throne ruling.
His enemies should be terrified.
a 1,000 year period of time after He comes to Judge is not required.
it's not written.
Although the Lord gives you the bread of adversity and the water of affliction, your teachers will be hidden no more; with your own eyes you will see them.
what's "He will drink from a brook along the way"? an hebraism
and after he did that, did He "lift his head high"?
some people are getting saved. The Lord's friends are joyful He is King on His Throne ruling.
His enemies should be terrified.
a 1,000 year period of time after He comes to Judge is not required.
it's not written.
B
It is a very simple distinction that we been given in the scriptures and is evidence even today. Here it is and let's see if you and others can hear it.
- we have the unbelieving Jew of Israel
- we have the unbelieving Gentile of the world
- we have the church made up of Jew and Gentile who have believed
A simple question would identify each of these. You ask if they believe in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sin and here are the answers.
- the Jew would say NO, rejecting Christ and remain in unbelief
- the Gentile would say NO, rejecting Christ and remain in unbelief
- the church would say YES and continue to walk by faith having the indwelling Spirit
The Jew and Gentile are distinct from one another but agree in their unbelief concerning Christ, so God concludes them all in unbelief so that he might give them mercy. The church has been called out of the Jew and Gentile and are distinct because they are new creatures in Christ through a new birth that those who live in unbelief have not received through the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ.
The day of salvation is now to the Jew and also to the Gentile and to the church who are those who have accepted that salvation by faith through the death, burial and resurrection of Christ.
- we have the unbelieving Jew of Israel
- we have the unbelieving Gentile of the world
- we have the church made up of Jew and Gentile who have believed
A simple question would identify each of these. You ask if they believe in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sin and here are the answers.
- the Jew would say NO, rejecting Christ and remain in unbelief
- the Gentile would say NO, rejecting Christ and remain in unbelief
- the church would say YES and continue to walk by faith having the indwelling Spirit
The Jew and Gentile are distinct from one another but agree in their unbelief concerning Christ, so God concludes them all in unbelief so that he might give them mercy. The church has been called out of the Jew and Gentile and are distinct because they are new creatures in Christ through a new birth that those who live in unbelief have not received through the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ.
The day of salvation is now to the Jew and also to the Gentile and to the church who are those who have accepted that salvation by faith through the death, burial and resurrection of Christ.
what? no thousand years? 4 times in this passage.
Revelation 20:2-5, "And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, who is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years--And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, until the thousand years should be finished; and after that he must be loosed a little season. And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them. And I saw the souls of those who were beheaded for their witness of Yahshua and for the word of Yahweh and who had not worshiped the beast, nor his likeness, neither had received his mark in their foreheads nor upon their hands; and they lived and reigned with the Messiah a thousand years-- But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection--"
Revelation 20:2-5, "And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, who is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years--And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, until the thousand years should be finished; and after that he must be loosed a little season. And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them. And I saw the souls of those who were beheaded for their witness of Yahshua and for the word of Yahweh and who had not worshiped the beast, nor his likeness, neither had received his mark in their foreheads nor upon their hands; and they lived and reigned with the Messiah a thousand years-- But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection--"
1) Paul had received by revelation a measure of grace according to God's purpose that he was to administer, dispense, oversee and manage in terms of its affairs, its doctrine and the building up of believers as a habitation of God through the Spirit.
2) This was to be done by faith and all under the stewardship of this grace that was given.
3) This was never offered to Israel nor was it a part of the commonwealth of Israel.
4) It was solely offered to the church as part of the manifold grace and wisdom of God according to God's purpose to reveal the mystery of Christ and the church.
5) It excluded Israel as a people and nation.....BradC
2) This was to be done by faith and all under the stewardship of this grace that was given.
3) This was never offered to Israel nor was it a part of the commonwealth of Israel.
4) It was solely offered to the church as part of the manifold grace and wisdom of God according to God's purpose to reveal the mystery of Christ and the church.
5) It excluded Israel as a people and nation.....BradC
B
Zone, your slip is showing. In Rev 19 God has had quite enough and there is no repentance on his part and I see lots of blood shed and destruction with the sword on the children of disobedience, which differs from the devouring fire that comes out of heaven in Rev 20 (1,000 years later). The funny thing about it is that despite the resistance of the world and these children of disobedience, they have no effective power in their revolt to prevent being overcome by these things that have dished out from heaven against them, including the armies that follow the Lord on white horses dressed in clean and white linen as the righteousness of the saints. Hard to deny that don't you think?
Even when Christ was here the first time he announced that he did not come to bring peace as the world would give it but a sword that would cause great division in the families of the earth. I am not saying it was a literal sword for the destruction of human life but a sword to separate the flesh from the Spirit. Do you also deny that? Peace on earth and good will toward men is not the process but the end result that God sent his Son to accomplish, even the peace of the cross was accomplished through a violent blood shed and crucifixion. If your home was invaded at any time without your consent would you do everything in your power to protect your dwelling place and those who reside within? Should we give up our rights to live, breath and have our being and be prosperous in this life just because we are Christians? If we are being persecuted as Christians because of our faith and the name of Christ, then we are to be lead of the Spirit and follow Christ in that persecution, but if not then any goes especially in the days that live in this present evil world.
I am not a pacifist nor a reactionary but if anyone or any government agency or group or legislated law is going to try and take away from me, as an individual, any of the liberties and rights associated with my citizenship or as a living human being, then I will appeal in whatever manner necessary to protect myself from that invasion. If someone attempts to hijack my vehicle or any of my possessions or attempts to imprison any member of my family or neighbor, whether I sense bodily harm or not, I consider that a threat and will resist that threat with whatever force or means needed. That is my planned response to that kind of treat that is getting more and more likely as we continue in this life. So go ahead and tell our armed service men and women who have risk their lives and shed their blood just how deceived and despicable they have acted on behalf of a people who believe in the freedoms that have been granted.
Even when Christ was here the first time he announced that he did not come to bring peace as the world would give it but a sword that would cause great division in the families of the earth. I am not saying it was a literal sword for the destruction of human life but a sword to separate the flesh from the Spirit. Do you also deny that? Peace on earth and good will toward men is not the process but the end result that God sent his Son to accomplish, even the peace of the cross was accomplished through a violent blood shed and crucifixion. If your home was invaded at any time without your consent would you do everything in your power to protect your dwelling place and those who reside within? Should we give up our rights to live, breath and have our being and be prosperous in this life just because we are Christians? If we are being persecuted as Christians because of our faith and the name of Christ, then we are to be lead of the Spirit and follow Christ in that persecution, but if not then any goes especially in the days that live in this present evil world.
I am not a pacifist nor a reactionary but if anyone or any government agency or group or legislated law is going to try and take away from me, as an individual, any of the liberties and rights associated with my citizenship or as a living human being, then I will appeal in whatever manner necessary to protect myself from that invasion. If someone attempts to hijack my vehicle or any of my possessions or attempts to imprison any member of my family or neighbor, whether I sense bodily harm or not, I consider that a threat and will resist that threat with whatever force or means needed. That is my planned response to that kind of treat that is getting more and more likely as we continue in this life. So go ahead and tell our armed service men and women who have risk their lives and shed their blood just how deceived and despicable they have acted on behalf of a people who believe in the freedoms that have been granted.
Amillennialism
Amillennialism (Greek: a- "no" + millennialism) is the view in Christian eschatology which states that Christ is presently reigning through the Church, and that the "1000 years" of Revelation 20:1-6 is a metaphorical reference to the present church age which will culminate in Christ's return. It stands in contrast to premillennialism, which states that Christ will return prior to a literal 1000 year earthly reign; and postmillennialism, which states that Christ's return will follow a 1000 year golden age ushered in by the church.
http://www.theopedia.com/Amillennialism < click short overview
Amillennialism (Greek: a- "no" + millennialism) is the view in Christian eschatology which states that Christ is presently reigning through the Church, and that the "1000 years" of Revelation 20:1-6 is a metaphorical reference to the present church age which will culminate in Christ's return. It stands in contrast to premillennialism, which states that Christ will return prior to a literal 1000 year earthly reign; and postmillennialism, which states that Christ's return will follow a 1000 year golden age ushered in by the church.
http://www.theopedia.com/Amillennialism < click short overview
just stand by your own convictions.
if you're having a change of heart, that's great.
you are FOR war, FOR Israel.
you've made it plain.
blah blah blah.
you're not for peace on earth goodwill toward men, even if it means you place your head on the chopping block for refusing to approve of killing anyone.
yes i would - UNLESS it was persecution FOR being a Christian refusing to renounce the name of Jesus.
if someone invaded my home and put a gun in my hand and ordered me to murder other people for Israel; or for Iran, i would refuse, and die instead. is this hard for you to ponder?
this kind of emotion rhetoric, the mixing of politics; self-defense in crime; and blurring it all in to the Christian faith and what Christians are called to do is typical of the sectarian cult of Christian Zionism.
[video=youtube;hDh1Vr7qajA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hDh1Vr7qajA[/video]
John Hagee Calls for Pre-emptive nuckler strike against Iran!
"it is time for America to consider a military pre-emptive strike against Iran to prevent a nuclear Holocaust in Israel and a nuclear attack in America"
and all the CHRISTIAN ZIONISTS CHEER - AND WAVE THE ISRAELI FLAG.
...
you don't listen. i'm ANTIWAR. understand?
and that, only since i have been a Christian and understood what Jesus said and meant.
prior to that i would have been a revolutionary.
this isn't about any of that.
but, standard tactics...hope what you've previously said is buried in the threads and make yourself sound reasonable.
you absolutely are a reactionary.
Christian Zionism is opposed to every principle Jesus set down.
no you won't.
you haven't done it with your own Govt.
you support it.
no doubt you were FOR torture (enhanced interrogation techniques) at GITMO for the ticking-time bomb terrorists.
it was called The Patriot Acts I & II and you were undoubtedly for them...because it has the newspeak word Patriot in it.
.....since those terrible awful MOOOSLIMS did 911 (NOT).
you've been p'wnd.
but it's a sin for you to consider any of that....perfectly conditioned.
"Tonight, we are a country awakened to danger and called to defend freedom. Our grief has turned to anger and anger to resolution. Whether we bring our enemies to justice or bring justice to our enemies, justice will be done.
(APPLAUSE)
All of America was touched on the evening of the tragedy to see Republicans and Democrats joined together on the steps of this Capitol singing ``God Bless America.''
And you did more than sing. You acted, by delivering $40 billion to rebuild our communities and meet the needs of our military. Speaker Hastert, Minority Leader Gephardt, Majority Leader Daschle and Senator Lott, I thank you for your friendship, for your leadership and for your service to our country.
(APPLAUSE)
America has no truer friend than Great Britain.
(APPLAUSE)
Once again, we are joined together in a great cause.
(APPLAUSE)
On September the 11th, enemies of freedom committed an act of war against our country. Americans have known wars, but for the past 136 years they have been wars on foreign soil, except for one Sunday in 1941. Americans have known the casualties of war, but not at the center of a great city on a peaceful morning.
Americans have known surprise attacks, but never before on thousands of civilians.
All of this was brought upon us in a single day, and night fell on a different world, a world where freedom itself is under attack.
Americans have many questions tonight. Americans are asking, ``Who attacked our country?''
The evidence we have gathered all points to a collection of loosely affiliated terrorist organizations known as al Qaeda.
The terrorists' directive commands them to kill Christians and Jews, to kill all Americans and make no distinctions among military and civilians, including women and children.
This group and its leader, a person named Osama bin Laden, are linked to many other organizations in different countries, including the Egyptian Islamic Jihad, the Islamic Movement of Uzbekistan.
There are thousands of these terrorists in more than 60 countries.
They are recruited from their own nations and neighborhoods and brought to camps in places like Afghanistan where they are trained in the tactics of terror. They are sent back to their homes or sent to hide in countries around the world to plot evil and destruction.......
The leadership of Al Qaeda has great influence in Afghanistan and supports the Taliban regime in controlling most of that country. In Afghanistan we see Al Qaeda's vision for the world. Afghanistan's people have been brutalized, many are starving and many have fled.
(APPLAUSE)
Our war on terror begins with Al Qaeda, but it does not end there.
It will not end until every terrorist group of global reach has been found, stopped and defeated.
(APPLAUSE)
Americans are asking ``Why do they hate us?''
They hate what they see right here in this chamber: a democratically elected government. Their leaders are self-appointed. They hate our freedoms: our freedom of religion, our freedom of speech, our freedom to vote and assemble and disagree with each other.
washingtonpost.com
if you ever get around to finding out who wrote this speech you may advance and pass GO.
if you're having a change of heart, that's great.
you are FOR war, FOR Israel.
you've made it plain.
blah blah blah.
you're not for peace on earth goodwill toward men, even if it means you place your head on the chopping block for refusing to approve of killing anyone.
yes i would - UNLESS it was persecution FOR being a Christian refusing to renounce the name of Jesus.
if someone invaded my home and put a gun in my hand and ordered me to murder other people for Israel; or for Iran, i would refuse, and die instead. is this hard for you to ponder?
this kind of emotion rhetoric, the mixing of politics; self-defense in crime; and blurring it all in to the Christian faith and what Christians are called to do is typical of the sectarian cult of Christian Zionism.
[video=youtube;hDh1Vr7qajA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hDh1Vr7qajA[/video]
John Hagee Calls for Pre-emptive nuckler strike against Iran!
"it is time for America to consider a military pre-emptive strike against Iran to prevent a nuclear Holocaust in Israel and a nuclear attack in America"
and all the CHRISTIAN ZIONISTS CHEER - AND WAVE THE ISRAELI FLAG.
...
you don't listen. i'm ANTIWAR. understand?
and that, only since i have been a Christian and understood what Jesus said and meant.
prior to that i would have been a revolutionary.
this isn't about any of that.
but, standard tactics...hope what you've previously said is buried in the threads and make yourself sound reasonable.
you absolutely are a reactionary.
Christian Zionism is opposed to every principle Jesus set down.
no you won't.
you haven't done it with your own Govt.
you support it.
no doubt you were FOR torture (enhanced interrogation techniques) at GITMO for the ticking-time bomb terrorists.
it was called The Patriot Acts I & II and you were undoubtedly for them...because it has the newspeak word Patriot in it.
.....since those terrible awful MOOOSLIMS did 911 (NOT).
you've been p'wnd.
but it's a sin for you to consider any of that....perfectly conditioned.
"Tonight, we are a country awakened to danger and called to defend freedom. Our grief has turned to anger and anger to resolution. Whether we bring our enemies to justice or bring justice to our enemies, justice will be done.
(APPLAUSE)
All of America was touched on the evening of the tragedy to see Republicans and Democrats joined together on the steps of this Capitol singing ``God Bless America.''
And you did more than sing. You acted, by delivering $40 billion to rebuild our communities and meet the needs of our military. Speaker Hastert, Minority Leader Gephardt, Majority Leader Daschle and Senator Lott, I thank you for your friendship, for your leadership and for your service to our country.
(APPLAUSE)
America has no truer friend than Great Britain.
(APPLAUSE)
Once again, we are joined together in a great cause.
(APPLAUSE)
On September the 11th, enemies of freedom committed an act of war against our country. Americans have known wars, but for the past 136 years they have been wars on foreign soil, except for one Sunday in 1941. Americans have known the casualties of war, but not at the center of a great city on a peaceful morning.
Americans have known surprise attacks, but never before on thousands of civilians.
All of this was brought upon us in a single day, and night fell on a different world, a world where freedom itself is under attack.
Americans have many questions tonight. Americans are asking, ``Who attacked our country?''
The evidence we have gathered all points to a collection of loosely affiliated terrorist organizations known as al Qaeda.
The terrorists' directive commands them to kill Christians and Jews, to kill all Americans and make no distinctions among military and civilians, including women and children.
This group and its leader, a person named Osama bin Laden, are linked to many other organizations in different countries, including the Egyptian Islamic Jihad, the Islamic Movement of Uzbekistan.
There are thousands of these terrorists in more than 60 countries.
They are recruited from their own nations and neighborhoods and brought to camps in places like Afghanistan where they are trained in the tactics of terror. They are sent back to their homes or sent to hide in countries around the world to plot evil and destruction.......
The leadership of Al Qaeda has great influence in Afghanistan and supports the Taliban regime in controlling most of that country. In Afghanistan we see Al Qaeda's vision for the world. Afghanistan's people have been brutalized, many are starving and many have fled.
(APPLAUSE)
Our war on terror begins with Al Qaeda, but it does not end there.
It will not end until every terrorist group of global reach has been found, stopped and defeated.
(APPLAUSE)
Americans are asking ``Why do they hate us?''
They hate what they see right here in this chamber: a democratically elected government. Their leaders are self-appointed. They hate our freedoms: our freedom of religion, our freedom of speech, our freedom to vote and assemble and disagree with each other.
washingtonpost.com
if you ever get around to finding out who wrote this speech you may advance and pass GO.
B
Your rhetoric to discredit has no weight, has lost its leverage and is non-complicite. Trying to confuse others away from simplicity is a way of life for you in communicating to others. It leaves a bad taste in their mouth and they loose a level of respect they once had. You can always argue with others and accomplish nothing of any redemptive value. Zone you are being reduced to zero and from God's point of view that is a good thing.
Ezekiel 38
King James Version (KJV)
38 And the word of the Lord came unto me, saying,
2 Son of man, set thy face against Gog, the land of Magog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal, and prophesy against him,
3 And say, Thus saith the Lord God; Behold, I am against thee, O Gog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal:
4 And I will turn thee back, and put hooks into thy jaws, and I will bring thee forth, and all thine army, horses and horsemen, all of them clothed with all sorts of armour, even a great company with bucklers and shields, all of them handling swords:
5 Persia, Ethiopia, and Libya with them; all of them with shield and helmet:
6 Gomer, and all his bands; the house of Togarmah of the north quarters, and all his bands: and many people with thee.
7 Be thou prepared, and prepare for thyself, thou, and all thy company that are assembled unto thee, and be thou a guard unto them.
8 After many days thou shalt be visited: in the latter years thou shalt come into the land that is brought back from the sword, and is gathered out of many people, against the mountains of Israel, which have been always waste: but it is brought forth out of the nations, and they shall dwell safely all of them.
9 Thou shalt ascend and come like a storm, thou shalt be like a cloud to cover the land, thou, and all thy bands, and many people with thee.
10 Thus saith the Lord God; It shall also come to pass, that at the same time shall things come into thy mind, and thou shalt think an evil thought:
11 And thou shalt say, I will go up to the land of unwalled villages; I will go to them that are at rest, that dwell safely, all of them dwelling without walls, and having neither bars nor gates,
12 To take a spoil, and to take a prey; to turn thine hand upon the desolate places that are now inhabited, and upon the people that are gathered out of the nations, which have gotten cattle and goods, that dwell in the midst of the land.
The invasion of Israel by Russia and all their allies and Zone cheering On hmmmm Jesus is going to send fire and brimstone on all of them hmmm Zone do you still want to be part of this fireworks
King James Version (KJV)
38 And the word of the Lord came unto me, saying,
2 Son of man, set thy face against Gog, the land of Magog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal, and prophesy against him,
3 And say, Thus saith the Lord God; Behold, I am against thee, O Gog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal:
4 And I will turn thee back, and put hooks into thy jaws, and I will bring thee forth, and all thine army, horses and horsemen, all of them clothed with all sorts of armour, even a great company with bucklers and shields, all of them handling swords:
5 Persia, Ethiopia, and Libya with them; all of them with shield and helmet:
6 Gomer, and all his bands; the house of Togarmah of the north quarters, and all his bands: and many people with thee.
7 Be thou prepared, and prepare for thyself, thou, and all thy company that are assembled unto thee, and be thou a guard unto them.
8 After many days thou shalt be visited: in the latter years thou shalt come into the land that is brought back from the sword, and is gathered out of many people, against the mountains of Israel, which have been always waste: but it is brought forth out of the nations, and they shall dwell safely all of them.
9 Thou shalt ascend and come like a storm, thou shalt be like a cloud to cover the land, thou, and all thy bands, and many people with thee.
10 Thus saith the Lord God; It shall also come to pass, that at the same time shall things come into thy mind, and thou shalt think an evil thought:
11 And thou shalt say, I will go up to the land of unwalled villages; I will go to them that are at rest, that dwell safely, all of them dwelling without walls, and having neither bars nor gates,
12 To take a spoil, and to take a prey; to turn thine hand upon the desolate places that are now inhabited, and upon the people that are gathered out of the nations, which have gotten cattle and goods, that dwell in the midst of the land.
The invasion of Israel by Russia and all their allies and Zone cheering On hmmmm Jesus is going to send fire and brimstone on all of them hmmm Zone do you still want to be part of this fireworks
TRUE OR FALSE:
1) "Comparing, then, what is said in Scripture concerning Israel and the Church, [a careful Bible student ] finds that in origin, calling, promise, worship, principles of conduct, and future destiny--all is contrast." - C.I. Scofield
2) the "basic premise of Dispensationalism is two purposes of God expressed in the formation of two peoples who maintain their distinction throughout eternity." - Charles Ryrie
1) "Comparing, then, what is said in Scripture concerning Israel and the Church, [a careful Bible student ] finds that in origin, calling, promise, worship, principles of conduct, and future destiny--all is contrast." - C.I. Scofield
2) the "basic premise of Dispensationalism is two purposes of God expressed in the formation of two peoples who maintain their distinction throughout eternity." - Charles Ryrie
B
Zone, as a pacifist you are a revolutionary in your stance against war and those who you deem to be warmongers,unless that war it is against Israel (Jews) or the US (Christians). You would never endorse any protection preemptively or otherwise against the Middle East nations (along with other selective nations) and terrorist groups who hate Israel and would have no problem relinquishing Israel or the US (for that matter) to nothing. This is fueled by your conspiracy theories based upon information that you gravitate to justify your revolutionary spirit. This is why your conclusions about 9-11 are so oriented in excusing terrorism and holding President Bush and others responsible for seeing that this would happen to manipulate the mindset of this country and develop a hatred for terrorism (and Muslims) through fear and to justify the Patriot Act that would follow. This is your sick and convoluted mind that has addressed this issue of 9-11 as a plot to rape the minds of US citizens and sublimate hatred toward the Muslims who have become a self religious imposed threat to the Jew and the Christian doing everything they can to destroy the infidel so that Allah can send Jews and Christians to hell to atone for the sins of Muslims. That's a great way of going about things in this world, don't you think. Save it Zone for someone who really cares what you have to say with your depraved mind on these matters.