Learning Knew Things

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Bob1953

Bob1953

Banned
#1
Sep 27, 2009
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#1
As we walk with the Lord, I imagine we learn new things that supplement what we’ve read in the Bible. Read this:

But there are also many other things which Jesus did; were every one of them to be written, I suppose that the world itself could not contain the books that would be written. John 21:25 RSV

Perhaps sometimes we discover ideas that amaze us and we want to share them with other Christians. These Christians might believe the ideas, politely disagree, angrily disagree, or ignore us all together. I don’t mind being agreed with or politely disagreed with, and I don’t mind being angrily disagreed with since I figure I can spar with the best of them. What is spooky, I think, is being ignored.

What do you think?
 
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Harley_Angel

Guest
#2
#2
I still hold firmly to the belief that God gave us the Holy Spirit to guide us in the things that weren't addressed specifically in the Bible. I think we are also guided through changes caused by the times, etc. This is one of the reasons why I don't think it's un-Christian for women to be priests and preachers. It was said by a man who was led by the Holy Spirit, and there is no reason why the Holy Spirit can't guide us through a change. The Bible is a great place to learn, to understand what it means to follow God, to get an idea of what things God wants from us, but we also need to listen to the Holy Spirit. Each one of us is different, which means each one of us has a different path to walk to get to God. If we all took the same one, it would be a well traveled road, which God has already told us, it's not. This is why it's important to read the Bible, so you can get an understanding of where to start your path, and then let prayer and God lead you through the labyrinth using the gift of the Holy Spirit.
 
T

Thaddaeus

Banned
#4
Jan 31, 2009
2,225
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Harley_Angel said:
I still hold firmly to the belief that God gave us the Holy Spirit to guide us in the things that weren't addressed specifically in the Bible. I think we are also guided through changes caused by the times, etc. This is one of the reasons why I don't think it's un-Christian for women to be priests and preachers. It was said by a man who was led by the Holy Spirit, and there is no reason why the Holy Spirit can't guide us through a change. The Bible is a great place to learn, to understand what it means to follow God, to get an idea of what things God wants from us, but we also need to listen to the Holy Spirit. Each one of us is different, which means each one of us has a different path to walk to get to God. If we all took the same one, it would be a well traveled road, which God has already told us, it's not. This is why it's important to read the Bible, so you can get an understanding of where to start your path, and then let prayer and God lead you through the labyrinth using the gift of the Holy Spirit.
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If the Holy Ghost says or leads us against the word of God then it is not a holy spirit it is not for God but against Him, the Father, the Son , and The Holy spirit are one, they can not be against one another a House divided can not stand, If the Word of God says Woman are not to pastor then the Holy Ghost will never say otherwise . if the Word of God says that when tongues are spoken in the Church then there must be an interpreter then there must Be an interpreter. Jesus never broke or destroy one jot or tittle of the law never against the Father, but fulfilled the law, the Holy Ghost will never break or destory one jot or tittle Of the law of the Lord. If the Holy Spirit goes against God then we don't have a Holy trinity, but we have a choice either follow that spirit or follow God.

1co 2:12Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.1co 2:13Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.1co 2:14But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.1co 2:15But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.1co 2:16For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.

comparing spiritual things with spiritual. is it still spiritual to obey God ? then the Holy spirit will never go against God
 
D

DieuMerci

Guest
#5
#5
well, there are things that are true, that arent explicitly in the 66 boks of the bible, but within those books, we learn how to tell the difference between truth and falsehood. There is also revelation that is in th e word of God subliminally...it doesnt explicitly say that Joshua judged Israel for 30 years but it does say that he was 40 when the 40 year wandering began and that he was 110 when he died, so subliminally within those numbers are the number of years that he judges israel.
 
Bob1953

Bob1953

Banned
#6
Sep 27, 2009
260
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#6
I am torn, because I think both Harley_Angel and Thaddaues (Pastor Keith) are great people, but they disagree on the issue of women pastors and priests, and the last thing I want to do is step on either of their toes.

Paul does say that women shouldn’t speak in church, but that seems extremely unfair to me, though I do not know all things.

Anyway, some churches allow women pastors and some don’t—we are all free to choose whichever church we wish to attend, assuming there are acceptable choices, and we can also fight within our churches for the causes we believe in.
 
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Harley_Angel

Guest
#7
#7
I understand Bob, this is a huge division. I'm still teetering on trying to find a firm belief in women being pastors. In fact, I've put my own desire to go to seminary on hold until God shows me His plan. It just bothers me that for some scripture, it's okay to use it out of context, and other scripture people jump down your throat if you use it out of context. PAUL, not God, not from the lips of Jesus, says that HE doesn't allow a woman to speak in church. From what I understand of the context of the time, women were uneducated second-class citizens who were more or less property. Once they found out they were equal to men in Christ, they started to cause disruptions in the Church. They were not trained or learned in Theology and it was hindering the learning of others. People say that it was the Holy Spirit that led the apostles to write, and I'm okay with that. But, all the reasons women were told not to speak in Church aren't around today. Women can get an education, we aren't second-class citizens anymore. God says we are to be man's helper, and teaching DOES help them. The priest has VERY little authority in the church if you ask me because in all the churches I've gone to, the congregation has councils and committees that hold authority over the comings and goings of the church and the priest is the one who serves them. My priest comes to work, talks to people, gives people advice, figures out what he wants to teach, goes to bible studies, helps people in the hospital, gives people money when they need it, visits the sick, the poor, brings food to the hungry. And then on Sunday, he stands in front of the congregation, teaches them, and gives out the Eucharist. He doesn't hold authority over me, he's SERVING me.

Besides, if women weren't allowed to speak in church, we shouldn't be allowed to pray, we shouldn't be allowed to have Bible Study that is in the church, we shouldn't be allowed to sing His praises, we shouldn't be allowed to confess, we should go there, keep our mouths shut, and then leave.

The Holy Spirit can guide us to do extraordinary things, and if a woman is called to serve her congregation by learning Theology, giving her life to God and being a priest/pastor I don't think there is anything wrong with that. Priesthood is a occupation of service, not authority over the people. They allow God to use them so they can serve their people.
 
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Buddee

Guest
#8
#8
I'm still scratching my head over each one of us being different and having a different path to walk to get to God??


:confused:


True, there are different paths one can take in this life, but only ONE leads to God, and that is Christ Jesus. And being as such, that path does NOT change or differ from person to person.

Our individual circumstances may differ, but His Truths remain constant throughout for all time.
 
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Leilaii425

Guest
#9
#9
I am completely closed off to learning anything. I have no further input.
 
Bob1953

Bob1953

Banned
#10
Sep 27, 2009
260
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#10
Jesus and the Bible are two different things. I give my allegiance only to Jesus—not the Bible. The Bible is a wonderful book, but my loyalty is to Jesus and Jesus alone.

I have a desire to see justice done and I believe Jesus gives his blessing to this. In my view, and I know that I don’t know everything, it is unjust to prevent women from being priests and pastors.

If anyone can show me were it is JUST to prevent women from becoming priests and pastors, then I would ask you to do so—I want to learn.
 
Bob1953

Bob1953

Banned
#11
Sep 27, 2009
260
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#11
Bob1953 said:
Jesus and the Bible are two different things. I give my allegiance only to Jesus—not the Bible. The Bible is a wonderful book, but my loyalty is to Jesus and Jesus alone.

I have a desire to see justice done and I believe Jesus gives his blessing to this. In my view, and I know that I don’t know everything, it is unjust to prevent women from being priests and pastors.

If anyone can show me were it is JUST to prevent women from becoming priests and pastors, then I would ask you to do so—I want to learn.
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I guess I mis-spelled the word “where” in that last sentence—or maybe I should have used the word “why””—but I suppose you all knew what I was saying. It should have said:

If anyone can show me why it is JUST to prevent women from becoming priests and pastors, then I would ask you to do so—I want to learn.
 
H

Harley_Angel

Guest
#12
#12
Buddee said:
I'm still scratching my head over each one of us being different and having a different path to walk to get to God??


:confused:


True, there are different paths one can take in this life, but only ONE leads to God, and that is Christ Jesus. And being as such, that path does NOT change or differ from person to person.

Our individual circumstances may differ, but His Truths remain constant throughout for all time.
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I mean that each one of us has a very different life, and finding God is different for us all. We each have different personal demons we have to address. For example, I may struggle with pride and promiscuity, whereas someone else my struggle with lying and alcoholism. We each need God in our lives, but in different ways. The paths we walk to get to God and stay with God are different for each of us in that an alcoholic needs to stray away from paths that involve alcohol, a promiscuous person should stay away from paths that glorify primiscuity, etc. Some people may be called to glorify God by singing, or writing music, or painting, or writing books, or dancing, or simply giving a homeless person a meal. God has a plan for EACH of us, and the Holy spirit guides us through the path God ordained for us.
 
M

Mobius

Banned
#13
Sep 27, 2009
261
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#13
Harley_Angel said:
From what I understand of the context of the time, women were uneducated second-class citizens who were more or less property.
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That was not true in Israel.

Ancient Israel was the EARLIEST society on record as requiring literacy of man, women and child alike (Deu 6).

Harley_Angel said:
Once they found out they were equal to men in Christ, they started to cause disruptions in the Church. They were not trained or learned in Theology and it was hindering the learning of others.
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I could actually make a pretty good argument that said the same thing about Paul himself. He did not go meet with the apostles upon his conversion, which would explain why his epistles record so little of Messiah's words or deeds. There was a pretty severe conflict between himself and the church in Ephesus, which both Luke and Paul himself spoke of, as well as (arguably) being talked about in Revelations' letter TO the Ephesians.
 
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Buddee

Guest
#14
#14
Harley_Angel said:
I mean that each one of us has a very different life, and finding God is different for us all. We each have different personal demons we have to address. For example, I may struggle with pride and promiscuity, whereas someone else my struggle with lying and alcoholism. We each need God in our lives, but in different ways. The paths we walk to get to God and stay with God are different for each of us in that an alcoholic needs to stray away from paths that involve alcohol, a promiscuous person should stay away from paths that glorify primiscuity, etc. Some people may be called to glorify God by singing, or writing music, or painting, or writing books, or dancing, or simply giving a homeless person a meal. God has a plan for EACH of us, and the Holy spirit guides us through the path God ordained for us.
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Harley,

These are not different paths.

There may be many stones one can stumble on along the way but still there is only one path, one answer, to (finding) God and that path, again, is Christ Jesus.

Put off the old and put on the new.

That is what and who the Holy Spirit will guide you to and through.
 
I

imoss

Banned
#15
Feb 27, 2007
3,179
19
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#15
Harley_Angel said:
I still hold firmly to the belief that God gave us the Holy Spirit to guide us in the things that weren't addressed specifically in the Bible. I think we are also guided through changes caused by the times, etc. This is one of the reasons why I don't think it's un-Christian for women to be priests and preachers. It was said by a man who was led by the Holy Spirit, and there is no reason why the Holy Spirit can't guide us through a change. The Bible is a great place to learn, to understand what it means to follow God, to get an idea of what things God wants from us, but we also need to listen to the Holy Spirit. Each one of us is different, which means each one of us has a different path to walk to get to God. If we all took the same one, it would be a well traveled road, which God has already told us, it's not. This is why it's important to read the Bible, so you can get an understanding of where to start your path, and then let prayer and God lead you through the labyrinth using the gift of the Holy Spirit.
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I've yet to encounter a situation not addressed in Gods word. In fact in moments of total dispare thank the Lord the perfect passage is always right there at hand or given by another of his faithful servants. If the Holy spirit is advising you contrary to HIS word then you have to question it. I think it is so important to yes, listen to the Holy Spirit but have your foundation as a Christian in the word of God so you grow STRONG roots in your faith. And always always always question it if you think the Holy spirit is leading you in a direction that is contrary to Gods word. I pray for discernment in these matters and truly feel the Lord is faithful in that. Please dont forget the word of God, this is GOD & to say its just a geat place to learn is kinda like referring to it as a book like any other book. It is not, it is the word of God. God bless you H.A. as you grow in the Lord and may you grow strong roots in Christ and be a mountain that can not be shaken. Your sister in Christ. :)
 
I

imoss

Banned
#16
Feb 27, 2007
3,179
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#16
Harley_Angel said:
I mean that each one of us has a very different life, and finding God is different for us all. We each have different personal demons we have to address. For example, I may struggle with pride and promiscuity, whereas someone else my struggle with lying and alcoholism. We each need God in our lives, but in different ways. The paths we walk to get to God and stay with God are different for each of us in that an alcoholic needs to stray away from paths that involve alcohol, a promiscuous person should stay away from paths that glorify primiscuity, etc. Some people may be called to glorify God by singing, or writing music, or painting, or writing books, or dancing, or simply giving a homeless person a meal. God has a plan for EACH of us, and the Holy spirit guides us through the path God ordained for us.
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1 cor 12 addresses this, we are all parts of the Body of Christ! praise the Lord that we are not all alike, for how boring would that be! And I thank God for my miserable past, for much has been forgiven but also because I can minister to my friends still stuck in my past using the word of God... my words never seem to get through but when i pray, am lead by the Holy Spirit in my words and give them scripture relevant to their particular situation, its God is speaking to them directly with His word! Praise the Lord!
 
I

imoss

Banned
#17
Feb 27, 2007
3,179
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#17
Bob1953 said:
Jesus and the Bible are two different things. I give my allegiance only to Jesus—not the Bible. The Bible is a wonderful book, but my loyalty is to Jesus and Jesus alone.

I have a desire to see justice done and I believe Jesus gives his blessing to this. In my view, and I know that I don’t know everything, it is unjust to prevent women from being priests and pastors.

If anyone can show me were it is JUST to prevent women from becoming priests and pastors, then I would ask you to do so—I want to learn.
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I dont think you fully understand what you think you just said. Jesus and the Bible are two different things???????????????????????? The Bible is... the word of God. I rebuke you as a sister in Christ. Receive it or discard it but it is with the Love of Christ and Gods word that I keep in my heart that this is given. I strongly urge you to pick up that "wonderful book"! God Bless U!
 
Bob1953

Bob1953

Banned
#18
Sep 27, 2009
260
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#18
I believe there is an untruth in the Bible. Read what Jesus says:

[34] But when the Pharisees heard that he had silenced the Sad'ducees, they came together.
[35] And one of them, a lawyer, asked him a question, to test him.
[36] "Teacher, which is the great commandment in the law?"
[37] And he said to him, "You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.
[38] This is the great and first commandment.
[39] And a second is like it, You shall love your neighbor as yourself.
[40] On these two commandments depend all the law and the prophets." Matthew 22:34-40 RSV

Now read what Paul says:

For the whole law is fulfilled in one word, "You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” Galatians 5:14

 
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imoss

Banned
#19
Feb 27, 2007
3,179
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Seeking to know Gods will and the heart of God through his word doesn not make one a pharasees. I love this passage as well and this instruction with regards to the Law, for we are no longer under the Law. Had to read the Good Book to get that instruction along with other instruction on our walk with the Lord. I stand by my previous post urging you to read your Bible to know the Lord. For it is God Given and still relevant. God Bless you.
 
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imoss

Banned
#20
Feb 27, 2007
3,179
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If you go to the NKJV it is written 14 For all the law is fullfilled in one word, even in this: " you shall love your neighbour as your self". I submit to you that the Galatians knew the Law of their Lord to love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul and with all your mind... he said the law is fullfilled in one word but didnt say that love the neighbour as yourself was that word, even IN this, is very important to note. Thank you for bringing to light another passage that causes me to reject my NIV Bible, for it is very deceptive in a subtle way.
 
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