It Is satanic Heresy to Deny Eternal Security
- Thread starter Atwood
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Sinnner; what can you see with your eyes? You can see how a person acts and hear them "talk the talk." But you have not seen with your own eyes into the Heart/ Spirit of anyone. Moreover, one's vision is distorted if one has not had the special eye salve put in the eyes (Rev 3). Eternal security is not promised to persons for having some doctrinal statement of belief, nor for professing Christ as Savior, nor for walking down some aisle and merely uttering some words as in prayer. So of course one may observer professors apostatize.
Neither can you prove that believing eternal security leads to sin. Think of all many, many RCC priest around the world, the incredible extent of child rape. And probably practically all of them deny eternal security. So you see what denying eternal security leads to? Look at the fruit!
My testimony is that trusting the Lord Jesus as Savior results in my loving Him and wanting to please Him. It has never encouraged me to sin. After He bought my eternal salvation at so great a cost on the cross, how could I despise the greatness of His sacrifice and act to displease Him?
Moreover, since I trust Him, that includes the trust that He wants only to do me good, and that His commandments lead to my good, while disobedience harms me. If I really trust Him (and I do), I must believe that obeying Him pleases Him (which I want to do) and results in the best for myself. So the idea that trusting the Lord for eternal security, results in sin, is nonsense.
For by grace you have been saved through faith . . . not of works lest anyone should boast, for we are His workmanship created in Christ Jesus for good works.
You will not be a tree who bears good fruit until you have been recreated; and that depends upon trusting the Lord Jesus as your Savior giving you eternal life. Right now he who does not trust the Lord Jesus for His eternal destiny, is stuck in the Adamic nature and can only sin and fulfill Romans 1. So if you would be free to non-sin, you must stop denying that the Lord Jesus saves unto eternal life, and put your trust in Him. Trust in Him and His word.
Rest in it,
Nest in it,
Fully be blessed in it!
I give them eternal life; and they shall never perish.
Neither can you prove that believing eternal security leads to sin. Think of all many, many RCC priest around the world, the incredible extent of child rape. And probably practically all of them deny eternal security. So you see what denying eternal security leads to? Look at the fruit!
My testimony is that trusting the Lord Jesus as Savior results in my loving Him and wanting to please Him. It has never encouraged me to sin. After He bought my eternal salvation at so great a cost on the cross, how could I despise the greatness of His sacrifice and act to displease Him?
Moreover, since I trust Him, that includes the trust that He wants only to do me good, and that His commandments lead to my good, while disobedience harms me. If I really trust Him (and I do), I must believe that obeying Him pleases Him (which I want to do) and results in the best for myself. So the idea that trusting the Lord for eternal security, results in sin, is nonsense.
For by grace you have been saved through faith . . . not of works lest anyone should boast, for we are His workmanship created in Christ Jesus for good works.
You will not be a tree who bears good fruit until you have been recreated; and that depends upon trusting the Lord Jesus as your Savior giving you eternal life. Right now he who does not trust the Lord Jesus for His eternal destiny, is stuck in the Adamic nature and can only sin and fulfill Romans 1. So if you would be free to non-sin, you must stop denying that the Lord Jesus saves unto eternal life, and put your trust in Him. Trust in Him and His word.
Rest in it,
Nest in it,
Fully be blessed in it!
I give them eternal life; and they shall never perish.
Romans 9-11 is about the future of Israel, a nation which was denying their Messiah. Paul was greatly grieved over this. I commend it to your meditation. (You may also want to ponder election in Romans 9; strong medicine there.)
Has God cut off his elect? Let it not be so!
But it is not all lf Abraham's seed who are elect. There is a believing remnant of the elect in Israel.
In Isaac is the elect, but not all of Isaac's seed is elect. For example, Esau was excluded from the Abrahamic Covenant. Those elected to enjoy the Abrahamic Covenant in full, including salvation, are a subset of national Israel, not the whole nation. Clearly the OT nation in large was a bunch of idolaters.
Romans 8 is clear that whoever is predestined makes it to glorification. Now we don't have to solve the difficulties in our human understanding of election and predestination. But it is clear that God does not cast off the elect.
Has God cut off his elect? Let it not be so!
But it is not all lf Abraham's seed who are elect. There is a believing remnant of the elect in Israel.
In Isaac is the elect, but not all of Isaac's seed is elect. For example, Esau was excluded from the Abrahamic Covenant. Those elected to enjoy the Abrahamic Covenant in full, including salvation, are a subset of national Israel, not the whole nation. Clearly the OT nation in large was a bunch of idolaters.
Romans 8 is clear that whoever is predestined makes it to glorification. Now we don't have to solve the difficulties in our human understanding of election and predestination. But it is clear that God does not cast off the elect.
Heb 6:4,5 if their "tasting" the heavenly gift and good word of God means they were never really, truly saved then....
Heb 2:9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
.....Christ "tasting" death means He never really, truly died.
Heb 2:9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
.....Christ "tasting" death means He never really, truly died.
False, Seabass.
"They gave him vinegar to drink mingled with gall: and when he had tasted thereof, he would not drink."
Scripture is clear that Christ died on the cross. He not only tasted death, but He also died. To say taste, does not imply that one does not drink; but neither does it imply that one drinks after tasting. We know that Christ not only tasted death, but died. However, he tasted the drug (gall, etc.) and did not get drugged. I see this as a satanic attempt to keep Him from suffering for our sins.
In the case of the apostates of Heb 6, we know that they were never saved because 6:9 indicates that. Thus it is proper to interpret the "taste" in the preceding context to refer to the kind of tasting of the vinegar-gall at the crucifixion of Christ.
"They gave him vinegar to drink mingled with gall: and when he had tasted thereof, he would not drink."
Scripture is clear that Christ died on the cross. He not only tasted death, but He also died. To say taste, does not imply that one does not drink; but neither does it imply that one drinks after tasting. We know that Christ not only tasted death, but died. However, he tasted the drug (gall, etc.) and did not get drugged. I see this as a satanic attempt to keep Him from suffering for our sins.
In the case of the apostates of Heb 6, we know that they were never saved because 6:9 indicates that. Thus it is proper to interpret the "taste" in the preceding context to refer to the kind of tasting of the vinegar-gall at the crucifixion of Christ.
A
I give them eternal life; and they shall never perish.
Atwood, you keep posting this passage , let me give you my take. This verse assumes that we understand it is to be taken in
context with passages like Rev. 2:10. We do not have eternal life yet. We have it in promise. We will have it in actuality at the resurrection. I see nothing in this scripture to support you cannot call from grace. Once we have eternal life in actuality then yes, we will never perish.
Atwood, you keep posting this passage , let me give you my take. This verse assumes that we understand it is to be taken in
context with passages like Rev. 2:10. We do not have eternal life yet. We have it in promise. We will have it in actuality at the resurrection. I see nothing in this scripture to support you cannot call from grace. Once we have eternal life in actuality then yes, we will never perish.
Paul was grieved his brethren in the flesh were lost, Rom 10:1, for God had cut them off, Rom 11:20ff.
In Rom 9:6-13 Paul is refuting the Jews idea that God had to choose them simply because they were the physical descendants of Abraham.
Verse 7 Paul shows Abraham had many children but one had to be of a particular seed, the seed of Issac, to be a child of promise.
Verse 8 children of the flesh are NOT children of God, one has to be of a particular seed to be a child of God.
Paul proves that physical birth did not automatically make one a child of God.
Paul then uses Jacob (Israel) and Esau (Edom) to show that God does not have to base his choices/promises upon physical birth. Both Israel and Edom were both the sons of Isaac, the true son of Abraham. So Edom was as much a true descendant of Abraham as was Israel but Edom was not chosen. So why should the Jews/Israel think God must choose them simply because they are Abraham descendants when Edom was not chosen but were just as much Abraham's descendants?
Rom 8 shows a group (Christian) is predestined not certain individuals unconditionally predestined apart from the group.
Heb 2:9 says "taste DEATH", it is not about tasting vinegar.
"taste death" means that Christ really, truly died just as tasted the heavenly gift and good word of God means they were really, truly Christians.
Heb 6:9 the Hebrew writer is saying he is persuaded his readers would not end up as those of verse 6 but experience "better things". Even though he was talking about falling away, v6, he feels sure of better things for his readers.
False, SeaBass. "As long as they sustain" is not stated -- you may not add to God's Word. The context says that the sheep DO hear and follow, fact, not "as long as."
It also says that I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish.
There are no ifs ands or buts.
Can you not trust the Lord Jesus and His promise?
The life He gives is eternal.
The perishing is never.
It also says that I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish.
There are no ifs ands or buts.
Can you not trust the Lord Jesus and His promise?
The life He gives is eternal.
The perishing is never.
And the other tasting is of the heavenly gift, not death, not drug-vinegar.
The point is the definition of "taste." Taste does not imply partake. One may indeed taste and partake or taste and spit out. Tasting does not mean they partook of the heavenly gift. And 6:9 nails it down that they were never saved. The Lord Jesus tasted death and died. He tasted vinegar-drug and did not drink it.
You may as well argue that they were dead. But taste doesn't mean died or partook. If the Lord Jesus tasted death and died, that does not prove that every time one tastes something one partakes of what one tasted or follows through with consumption. Proof: The vinegar was not received. In Heb 6 the gift of salvation was not received, as 6:9 tells us.
Reading the Bible may lead to salvation or it may lead to damnation. The same sun that melts wax hardens clay. For example, how are you cooking? Are you melting or hardening. Remember the warning in Heb 6; it is dangerous to just be a taster. Beware lest you be numbered among the apostate tasters, who never arrived at salvation.
The things said of the apostates is that they tasted and apostatized and cannot be renewed to a change of mind (from non-faith in Christ to faith in Christ) now. Is that your condition? You have been exposed to concrete proof that the Lord Jesus is a Savior who gives eternal life so that one never perishes. You have tasted it. But you have not yet swallowed it.
Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you shall be saved, O Seabass.
There is therefore now no condemnation to them who are in Christ Jesus.
The point is the definition of "taste." Taste does not imply partake. One may indeed taste and partake or taste and spit out. Tasting does not mean they partook of the heavenly gift. And 6:9 nails it down that they were never saved. The Lord Jesus tasted death and died. He tasted vinegar-drug and did not drink it.
You may as well argue that they were dead. But taste doesn't mean died or partook. If the Lord Jesus tasted death and died, that does not prove that every time one tastes something one partakes of what one tasted or follows through with consumption. Proof: The vinegar was not received. In Heb 6 the gift of salvation was not received, as 6:9 tells us.
Reading the Bible may lead to salvation or it may lead to damnation. The same sun that melts wax hardens clay. For example, how are you cooking? Are you melting or hardening. Remember the warning in Heb 6; it is dangerous to just be a taster. Beware lest you be numbered among the apostate tasters, who never arrived at salvation.
The things said of the apostates is that they tasted and apostatized and cannot be renewed to a change of mind (from non-faith in Christ to faith in Christ) now. Is that your condition? You have been exposed to concrete proof that the Lord Jesus is a Savior who gives eternal life so that one never perishes. You have tasted it. But you have not yet swallowed it.
Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you shall be saved, O Seabass.
There is therefore now no condemnation to them who are in Christ Jesus.
Human intentions are often not carried out. Neither is that an example of a promise.
But if the Lord should tell you that tomorrow about this time you will be trampled to death in the gate as the starving mob of Jerusalem storms out to the leper's camp for food, what do you think will happen to you?
Now the Lord has given us exceeding great, gracious, and marvelous promises. He cares greatly that we believe Him.
He has promised you eternal life if only you will trust the Lord Jesus with your spiritual needs and destiny.
Cast it all on Him. He cares for you; He died for you paying for all your sin. Now it gets down to "Whosoever will."
Will you be a "whosoever won't"?
Rom 4:16
For this cause it is of faith, that it may be according to grace; to the end that the promise may be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all
End of Rom 8:
And we know that to them that love God all things work together for good, even to them that are called according to his purpose. For whom
he foreknew,
he also foreordained to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren: and whom
he foreordained, them
he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom
he justified, them
he also glorified.
What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who is against us? He who spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not also with him freely give us all things?
Who shall lay anything to the charge of God’s elect? It is God who justifies;
who is he who condemns?
It is Christ Jesus that died, yea rather, that was raised from the dead, who is at the right hand of God, who also makes intercession for us.
Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or anguish, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? Even as it is written,
For thy sake we are killed all the day long;
We were accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
But if the Lord should tell you that tomorrow about this time you will be trampled to death in the gate as the starving mob of Jerusalem storms out to the leper's camp for food, what do you think will happen to you?
Now the Lord has given us exceeding great, gracious, and marvelous promises. He cares greatly that we believe Him.
He has promised you eternal life if only you will trust the Lord Jesus with your spiritual needs and destiny.
Cast it all on Him. He cares for you; He died for you paying for all your sin. Now it gets down to "Whosoever will."
Will you be a "whosoever won't"?
Rom 4:16
For this cause it is of faith, that it may be according to grace; to the end that the promise may be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all
End of Rom 8:
And we know that to them that love God all things work together for good, even to them that are called according to his purpose. For whom
he foreknew,
he also foreordained to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren: and whom
he foreordained, them
he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom
he justified, them
he also glorified.
What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who is against us? He who spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not also with him freely give us all things?
Who shall lay anything to the charge of God’s elect? It is God who justifies;
who is he who condemns?
It is Christ Jesus that died, yea rather, that was raised from the dead, who is at the right hand of God, who also makes intercession for us.
Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or anguish, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? Even as it is written,
For thy sake we are killed all the day long;
We were accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
2
Such amazingly stubborn twisting
John 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?
who ever lives in me (word of God)
and believes in me (word of God)
shall never perish
it is conditional
conditional
conditional
it depends if you do something or not
believe on the word of God is the condition
here is the word of God
Remember the sabbath day to keep it holy six days SHALT thous labor and do all thy work but the SEVENTH day is the Sabbath of the LORD they God.
you said you are a believer
do you believe that?
you have to believe the whole Bible
do you believe that?
ist sayd
John 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?
you have to believe it and live it then you get eternal life
do you live the sabbath?
no?
no soup for you.
disobedient do NOT inherit life
says it right there
if you believe
and live it
you will get eternal live
that goes for every other verse in the Bible
the devils believe
but they dont obey
those who believe and obey like Abraham get eternal life
the others dont get eternal anything but death.
so simple
How MANY bible verses would you like telling you eternal life is CONDITINAL?
give me a number and I will post them
the
John 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?
who ever lives in me (word of God)
and believes in me (word of God)
shall never perish
it is conditional
conditional
conditional
it depends if you do something or not
believe on the word of God is the condition
here is the word of God
Remember the sabbath day to keep it holy six days SHALT thous labor and do all thy work but the SEVENTH day is the Sabbath of the LORD they God.
you said you are a believer
do you believe that?
you have to believe the whole Bible
do you believe that?
ist sayd
John 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?
you have to believe it and live it then you get eternal life
do you live the sabbath?
no?
no soup for you.
disobedient do NOT inherit life
says it right there
if you believe
and live it
you will get eternal live
that goes for every other verse in the Bible
the devils believe
but they dont obey
those who believe and obey like Abraham get eternal life
the others dont get eternal anything but death.
so simple
How MANY bible verses would you like telling you eternal life is CONDITINAL?
give me a number and I will post them
the