Might be because you approach the matter with put-downs, like 'ignorance' and 'deception'. 'Hey you, atheist, you're ignorant and you're deceptive! Come and follow me'. 'Na, you're okay, thanks'. The tone of your speech is what people listen to before they decide whether they'll heed the words you say.
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Might be because you approach the matter with put-downs, like 'ignorance' and 'deception'. 'Hey you, atheist, you're ignorant and you're deceptive! Come and follow me'. 'Na, you're okay, thanks'. The tone of your speech is what people listen to before they decide whether they'll heed the words you say.
C
ChristIsGod
Guest
Bears repeating.
Excellent, as this is how Jesus and His Apostles worked by The Spirit's leading and not of themselves.
*
I have been thinking about this a lot recently..(and someones thread gave me the idea to ask others),so I will ask you, does it bother you when people..mostly non-christian's I think..use the whole don't judge others, like Jesus was just about the whole kumbyah sitting around the campfire holding hands stuff..do you think that maybe we should be spreading a little harsher message, because in the end we are going to be judged, so shouldn't we be spreading the what not to do message more along with the Jesus is love message? (I mean obviously you need to be free of the sin yourself before "judging" or helping others maybe a better term). Ok that has been on my mind for awhile so thanks for sharing your thought with me..
The message should be first and foremost about LOVE. The Love discussion comes first...once you have established that in your conversation and they truly understand, then comes the stuff about behaving in ways that honor God (the LAW).
A
AgeofKnowledge
Guest
Sure does. Consider that they crucified Jesus Christ, the son of the living God, for goodness sakes!
A
AgeofKnowledge
Guest
Not so much really. There's a lot of proud, seditious, anti-Christ oriented addicts, homosexuals, etc... in the world which the bible asserts are headed into God's judgment who reject the Gospel and lash out at the godly. I've met plenty of them.
Not sure where you two picked up the idea that unrepentant addicts, homosexuals, prostitutes, etc... are going to heaven while genuine Christians who strive with the unrepentant sharing the Gospel with them, teaching them, correcting them, and when it becomes necessary refuting their false beliefs and assertions are going to hell.
You might want to rethink your "theology" because the bible says exactly the opposite.
Not sure where you two picked up the idea that unrepentant addicts, homosexuals, prostitutes, etc... are going to heaven while genuine Christians who strive with the unrepentant sharing the Gospel with them, teaching them, correcting them, and when it becomes necessary refuting their false beliefs and assertions are going to hell.
You might want to rethink your "theology" because the bible says exactly the opposite.
K
Kerry
Guest
The message should be first and foremost about LOVE. The Love discussion comes first...once you have established that in your conversation and they truly understand, then comes the stuff about behaving in ways that honor God (the LAW).
First of all describe love? Love can be very mean at times. I meant for God so loves the world that He gave His son, but if you do not accept Him, you burn in hell. That's love, I meant you love your son right. But if you catch Him smoking pot and drinking and snorting coke, you love Him, but you hate what he is doing. So you punish or even cut him off in love. Because you will not support his actions and no better what's for him or you become an enabler allowing to continue in hopes that he will see the light.
God works in ways that we do not understand, we are to love and we are to hate, I meant God hates strange fire and God hates homosexuality, but will save a homo and God hates drugs but will save a drug user, God hates murder but will save a murder.
But when a nation is bent on sin, the church must speak out, because God will destroy that nation and use sinful countries to do it. Israel is a prime example, God destroyed His chosen people because of the condolence of sin. Exactly what America is doing.
To OP
I don't know what do you mean by Judge.
If I say Jesus is the only way to heaven, mean I judge Buddha, Islam etc the way to hell. It is judge or love, tray to tell the truth so other not go to hell?
Tell the truth is love, not tell the truth will bring other to judgement and it is hatred.
I don't know what do you mean by Judge.
If I say Jesus is the only way to heaven, mean I judge Buddha, Islam etc the way to hell. It is judge or love, tray to tell the truth so other not go to hell?
Tell the truth is love, not tell the truth will bring other to judgement and it is hatred.
K
Kerry
Guest
We judge the message and not the person, because anyone can get saved even at 120 years old and lived a life of debauchery. But we must judge the message and expose it to our brethren.
A
AgeofKnowledge
Guest
You mean do not put down people like you just did in this post of yours as you condemned me for doing what you just hypocritically did to me. LOL!
Pull the log out of your own eye "brother" and remember the tone of your speech is what people listen to before they decide whether they'll heed the words you say lolol.
C
childOFgod94
Guest
Well u have 2 remember that jesus when he wanted to open somone eyes to the truth. First he went around healing, casting out demons... strething people faith. Look at wen jesus was talking to the woman at the well John 4:10 says..Then saith the woman of Samaria unto him, How is it that thou, being a Jew, askest drink of me, which am a woman of Samaria? for the Jews have no dealings with the Samaritans.
10*Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water.
1sr we much talk about the goodness of god, then the necessary steps to righteousness
10*Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water.
1sr we much talk about the goodness of god, then the necessary steps to righteousness
So you don't like to heed words from someone when they speak down to you either. Glad you understand now, AgeofKnowledge. It's not pleasant for anybody, least of all the people on the bottom of the proverbial cesspool.
I was saying that Christ spoke to the Samaritans different than He did to the Sadducees.
Jesus spoke to the crowds differently than He spoke to the Pharisees.
To those who thought they were without sin, He showed them their sin.
To those who knew they had sin, He showed them mercy.
All of it was done in love, and all of it is the Gospel.
You misunderstood something that I said.
A person must have faith to be saved, and faith bears the fruit of good works.
No unrepentant can claim to have faith, as they display their faithlessness.
But surely you know how many people have been raised in churches, call themselves "christians", act like "christians" should act, but have no real RELATIONSHIP with Christ. It is obvious in their attitudes: lacking love in conversation, judgemental attitudes toward the lost rather than compassion, strong political/cultural views as if they are part of their faith.
This is not an over-arching condemnation of churches, but a very real and present issue, at least in the local congregations in my town.
I find it easier to share the Gospel with a drunk than with an elderly woman in a casino. Why? Because she goes to church every Sunday, and gambling isn't in the Bible .... She thinks she is saved because she and all her family are "good christians". But I ask her about her relationship with God, and she has nothing to say.
Cliche phrases pass for faith? no.
Don't tell me you support the Westboro Baptist antichrists.
People know what God hates. People need to know that He has made a Way out.
Taking Christ as an example, whenever He encountered the proud and sell righteous He would unload both barrels, but when He came across the broken, down trodden or needy He was full of compassion and patience.I have been thinking about this a lot recently..(and someones thread gave me the idea to ask others),so I will ask you, does it bother you when people..mostly non-christian's I think..use the whole don't judge others, like Jesus was just about the whole kumbyah sitting around the campfire holding hands stuff..do you think that maybe we should be spreading a little harsher message, because in the end we are going to be judged, so shouldn't we be spreading the what not to do message more along with the Jesus is love message? (I mean obviously you need to be free of the sin yourself before "judging" or helping others maybe a better term). Ok that has been on my mind for awhile so thanks for sharing your thought with me..
C
ChristIsGod
Guest
Christ walked in the Spirit -- He knew which sinners would come to Him - like the Mary, the Samaritan woman, Matthew and the others -- but He told the others where they were at, because he knew they were not going to follow him and why they were if it was just for the fish & loaves, etc..
We have a misconception about Jesus sometimes. Paul was Jesus' prime example of walking like He did. And why so much of Acts is about him and why he wrote near half the N.T.. and saying "follow me as I follow Christ". Paul could say that -- I couldn't - but I like Phil 3, so we're all pressing on but not having 'arrived' yet nor already made perfect. Also Romans 8.
We have a misconception about Jesus sometimes. Paul was Jesus' prime example of walking like He did. And why so much of Acts is about him and why he wrote near half the N.T.. and saying "follow me as I follow Christ". Paul could say that -- I couldn't - but I like Phil 3, so we're all pressing on but not having 'arrived' yet nor already made perfect. Also Romans 8.
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AgeofKnowledge
Guest
I find your dry contentious egotistical hypocrisy mildly entertaining and that root of bitterness you've put on display here today is really your own fault not mine. If you don't like having the false assertions you espouse refuted: don't make them.
And if you lived the advice you're so quick to espouse, I might give two cents. As it is, you don't, so I don't care. If you want to be an embittered sour puss, that's your choice. My own is to make a pitcher of stevia flavored lemonade and watch a movie. Au revoir.
And if you lived the advice you're so quick to espouse, I might give two cents. As it is, you don't, so I don't care. If you want to be an embittered sour puss, that's your choice. My own is to make a pitcher of stevia flavored lemonade and watch a movie. Au revoir.
A
AgeofKnowledge
Guest
Jesus often judged the behavior of other people during His ministry on earth. In fact, in the end, He will judge all behavior of every person including the Samaritans (Acts 10:42, Matthew 25, etc...).
Read 1 Corinthians 5:12-13 with regard to judging people in the church. Inside the church, we judge those who grossly violate God's moral law (1 Corinthians 5) in our midst.
The historical background of the Corinthian church is interesting. It has long been recognized by Biblical historical scholars that many of the problems Paul addresses in the church at Corinth are grounded in their wrong thinking (that was a result of the Hellenism and mystical cults that had spread across the Roman Empire from the East which many of the gentile believers had followed before becoming Christians).
You see Plato had taught that the body was the tomb of the soul; that death brought liberation from physical captivity; that already in this life one could transcend the negative arena of matter by a higher knowledge of ultimate reality. Various Hellenistic cults offered immortality via union with the god or gods, sometimes symbolized or achieved through cultic prostitution.
Within such a religious philosophical climate, Paul’s teaching regarding freedom “in Christ” and life “in the Spirit” was all too often, and particularly at Corinth, perverted into an enthusiastic libertinism that rejected moral restraints, particularly in the realm of the physical.
The proper response, both to the intolerable case of sexual immorality as well as to their imagined philosophical superiorities, should have been mourning. A repentant attitude would inevitably lead to the removal of the gross immoral offender from their church and fellowship.
That some form of excommunication is intended is clear not only from 1 Corinthians 5:2, but from the Passover analogy in 1 Corinthians 5:6–8 (“Get rid of the old yeast”) and the citation of Deuteronomy 17:7 (“Expel the wicked man from among you”—1 Cor 5:13). The nature of the removal is expressed in the ambiguous phrase “hand this man over to Satan.” Its purpose is twofold: (1) that his “sinful nature” or “flesh” would be destroyed and (2) that his “spirit” would be saved (1 Cor 5:5).
However, the phrase “hand over to Satan” must be recognized in some figurative metaphorical sense as a person literally abandoned to Satan would seem to be lost irrevocably and this end is not envisioned.
The ancient Corinthians had the same problem many who profess to believe in God do today: wrong thinking rooted in ignorance, rebellion, and immersion in an increasingly immoral society.
Read ALL three pages of Skye Jethani M.Div.'s article titled 'What Did Jesus Mean by "Judge Not"? Nine out of ten young people say Christians are judgmental, but are they right?' in Christianity Today: What Did Jesus Mean by "Judge Not"? | PARSE
I think it will help you truly understand what Jesus Christ actually meant and temper your own accusations against genuine Christians adhering to God's holiness who, in reality, aren't anything like the ultra-aggressive ancient first century Pharisees who would stone a person to death for a single case of sexual immorality.
And it's ridiculous to bring up a deviant sect of forty people as if they somehow represent a worldview which encompasses about two billion people. No offense. Peace.
Read 1 Corinthians 5:12-13 with regard to judging people in the church. Inside the church, we judge those who grossly violate God's moral law (1 Corinthians 5) in our midst.
The historical background of the Corinthian church is interesting. It has long been recognized by Biblical historical scholars that many of the problems Paul addresses in the church at Corinth are grounded in their wrong thinking (that was a result of the Hellenism and mystical cults that had spread across the Roman Empire from the East which many of the gentile believers had followed before becoming Christians).
You see Plato had taught that the body was the tomb of the soul; that death brought liberation from physical captivity; that already in this life one could transcend the negative arena of matter by a higher knowledge of ultimate reality. Various Hellenistic cults offered immortality via union with the god or gods, sometimes symbolized or achieved through cultic prostitution.
Within such a religious philosophical climate, Paul’s teaching regarding freedom “in Christ” and life “in the Spirit” was all too often, and particularly at Corinth, perverted into an enthusiastic libertinism that rejected moral restraints, particularly in the realm of the physical.
The proper response, both to the intolerable case of sexual immorality as well as to their imagined philosophical superiorities, should have been mourning. A repentant attitude would inevitably lead to the removal of the gross immoral offender from their church and fellowship.
That some form of excommunication is intended is clear not only from 1 Corinthians 5:2, but from the Passover analogy in 1 Corinthians 5:6–8 (“Get rid of the old yeast”) and the citation of Deuteronomy 17:7 (“Expel the wicked man from among you”—1 Cor 5:13). The nature of the removal is expressed in the ambiguous phrase “hand this man over to Satan.” Its purpose is twofold: (1) that his “sinful nature” or “flesh” would be destroyed and (2) that his “spirit” would be saved (1 Cor 5:5).
However, the phrase “hand over to Satan” must be recognized in some figurative metaphorical sense as a person literally abandoned to Satan would seem to be lost irrevocably and this end is not envisioned.
The ancient Corinthians had the same problem many who profess to believe in God do today: wrong thinking rooted in ignorance, rebellion, and immersion in an increasingly immoral society.
Read ALL three pages of Skye Jethani M.Div.'s article titled 'What Did Jesus Mean by "Judge Not"? Nine out of ten young people say Christians are judgmental, but are they right?' in Christianity Today: What Did Jesus Mean by "Judge Not"? | PARSE
I think it will help you truly understand what Jesus Christ actually meant and temper your own accusations against genuine Christians adhering to God's holiness who, in reality, aren't anything like the ultra-aggressive ancient first century Pharisees who would stone a person to death for a single case of sexual immorality.
And it's ridiculous to bring up a deviant sect of forty people as if they somehow represent a worldview which encompasses about two billion people. No offense. Peace.
Safest bet is to be sensitive to the Spirit's leading in any given situation.
"And of some have compassion, making a difference: And others save with fear; pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh." - Jude 1:22,23
"And of some have compassion, making a difference: And others save with fear; pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh." - Jude 1:22,23
I have been thinking about this a lot recently..(and someones thread gave me the idea to ask others),so I will ask you, does it bother you when people..mostly non-christian's I think..use the whole don't judge others, like Jesus was just about the whole kumbyah sitting around the campfire holding hands stuff..do you think that maybe we should be spreading a little harsher message, because in the end we are going to be judged, so shouldn't we be spreading the what not to do message more along with the Jesus is love message? (I mean obviously you need to be free of the sin yourself before "judging" or helping others maybe a better term). Ok that has been on my mind for awhile so thanks for sharing your thought with me..
What do you mean by harsher message? That we should tell them they are going to go to Hell and burn if they don't choose God? Do you think that would make them love God and want to follow Him....
I can tell you that it would make me turn and run from this God as all He wants to do is punish me for something I am un-capable of doing which is clean myself up and be perfect before I can come to Him...
God in love sent His Son Jesus to die for us while we were yet sinners, before we even thought of cleaning ourselves up or before we ever even knew we needed God or a Savior, that is when God sent Jesus to die for us. Because He so loved us that He gave up His Son to die for us.
Do we need a harsher message No because the existing message of the gospel is strong enough on it's own to compel people to change, the problem is that we as Christians don't live and give the example of saved loving Christians toward each other much less those around us. So the only cleaning up we need to do is to fall at the feet of Jesus and humble ourselves and truly give our hearts to God to make us new creatures so that we can go out and spread the existing gospel of love with loving hearts to all that we come in contact with and with Jesus/Holy Spirit living in us Jesus said if I be lifted up will draw all men unto me.
We need to lift up Jesus and be living examples of His love that will draw men to God not a harsher gospel. Those are my thoughts on this matter.