Which laws are and are not valid?
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To the law 'biders:
There are two operative covenants; but you can only be under one at a time.
1) Faithfully keep all 613 mitzvoht without a single breach (as Jesus did) and you will be declared righteous.
2) Accept that Jesus fulfilled the 613 mitzvoht on your behalf and accept Jesus' righteousness, and unearned Salvation on God's terms.
There is no way to be under both covenants!
There are two operative covenants; but you can only be under one at a time.
1) Faithfully keep all 613 mitzvoht without a single breach (as Jesus did) and you will be declared righteous.
2) Accept that Jesus fulfilled the 613 mitzvoht on your behalf and accept Jesus' righteousness, and unearned Salvation on God's terms.
There is no way to be under both covenants!
J
How very sad, mate.
That you cannot engage in an intelligent discussion without resorting to "lies" and "liars" .....
simply because someone does not fully agree with your point of view.
Infallibility must be such a wonderful thing.
At least Elin tried to defend the indefensible in her post #74.
That you cannot engage in an intelligent discussion without resorting to "lies" and "liars" .....
simply because someone does not fully agree with your point of view.
Infallibility must be such a wonderful thing.
At least Elin tried to defend the indefensible in her post #74.
What's sad is those who reject clear scripture for lies. I've posted plenty of scripture, many times, that you people reject. You've been presented the clear word of God in the matter, not my views. I believe the New Testament, you don't. That's what's sad... mate.
But I'd be happy to consider politically correct terms for lies and liars, who refute the New Testament gospel of Jesus Christ and denigrate His blood and work, who denigrate grace by faith, who are peddling the fake gospels Paul calls accursed.
there's a word for you in scripture, but i can't repeat it here. the censors automatically delete it.
you're english is as bad as , well, just plain bad.
try reading again, or get help. (i even put a comma in the 'right' place in the post you couldn't understand --- not as if a comma is needed... but it leaves you without any excuse.) why you keep trying, i don't understand --- what purpose , plan, or agenda do you have ?
you're english is as bad as , well, just plain bad.
try reading again, or get help. (i even put a comma in the 'right' place in the post you couldn't understand --- not as if a comma is needed... but it leaves you without any excuse.) why you keep trying, i don't understand --- what purpose , plan, or agenda do you have ?
How very sad, mate.
That you cannot engage in an intelligent discussion without resorting to "lies" and "liars" .....
simply because someone does not fully agree with your point of view.
Infallibility must be such a wonderful thing.
At least Elin tried to defend the indefensible in her post #74.
That you cannot engage in an intelligent discussion without resorting to "lies" and "liars" .....
simply because someone does not fully agree with your point of view.
Infallibility must be such a wonderful thing.
At least Elin tried to defend the indefensible in her post #74.
The Bible doesn't regard "unbelief" of the NT word of God as a "point of view."
Spare us the euphemisms. . .and the unbelief. . .
trouble with tribbles. one of these days, if you seek and keep seeking, you'll meet jesus. paul happens to agree with jesus and declares that he was taught by the resurrected jesus.
keep seeking. there's a huge amount of obstacles for you to get through. and if you don't seek, you won't find. (unless yahweh chooses to make himself known to you anyway, for your forgiveness, healing, and life; he can, you know, if he chooses to)
keep seeking. there's a huge amount of obstacles for you to get through. and if you don't seek, you won't find. (unless yahweh chooses to make himself known to you anyway, for your forgiveness, healing, and life; he can, you know, if he chooses to)
J
The way the New Testament characterizes liars, the self-righteous, the false prophets, would send them into convulsions. And no, unbelief is not a point of view. There's nothing in the Bible that advocates that everybody crowd on to a ship destined for hell, singing kumbaya.
It's all a smokescreen. They want your tacit approval of the lies, under the guise of avoiding being adversarial. I suppose you need to just keep the truth to yourself?
2 John 1:10-11 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.
It's all a smokescreen. They want your tacit approval of the lies, under the guise of avoiding being adversarial. I suppose you need to just keep the truth to yourself?
2 John 1:10-11 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.
J
If I may inject, I've never wanted to imply somebody exercising Old Testament admonitions is wrong, in their personal walk. I avoid the garbage food of the Old Testament, also, but it's not a matter of any meritorious obedience, some notion God is impressed by what we eat, that Holy God is a respecter of persons or impressed by our filthy rags works and self-righteousness. As a matter of fact, I can eat what I want, in faith, but choose things healthier by Old Testament standards, find merit in the Jewish diet, but only in the flesh. And this is the first time I've revealed this to anybody here, some should note.
The issue is when anybody starts whipping out the claim of legalistic obedience required to have standing or some superior standing with God. This is not New Testament Christianity, is deception. One is either clothed in the righteousness of Jesus Christ and born of the Holy Spirit, or not. A lifetime of avoiding pepperoni pizza or getting extra religious on Saturday avails one nothing. Again, there are those here pushing legalism, all the time, in terms of necessary obedience to have standing, and this is pushing bondage, carrying the corpse on our backs: this is evil.
There is nothing ambiguous here,
Galatians 5:1-6 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage. Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith. For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.
Galatians 1:17-18 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.
One believes the gospel of Jesus Christ of the New Testament, or not. It's not rocket science, the gospel clear, and there are those here who don't believe the gospel, are trying to put forth a false gospel.
The issue is when anybody starts whipping out the claim of legalistic obedience required to have standing or some superior standing with God. This is not New Testament Christianity, is deception. One is either clothed in the righteousness of Jesus Christ and born of the Holy Spirit, or not. A lifetime of avoiding pepperoni pizza or getting extra religious on Saturday avails one nothing. Again, there are those here pushing legalism, all the time, in terms of necessary obedience to have standing, and this is pushing bondage, carrying the corpse on our backs: this is evil.
There is nothing ambiguous here,
Galatians 5:1-6 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage. Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith. For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.
Galatians 1:17-18 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.
One believes the gospel of Jesus Christ of the New Testament, or not. It's not rocket science, the gospel clear, and there are those here who don't believe the gospel, are trying to put forth a false gospel.
likewise, almost (i really do not understand , i don't even know, you're background , and what you post often appears to me not at all clear and right with Scripture.... )
i.e. for later pursuit, yahweh willing, the 'origin' of some beliefs. definitely not today, unless ...... (yahweh might make it so)....
so, to keep it simple>>>
"scripture, for yahweh's people, yahweh's son (yahshua), is TORAH, OT (OLD Testament)."
((p.s. i haven't structured a sentence or pickled a participle or declined a verb in over 30 years ! ))
scripture,
...... for yahweh's people, (('and')) yahweh's son(yahshua) , <<< and us. plus we have NT >>>
.............. is TORAH.
scripture is TORAH. yeshua and all yahweh's people honor TORAH as SCRIPTURE, unchanged.
the apostles all taught and proved((the GOSPEL:GOOD NEWS)) yahshua IS THE MESSIAH, from TORAH.
i.e. for later pursuit, yahweh willing, the 'origin' of some beliefs. definitely not today, unless ...... (yahweh might make it so)....
so, to keep it simple>>>
"scripture, for yahweh's people, yahweh's son (yahshua), is TORAH, OT (OLD Testament)."
((p.s. i haven't structured a sentence or pickled a participle or declined a verb in over 30 years ! ))
scripture,
...... for yahweh's people, (('and')) yahweh's son(yahshua) , <<< and us. plus we have NT >>>
.............. is TORAH.
scripture is TORAH. yeshua and all yahweh's people honor TORAH as SCRIPTURE, unchanged.
the apostles all taught and proved((the GOSPEL:GOOD NEWS)) yahshua IS THE MESSIAH, from TORAH.
E
first of all, no one can make the Lord of Lords and King of Kings a liar; apart from that, if they could, why would anyone want to get along with them...no scripture demands we get along with those who want to make their own sheepfold and herd 'em in....
although you may have said the above in jest? not sure...
J
No, not jest: that's just a figure of speech, which means that when you refute somebody telling the truth, you are making them out to be a liar. You are stating they're not telling the truth, somebody refuting scripture truth making it out to be a lie, holding the author out to be a liar. (Note that Jesus Christ, the word of God, is the author of all inspired scripture.) But this is not saying anybody is literally making truth a lie, that anybody actually makes Jesus Christ a liar, which is impossible, rather this the claim they're making, by denying truths. And it's more trying to form a herd of goats!
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