Catholic Heresy (for the record)
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Originally Posted by valiant
Very simple. The 'washing of regeneration' had in mind the rain that came down after the dry season. It washes the earth and produces new life. It was thus a picture of the activity of the Holy Spirit. Compare the 'washing of water WITH THE WORD'. How shall a young man cleanse his way? By taking heed to it according to His word.'' (Psalm 119.9). It is not referring to the practise of baptism. Paul NEVER refers to baptism as washing.
You need to beware of Titus 3.5. It speaks of a Christian being 'saved once for all' (aorist tense) not by works of righteousness (which would include baptism) but through the activity of the Holy Spirit so that we are counted as righteous (justified) in the sight of God asa consequence of His unmerited love and favour (grace)..
John 3:5
Jesus replied, “I assure you, no one can enter the Kingdom of God without being born of water and the Spirit.
First off, Jesus doesn't say ONE word about baptism in John 3. You've fallen to a false interpretation of scripture on that score. He is talking about natural birth and comparing it to spiritual rebirth. Nothing there about baptism.
Titus 3:5
he saved us, not because of the righteous things we had done, but because of his mercy. He washed away our sins, giving us a new birth and new life through the Holy Spirit.
Once again, no mention of baptism, but we know that the blood of Jesus washes us clean and His Spirit fills us with springs of living water.
Romans 6:3-7
Or have you forgotten that when we were joined with Christ Jesus in baptism, we joined him in his death? [SUP]4 [/SUP]For we died and were buried with Christ by baptism. And just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glorious power of the Father, now we also may live new lives. [SUP]5 [/SUP]Since we have been united with him in his death, we will also be raised to life as he was. [SUP]6 [/SUP]We know that our old sinful selves were crucified with Christ so that sin might lose its power in our lives. We are no longer slaves to sin. [SUP]7 [/SUP]For when we died with Christ we were set free from the power of sin.
Once again, no mention that baptism has any power. Baptism, as spoken of here, is a wonderful symbolic act we undergo in obedience to God that affirms publically that we have undergone the new birth, identifying with the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ. We do this because we are already saved and want to obey God!
Those who are unsaved are not required, nor are they invited to be baptized! Water baptism (full immersion, by the way) is only for believers.
Acts 2:38
Peter replied, “Each of you must repent of your sins and turn to God, and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. Then you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Yes, repent! Repenting, abandoning one's sin and turning toward God and the things of God is what brings us salvation. Then, be baptized! The word "for" doesn't mean "in order that" or "in order to get"! Do you take two Advil for a headache IN ORDER TO GET a headache? No, you take two Advil BECAUSE you have a headache.
Acts 22:16
What are you waiting for? Get up and be baptized. Have your sins washed away by calling on the name of the Lord.
This one's pretty self-explanatory! Our sins are washed away by placing our faith in Jesus Christ and calling upon Him for forgiveness. Because of our new faith in Jesus, we obey God by being baptized.
1 Peter 3:21
And that water is a picture of baptism, which now saves you, not by removing dirt from your body, but as a response to God from a clean conscience. It is effective because of the resurrection of Jesus Christ.
If you think this one isolated verse trumps the opposite that the entire volume of the book doesn't, then you have been hoodwinked! Don't be so gullible. All other scripture tells you that salvation is by God's grace through faith, and not of works!
This verse clearly teaches that water is only good for washing away physical dirt, but that our faith in Jesus Christ is what saves us.Being immersed in water does nothing but wash away dirt. Through Peter, God is telling you that by faith we have been cleared of sin and come now before God with a clean conscience, which baptism represents, according to Peter's words.
So....you've only revealed that you have been taught falsehoods concerning baptism. It cannot save you, so you need to quickly reject the idea that it has saved you and get before the Lord in repentance and receive salvation rightly...through faith in the Saviour, Jesus Christ. Then be baptized.
Jesus replied, “I assure you, no one can enter the Kingdom of God without being born of water and the Spirit.
First off, Jesus doesn't say ONE word about baptism in John 3. You've fallen to a false interpretation of scripture on that score. He is talking about natural birth and comparing it to spiritual rebirth. Nothing there about baptism.
Titus 3:5
he saved us, not because of the righteous things we had done, but because of his mercy. He washed away our sins, giving us a new birth and new life through the Holy Spirit.
Once again, no mention of baptism, but we know that the blood of Jesus washes us clean and His Spirit fills us with springs of living water.
Romans 6:3-7
Or have you forgotten that when we were joined with Christ Jesus in baptism, we joined him in his death? [SUP]4 [/SUP]For we died and were buried with Christ by baptism. And just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glorious power of the Father, now we also may live new lives. [SUP]5 [/SUP]Since we have been united with him in his death, we will also be raised to life as he was. [SUP]6 [/SUP]We know that our old sinful selves were crucified with Christ so that sin might lose its power in our lives. We are no longer slaves to sin. [SUP]7 [/SUP]For when we died with Christ we were set free from the power of sin.
Once again, no mention that baptism has any power. Baptism, as spoken of here, is a wonderful symbolic act we undergo in obedience to God that affirms publically that we have undergone the new birth, identifying with the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ. We do this because we are already saved and want to obey God!
Those who are unsaved are not required, nor are they invited to be baptized! Water baptism (full immersion, by the way) is only for believers.
Acts 2:38
Peter replied, “Each of you must repent of your sins and turn to God, and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. Then you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Yes, repent! Repenting, abandoning one's sin and turning toward God and the things of God is what brings us salvation. Then, be baptized! The word "for" doesn't mean "in order that" or "in order to get"! Do you take two Advil for a headache IN ORDER TO GET a headache? No, you take two Advil BECAUSE you have a headache.
Acts 22:16
What are you waiting for? Get up and be baptized. Have your sins washed away by calling on the name of the Lord.
This one's pretty self-explanatory! Our sins are washed away by placing our faith in Jesus Christ and calling upon Him for forgiveness. Because of our new faith in Jesus, we obey God by being baptized.
1 Peter 3:21
And that water is a picture of baptism, which now saves you, not by removing dirt from your body, but as a response to God from a clean conscience. It is effective because of the resurrection of Jesus Christ.
If you think this one isolated verse trumps the opposite that the entire volume of the book doesn't, then you have been hoodwinked! Don't be so gullible. All other scripture tells you that salvation is by God's grace through faith, and not of works!
This verse clearly teaches that water is only good for washing away physical dirt, but that our faith in Jesus Christ is what saves us.Being immersed in water does nothing but wash away dirt. Through Peter, God is telling you that by faith we have been cleared of sin and come now before God with a clean conscience, which baptism represents, according to Peter's words.
So....you've only revealed that you have been taught falsehoods concerning baptism. It cannot save you, so you need to quickly reject the idea that it has saved you and get before the Lord in repentance and receive salvation rightly...through faith in the Saviour, Jesus Christ. Then be baptized.
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I understand this, lol, Please understand i accept the authority of the Church in these matters. I have been posting here over a month now after a three year break from this. I still have not found any authority in what you do. I've seen some very strange stuff here and that's what happens with no authority. I've tried to bring up some of these issues here and just get sentenced to hell by supposed christians. I believe ya'll are the ones with closed minds. I even quoted something from the OT and the pavlovian response was, " we don't follow jewish customs". I trust the church and the writings of the saints.
Some might say he's not doing it very well?
Just have a look at the vast divergence of opinions here in Christian Chat about almost every facet of Christianity.
Don't worry about the form of baptism or infant baptism or any of that.
What about the important stuff ?
I have no doubt that the sincere, well-read, educated, ardent christians who come here all believe that the Holy Spirit supports their multitude of different views on the means of salvation, life after death, the last days, etc etc etc etc
Just have a look at the vast divergence of opinions here in Christian Chat about almost every facet of Christianity.
Don't worry about the form of baptism or infant baptism or any of that.
What about the important stuff ?
I have no doubt that the sincere, well-read, educated, ardent christians who come here all believe that the Holy Spirit supports their multitude of different views on the means of salvation, life after death, the last days, etc etc etc etc
The RCC has no authority. The authority of Jesus Christ is given to His Church, which consists of all believers. It is not an organized body that has an earthly headquarters in the Vatican. So, blindly following what the RCC, a man-made religion has to say about anything is spiritually perilous.
You need to put your trust in Jesus Christ and God's word. Then you will be standing on even ground with Christians.
You need to put your trust in Jesus Christ and God's word. Then you will be standing on even ground with Christians.