Eternal Security

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J

JesusIsAll

Guest
#1
There are those here who have a lot of doubt attached to their faith, who try to infect others with that doubt, going as far as, in essence, teaching a works salvation. Some have expressed in their lives being despondent, doubtful of salvation, but this is merely what all Christians have suffered at one time or another, especially those young in the faith.

Something important people struggling should know:
Salvation, in the Christian faith, is not about the strength of your faith, is not about your infallibility, it is rather about the strength of the faith of Jesus Christ, His work for you on the cross, His work in you by His Spirit, His faithfulness to hold you in His strong hand, His infallibility, which you can rest in, have assurance of the Good Shepherd that loses none of His flock. Instead of doubt, it is for you to have greater faith, have certain hope and trust in the Lord!

Here is a small article about eternal security, which works nicely into a message forum posting format, by a fine man of God, Dr. Irwin Lutzer.


Eternal Security
By Dr. Erwin W. Lutzer

The oft repeated phrase “once saved, always saved” is often criticized as condoning, or encouraging Christians to be lax and even carnal. After all, the argument goes, if people have the assurance that they will be saved regardless of how they live, there is no incentive to live a godly life; Christians can revel in iniquity with impunity. For this reason, the doctrine of eternal security, “once saved, always saved,” has often been better described as “the perseverance of the saints,” that is, true saints will persevere in holiness. They might have lapses in their spiritual journey to be sure, but the direction of their life is to seek holiness, and as they progress in their Christian experience, they become more and more conformed to the image of Christ.

In responding to this controversy and questions about it, we make the following points:

First, that those who are truly saved are kept by Christ until the day of redemption; in other words, God preserves the elect and thus their place in heaven is assured.

Second, conversion brings about a change in the life of all who believe. We have a right to question the salvation of those who bear no outward evidence of the wonderful work of God that is wrought in the hearts of all who truly believe.

Third, after we are initially saved by grace through faith, we should not give the impression that our salvation is somehow maintained and preserved by good works.

Fourth, Christians might at times backslide, capitulating into many different sins and discouragements. No one can say when such have “crossed the line” that they are unbelievers. We must leave the matter to God.

Finally, even though good works are the fruit of saving faith, ultimately, our assurance is based on full confidence in the work of Christ and not our good deeds or lack thereof.

Regarding God’s preservation (our eternal security), John penned the emphatic words of Christ, “All those the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never drive away. For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day” (John 6:37-39).

Read John 10:27-30 which contains a strong promise that Jesus will not lose any of His sheep. We could not respect a shepherd who began with 100 sheep in the morning but returned with only 98 in the evening. True, we, like sheep, can be very stubborn, but in the end, the shepherd makes sure that all of His sheep will be safely in the fold.

Source:
Eternal Security | Articles | Moody Church Media

John 16:33
These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.
 
S

Sirk

Guest
#2
I used to go this bible study with a group of guys. There was one particular fellow there that just loved to live on "rabbit hole planet"... and it just sucked the life outa the group. The man had been a Christian for a lot of years.

I know that when I left there I thought to myself.....how depressing...to live in that constant state letting your brain run rampant like the waves blow the sea....to and fro...and not resting in God's grace and trusting in the Holy Spirit to direct you into more and more personal holiness and faith. We tried to tell him that but there were never sufficient answers to his questions.
 
F

flob

Guest
#3
First, that those who are truly saved are kept by Christ until the day of redemption; in other words, God preserves the elect and thus their place in heaven is assured.
I assume he means their place in rapture.





Second, conversion brings about a change in the life of all who believe. We have a right to question the salvation of those who bear no outward evidence of the wonderful work of God that is wrought in the hearts of all who truly believe.
good point.





Third, after we are initially saved by grace through faith, we should not give the impression that our salvation is somehow maintained and preserved by good works.
Amen.
Good works are a part of salvation, Ephesians 2:10; 5:9. In other words, we're saved into them.







Fourth, Christians might at times backslide, capitulating into many different sins and discouragements. No one can say when such have “crossed the line” that they are unbelievers. We must leave the matter to God.
Even were a former (genuine) believer to unbelieve, he or she is still stuck. God is faithful, and undefeatable.







Finally, even though good works are the fruit of saving faith, ultimately, our assurance is based on full confidence in the work of Christ and not our good deeds or lack thereof.
There is assurance of different things in the Scripture. Just as salvation is from different, various, things in the Scripture. 2 Tim 4:7-8.
There is a full-growth and full-salvation in the apostles' teaching. Heb 5:14; 6:11.







Regarding God’s preservation (our eternal security), John penned the emphatic words of Christ, “All those the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never drive away. For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day” (John 6:37-39).
Amen. So be it. God says it.






Read John 10:27-30 which contains a strong promise that Jesus will not lose any of His sheep. We could not respect a shepherd who began with 100 sheep in the morning but returned with only 98 in the evening. True, we, like sheep, can be very stubborn, but in the end, the shepherd makes sure that all of His sheep will be safely in the fold.
In the end. Amen.
Once reborn, always reborn.





Re: Sirk,
Lord have mercy on that guy. May he come forward to You in his spirit, Heb 4:16, 12
 
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Dec 12, 2013
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#4
Amen and I agree.......my salvation is based entirely upon the work and faith of Jesus.....he promises to finish what he started, to complete that which he began and he states clearly that he will NEVER leave me nor forsake me......eternal means exactly that....eternal....and to say that eternal life can be forfeit is to say that the life he gives is temporary......I believe that God has raised Jesus from the dead and I have confessed that with my mouth...the bible is clear...I am currently possessing eternal life and the word "HATH" is clear!
 
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Rosesrock

Guest
#5
I used to go this bible study with a group of guys. There was one particular fellow there that just loved to live on "rabbit hole planet"... and it just sucked the life outa the group. The man had been a Christian for a lot of years.

I know that when I left there I thought to myself.....how depressing...to live in that constant state letting your brain run rampant like the waves blow the sea....to and fro...and not resting in God's grace and trusting in the Holy Spirit to direct you into more and more personal holiness and faith. We tried to tell him that but there were never sufficient answers to his questions.
I truly believe some people are addicted to misery.
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
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#7
The blood of Christ is all sufficient. Eternally sufficient. Made my salvation by grace.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
J

JesusIsAll

Guest
#8
I used to go this bible study with a group of guys. There was one particular fellow there that just loved to live on "rabbit hole planet"... and it just sucked the life outa the group. The man had been a Christian for a lot of years.

I know that when I left there I thought to myself.....how depressing...to live in that constant state letting your brain run rampant like the waves blow the sea....to and fro...and not resting in God's grace and trusting in the Holy Spirit to direct you into more and more personal holiness and faith. We tried to tell him that but there were never sufficient answers to his questions.
I know what you mean, that sort of person that could make it rain in Death Valley. Fortunately, they're rare. Of the OP issue, it's not even complicated, though. There are no big questions, the only confusion coming from man's thinking. Take this, the NASB to move it into modern language,

John 5:24
Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.

has eternal life - The person who believes has eternal life, presently, and it wouldn't be eternal life, at all, if it were temporary, could be extinguished or lost.
does not come into judgment - Has eternal life already, and does not come into judgment. Not at all. Period. This is grace by faith, His righteousness our clothing.
passed out of death into life - Not condemned, because a person born again of the Spirit has passed from the realm of spiritual death, unregenerate in sin, into life, by His Spirit.

This one verse is complete destruction of any claims contrary, either Christ telling the plain truth here, or somebody is trying to make Him a liar.

These things are not mysterious, Sunday School stuff, really.
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
25,316
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#9
In regards to those here who have a lot of doubt attached to their faith and try to infect others with that same doubt, misery loves company! Of course, those who teach salvation by works lack saving faith in Christ. Salvation is not probation. Eternal life is not temporary life. Jesus is the door. He is not a revolving door.
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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#10
I know what you mean, that sort of person that could make it rain in Death Valley. Fortunately, they're rare. Of the OP issue, it's not even complicated, though. There are no big questions, the only confusion coming from man's thinking. Take this, the NASB to move it into modern language,

John 5:24
Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.

has eternal life - The person who believes has eternal life, presently, and it wouldn't be eternal life, at all, if it were temporary, could be extinguished or lost.
does not come into judgment - Has eternal life already, and does not come into judgment. Not at all. Period. This is grace by faith, His righteousness our clothing.
passed out of death into life - Not condemned, because a person born again of the Spirit has passed from the realm of spiritual death, unregenerate in sin, into life, by His Spirit.

This one verse is complete destruction of any claims contrary, either Christ telling the plain truth here, or somebody is trying to make Him a liar.

These things are not mysterious, Sunday School stuff, really.
Amen to that as well.....the simplicity that is in Christ...just read it and believe it...... Believe in thy heart and confess it with thy mouth = salvation!
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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#11
In regards to those here who have a lot of doubt attached to their faith and try to infect others with that same doubt, misery loves company! Of course, those who teach salvation by works lack saving faith in Christ. Salvation is not probation. Eternal life is not temporary life. Jesus is the door. He is not a revolving door.
Amen to that...what I find interesting is the fact that those who teach you can lose it never seem to lose it......and how in the heck can you keep track..saved..sin..lose it..get it back..saved..sin..lose it..get it back..saved...sin..lose it..get it back.....such a ridiculous concept and contrary to the truth!
 
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sparkman

Guest
#12
Attached is a document I did on the topic of assurance of salvation. It's something I am very passionate about.

After reading a book by RC Sproul called Faith Alone, I accepted that my salvation was all about what Christ did on the cross, and not about my works. That naturally led to me accepting eternal security.

I am not a big fan of the once saved-always saved label as it seems to convey antinomianism. I prefer the phrase "preservation of the Holy Spirit" but that's a bit long.
 

Attachments

J

JesusIsAll

Guest
#13
I am not a big fan of the once saved-always saved label as it seems to convey antinomianism. I prefer the phrase "preservation of the Holy Spirit" but that's a bit long.
I've somewhat thought the same way about it, as if there's an implication of easy believism, but that's not really so. It's slanderers who try to paint others who are of the gospel of scripture as being purveyors of sin, if you merely speak of Biblical grace to some trollish people around here. But the Bible speaks for itself on grace, and I don't think the Sunday School gospel is hard to defend. If you're saved, you're born again of the Spirit. The only question is saved or not, authenticity of one's repentance and coming to the Lord in truth, but OSAS is the same as eternal security.
 
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sparkman

Guest
#14
I used to go this bible study with a group of guys. There was one particular fellow there that just loved to live on "rabbit hole planet"... and it just sucked the life outa the group. The man had been a Christian for a lot of years.

I know that when I left there I thought to myself.....how depressing...to live in that constant state letting your brain run rampant like the waves blow the sea....to and fro...and not resting in God's grace and trusting in the Holy Spirit to direct you into more and more personal holiness and faith. We tried to tell him that but there were never sufficient answers to his questions.
My pastor is preaching on Philippians. He called Judaizers joy-suckers. I doubt your friend was a Judaizer but the term joy-sucker seems to apply the way you described his effect on the group :)
 
Dec 12, 2013
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#15
I've somewhat thought the same way about it, as if there's an implication of easy believism, but that's not really so. It's slanderers who try to paint others who are of the gospel of scripture as being purveyors of sin, if you merely speak of Biblical grace to some trollish people around here. But the Bible speaks for itself on grace, and I don't think the Sunday School gospel is hard to defend. If you're saved, you're born again of the Spirit. The only question is saved or not, authenticity of one's repentance and coming to the Lord in truth, but OSAS is the same as eternal security.
I agree with the last statement for sure.....eternal security and or OSAS...both are the same and biblical!
 
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sparkman

Guest
#16
I agree. The phrase just rubs me the wrong way, and I know how the other side of arguments love to use phrases to distort the others' positions.

For instance, the use of the phrase "Free Will" when it comes to opposing Reformed theology...or the phrases "Free Grace" and "Lordship Salvation".

I think propaganda is built into the names when it comes to presenting an opponents' theological system or your opposition to it.

I've somewhat thought the same way about it, as if there's an implication of easy believism, but that's not really so. It's slanderers who try to paint others who are of the gospel of scripture as being purveyors of sin, if you merely speak of Biblical grace to some trollish people around here. But the Bible speaks for itself on grace, and I don't think the Sunday School gospel is hard to defend. If you're saved, you're born again of the Spirit. The only question is saved or not, authenticity of one's repentance and coming to the Lord in truth, but OSAS is the same as eternal security.
 
J

JesusIsAll

Guest
#17
I agree. The phrase just rubs me the wrong way, and I know how the other side of arguments love to use phrases to distort the others' positions.

For instance, the use of the phrase "Free Will" when it comes to opposing Reformed theology...or the phrases "Free Grace" and "Lordship Salvation".

I think propaganda is built into the names when it comes to presenting an opponents' theological system or your opposition to it.
Trying to demonize by shaping the vocabulary is just a trick. Like "Lordship." I don't know if there's some whacked teaching out there, but Christ must become your Lord and Master, not just your Savior, can't be that you'll take a generous helping of grace, but skip on having to submit to a Lord. Well, there's no repentance there: such a person hasn't agreed with God yet on the basic situation, merely who's who, yet! But there are those who try to impugn the concept of Jesus Christ being one's Lord, which the Bible teaches out the wazoo, the God which is Lord all over scripture, and Jesus Christ being the Lord the confession of all.
 
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Rosesrock

Guest
#18
I'm just basking in the fact this thread is still pure and uninterrupted.
 
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Rosesrock

Guest
#19
Trying to demonize by shaping the vocabulary is just a trick. Like "Lordship." I don't know if there's some whacked teaching out there, but Christ must become your Lord and Master, not just your Savior, can't be that you'll take a generous helping of grace, but skip on having to submit to a Lord. Well, there's no repentance there: such a person hasn't agreed with God yet on the basic situation, merely who's who, yet! But there are those who try to impugn the concept of Jesus Christ being one's Lord, which the Bible teaches out the wazoo, the God which is Lord all over scripture, and Jesus Christ being the Lord the confession of all.
I thought lordship salvation was the belief that if he's not Lord of all than he's not Lord at all. Meaning there are still things you need to deal with.