For those who say they were saved before they spoke in tongues....
- Thread starter Saint-John
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9 ¶ And when they came unto the threshingfloor of Chidon, Uzza put forth his hand to hold the ark; for the oxen stumbled.
10 And the anger of the LORD was kindled against Uzza, and he smote him, because he put his hand to the ark: and there he died before God.
one step wrong..not Gods way..
Jeroboam..you dont need to go to Jerusalem..we can build an alter here in Samaria..caused Israel to sin ..not his way...
do you think God waited for women and children to evacuate from Sodom and Gomorrah..only his chosen...
and the Flood..!
Ex 25:9 According to all that I shew thee, after the pattern....GODS pattern same as in acts ..not your own..
10 And the anger of the LORD was kindled against Uzza, and he smote him, because he put his hand to the ark: and there he died before God.
one step wrong..not Gods way..
Jeroboam..you dont need to go to Jerusalem..we can build an alter here in Samaria..caused Israel to sin ..not his way...
do you think God waited for women and children to evacuate from Sodom and Gomorrah..only his chosen...
and the Flood..!
Ex 25:9 According to all that I shew thee, after the pattern....GODS pattern same as in acts ..not your own..
Jesus went into Galilee, proclaiming the good news of God. "The time has come," he said. "The kingdom of God has come near. Repent and believe the good news!"
Jesus also said, "The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent."
That is God's way. If you declare with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
Jesus also said, "The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent."
That is God's way. If you declare with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
P
1 Corinthians 12:28-31 "And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues. Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles?
Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?
But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet shew I unto you a more excellent way."
I would highly suggest the OP open his bible and actually read it....when he comes down from the high that he is on(I hope it is medication and not illegal drugs).
In more than one place Paul lists the gifts and tongues comes in last. He tells us to desire the best gifts. Why are you placing utmost emphasis on the least one?
Are you a miracle worker? Can you heal? Why not? Those are better gifts - don't you want to be obedient to the word?
Read your bible. You are nowhere near of sufficient maturity to be trying to teach anyone on this forum.
Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?
But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet shew I unto you a more excellent way."
I would highly suggest the OP open his bible and actually read it....when he comes down from the high that he is on(I hope it is medication and not illegal drugs).
In more than one place Paul lists the gifts and tongues comes in last. He tells us to desire the best gifts. Why are you placing utmost emphasis on the least one?
Are you a miracle worker? Can you heal? Why not? Those are better gifts - don't you want to be obedient to the word?
Read your bible. You are nowhere near of sufficient maturity to be trying to teach anyone on this forum.
U
[h=3]I Corinthians 13[/h] If I could speak all the languages of earth and of angels, but didn’t love others, I would only be a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. [SUP]2 [/SUP]If I had the gift of prophecy, and if I understood all of God’s secret plans and possessed all knowledge, and if I had such faith that I could move mountains, but didn’t love others, I would be nothing. [SUP]3 [/SUP]If I gave everything I have to the poor and even sacrificed my body, I could boast about it; but if I didn’t love others, I would have gained nothing.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Love is patient and kind. Love is not jealous or boastful or proud [SUP]5 [/SUP]or rude. It does not demand its own way. It is not irritable, and it keeps no record of being wronged. [SUP]6 [/SUP]It does not rejoice about injustice but rejoices whenever the truth wins out. [SUP]7 [/SUP]Love never gives up, never loses faith, is always hopeful, and endures through every circumstance.
[SUP]8 [/SUP]Prophecy and speaking in unknown languages and special knowledge will become useless. But love will last forever! [SUP]9 [/SUP]Now our knowledge is partial and incomplete, and even the gift of prophecy reveals only part of the whole picture! [SUP]10 [/SUP]But when the time of perfection comes, these partial things will become useless.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]When I was a child, I spoke and thought and reasoned as a child. But when I grew up, I put away childish things. [SUP]12 [/SUP]Now we see things imperfectly, like puzzling reflections in a mirror, but then we will see everything with perfect clarity. All that I know now is partial and incomplete, but then I will know everything completely, just as God now knows me completely.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]Three things will last forever—faith, hope, and love—and the greatest of these is love.
I find it that something so pivotal to our salvation is considered 'partial' and will become 'useless', as you seem to insist is true OP. Seems Paul had a different standard and emphasis than you.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Love is patient and kind. Love is not jealous or boastful or proud [SUP]5 [/SUP]or rude. It does not demand its own way. It is not irritable, and it keeps no record of being wronged. [SUP]6 [/SUP]It does not rejoice about injustice but rejoices whenever the truth wins out. [SUP]7 [/SUP]Love never gives up, never loses faith, is always hopeful, and endures through every circumstance.
[SUP]8 [/SUP]Prophecy and speaking in unknown languages and special knowledge will become useless. But love will last forever! [SUP]9 [/SUP]Now our knowledge is partial and incomplete, and even the gift of prophecy reveals only part of the whole picture! [SUP]10 [/SUP]But when the time of perfection comes, these partial things will become useless.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]When I was a child, I spoke and thought and reasoned as a child. But when I grew up, I put away childish things. [SUP]12 [/SUP]Now we see things imperfectly, like puzzling reflections in a mirror, but then we will see everything with perfect clarity. All that I know now is partial and incomplete, but then I will know everything completely, just as God now knows me completely.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]Three things will last forever—faith, hope, and love—and the greatest of these is love.
I find it that something so pivotal to our salvation is considered 'partial' and will become 'useless', as you seem to insist is true OP. Seems Paul had a different standard and emphasis than you.
Beat me to the punch on this passage...
Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? Do all possess gifts of healing? Do all speak with tongues? Do all interpret?
(1Co 12:29-30)
Obviously, Paul is asking rhetorical questions which the expected answer is NO for each one...including "Do all speak in tongues?"...that ends the issue. If all speak in tongues then we are all apostles and prophets and such.
Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? Do all possess gifts of healing? Do all speak with tongues? Do all interpret?
(1Co 12:29-30)
Obviously, Paul is asking rhetorical questions which the expected answer is NO for each one...including "Do all speak in tongues?"...that ends the issue. If all speak in tongues then we are all apostles and prophets and such.
Excuse me? Theology crucified CHRIST? lol lol lol I insist that you will tell that to JESUS CHRIST in person one day. You won't get a scolding from me..far from it. Your puffed up assumption, if left as is, will only get you ONE reply, directly from JESUS Himself :"Depart from ME, for I never knew YOU". Between Now and Then, you have a new fresh chance to renew your mind, turn it towards CHRIST, allowing the holy spirit to move into your temple (body) so that you will never declare something like this again!!!!!!!!!! Our sins nailed JESUS to the cross....if I was the only person on earth, I would have to be honest and confess this. However, if I was the only person on earth, JESUS would still have died for my salvation. I am most blessed!
*
I do not know what my spiritual gift is. But I do know that God called me. He called me over a lengthy period of time, and I eventually laid down my opposition to Him, surrendered my life to Him, and was baptized in 2004. I had cried out to Him even as a non-believer, to help me when I was in a great deal of emotional pain. He delivered me of mind and mood altering substance addiction long before I came to believe in Him or acknowledge His existence as a reality. I have testified to these facts during the time that I have been here, since July 3rd, 2015, exactly one month ago.
I was a professionally practicing pagan, who had studied with shamans and explored a number of different spiritual paths, while living out my mundane day-to-day life. I also did dream work off and on over the course of decades. I was seeking spiritual truth, because I'd had numerous paranormal experiences from a young age, some of them while dreaming. I knew there was something, but I did not know what it was. I thought tenderheartedly about Jesus and loved talking about God, but was decidedly a non-believer and generally dismissed institutionalized religious beliefs.
In August of 2003, God specifically and audibly told me to put down what I was doing. It as very difficult for me to accept, not just that God spoke to me, but that what I had been seeking was that which I had rejected many years before. However, I eventually realized that I had been trying to make God acceptable to me as opposed to making myself acceptable to God. Even to this day it seems a little fantastic, but honestly, I come to sites like these, in part, so I can share these elements my life story. I don't think I went through all that for nothing, and we are to testify regarding the power of God in our lives to others. We don't all fit the cookie cutter mold.
It was through sharing with another member here just a few days ago that I came to understand what happened to me when I experienced the spiritual circumcision. At the time it happened, it was the single most terrifying thing I had ever experienced in my life. I had no idea what happened to me, or who did it, or for what purpose, or how it was done beyond being on a spiritual level, despite the fact that I felt it happening. Of course I knew it had something to do with God. But I could hardly bring myself to believe in God at that time.
There is nothing you could say to convince me that because I have not spoken in tongues that I have not been born again of the Spirit of God. All praise and power and honour and glory go to God the Father and His eternal Son, Jesus Christ, Who gave His life and shed His blood for the remission of sin that we might have eternal life in Him.
"To him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb be praise and honor and glory and power, for ever and ever!"
I do not know what my spiritual gift is. But I do know that God called me. He called me over a lengthy period of time, and I eventually laid down my opposition to Him, surrendered my life to Him, and was baptized in 2004. I had cried out to Him even as a non-believer, to help me when I was in a great deal of emotional pain. He delivered me of mind and mood altering substance addiction long before I came to believe in Him or acknowledge His existence as a reality. I have testified to these facts during the time that I have been here, since July 3rd, 2015, exactly one month ago.
I was a professionally practicing pagan, who had studied with shamans and explored a number of different spiritual paths, while living out my mundane day-to-day life. I also did dream work off and on over the course of decades. I was seeking spiritual truth, because I'd had numerous paranormal experiences from a young age, some of them while dreaming. I knew there was something, but I did not know what it was. I thought tenderheartedly about Jesus and loved talking about God, but was decidedly a non-believer and generally dismissed institutionalized religious beliefs.
In August of 2003, God specifically and audibly told me to put down what I was doing. It as very difficult for me to accept, not just that God spoke to me, but that what I had been seeking was that which I had rejected many years before. However, I eventually realized that I had been trying to make God acceptable to me as opposed to making myself acceptable to God. Even to this day it seems a little fantastic, but honestly, I come to sites like these, in part, so I can share these elements my life story. I don't think I went through all that for nothing, and we are to testify regarding the power of God in our lives to others. We don't all fit the cookie cutter mold.
It was through sharing with another member here just a few days ago that I came to understand what happened to me when I experienced the spiritual circumcision. At the time it happened, it was the single most terrifying thing I had ever experienced in my life. I had no idea what happened to me, or who did it, or for what purpose, or how it was done beyond being on a spiritual level, despite the fact that I felt it happening. Of course I knew it had something to do with God. But I could hardly bring myself to believe in God at that time.
There is nothing you could say to convince me that because I have not spoken in tongues that I have not been born again of the Spirit of God. All praise and power and honour and glory go to God the Father and His eternal Son, Jesus Christ, Who gave His life and shed His blood for the remission of sin that we might have eternal life in Him.
"To him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb be praise and honor and glory and power, for ever and ever!"
Great post though slightly misleading title. Then I read through the responses and my heart sank. 
There is one thing I will add to what you say, which is that there is a time factor between being saved and receiving the gift of tongues, as testimonies prove. It may be a short time, as in immediately after, or it may be a longer time, sometimes years, but it can never be BEFORE.
I was born again while working in a hospital many years ago. I had never attended church apart from Christmas and marriages and I had never read the Bible. I just simply asked the Lord Jesus to change me and handed my life over to Him, according to how I heard the Gospel delivered to me by a temporary workmate.
I was different immediately, but still ignorant, though hungry to learn. Pretty quickly the Lord showed me the difference between the religious ones who have the FORM of godliness but deny the power, and the real ones who have the real thing. I began to read and read and read my Bible. And I asked a lot of questions which only a few seemed able to answer.
One day I knew that I had received the Holy Spirit because Jesus showed me. He spoke to me powerfully and personally in His word to comfort me about a specific situation. I did not have to check it out with anyone: I knew it was Him. This communication continued in this way and it still does 29 years or so later...only it gets deeper, the deeper you want to go.
By and by I found some believers who also heard His voice in a similar way. I found out about the baptism with the Holy Spirit and begun to desire for myself this life-changing experience. When it happened to me I was at home in my room and wonderfully swimming and super-alive in the Spirit of God. I did not speak in tongues. I didn't even desire to: maybe that is why. The experience was enormous and sufficient to propel me forward into ministry, operating in a much greater level of faith.
A few years later I started to worry that I was somehow deficient without the gift of tongues, so I asked the Lord for it. I walked into an unfamiliar church Bible study, said honestly what I needed, someone laid hands on me and spoke "the Lord says you already have the gift of tongues, you need to just open your mouth and use it" or words to that effect.
So I went home and got on with it. Practising (as in using, not perfecting) the tongue gift I had received opened up a new world of spirituality through prayer that I could not have imagined existed. I understand that there are divers tongues as Paul says, and so I know I have one of them...I also know that so far it is not the kind of prophetic tongue gift that has to be spoken in the congregation, but that may change.
This is all a long time ago now but I feel I should say that if you are prejudiced against ANY of the good things God has for you, to the point that you malign others who operate in them, and pour scorn on the using of the gifts themselves, it is just an excuse for your unbelief, and with that, you will never progress spiritually.
Without faith it is impossible to please God, so search yourselves and see where you left that mustard seed. As long as it remains dry, gathering fluff in your pocket, it will not germinate and flourish. But add your faith to the water of the Word and you will see it explode into life.
Do not settle for death!
James 1 shows the heart of God towards the believing and the faithless: let us make sure we are of the former, and not the latter, as follows.
5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.
6 But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.
7 For let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord.
There is one thing I will add to what you say, which is that there is a time factor between being saved and receiving the gift of tongues, as testimonies prove. It may be a short time, as in immediately after, or it may be a longer time, sometimes years, but it can never be BEFORE.
I was born again while working in a hospital many years ago. I had never attended church apart from Christmas and marriages and I had never read the Bible. I just simply asked the Lord Jesus to change me and handed my life over to Him, according to how I heard the Gospel delivered to me by a temporary workmate.
I was different immediately, but still ignorant, though hungry to learn. Pretty quickly the Lord showed me the difference between the religious ones who have the FORM of godliness but deny the power, and the real ones who have the real thing. I began to read and read and read my Bible. And I asked a lot of questions which only a few seemed able to answer.
One day I knew that I had received the Holy Spirit because Jesus showed me. He spoke to me powerfully and personally in His word to comfort me about a specific situation. I did not have to check it out with anyone: I knew it was Him. This communication continued in this way and it still does 29 years or so later...only it gets deeper, the deeper you want to go.
By and by I found some believers who also heard His voice in a similar way. I found out about the baptism with the Holy Spirit and begun to desire for myself this life-changing experience. When it happened to me I was at home in my room and wonderfully swimming and super-alive in the Spirit of God. I did not speak in tongues. I didn't even desire to: maybe that is why. The experience was enormous and sufficient to propel me forward into ministry, operating in a much greater level of faith.
A few years later I started to worry that I was somehow deficient without the gift of tongues, so I asked the Lord for it. I walked into an unfamiliar church Bible study, said honestly what I needed, someone laid hands on me and spoke "the Lord says you already have the gift of tongues, you need to just open your mouth and use it" or words to that effect.
So I went home and got on with it. Practising (as in using, not perfecting) the tongue gift I had received opened up a new world of spirituality through prayer that I could not have imagined existed. I understand that there are divers tongues as Paul says, and so I know I have one of them...I also know that so far it is not the kind of prophetic tongue gift that has to be spoken in the congregation, but that may change.
This is all a long time ago now but I feel I should say that if you are prejudiced against ANY of the good things God has for you, to the point that you malign others who operate in them, and pour scorn on the using of the gifts themselves, it is just an excuse for your unbelief, and with that, you will never progress spiritually.
Without faith it is impossible to please God, so search yourselves and see where you left that mustard seed. As long as it remains dry, gathering fluff in your pocket, it will not germinate and flourish. But add your faith to the water of the Word and you will see it explode into life.
Do not settle for death!
James 1 shows the heart of God towards the believing and the faithless: let us make sure we are of the former, and not the latter, as follows.
5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.
6 But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.
7 For let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord.