Obsession with Confession (1 John 1:9, sin confession)

[dcontroversal]

I believe and trust in what the Holy Spirit and the Word of God through Jesus and the Apostles say.

Not man made doctrines and man made teaching systems that have corrupted the word of God since the 4th century.

Once again to make John 3:16, 3:36, and 6:47 something other than an immediate mental possession is to take and make Jesus words contradict with Apostle Paul and Peter's teachings that salvation is the ending result of our faith that we seek and hope to receive.

So either Jesus was right and Peter and Paul were wrong, or all three were right which means eternal life/salvation being ours now is in an immediate mental assurance state.

Or you interpretation is flawed...that is what I will go with....NO where is it equated to a MENTAL assurance....RIGHT NOW a BELIEVER is a CHILD of GOD...it is the spirit that has BEEN BORN AGAIN by faith......it is NOT something that is YET future....it is a CURRENT possession as OUR spirit bears witness with the HOLY SPIRIT that I AM a SON of GOD by birth.....so..at the end of the day your view is flawed and lacking any substance and or believability!

 

[KennethC]

Or you interpretation is flawed...that is what I will go with....NO where is it equated to a MENTAL assurance....RIGHT NOW a BELIEVER is a CHILD of GOD...it is the spirit that has BEEN BORN AGAIN by faith......it is NOT something that is YET future....it is a CURRENT possession as OUR spirit bears witness with the HOLY SPIRIT that I AM a SON of GOD by birth.....so..at the end of the day your view is flawed and lacking any substance and or believability!

Pisteuo Strong's Greek: 4100

1. intransitive, to think to be true; to be persuaded of; to credit, place confidence in;
a) to credit, have confidence,

b)absolutely to trust in Jesus or in God as able to aid either in obtaining or in doing something


Apostle Paul said multiple times by faith we seek for and hope for salvation, not that we already have it !!!


1 Thessalonians 5:8
But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation.


Romans 13:11
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.




Romans 2:7
To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:




1 Timothy 4:8
For bodily exercise profiteth little: but godliness is profitable unto all things, having promise of the life that now is, and of that which is to come.




1 Timothy 6:12
Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, where unto thou art also called, and hast professed a good profession before many witnesses.




1 Timothy 6:19
Laying up in store for themselves a good foundation against the time to come, that they may lay hold on eternal life.




2 Timothy 2:10
Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.


Titus 1:2
In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

Titus 3:7
That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.





Colossians 1:22-23


In the body of His flesh through death, to present you holy, and blameless, and above reproach in His sight— if indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel which you heard, which was preached to every creature under heaven, of which I, Paul, became a minister.

 

[mailmandan]

Apostle Paul said multiple times by faith we seek for and hope for salvation, not that we already have it !!!

This hope is not some wishy washy cross your fingers hope I make it kind of hope. Unlike the english word "hope," the N.T. word contains no uncertainty; it speaks of something that is certain. - Strong's #1680 elpís (from elpō, "to anticipate, welcome") – properly, expectation of what is sure (certain); hope. If we have saving faith then we have this hope. Faith is the substance of things HOPED for.. (Hebrews 11:1). So that being justified by His grace we would be made heirs according to the HOPE of eternal life (Titus 3:7).

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

I believe and trust in what the Holy Spirit and the Word of God through Jesus and the Apostles say.

Not man made doctrines and man made teaching systems that have corrupted the word of God since the 4th century.

I wonder, how is it that man didn't influence our Bible prior to the 4th century?

Also, do you own a 4th century translation? The translations you often quote date anywhere from around 15th-20th centuries.

 

[AceMichaels]

Pisteuo Strong's Greek: 4100

1. intransitive, to think to be true; to be persuaded of; to credit, place confidence in;
a) to credit, have confidence,

b)absolutely to trust in Jesus or in God as able to aid either in obtaining or in doing something


Apostle Paul said multiple times by faith we seek for and hope for salvation, not that we already have it !!!


1 Thessalonians 5:8
But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation.


Romans 13:11
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.




Romans 2:7
To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:




1 Timothy 4:8
For bodily exercise profiteth little: but godliness is profitable unto all things, having promise of the life that now is, and of that which is to come.




1 Timothy 6:12
Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, where unto thou art also called, and hast professed a good profession before many witnesses.




1 Timothy 6:19
Laying up in store for themselves a good foundation against the time to come, that they may lay hold on eternal life.




2 Timothy 2:10
Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.


Titus 1:2
In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

Titus 3:7
That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.





Colossians 1:22-23


In the body of His flesh through death, to present you holy, and blameless, and above reproach in His sight— if indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel which you heard, which was preached to every creature under heaven, of which I, Paul, became a minister.

I agree with this. Salvation comes at the end of life (physical life)

 

[Gr8grace]

Whatever, as I said to Dcon I was only in it for 5 years and in that time they did very little scripture teaching.
It was mostly their false history of their church, and anytime scripture came up I questioned and tested it by the Word of God. I did not just accept it or let it influence my stance in the faith.

I go by the Holy Spirit's guidance and the Word of God alone for my understanding in His ways.

You then said what the Holy Spirit says in the scriptures; Do you believe the Holy Spirit only speaks to us through the word (bible), or do you believe He also speaks to us personally ???

I ask that because I know He speaks to me personally as well when I don't even have the bible opened.
I could be out in the field mowing, fishing, or cutting down trees and I will hear Him say something to me to either speak on or go take a look at.






No what you don't understand by what I said is there is a difference between one who accepts Jesus as Lord and Savior at an early age and lives out the rest of their life in that faith, and a person who comes to finally accept Jesus as their Lord and Savior on their death bed.

That person who has a genuine repentance on their death bed could have been one of the most vial sinners but they would still be forgiven. However the person who accepts Jesus as Lord and Savior early in life can not continue to live as that vial sinner they once were before putting their faith in Him.

Love, Mercy, Forgiveness !!!

So it is easier to be saved on our death bed than it is if we have our whole life ahead of us?

You have to see how silly you sound.

 

[KennethC]

I wonder, how is it that man didn't influence our Bible prior to the 4th century?

Also, do you own a 4th century translation? The translations you often quote date anywhere from around 15th-20th centuries.

There was already divisions happening in the first centuries but as for the scriptures we now have today as our bible they were influenced by men when put together.

The writings of the Apostles were passed around used but were still debated on what one's to use and what one's not to use.
Like for instance there were some that want James, Hebrews, and 1 John to be left out of the completed bible canon, and some even to this day try and teach that none of those books apply to us.

The 4th century is where the apostasy writings really started to take off, and where do you get what I quote is only from the 15th to the 20th century ???

I mentioned in the past writings from Barnabas, Ignatius, and others from the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd centuries that showed that eternal security and osas was not taught in those first 3 centuries. It was not tell Augustine in the 4th century that started this teaching.

I agree with this. Salvation comes at the end of life (physical life)

Yes there are to many scriptures from Apostle Paul that state and show this.

 

[KennethC]

So it is easier to be saved on our death bed than it is if we have our whole life ahead of us?

You have to see how silly you sound.

It is only silly to those who do not want to accept how the word of God says that by those of us who believe His commandments will not be burdensome or hard to keep. 1 John 5:3

This is what I mean by some speak like after they are born again that doing as the Lord commanded is hard or impossible still, and that would be denying the scriptures that say they are not burdensome and all things are possible to the one's who believe.

Even Apostle Paul says do not use examples like that or use grace for an opportunity to appease the flesh, meaning just because you are under grace do not think you can do whatever you want and keep that hope of the gospel.

 

[mailmandan]

I agree with this. Salvation comes at the end of life (physical life)

Salvation has three tenses. We "have been saved" from the PENALTY of sin (Justification); we are "being saved" from the POWER of sin (ongoing Sanctification); we "will be saved" from the PRESENCE of sin (Glorification). These three tenses at times can get mixed up.

 

[KennethC]

This hope is not some wishy washy cross your fingers hope I make it kind of hope. Unlike the english word "hope," the N.T. word contains no uncertainty; it speaks of something that is certain. - Strong's #1680 elpís (from elpō, "to anticipate, welcome") – properly, expectation of what is sure (certain); hope. If we have saving faith then we have this hope. Faith is the substance of things HOPED for.. (Hebrews 11:1). So that being justified by His grace we would be made heirs according to the HOPE of eternal life (Titus 3:7).

The definition from the Strong's says it is an expectation or confidence that we will receive it, so once again it is not saying we already physically possess it. It is a mental assurance that we will receive eternal life by standing firm in the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Definition: hope, expectation, trust, confidence.

Either way you look at it it is still referring to a future physical possession of receiving the eternal life.

 

[dcontroversal]

Pisteuo Strong's Greek: 4100

1. intransitive, to think to be true; to be persuaded of; to credit, place confidence in;
a) to credit, have confidence,

b)absolutely to trust in Jesus or in God as able to aid either in obtaining or in doing something


Apostle Paul said multiple times by faith we seek for and hope for salvation, not that we already have it !!!


1 Thessalonians 5:8
But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation.


Romans 13:11
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.




Romans 2:7
To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:




1 Timothy 4:8
For bodily exercise profiteth little: but godliness is profitable unto all things, having promise of the life that now is, and of that which is to come.




1 Timothy 6:12
Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, where unto thou art also called, and hast professed a good profession before many witnesses.




1 Timothy 6:19
Laying up in store for themselves a good foundation against the time to come, that they may lay hold on eternal life.




2 Timothy 2:10
Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.


Titus 1:2
In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

Titus 3:7
That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.





Colossians 1:22-23


In the body of His flesh through death, to present you holy, and blameless, and above reproach in His sight— if indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel which you heard, which was preached to every creature under heaven, of which I, Paul, became a minister.

Look, your interpretation of what is said is flawed....the verses you quote cannot and do not trump and or over ride all of the verses that teach and give a PRESENT reality of salvation and eternal life....and your cut and paste of a Strong's concordance word does not make your view right...so, cut and paste and highlight all you want...it does not change the inspired verb tense and or the scriptures that discount your heretical interpretation...

 

[mailmandan]

The definition from the Strong's says it is an expectation or confidence that we will receive it, so once again it is not saying we already physically possess it. It is a mental assurance that we will receive eternal life by standing firm in the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Definition: hope, expectation, trust, confidence.

Either way you look at it it is still referring to a future physical possession of receiving the eternal life.

Yes, expectation of what is sure (certain). We have not yet received our glorified bodies, but believers are saved now.

 

[dcontroversal]

This hope is not some wishy washy cross your fingers hope I make it kind of hope. Unlike the english word "hope," the N.T. word contains no uncertainty; it speaks of something that is certain. - Strong's #1680 elpís (from elpō, "to anticipate, welcome") – properly, expectation of what is sure (certain); hope. If we have saving faith then we have this hope. Faith is the substance of things HOPED for.. (Hebrews 11:1). So that being justified by His grace we would be made heirs according to the HOPE of eternal life (Titus 3:7).

Amen to that...his problem is he believes in working to the end to get it instead of trusting into the FINISHED work of Christ by faith.....

 

[Willie-T]

Amen to that...his problem is he believes in working to the end to get it instead of trusting into the FINISHED work of Christ by faith.....

Yeah, a lot of people honestly think it doesn't start until we die. So they are trying to make sure they earn admittance.

 

[Skinski7]

One is only a child of God if one is walking in righteousness according to the leading of the Spirit.

Jesus clearly taught...

Joh 8:39 They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham.
Joh 8:40 But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham.
Joh 8:41 Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.
Joh 8:42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
Joh 8:43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

It is erroneous to believe that one can willfully engage in wickedness and be a true child of God.

He who sins is the servant of sin is what Jesus taught. Why? Because willful sinning is an act of the will and is an act of defiance to God. To willfully sin is to choose evil over good and the children of God simply do not choose evil over God because such a thing is abhorrent.


Yet in 2015 we are faced with a religion which poses as Christianity in which its adherents believe they can willfully choose to engage in evil and yet still claim to be children of God. These people believe in a salvation which leaves people wicked. What kind of salvation is that? What do these people think they are saved from what? Certainly not saved from sin and wickedness.

Salvation to them is merely a salvation from judgement not inward wickedness. Thus the inward wickedness still exists, yet because they perceive they reap no condemnation for it, clearly, the salvation they believe, is a license to engage in wickedness without condemnation.

What is the different between the Christian and the non-Christian to these people? The only real difference is that they think that their wickedness is covered by some provision they believe took place on the cross. Thus the Gospel to them is a cloak for wickedness once all the fluff is stripped away.





The children of God are born again of the Spirit and are inwardly transformed. The inward transformation necessitates outward holiness. Anyone walking according to the lusts of the flesh in rebellion to God and yet believes they are a child of God because they "believe in Jesus" is extremely deceived.

 

[Skinski7]

If a porn watcher does not have to forsake engaging in pornographic activity BEFORE God grants forgiveness then they NEVER have to forsake it.

If people are forgiven IN their sins because there is no need to FORSAKE their sins then one can do as they please. The claim that "we should serve God" or "we change because we are thankful" is hogwash because none of these people (as far as I am aware) contend that the willful sin ever stops.

 

[Willie-T]

If a porn watcher does not have to forsake engaging in pornographic activity BEFORE God grants forgiveness then they NEVER have to forsake it.

If people are forgiven IN their sins because there is no need to FORSAKE their sins then one can do as they please. The claim that "we should serve God" or "we change because we are thankful" is hogwash because none of these people (as far as I am aware) contend that the willful sin ever stops.

Yes, you are absolutely correct...... IF you are not grateful.

 

[Skinski7]

I have spoken directly multitudes of pastors and every single one of them bar one told me that one can be "saved and forgiven" whilst one willfully engages in wickedness (like pornography for example).

That alone demonstrates to me that the current state of the professing church is dire when the people who preach from the pulpits each Sunday actually believe that one can engage in willful wickedness and not be condemned. No wonder wickedness pervades the churches. Just today yet another pastor near where I live was indicted on child pornography charges.

 

[dcontroversal]

Yeah, a lot of people honestly think it doesn't start until we die. So they are trying to make sure they earn admittance.

I agree fully...they miss the fact that it is the spirit that has been born again...something BORN is alive the moment it is BORN....and to say you must work and or walk the line till your death to get it is a veiled form of works for salvation no matter how you slice and dice....

 

[Skinski7]

Yes, you are absolutely correct...... IF you are not grateful.

Let's put you on the spot Willie and see if you run and hide. You will serve as a good example in regards to what is going on.

Does a child molester have to stop engaging in the molestation of children BEFORE God will forgive them?

Does a child molester have to stop engaging in the molestation of children BEFORE reconciliation with God can take place?

What do you believe in regards to that question Willie? Will you answer it directly so we can discuss it, or will you run and hide?