Who's teaching you?

[notuptome]

Ephesians 4:11 God is still gifting pastors to the local church. 11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:

Todays church is not all that unlike apostate Israel. God sent prophets and Israel slew them. Today God gifts pastors and the congregations beat them into a pulp, starve them and wholly reject biblical preaching that the do not consider worthy of their attention.

Perilous times indeed. 2 Timothy 2:1 ¶ This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,
7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
8 Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith.
9 But they shall proceed no further: for their folly shall be manifest unto all men, as theirs also was.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Yet]

Are you sure these people are in the body of Christ?

Many are, many are not. I've never doubted my salvation but I still tried to follow the false doctrine of the local Pentecostal church.......tithing......clerical construct. To my and my family's hurt big time. They 'subvert whole houses' is what the word says. And their good at it?
Not all men in these tithe taking positions are intentionally doing wrong. They are simply carrying on what they've been drilled with. However they need to pay attention to the Holy Spirit and the word of God and repent of these heresies.

 

[Yet]

Ephesians 4:11 God is still gifting pastors to the local church. 11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:

Todays church is not all that unlike apostate Israel. God sent prophets and Israel slew them. Today God gifts pastors and the congregations beat them into a pulp, starve them and wholly reject biblical preaching that the do not consider worthy of their attention.

Perilous times indeed. 2 Timothy 2:1 ¶ This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,
7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
8 Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith.
9 But they shall proceed no further: for their folly shall be manifest unto all men, as theirs also was.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

God is NOT giving, what we define as, the single lord pastor to the local body. That has transpired by the inspiration of satan in order to shut down the every member functioning assembly. The damage done is incalculable unto this hour.

I've written this before. Read 1Peter 5. All elders are shepherds/pastors. There is no scriptural basis for the 'single, salaried, above everyone else pastor' as there has been since Constantine started the Catholic Church instituting the deeds of the Nicolaitans, clerical/laity system.

You can keep repeating the mantra 'head pastor, head pastor' till hell freezes up but it still will not be scriptural.

And this has been regurgitated for 1700 years now but still the concept has not mysteriously and magically appeared anywhere in your NT!
On this particular issue, most sheep cry out corporately ' the word be damned'. 'We must have our king'! 'Give us a king like other nations have'?
Matt.20 Jesus told His own that the other nations have their Kings that rule over them but it shall not be so among you.

Yet the the sheep keep demanding to sit under the pastor/King that 'lords it over His heritage' for filthy lucre.

Its not not in the bible, NT. But that doesn't really matter.

Like one pastor's wife said in anger after I proved to her and her class that NT tithing was a lie, she said 'I don't care if it's not in the NT. You had better pay it or God's gonna curse you'. She was mad at me for gently pointing to the scriptures. Then they threw me out of their hall of oratory monologue!

That's how desperate these hirelings are to keep their position and bucks rolling in.

As as far as I know, those dumb sheep are still there coughing up the blasphemous tithe. 'Blind guides to the blind. Waddling in the ditch of deadness'.

 

[convallaria]

I was without a church home for months and I prayed for 2 months straight, asking God to direct me to a church of His choice. I finally started attending a Presbyterian church and the pastor preached good things. However the congregation didn't take it to heart, and it was more of a blessing to them to hear a testimony of how God blessed a person that caught a big fish during his vacation. I quit because of other things I noticed, but that was the lat straw, not because of the pastor, but because of the congregation. I wrote them my concerns, and I received no answer of concern which confirmed to me that they didn't care. This church is dead like most that I have attended IMO. Not because the preaching wasn't any good, but because of the attitude of complacency. A shepherd can lead to flock to good pasture, but if the flock isn't hungry, they won't eat.

"Woe to them that are at ease in Zion, and trust in the mountain of Samaria, which are named chief of the nations, to whom the house of Israel came!" (Amos 6:1)

I know what you mean!

I don't think the flock is encouraged to be hungry, more to fall asleep so that things stay the same, week after week. Once I asked a lady who was giving me a little telling off for not "going anywhere"...I asked what is it the Lord called you to do? Where do you fit in the body of Christ? She had no idea, only that she was content with how things were and what she does with her days.

Hmmmm seems dangerous to me! The way things are set up in those places is not really lending itself to any kind of personal spiritual discovery. How can we have any level of obedience of we don't know what the Lord has called us to be?

 

[shotgunner]

I know what you mean!

I don't think the flock is encouraged to be hungry, more to fall asleep so that things stay the same, week after week. Once I asked a lady who was giving me a little telling off for not "going anywhere"...I asked what is it the Lord called you to do? Where do you fit in the body of Christ? She had no idea, only that she was content with how things were and what she does with her days.

Hmmmm seems dangerous to me! The way things are set up in those places is not really lending itself to any kind of personal spiritual discovery. How can we have any level of obedience of we don't know what the Lord has called us to be?

That has not been my church experience at all. I have been to places like that but the two that I have been committed to have been places to grow into the image of Christ, with a pastor more like a coach equipping and teaching every member of the team.

 

[just-me]

I know what you mean!

I don't think the flock is encouraged to be hungry, more to fall asleep so that things stay the same, week after week. Once I asked a lady who was giving me a little telling off for not "going anywhere"...I asked what is it the Lord called you to do? Where do you fit in the body of Christ? She had no idea, only that she was content with how things were and what she does with her days.

Hmmmm seems dangerous to me! The way things are set up in those places is not really lending itself to any kind of personal spiritual discovery. How can we have any level of obedience of we don't know what the Lord has called us to be?

One Sunday when I was teaching the adult Sunday-school class, I was teaching on growing in the faith. One ole timer spoke up and said " I was saved 20 years ago and I'm still a babe in Christ, and that's good enough for me." All I had to say in response was that we are suppose to mature in Christ, and that kindled a fire. The end result wasn't good, but it caused me to see some things that I hadn't noticed previously. Nuff said.

 

[Yet]

One Sunday when I was teaching the adult Sunday-school class, I was teaching on growing in the faith. One ole timer spoke up and said " I was saved 20 years ago and I'm still a babe in Christ, and that's good enough for me." All I had to say in response was that we are suppose to mature in Christ, and that kindled a fire. The end result wasn't good, but it caused me to see some things that I hadn't noticed previously. Nuff said.

The average church is set up in such a way that the folks remain students that never graduate. Sit and listen...sit and listen..for the rest of your life then die is the only way your going to make it to the podium. Trouble is its in a casket! And you still can't use your function. Somebody say whoopie!

 

[notuptome]

God is NOT giving, what we define as, the single lord pastor to the local body. That has transpired by the inspiration of satan in order to shut down the every member functioning assembly. The damage done is incalculable unto this hour.

I've written this before. Read 1Peter 5. All elders are shepherds/pastors. There is no scriptural basis for the 'single, salaried, above everyone else pastor' as there has been since Constantine started the Catholic Church instituting the deeds of the Nicolaitans, clerical/laity system.

You can keep repeating the mantra 'head pastor, head pastor' till hell freezes up but it still will not be scriptural.

And this has been regurgitated for 1700 years now but still the concept has not mysteriously and magically appeared anywhere in your NT!
On this particular issue, most sheep cry out corporately ' the word be damned'. 'We must have our king'! 'Give us a king like other nations have'?
Matt.20 Jesus told His own that the other nations have their Kings that rule over them but it shall not be so among you.

Yet the the sheep keep demanding to sit under the pastor/King that 'lords it over His heritage' for filthy lucre.

Its not not in the bible, NT. But that doesn't really matter.

Like one pastor's wife said in anger after I proved to her and her class that NT tithing was a lie, she said 'I don't care if it's not in the NT. You had better pay it or God's gonna curse you'. She was mad at me for gently pointing to the scriptures. Then they threw me out of their hall of oratory monologue!

That's how desperate these hirelings are to keep their position and bucks rolling in.

As as far as I know, those dumb sheep are still there coughing up the blasphemous tithe. 'Blind guides to the blind. Waddling in the ditch of deadness'.

A bitter and contentious man but you argue against the word of God.

God is not teaching you these things. It is no wonder to me that no one wants you in their church assembly.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[KenAllan]

I am taught by many people and by the Holy Spirit!

I listen to and read what great men have said down the centuries. I listen to and read what great men have said today.

I listen to what my Pastor teaches.

Then i take all of this and compare it to what the Holy Spirit says in the Scriptures.

This is how i am taught!

 

[KohenMatt]

Who's teaching me?

God.

Often, through my pastors.

 

[KenAllan]

1 Corinthians 12:28
[SUP]28 [/SUP] And God has appointed these in the church: first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, administrations, varieties of tongues.

God HAS appointed certain people in the Church to be TEACHERS! People who will teach us the Truth.

2 Peter 2:1
[SUP]1 [/SUP] But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction.

God DID say there are Teachers in the Church to teach us the Truths in the Scriptures. Does it matter if they are paid? Would you want to be a teacher in a Church as your job and not be paid for it?

Where in the Scriptures does God ever say people working in the Church cannot be paid?

2 Corinthians 11:7-9
[SUP]7 [/SUP] Did I commit sin in humbling myself that you might be exalted, because I preached the gospel of God to you free of charge?
[SUP]8 [/SUP] I robbed other churches, taking wages from them to minister to you.
[SUP]9 [/SUP] And when I was present with you, and in need, I was a burden to no one, for what I lacked the brethren who came from Macedonia supplied. And in everything I kept myself from being burdensome to you, and so I will keep myself.


1 Timothy 5:17-18
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Let the elders who rule well be counted worthy of double honor, especially those who labor in the word and doctrine.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] For the Scripture says, "You shall not muzzle an ox while it treads out the grain," and, "The laborer is worthy of his wages."

Pastors who teach us ARE worthy of their wages paid to them. Just because you disagree with the Holy Spirit does not mean you can go around sinning against the Holy Spirit and what He says, Yet!

 

[AceMichaels]

Sure you can learn a lot of good stuff as a newbie but it's the bad stuff that'll eventually kill you.

But this submitting to a man deal is very dangerous. What if he's wrong? How does that help you?

Go ahead and submit, but when it finally places you in bondage, and it will, look me up.

What if the voices in your head are wrong? How would you know?

 

[Willie-T]

That has not been my church experience at all. I have been to places like that but the two that I have been committed to have been places to grow into the image of Christ, with a pastor more like a coach equipping and teaching every member of the team.

Amen, and again, AMEN !

 

[RussellJBenigno]

This church is dead like most that I have attended IMO. Not because the preaching wasn't any good, but because of the attitude of complacency. A shepherd can lead to flock to good pasture, but if the flock isn't hungry, they won't eat.

"Woe to them that are at ease in Zion, and trust in the mountain of Samaria, which are named chief of the nations, to whom the house of Israel came!" (Amos 6:1)

It is extremely rare to find a church which meets all your needs.
I shut my church down because the people were complacent.

 

[RussellJBenigno]

What if the voices in your head are wrong? How would you know?

You know your hearing from God because the Revelation lines up with in context scripture.
Most teachings in churches are based on out of context verses and the vain imagination found in commentaries.

 

[RussellJBenigno]

1 Corinthians 12:28
[SUP]28 [/SUP] And God has appointed these in the church: first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, administrations, varieties of tongues.

God HAS appointed certain people in the Church to be TEACHERS! People who will teach us the Truth.

See! You are [and I say this with sadness and not anger] an example of the problem in the modern church. You missed it! And the verse is right in front of you. You just ignored the other offices of ministry. How can you speak about truth when you just ignored the Truth. This is the problem with the modern church. They pick and chose what they will believe and reject the Word of God as spoken by the Apostle in scripture.
First Apostles, second Prophets,third Teachers, after that [workers of] Miracles, then [those with] Gifts of Healing, Helps, Administration, varieties of Tongues.
We need all these people in order to bring growth to the church.

 

[RussellJBenigno]

I am taught by many people and by the Holy Spirit!

I listen to and read what great men have said down the centuries. I listen to and read what great men have said today.

I listen to what my Pastor teaches.

Then i take all of this and compare it to what the Holy Spirit says in the Scriptures.

This is how i am taught!

Good for you.
All things need to be compared to "in context scripture". If it does not match toss it out. We all need to be taught directly by the Holy Spirit and then secondarily with the help of men.

 

[RussellJBenigno]

The average church is set up in such a way that the folks remain students that never graduate. Sit and listen...sit and listen..for the rest of your life then die is the only way your going to make it to the podium. Trouble is its in a casket! And you still can't use your function. Somebody say whoopie!

Once again, sadly most People are feed watered down milk at best. This is because many who teach are not called to teach. And on top of that not even a child of God.

 

[Yet]

1 Corinthians 12:28
[SUP]28 [/SUP] And God has appointed these in the church: first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, administrations, varieties of tongues.

God HAS appointed certain people in the Church to be TEACHERS! People who will teach us the Truth.

2 Peter 2:1
[SUP]1 [/SUP] But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction.

God DID say there are Teachers in the Church to teach us the Truths in the Scriptures. Does it matter if they are paid? Would you want to be a teacher in a Church as your job and not be paid for it?

Where in the Scriptures does God ever say people working in the Church cannot be paid?

2 Corinthians 11:7-9
[SUP]7 [/SUP] Did I commit sin in humbling myself that you might be exalted, because I preached the gospel of God to you free of charge?
[SUP]8 [/SUP] I robbed other churches, taking wages from them to minister to you.
[SUP]9 [/SUP] And when I was present with you, and in need, I was a burden to no one, for what I lacked the brethren who came from Macedonia supplied. And in everything I kept myself from being burdensome to you, and so I will keep myself.


1 Timothy 5:17-18
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Let the elders who rule well be counted worthy of double honor, especially those who labor in the word and doctrine.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] For the Scripture says, "You shall not muzzle an ox while it treads out the grain," and, "The laborer is worthy of his wages."

Pastors who teach us ARE worthy of their wages paid to them. Just because you disagree with the Holy Spirit does not mean you can go around sinning against the Holy Spirit and what He says, Yet!

What sins am I sinning. Am I your enemy because I tell you the truth?

 

[shotgunner]

What sins am I sinning. Am I your enemy because I tell you the truth?

I don't know that you are in sin. I don't even know you. Just based on your posts though, I would say that you seem way too concerned that someone is trying to get your money.

Keep in mind I say that knowing fully well that I do many things just as bad.