How to Recognize a Mixed-Grace Gospel

Grace777x70 · Jan 15, 2016

Here is the link that shows the differences between the mixed-grace gospel and the so-called hyper-grace gospel of Christ.

https://escapetoreality.files.wordpress.com/2014/04/20-differences-table.pdf

KennethC · Jan 15, 2016

phil36 said:

I think the issue would be "what is legalism"???

I ask this because it seems some don't really know what that means or they want to add stuff to the term so that they can just take that paint brush and slap that self-righteous label on anybody they please.

The "legalism" that was fought in Jesus and Paul's days were those trying to force people into keeping the Mosaic laws !!!

Now days though they want to slap this title on those who speak of obedience to Christ's teachings, and even go as far as trying to say obedience to Christ is placing people under the law. This also is not true !!!

The other thing that happens is we have those who act like as though Paul taught different standards then what Jesus taught when they both taught the same things.

Grace believers for some reason think those who speak a lot on obedience deny Grace, why I do not know !!!

PeterJens · Jan 15, 2016

Jesus love is always been exceedingly great, it is what drove Him to the cross.

The reason why catholics have Christ on the cross, and call communion mass is because of the high esteem they hold it all in.

But this is still bounded by sin and righteousness. Faith conquers sin and walks in righteousness.

The problem is where we see greed and self indulgence we get the "hyper-grace" preaching.
Where we had "little gods" we get "a pure perfect spirit planted in the believer."

It is not surprising to get a little cynical that those who have now "converted" to grace have jumped ship off one version of license to pick up on the latest version.

Emotions play an amazing role in what people believe. If you can keep the wealth, the privilege and the pride, then wow, you got a deal.

eternally-gratefull · Jan 15, 2016

PeterJens said:

Nope thats not the issue at all.. The issue is who do you trust, God, Or yourself.. Thats the whole issue in a nutshell. Sin is trusting in self. All the worlds religions are based on this religion. Trust self. bring God down to my level. And when we do this, we reject God..

Again, this is serious error.

If our mind is right, and we are made alive, the things of God are no longer foolish. We understand God, and why we need to walk with him, We learn to rest in him, Obedience stops becomeing work, and becomes a natural way of life.

Thats how you can tell a legalist or licentious person from a true grace person. A person who trusts God believes obedience is a lifestyle A legalist person believes obedience is a chore, a work, or something we MUST DO. or we will lose this grate gift God has given to us, They preach a change of life, but they do not preach how it is God who does this work in us

Again, Who has said this, I have yet to see one person say it. And if they did, I would seriously question them.

But what I refuse to do. is go 180 degrees out, and walk in another false gospel. jhist to oppose their gospel. thats mans away, Not Gods way.

speak to yourself. because this is what you are doing.

You have to understand it yourself before you can share it with others.. And I see no understanding from you at all. I see basics where you have it, but the simple message of grace, you have lost it, you do not understand it, If you do not understand grace you will never understand God..

eternally-gratefull · Jan 15, 2016

Willie-T said:

You missed my whole point.

My point was if we go outside the bible to make our gospel truth or doctrinal positions, we are in serious trouble.

They are using gnostic teachings written 2000 years ago to try to prove that I am a heretic.. lets get real here. (speaking to them)

Should we not be the nereans, who listen to others, but use Gods word to test what they say?

eternally-gratefull · Jan 15, 2016

PeterJens said:

Nothing further needs said,

2 Tim 3:
[SUP]16 [/SUP]All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, [SUP]17 [/SUP]that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.

If scripture is not complete. It can not do what Paul by inspiration of God, told us in Gods word..

And if you do not believe this, You just disqualified yourself from being able to teach anyone, because you believe fables and fairytails are equal with scripture.

eternally-gratefull · Jan 15, 2016

phil36 said:

That is the debate. and has been from the begining

Hyper grace is rejection of eternal security, There is no such thing as hyper grace, they ust change the words so we think they are talking about somethign else. Don;t buy into thier deception.

eternally-gratefull · Jan 15, 2016

KennethC said:

E.G. constantly lies on me which is why I have him on ignore........

I am not a legalist nor is he right that I don't believe in assurance of salvation.

The problem that E.G. has with me is that I speak on the assurance of salvation in the manner of how it is placed in the Word of God.

Jesus, Paul, James, and John all show it clear that the assurance comes from our walk in the faith, as our deeds will be reflective of the faith we have in Jesus.

If we walk around with hatred toward others then the Truth is not in us...........Apostle John showed this as well as a number of other things that said if you are acting this way then eternal life does not abide in you.

Apostle James said a hearer only but not a doer is deceived.......

Apostle Paul said to examine ourselves (means our actions) to make sure we are of the faith...........

Some want to separate the walk from the faith itself which can not be done, but thus by doing so places a dangerous road that can branch off the narrow path and lead to the broad ways of destruction.

Do you think a person who always has constant hatred toward others is saved in Christ ???? John gives us the answer as he says no, for if they were of God they would love because God is love !!!

No, thats not why he has me on ignore.

He has me on ignore because I confront him openly, And he does not like it..

It is ok for him to lie about my faith, but not ok for me to confront him about his.. IE Ken is a hypocrite.

Willie-T · Jan 15, 2016

eternally-gratefull said:

Predoname. I wasn't paying any attention to that gnostic jabber. I simply replied to the statement in your post.

eternally-gratefull · Jan 15, 2016

Willie-T said:

its all good bro.. Sorry if their was a misunderstanding, I agree with what you said in your context..

eternally-gratefull · Jan 15, 2016

KennethC said:

Its easy..

Legalism is a doctrine which states salvation can be lost. be it in any of the following ways

1. Salvation is not assured until the resurrection. So no one is saved until then.
2. Salvation is given as a gift based on faith. But faith, or works must be maintained if that salvation is to be granted (basically another way of saying number 1)
3. Salvation is gained by some amount of work which mankind must do in order to have his sin forgiven. From as many rules as the pharisee or roman catholics to the minor list of rules given in alot of modern day so called evangelic churches..

it is apposed to grace, which states salvation is given to an unearned soul when they place their complete and utter faiht in Christ, And that salvation is assured because it was given, and paid for, and assured by Christ himself..

Grace777x70 · Jan 15, 2016

Here is a quote that needs to be pondered on continuously ...I know I need it... ( borrowed it from FreeNChrist..thanks brother..)

"You may have harnessed the energy of the flesh in an otherwise quite genuine desire to honor the Lord Jesus in your life. The flesh, which has its origin in Satan, will go along with you; to survive, it is quite prepared to engage in every form of Christian activity, even though this may seem to honor Christ.

The flesh will sing in the choir, teach Sunday school, preside at a deacons’ meeting, preach from the pulpit, organize an evangelistic crusade, go to Bible college, volunteer for the mission field, and a thousand other things, all of which may in themselves be otherwise legitimate, if only it can keep its neck out of the noose. The flesh will threaten, shout, strut, domineer, sulk, plot, creep, beg, plead, or sob, whatever the situation may demand in the interests of its own survival. By any and all means it will seek to cause every Christian to live by his own strength instead of by the power and grace of the Lord Jesus, and to conclude that doing so is actually a good thing!

The characteristic of the spiritually immature is that they are unable to discern between good and evil (Hebrews 5:13-14), and the baby Christian, like the foolish Galatians, “having begun in the Spirit” still tries to be “made perfect by the flesh” (Galatians 3:3).

We must be particularly patient with those whose lack of understanding allows a genuine love for the Lord Jesus to be satisfied with, and sometimes to be quite enthusiastic about, Christian activities involving means and methods which are heavily contaminated by the flesh. These are more deserving of instruction than rebuke, for they are still in their spiritual babyhood.

.....The flesh will seek to produce the most plausible arguments in justification of its own illegitimate activities, even though these activities are only what the Bible calls “dead works” (Hebrews 6:1; 9:14) and not the “good works” which are truly the work of God. “Good works” are those that have their origin in Jesus Christ, as Christ’s activity is released through your body because you present it to Him as a living sacrifice. You do this only by faith that expresses total dependence, as opposed to Adamic independence."

Major Ian Thomas: The Way Of The Flesh; from The Indwelling Life of Christ

iwant2serve · Jan 15, 2016

Hyper grace and mixed grace let me see. Many people believe that because you are saved you have no responsibility to remain in the vine saying its all up to Jesus and if you think you can do it you are putting works in it. Well there ar many passages of warning for the believer to remain. If it is all on Jesus and nothing to do with us explain these scriptures.

1 Corinthians 15-2: "By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain.
2 Timothy 2:12: "If we endure, we will also reign with him. If we disown him, he will also disown us."
John 15:6: "If anyone does not remain in me, he is like a branch that is thrown away and withers; such branches are picked up , thrown into the fire and burned."
2 Peter 2:20-21: "For if after they have escaped the pollution's of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.

Grace777x70 · Jan 15, 2016

1 Corinthians 15:2 (NASB)
[SUP]2 [/SUP] by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain.

If we hold it fast ([FONT="Gentium" !important][I]ei katechete[/I][/FONT][/COLOR][/SIZE]). [COLOR=#008000][B]Condition of first class determined as fulfilled[/B][/COLOR]. Paul assumes that they are holding it fast
Word Pictures in the New Testament.

[B]2 Timothy 2:12-13 (NASB)
[/B][SUP][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000000]12 [/COLOR][/SIZE][/SUP] If we endure, we will also reign with Him; If we deny Him, He also will deny us; ( [B]deny also means " to contradict in the greek [/B]" )
[SUP][SIZE=4][COLOR=#000000]13 [/COLOR][/SIZE][/SUP] If we are faithless, He remains faithful, for He cannot deny Himself. This verse is not speaking of a simple failure in some area of our Christian walk. The next verse clarifies that. If we just fail to believe the way we should, the Lord remains faithful to us. He can’t deny Himself

Here is a look from one of our brothers about 2 Peter 2:20-21..mailmandan..excellent job

Please show me the words "forfeited being God's child" or "no longer a child of God." Those who are truly born of God have received a new nature, a divine nature, and they have new and different appetites and desires. They have been transformed from pigs and dogs into sheep. The change is more than just cosmetic, as in 2 Peter 2:20.

[B]Compare[/B] 2 Peter 1:4 - [B]"partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption - Strongs #5356[/B] that is in the world through lust with 2 Peter 2:20 - with they escaped the[B] pollutions - Strongs #3356 (different Greek word)[/B] of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, yet they are again entangled therein, and overcome. Notice that 2 Peter 2:20 did not mention them being "partakers of the divine nature."

[B]Corruption (Strongs #5356)[/B] (to shrivel or wither, spoil , ruin , deprave, corrupt , defile, to destroy by means of corrupting, to spoil as does milk). Corruption - describes decomposition or rotting of an organism and the accompanying stench. The utter depravity of the fallen flesh and the resultant moral decomposition of the world opposed to God is driven by it sinful lusts or evil desires. [B]Internal corruption.[/B]

[B]Pollutions/Defilements (Strongs #3393)[/B] ("pollutions", "filthy things", "contaminations", "world's filth") describes the state of being tainted or stained by evil and refers to impurity, impure, tainted, defilement, foulness or pollution. Pollutions/Defilement refers to what is on the [B]outside[/B] (2 Peter 2:20). But genuine believers have [B]escaped the corruption[/B] that is in the world through lust (2 Peter 1:4).

Corruption is [B]deeper [/B]than pollutions/defilements on the outside: it is [B]decay on the inside[/B]

[QUOTE="iwant2serve, post: 2443041"]Hyper grace and mixed grace let me see. Many people believe that because you are saved you have no responsibility to remain in the vine saying its all up to Jesus and if you think you can do it you are putting works in it. Well there ar many passages of warning for the believer to remain. If it is all on Jesus and nothing to do with us explain these scriptures.

1 Corinthians 15-2: "By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain.
2 Timothy 2:12: "If we endure, we will also reign with him. If we disown him, he will also disown us."
John 15:6: "If anyone does not remain in me, he is like a branch that is thrown away and withers; such branches are picked up , thrown into the fire and burned."
2 Peter 2:20-21: "For if after they have escaped the pollution's of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
[/QUOTE]

Grace777x70 · Jan 15, 2016

[FONT="Gentium" !important]arneomai[/FONT]
Strong's Talking Greek & Hebrew Dictionary.

to contradict, i.e. disavow, reject, abnegate :- deny, refuse.
Strong's Talking Greek & Hebrew Dictionary.

phil36 · Jan 15, 2016

Grace777x70 said:

Hi grace777x70,

I had a read of the PDF document you provided a link for. to be honest none of these two on their own actually equates to the full gospel of sciptural teaching. I must admit his representation of mixed-grace gospel is a strawman and actually does not reflect the majority of Bible belieivng Christians.

What I can say is that these movements come and go, from this to that. And the so called -Hyper - grace movement will be one of them. There is a good alternative name for it... Grace Boys. One day you will grow into Grace Men (quote)

Who are they? “The True Grace Boys?” “The Holiness Movement?” Heaven forbid, history has had enough of those. “The Sanctification Movement?” Doesn’t have much of a ring to it. The problem is just like hyper-Calvinism isn’t Calvinism, hyper-grace of the sort ascribed by Galatians 5:13ff and Jude 4, isn’t grace at all. It is license, a distortion of the gospel about which the Apostle Paul regularly exclaims, “May it never be!” (Rom 3:8,31; 6:1,2,15).

Revisiting the Grace Boys

Grace777x70 · Jan 15, 2016

If it doesn't reflect what some people believe then it will not offend them...that's a good thing!!!

of course what the author said here in your link is totally false too....and is a common myth that has been put forth...

Too many are preaching a truncated gospel: justification without sanctification, faith without works, privilege without duty, grace without law, holiness without effort

phil36 said:

FreeNChrist · Jan 15, 2016

phil36 said:

Hi grace777x70,

I had a read of the PDF document you provided a link for. to be honest none of these two on their own actually equates to the full gospel of sciptural teaching. I must admit his representation of mixed-grace gospel is a strawman and actually does not reflect the majority of Bible belieivng Christians.

What I can say is that these movements come and go, from this to that. And the so called -Hyper - grace movement will be one of them. There is a good alternative name for it... Grace Boys. One day you will grow into Grace Men (quote)

Who are they? “The True Grace Boys?” “The Holiness Movement?” Heaven forbid, history has had enough of those. “The Sanctification Movement?” Doesn’t have much of a ring to it. The problem is just like hyper-Calvinism isn’t Calvinism, hyper-grace of the sort ascribed by Galatians 5:13ff and Jude 4, isn’t grace at all. It is license, a distortion of the gospel about which the Apostle Paul regularly exclaims, “May it never be!” (Rom 3:8,31; 6:1,2,15).

Revisiting the Grace Boys

Nope. This is not a "movement".

phil36 · Jan 15, 2016

Grace777x70 said:

It doesnt actually reflect Christianity as a whole (whole teaching

)

phil36 · Jan 15, 2016

https://www.monergism.com/blog/faith-or-obedience

Revisiting the Grace Boys

I'm sure you guys won't mind as you like to post links

How to Recognize a Mixed-Grace Gospel

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