The 1 John 1:9 Lie: More New.Modern.Hyper Grace blasphemy

[Grace777x70]

....the point was that the person praying wanted the will of God but they had no knowledge that Jesus had already come...so it was just an example of "praying although sincere..was in fact useless "....it was just an example of praying uselessly...

I am not sure how you see praying for something that has already happened to be the equivalent of a person praying to be aligned with God's will for their life in the present ongoing into the future.

 

[Magenta]

oops

Romans 8: Life in the Spirit
1 There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.2 For the law of the Spirit of life has set you free in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death Romans 8: Life in the Spirit

ware did you get your definition of sin.

That is true we are not condemned for sin, it is thrown into the fire and burned up still the same.

 

[peacefulbeliever]

I'll happy to answer your question just as soon as you answer mine. (And I do have an answer regarding Heb. 12)

God says very clearly that in the New Covenant, this will be the case:

34 And no longer shall each one teach his neighbor and each his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for they shall all know me, from the least of them to the greatest, declares the Lord. For I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.” (from Jer. 31)
​

It's repeated here:

17 Then he adds:

“Their sins and lawless acts
I will remember no more.”

18 And where these have been forgiven, sacrifice for sin is no longer necessary. (from Heb. 10)
​

And I'll actually add to my question.

If further forgiveness for sins is necessary for believers why is sacrifice for those sins no longer necessary?

And why would God/His Holy Spirit, remind you of sins He has told us He chooses to remember no more and have already been forgiven?

And if you say that sins committed after you believed still need to be confessed before they're forgiven because they are in the future, THINK for a moment:

EVERY SIN that you committed was in the future when Christ did the Work of the Cross, the Resurrection, the Ascension, and became the Perfect, Permanent High Priest Who SITS in the heavenly Temple at the Right Hand of God in a position of REST because His Work is DONE.

Your sins, my sins, everyone's sins for ALL TIME were dealt with by Christ already. There is no process of sin, ask forgiveness, rinse, and repeat for the believer. You were cleansed by the Blood of Christ for ONE reason, and that was so that you could be indwelt with New Life - sealed with the Holy Spirit, because God won't live in dirty places. Christ made you CLEAN.

If His cleansing, and the Righteousness and New Life of His Spirit that was gifted to you (which, and please please please get this - this is NOT Gnostic thought - the Righteousness and the New Life we receive is HIS, not ours, just cleaned up until our next sin - look it up) could be defiled, EVERY SIN, NO MATTER HOW GREAT OR HOW SMALL that you commit, would cause God's Spirit to leave you, making you spiritually DEAD. That's serious business, and the New Covenant Scriptures are clear that is not what happens when we sin.

"Little children, when you sin, confess your sins to receive forgiveness to restore fellowship . . . "

No, that's not what John says, he says this:

My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin. But if anyone does sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. (from 1 John 2)​

John follows up by telling us why that advocacy is in place:

2 He is the propitiation [the full satisfaction of God's justice] for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world. 3 And by this we know that we have come to know him, if we keep his commandments. (from 1 John 2)​

There it is! We have to keep His commandments! Also defined by John:

23 And this is his commandment, that we believe in the name of his Son Jesus Christ and love one another, just as he has commanded us. 24 Whoever keeps his commandments abides in God, and God in him. And by this we know that he abides in us, by the Spirit whom he has given us. (from 1 John 3)​

God's commandments after the Cross are only two: Believe in Christ and love one another. And Love is the First Fruit of the Spirit that He gives us and Who abides in us. And He cannot abide in us unless we are first cleansed by Him, and after He abides (comes to live) in us, He SEALS US UNTO THE DAY OF REDEMPTION (see Eph. 1).

Nowhere does New Covenant Scripture say that your behavior undoes any or all of that. Rather New Covenant Scriptures tell us over and over who we are in Christ (read through the Epistles and see how many times you see 'in Christ', 'through Christ', 'because of Christ', etc.), building us up in Him and then exhorting us to live/behave accordingly.

That is Grace - getting what we DON"T deserve - the Godhead maintaining our salvation because we can no more maintain it that we could attain it - it is by faith from first to last.

** Remember those questions above. I highlighted them in red for you =).

-JGIG

I think most of us believe all of the above - but where is 1 John 1? 1 John 1 is not talking about salvation. It is talking about one's WALK - It is talking about fellowship, relationship, communion, a REALLY close relationship.
"that which we have seen and heard we proclaim also to you SO THAT YOU TOO MAY HAVE FELLOWSHIP with us and indeed our fellowship is with the Father and with his Son, Jesus Christ. We are writing these things so that our joy may be complete." What things are they writing about: fellowship, relationship.

Why even talk about this at all if there is no need to ask for forgiveness? Why is this portion of scripture even in here? We don't need it so we can just rip it out for it has no purpose . . .

 

[KennethC]

Oppps..gave the wrong one out..thanks Kenneth..


[video=youtube;EcuyzQuqQd0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EcuyzQuqQd0[/video]

I was done at 23 minutes in because even though Prince said it was sad, he still said certain people who were living in willful sin where still operating in God's grace.

That is a lie because there is no darkness in the Light, you can not operate in sin and in God's grace at the same time.

He was placing the gifts of the Holy Spirit in the hands of the disobedient, which is contradictory to scripture as the Holy Spirit is given to those who obey.......Acts 5:32

 

[crossnote]

Instead of thinking of Gods discipline as punishment, because its not, think of it as a boxers body and what it experiences in being being trained for a a boxing match, because that is exactly what is in view. We are all in training, being trained by God to fight the good fight.

Here is just one word 'chastise'...

to chew, consume, eat, devour
g3146. μαστιγόω mastigoō; from 3148; to flog ( literally or figuratively): — scourge.
AV ( 7)- scourge 7;
to scourge

and here is 'discipline'...

g3811. παιδεύω paideuō; from 3816; to train up a child, i. e. educate, or (by implication), discipline (by punishment):— chasten (- ise), instruct, learn, teach.

 

[Magenta]

....the point was that the person praying wanted the will of God but they had no knowledge that Jesus had already come...so it was just an example of "praying although sincere..was in fact useless "....it was just an example of praying uselessly...

It was certainly useless as an example of a Christian praying to be aligned with God's will for their life.

 

[crossnote]

Indeed, but for us, how long is the present the present, before it is the past?

point??...

 

[Willie-T]

....the point was that the person praying wanted the will of God but they had no knowledge that Jesus had already come...so it was just an example of "praying although sincere..was in fact useless "....it was just an example of praying uselessly...

An example might be sincerely praying for God's love? Since we are told, in dozens of places, that we already have God's love. Right?

 

[royalscot]

judge not or be judged. done 30 seconds etc

Romans 8: Life in the Spirit
1 There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.2 For the law of the Spirit of life has set you free in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death Romans 8: Life in the Spirit

ware did you get your definition of sin.

 

[KennethC]

oops

Romans 8: Life in the Spirit
1 There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.2 For the law of the Spirit of life has set you free in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death Romans 8: Life in the Spirit

ware did you get your definition of sin.

Yes walking by the Spirit, because the fruit of the Holy Spirit will not lead one to transgress against God's ways.

However there will be some that will continue to live by the flesh, and these are still held under the law and its condemnation !!!

 

[BenFTW]

I wonder how anyone could see praying to be aligned with the will of God as a waste of time.

That isn't being posited. lol I even said, "Nothing wrong with being open with the Lord about your struggles."

 

[Grace777x70]

Kenneth...this wasn't for you..I knew you would be against the teaching because you believe people can lose their salvation and it's SIN that does it..sin is so much more powerful then the blood of Jesus.....but everyone is entitled to their own beliefs...

I was done at 23 minutes in because even though Prince said it was sad, he still said certain people who were living in willful sin where still operating in God's grace.

That is a lie because there is no darkness in the Light, you can not operate in sin and in God's grace at the same time.

He was placing the gifts of the Holy Spirit in the hands of the disobedient, which is contradictory to scripture as the Holy Spirit is given to those who obey.......Acts 5:32

 

[crossnote]

I apologize. I didn't realize you meant that you actually do still pocket change you know is in excess, and have to return it when you begin to feel guilty.

That's good that you eventually give it back. And, I'd say you are right, THAT probably is conviction for giving in to worldly behavior.

Ok, so you agree that Christians are convicted by the Holy Spirit? (even though I said I can't even pocket $5 today ...meaning it never gets that far).

 

[BenFTW]

point??...

The point being all sin is past after being committed.

 

[Grace777x70]

Hebrews 12:6 Does God Scourge His Kids?

Everyone has a mental picture of God. Perhaps you think he is distant, aloof, angry, even terrifying. Possibly you envision him holding a whip in his hands…

For those whom the Lord loves he disciplines, and he scourges every son whom he receives. (Heb 12:6, NASB)

Yet your heavenly Father is not like this. How do I know? I’ve seen Jesus. Jesus is none of these things. Rather, he is loving, gracious, kind and desires to share his life with you. Jesus said he was about his Father’s business and that business is not the condemning business but the adoption business. God loves you and wants to spend eternity delighting in you.

So how does scourging fit into this picture? It doesn’t. It sticks out like a cobra in a kindergarten. It shouldn’t be there. Yet it is, in black and white in Hebrews 12. So does God scourge his kids or doesn’t he?

Anyone interested in the rest of the teaching...

Hebrews 12:6 Does God Scourge His Kids? – Escape to Reality

 

[FreeNChrist]

Here is just one word 'chastise'...

to chew, consume, eat, devour
g3146. μαστιγόω mastigoō; from 3148; to flog ( literally or figuratively): — scourge.
AV ( 7)- scourge 7;
to scourge

and here is 'discipline'...

g3811. παιδεύω paideuō; from 3816; to train up a child, i. e. educate, or (by implication), discipline (by punishment):— chasten (- ise), instruct, learn, teach.

The word chastise is not in my Bible, the word discipline is.

 

[royalscot]

educate is different to saved by grace, after all when, did we have the same IQ,

yet trying to teaching humans, to trip over, the stone, the builder rejected. because it was not explained full till later date.

so context will show, up everytime.

 

[KennethC]

Kenneth...this wasn't for you..I knew you would be against the teaching because you believe people can lose their salvation and it's SIN that does it..sin is so much more powerful then the blood of Jesus.....but everyone is entitled to their own beliefs...

There you go with you false allegation again as I never said sin causes one to lose their salvation.......

I will repeat what I have said multiple times in big letters and maybe it will get through:

Rather one is in the FAITH or not determines if they have salvation in Christ !!!

Deliberate continuous sinning is a byproduct of one who is not in the faith...................

 

[phil36]

The word chastise is not in my Bible, the word discipline is.

This should clear the matter up for you:

παιδεύω

 

[BenFTW]

There you go with you false allegation again as I never said sin causes one to lose their salvation.......

I will repeat what I have said multiple times in big letters and maybe it will get through:

Rather one is in the FAITH or not determines if they have salvation in Christ !!!

Deliberate continuous sinning is a byproduct of one who is not in the faith...................

So what is there to argue about? Grace-believers agree that sin will not dominate us for we are not under the law but grace, as scripture says.