ONE BAPTISM - Ephesians 4:5

skylove7 · Mar 22, 2016

Also Posthuman lol
Please allow me to honestly say
I don't know why the preacher baptized us children so much
Like I said....he had his own way
But yes...keep in mind
We were kids
My daddy made me attent the church from age 5 to 18

But at 18
I chose my own church

But sad thing is
With children in a church that chooses 'their' way not the 'bible' way

Yea
You just kinda believe the preacher
And you don't understand til you meet folks that follow 'the truth'

skylove7 · Mar 22, 2016

When I became a woman
I realized why my childhood pastor baptized us alot

He liked to put on a show is all
He liked to act like he was John the Baptist
Jesus' s right hand man or something lol

4enlightment · Mar 22, 2016

plaintalk said:

John said that he Baptized by water, but someone will come after him that will Baptizes us by the Holy spirit; and so that means that his Baptism is not the true Baptism. If it were then we will not have to b Baptized again.

Matthew 21:25 John’s baptism—where did it come from? Was it from heaven, or of human origin?” They discussed it among themselves and said, “If we say, ‘From heaven,’ he will ask, ‘Then why didn’t you believe him?’

John 7:38 Whoever believes in me, as Scripture has said, rivers of living water will flow from within them.”

Isaiah 4:4 The Lord will wash away the filth of the women of Zion; he will cleanse the bloodstains from Jerusalem by a spirit of judgment and a spirit of fire.

Luke 3:16 John answered them all, “I baptize you with water. But one who is more powerful than I will come, the straps of whose sandals I am not worthy to untie. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.

Acts 8:18 When Simon saw that the Spirit was given at the laying on of the apostles’ hands, he offered them money

plaintalk · Mar 23, 2016

To: 4enlightment #143
Please, back up for a minute; my comment did not reference the baptism of John the Baptist, I was speaking in reference to the baptism that Jesus authorized in Matt. 28: 18-20, which also involved water as a medium. But we should not, IMO, disparage the baptism of John the Baptist, as you pointed out it was from heaven, God given. (Matt. 21: 25) To reject it, was to reject the counsel or purpose of God. (Luke 7: 30); but it was for the Jews, not all men. It was a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins (Mark 1: 4); it was an old covenant practice.

The baptism authorized by Jesus in Matt. 28: 18-18 was in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit was also in the medium of water; it is however a new covenant event; it was for all nations, Jews and Gentiles; it is for discipleship and entrance into Christ (Rom. 6: 3); it is for sonship (Gal. 3: 26, 27); it to is connected with repentance and the forgiveness of sins (Acts 2: 38, 39; 22: 16); and it carried with it, the promise of the gift of the Holy Spirit. This is the baptism of which Jesus, “He who has believed (the gospel) and has been baptized shall be saved.” (Mark 16: 15, 16) Peter said this baptism now saves us. (1 Peter 3; 21) and Paul said we are saved by the washing of regeneration and the renewal of the Holy Spirit. (Titus 3: 5, 6)

The above is not said to diminish the baptism in the Holy Spirit. The gift of the Holy Spirit that is given to all who believe (John 7: 39) and obey (Acts 5: 32) involves the anointing, the baptism with the Spirit, the indwelling of the Spirit, regeneration, renewal and much more. “For by (with or in) one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit.” (1 Cor. 12: 12)

The dilemma that we all face in understanding Eph. 4: 5 is what shall we do with the baptism authorized by Jesus in Matt. 28: 18-20 and the baptism with the Spirit promised by John the Baptist? IMO we cannot simply pass over one or the other. The solution is found in John 3: 5 were we find that the one spiritual birth involves two elements, water and Spirit. Similarly, IMO, the one baptism involves two elements, water and the spirit. God bless.

plaintalk · Mar 23, 2016

To: SeaBass #122 Thread: One Baptism
The promise of the baptism with the Holy Spirit, by Jesus as the agent, to the Jews who came to be baptized by John the Baptist, was recorded by all of the writers of the four gospels. (Matt3: 11; Mark 1: 8; Luke 3: 16; John 1: 33) IMO this promise cannot fairly just be written off or ignored; it is of great significance. Because it was to the Jews, were the Gentiles to be ignored? Would God be impartial if gave such a life changing gift to some but not to other? We find that Jesus promised His apostles that He would baptize them with the Holy Spirit in a few days in Jerusalem. (Acts 1: 5) Years later, after Cornelius, a Gentile, and his household were baptized with the Holy Spirit, Peter referred to this promise in regard to the Gentiles. So we see that God’s promise in regard to baptism with the Spirit was not as restrictive as some think. (Acts 11: 16)

At Pentecost the Spirit was made available to all mankind. God gives the Spirit to those that believe (John 7: 39) and obey (Acts 5: 32) by repentance and baptism in the name of Christ. (Acts 2: 38, 39) Three thousand Jews were promised the gift of the Holy Spirit. We are not told at this time specifically what this involved. But years later, with Cornelius, we find that, among other things, the gift of the Holy Spirit includes baptism with the Spirit and receiving the Spirit. (Acts 10: 44-48) We conclude therefore, that the promise that John the Baptist, made to the Jews, was begun to be fulfilled at Pentecost and that the Gentiles were also to be included in this promise.

Thus, all who repent and are baptized in the name of Christ, in water, for the forgiveness of their sins are given the gift of the Holy Spirit. This gift is poured out richly and abundantly so that the recipients are metaphorically immersed in the Spirit. (Titus 3: 5, 6) This is the one baptism. As the believers come forth from this baptismal experience, they are born of both water and the Spirit. (John 3: 3, 5) They are born again. God bless.

mailmandan · Mar 24, 2016

plaintalk said:

The two elements are living water and Spirit. - *The Spirit is the source of living water. The solution is not merging water baptism and Spirit baptism into one baptism. Unfortunately, I see that you remained deceived by the church of Christ.

mailmandan · Mar 24, 2016

plaintalk said:

In Acts 2:38, "for the remission of sins" does not refer back to both clauses, "you all repent" and "each one of you be baptized," but refers only to the first. Peter is saying "repent unto the remission of your sins," the same as in Acts 3:19. The clause "each one of you be baptized" is parenthetical. This is exactly what Acts 3:19 teaches except that Peter omits the parenthesis. Also compare the fact that these Gentiles in Acts 10:45 received the gift of the Holy Spirit (compare with Acts 2:38 - the gift of the Holy Spirit) and this was BEFORE water baptism (Acts 10:47).

In Acts 10:43 we read ..whoever believes in Him will receive remission of sins. These Gentiles received the gift of the Holy Spirit - Acts 10:45 - (compare with Acts 2:38 - the gift of the Holy Spirit) when they believed on the Lord Jesus Christ - Acts 11:17 - (compare with Acts 16:31 - Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved) BEFORE water baptism - Acts 10:47 - this is referred to as repentance unto life - Acts 11:18.

It's called Spirit baptism, not water baptism. 1 Corinthians 12:13 - For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body--whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free--and have all been made to drink into one Spirit. Water baptism FOLLOWS (Acts 10:43-47; 11:17,18).

False. Prior to receiving water baptism, believers are born of water and the Spirit. You continue to confuse water baptism with Spirit baptism and plain ordinary H20 with LIVING WATER.

plaintalk · Mar 24, 2016

#146 If we read John 3: 5 again, those that have eyes to see, will find that the text does not say "living water," the text says "water." The baptism, in water, in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit was to all nations, to make disciples (Matt. 28; 18-20); to all creation (Mark 16: 15, 16); and to as many as God shall call to Himself (Acts 2: 38, 39) and should not IMO be dismissed in any consideration of the "one baptism." God bless.

notuptome · Mar 24, 2016

this is a long dead thread. The OP has been banned for a long time.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

plaintalk · Mar 24, 2016

# 147 For centuries the Jews, under the direction God, practiced the washing with water for purification. (Ex. 29: 4) John the Baptist, who was to prepare the way for Christ, came preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sin. (Mark 1: 4) Forgiveness of sins was connected to repentance and baptism.
Paul's sins were washed away when he was baptized. (Acts 22: 16)
We are freed from our sins when we die to the old self in baptism. (Rom. 6: 3-7)
We are freed from sin when we obey that form of teaching--death, burial, resurrection--that is found in baptism. (Rom. 6: 17, 18; 6: 3-6)
All spiritual blessings, including redemption, the forgiveness of sin, is in Christ; we are baptized into Christ. (Eph. 1: 3, 7; Col. 1: 14; Rom. 6: 3; Gal. 3 : 26, 27)
We are cleansed by the washing with water as directed by the word. (Eph. 5: 26)
We must be born of water and the Spirit. (John 3: 5)
We are saved by the washing of regeneration. (Titus 3: 5)
As our bodies are washed with pure water, or hearts are sprinkled clean with the blood of Christ. (Heb. 10: 22; 9; 14)
When we obey Jesus, we are sprinkled with His blood. (1 Peter 1; 2)
The clause, "each one of you be baptized," is given in that way to emphasize the necessity of baptism for each and every person to be baptized. (Acts 2: 38)
Cornelius was saved as we all are by the grace of God. (Acts 15: 11) He was ordered to be baptized in water in the name of Christ, as we all are even though he had been baptized with the Spirit. (Acts 10: 44-48) Was that two baptism? The order of event was changed by God to convince the Jewish Christians that the gentiles are acceptable to God. God bless.

plaintalk · Mar 24, 2016

# 147 It is true that those who believe will receive remission of sin; it is not necessarily true that this takes place immediately. For example, Gal. 3: 26 tells us that we are children of God through faith. Does that take place immediately upon believing? No, the next verse begins, "For all of you who were baptized into Christ have been clothed with Christ." (v. 27) Again, John 1: 12 states that those who received Christ by believing in His name are giving the right to become children of God. Obviously, they do not become children immediately upon coming to faith.
The way of salvation and the order of events was established for all, Jews and Gentiles, in Acts 2. The order of events, but not the events themselves, was changed for Cornelius to accomplish God's purpose. We must hear the gospel, believe the gospel, repent and be baptized in the name of Christ and then we receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Acts 16: 31 It is true that those who believe will be saved, but it is only an unsupported assumption that this is immediate. Jesus said, "He who has believed and has been baptized shall be saved. (Mark 16: 15, 16) Upon being baptized (v 33), he set food before Paul and Silas, and rejoiced greatly (v 34) having believed in God (v 34). The rejoicing came after he was baptized and IMO was indicative of salvation. God bless.

notuptome · Mar 24, 2016

plaintalk said:

# 147 It is true that those who believe will receive remission of sin; it is not necessarily true that this takes place immediately. For example, Gal. 3: 26 tells us that we are children of God through faith. Does that take place immediately upon believing? No, the next verse begins, "For all of you who were baptized into Christ have been clothed with Christ." (v. 27) Again, John 1: 12 states that those who received Christ by believing in His name are giving the right to become children of God. Obviously, they do not become children immediately upon coming to faith.
The way of salvation and the order of events was established for all, Jews and Gentiles, in Acts 2. The order of events, but not the events themselves, was changed for Cornelius to accomplish God's purpose. We must hear the gospel, believe the gospel, repent and be baptized in the name of Christ and then we receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Acts 16: 31 It is true that those who believe will be saved, but it is only an unsupported assumption that this is immediate. Jesus said, "He who has believed and has been baptized shall be saved. (Mark 16: 15, 16) Upon being baptized (v 33), he set food before Paul and Silas, and rejoiced greatly (v 34) having believed in God (v 34). The rejoicing came after he was baptized and IMO was indicative of salvation. God bless.

You are teaching a false gospel. You make salvation dependent upon man and not upon Christ.

Salvation is by grace not works. Eph 2:8-9. Salvation is wholly dependent upon what Christ has done not what you suppose we ought to do.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

plaintalk · Mar 24, 2016

#147 "Or do you not know that all of us who were baptized into Christ Jesus have been baptized into His death? (Rom 6: 3)

"For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ." (Gal. 3: 27)

"For by (in) one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were made to drink of one Spirit. (1 Cor. 12: 13)

IMO there is one baptism with two elements just as there is one spiritual birth with two element. (John 3: 5) We can not be born (come out of) water and the Spirit unless we have first been immersed in water and the Spirit. This is just common sense God bless.

notuptome · Mar 24, 2016

plaintalk said:

Until you understand the difference between Spirit baptism and water baptism you will continue in error.

Compare what you teach with what the bible teaches regarding water baptism.

Acts 8:36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?
37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.

Saved before water baptism or not saved at all.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

mailmandan · Mar 24, 2016

plaintalk said:

If you read John 3:5 again, those who have eyes to see, will find that the text does not say "baptism" and one chapter later, Jesus says in verse 10 - "If you knew the gift of God, and who it is who says to you, 'Give Me a drink,' you would have asked Him, and He would have given you living water." In regards to living water, in verse 14, Jesus said - "but whoever drinks of the water that I shall give him will never thirst. But the water that I shall give him will become in him a fountain of water springing up into everlasting life." *Jesus connects this water with eternal life and living water is not water baptism. *Simply reading this verse in context would give one no reason to assume Jesus was speaking of water baptism, unless one was looking to read into the passage a "preconceived idea or theology." *John 3:5 fits perfectly with John 4:10-14.

Getting water baptized is not what magically makes one "become" a disciple. Those who have chosen to become a disciple, a learner, pupil, follower of Christ afterwards get water baptized. Although getting water baptized and observing all that Christ has commanded is a part of discipleship, believers have chosen to become disciples (learners, pupils, followers of Christ) prior to getting water baptized. So you don't baptize unbelievers in order to make them become believers or baptize believers in order to magically make them become disciples, but because they have chosen to become disciples of Christ.

I've already explained Mark 16:16 to you numerous times - He who believes and is baptized will be saved (general cases without making a qualification for the unusual case of someone who believes but is not baptized) but he who does not believe will be condemned. The omission of baptized with "does not believe" shows that Jesus does not make baptism absolutely essential to salvation. Condemnation rests on unbelief, not on a lack of baptism. So salvation rests on belief. NOWHERE does the Bible say "baptized or condemned."

If water baptism is absolutely required for salvation, then why did Jesus not mention it in the following verses? (3:15,16,18; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26). What is the ONE requirement that Jesus mentions 9 different times in each of these complete statements? BELIEVES. *What happened to baptism? *Hermeneutics. John 3:18 - He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who (is not water baptized? - NO) does not believe is condemned already, because he has not (been water baptized? - NO) because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

I just explained Acts 2:38 to you in post #147 and the only logical conclusion "when properly harmonizing Scripture with Scripture" is that faith in Jesus Christ "implied in genuine repentance" (rather than water baptism) brings the remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Spirit (Luke 24:47; Acts 2:38; 3:19; 5:31; 10:43-47; 11:17,18; 15:8,9; 16:31). *Perfect Harmony*

mailmandan · Mar 24, 2016

notuptome said:

Sadly, his whole purpose on CC is to pervert the gospel of Christ (which is the power of God unto salvation to everyone who BELIEVES.. - Romans 1:16) and teach salvation by "water and works."

Amen! Salvation is by grace through faith and is not by water and works.

notuptome said:

Amen! You hit the nail on the head!

posthuman · Mar 24, 2016

our word "baptize" is not a translated word. it is a transliteration of the Greek word "baptizo"

the word literally means "to immerse"

i have found it helpful for understanding properly, if every time we read this word in the scripture, we remember this. obviously the scripture talks about "baptism" in several places where contextually it has nothing at all to do with literal H[SUB]2[/SUB]O.

this is why i said, we need to be immersed in Christ, and that is the only immersion that saves.

mailmandan · Mar 25, 2016

posthuman said:

Amen! One example is in Luke 12:50, in which Jesus said - "But I have a baptism to be baptized with, and how distressed I am till it is accomplished!" Of course Jesus was not distressed about water baptism, but being "immersed" into suffering, namely His sacrificial death on the cross.

Amen! 1 Corinthians 12:13 - For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body--whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free--and have all been made to drink into one Spirit.

mailmandan · Mar 25, 2016

notuptome said:

I recently ran across the OP (SeaBass) on the CARM forums (I occasionally post there) and he was singing the blues about being unfairly banned from CC. He is completely clueless about being a false teacher. He is now terrorizing that Christian forum with his perverted gospel.

integerlost · Mar 25, 2016

SeaBass said:

You only get reborn once. You go through a fiery test and your heart is purified when you come out the other side.

Matthew 3:11 KJV
I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:

ONE BAPTISM - Ephesians 4:5

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