Once saved, always saved

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HeRoseFromTheDead said:
What was the point that you think I could have missed? I think I fully understood the point of the comment and was clarifying that animals/plants and humans don't operate according to the same principals.
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I think the point of that 1-liner was: What do Christians do? They grow. Like a fish swims and like a bird flies, a Christian grows. A fish, that does not swim, is dead. A bird (save, maybe an ostrich), that does not fly, is dead. A Christian, that does not grow, is dead.

I don't think Roger's point was that animals and humans operate according to different principles. This statement is supported by Roger's clarification in the post:

notuptome said:
If one professes to know Christ as Savior and does not grow in the admonition and nurture of the Lord how can they be called Christians?
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BrotherJustin said:
I think the point of that 1-liner was: What do Christians do? They grow. Like a fish swims and like a bird flies, a Christian grows. A fish, that does not swim, is dead. A bird (save, maybe an ostrich), that does not fly, is dead. A Christian, that does not grow, is dead.

I don't think Roger's point was that animals and humans operate according to different principles. This statement is supported by Roger's clarification in the post:
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some people just refuse to look at what someone else says, they need to nit pick it to death to prove they are right, even if what they are nitpicking is due to a misunderstanding of what the person meant, that does not matter.



 
eternally-gratefull said:
some people just refuse to look at what someone else says, they need to nit pick it to death to prove they are right, even if what they are nitpicking is due to a misunderstanding of what the person meant, that does not matter.
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Its just the work based salvation people can't fathom ceasing from their work of "maintaining" and "attaining" their salvation.

There is no misunderstanding. They do it on purpose.

"Yes but what about free-will"?

"Yes but faith without works is dead"


I don't know why the Lord would allow a Christian to think that their works caused or earned their own salvation. He didn't allow me to think that for very long.
 
Grandpa said:
Its just the work based salvation people can't fathom ceasing from their work of "maintaining" and "attaining" their salvation.

There is no misunderstanding. They do it on purpose.

"Yes but what about free-will"?

"Yes but faith without works is dead"


I don't know why the Lord would allow a Christian to think that their works caused or earned their own salvation. He didn't allow me to think that for very long.
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Personally I do not think he does allow it. But like the pharisee, Some people are just blind to it. And no matter how often God tries to show them, they refuse to see it.

God will hold them more accountable at the end, Because they have heard truth and rejected it. and tried to spread their own gospel, claiming it was Christ's Gospel
 
eternally-gratefull said:
Personally I do not think he does allow it. But like the pharisee, Some people are just blind to it. And no matter how often God tries to show them, they refuse to see it.

God will hold them more accountable at the end, Because they have heard truth and rejected it. and tried to spread their own gospel, claiming it was Christ's Gospel
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Self will is the tap root of sin. Self will does not allow Christ to save but interjects itself into the salvation event. Until and unless we surrender our self will to Gods will we cannot be saved. This is why scripture stresses over and over again that salvation is not by the will of man but by the will of God.

Satan said "I will" and that is what Adam said in the garden. I will eat because the woman gave to me. Transgress Gods word because of self will.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
BrotherJustin said:
I think the point of that 1-liner was: What do Christians do? They grow. Like a fish swims and like a bird flies, a Christian grows. A fish, that does not swim, is dead. A bird (save, maybe an ostrich), that does not fly, is dead. A Christian, that does not grow, is dead.

I don't think Roger's point was that animals and humans operate according to different principles. This statement is supported by Roger's clarification in the post:

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That's great. Real Christians grow. Now how do they do that? An animal/plant doesn't ever have to ask that question. What's the practical value of the statement that all Christians grow? That's like saying an oak leaf is green, and if it's brown it's dead.
 
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Grandpa said:
Its just the work based salvation people can't fathom ceasing from their work of "maintaining" and "attaining" their salvation.

There is no misunderstanding. They do it on purpose.

"Yes but what about free-will"?

"Yes but faith without works is dead"


I don't know why the Lord would allow a Christian to think that their works caused or earned their own salvation. He didn't allow me to think that for very long.
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It's not a issue of what causes or earns salvation (how many times will we have to keep repeating this?), but of walking in salvation. A Christian that doesn't walk is dead.
 
notuptome said:
Self will is the tap root of sin. Self will does not allow Christ to save but interjects itself into the salvation event. Until and unless we surrender our self will to Gods will we cannot be saved. This is why scripture stresses over and over again that salvation is not by the will of man but by the will of God.

Satan said "I will" and that is what Adam said in the garden. I will eat because the woman gave to me. Transgress Gods word because of self will.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
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Nay. A will that follows the flesh is the root of sin. Nothing wrong with self-will if it is in agreement with GOD's will.
 
just curious what is a "loving punch"?
BrotherJustin said:
I can't tell if you missed the point, or saw it but wanted to bend it into a new point...

...regardless, I've got the urge to punch you in the face...

...a loving punch--don't fret.
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HeRoseFromTheDead said:
That's great. Real Christians grow. Now how do they do that? An animal/plant doesn't ever have to ask that question. What's the practical value of the statement that all Christians grow? That's like saying an oak leaf is green, and if it's brown it's dead.
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Of what use is a dead Oak? Will it bear fruit or seed? Will it continue to provide shade or nutrition for other species?

Similarly...

Of what use are the words of a dead Christian?

-or-

If I am not growing, am I really a Christian?
 
Noah's ark being an interesting foreshadow of grace ... the ark being comparable to Jesus ... as I read this scripture I thought of this thread.

GENESIS 7

15 And they went in unto Noah into the ark, two and two of all flesh, wherein is the breath of life.
16 And they that went in, went in male and female of all flesh, as God had commanded him: and the Lord shut him in.

Noah did not shut the door (symbol of security) himself ... God did ... I think the door is, interestingly enough, a kind of comparison with the Holy Spirit that SEALS us in adoption.
 
notuptome said:
Self will is the tap root of sin. Self will does not allow Christ to save but interjects itself into the salvation event. Until and unless we surrender our self will to Gods will we cannot be saved. This is why scripture stresses over and over again that salvation is not by the will of man but by the will of God.

Satan said "I will" and that is what Adam said in the garden. I will eat because the woman gave to me. Transgress Gods word because of self will.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
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The flesh is weak, That is why satan can deceive people into self righteousness. That is why scripture says repent. The problem is people water down repentance, Like they water down the law. And we have religion. which has an appearance (form) of godliness, but a religion which denies its power.
 
thepsalmist said:
Noah's ark being an interesting foreshadow of grace ... the ark being comparable to Jesus ... as I read this scripture I thought of this thread.

GENESIS 7

15 And they went in unto Noah into the ark, two and two of all flesh, wherein is the breath of life.
16 And they that went in, went in male and female of all flesh, as God had commanded him: and the Lord shut him in.

Noah did not shut the door (symbol of security) himself ... God did ... I think the door is, interestingly enough, a kind of comparison with the Holy Spirit that SEALS us in adoption.
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Amen sis, to take it even further, Not only did God shut him in after he entered, I doubt noah could have changed his mind to open the ark door and leave once he got it. Noah was sealed until Gods wrath was completed. Then he was let out, to continue to do Gods work
 
thepsalmist said:
Noah's ark being an interesting foreshadow of grace ... the ark being comparable to Jesus ... as I read this scripture I thought of this thread.

GENESIS 7

15 And they went in unto Noah into the ark, two and two of all flesh, wherein is the breath of life.
16 And they that went in, went in male and female of all flesh, as God had commanded him: and the Lord shut him in.

Noah did not shut the door (symbol of security) himself ... God did ... I think the door is, interestingly enough, a kind of comparison with the Holy Spirit that SEALS us in adoption.
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Amen my friend!:)

As you keep studying the Bible, you will keep seeing how secure we are in Christ! I thought of this verse when I read the part you wrote "and the Lord shut him in":

"For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God." Col 3:3
 
HeRoseFromTheDead said:
Nay. A will that follows the flesh is the root of sin. Nothing wrong with self-will if it is in agreement with GOD's will.
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You are determined not to see. The truth is before you and your self will prevents you from seeing it. Self will is never in agreement with Gods will.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
eternally-gratefull said:
Amen sis, to take it even further, Not only did God shut him in after he entered, I doubt noah could have changed his mind to open the ark door and leave once he got it. Noah was sealed until Gods wrath was completed. Then he was let out, to continue to do Gods work
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And what did Noah do when he was let out? He planted a vineyard, got drunk and naked.:)
 
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