A Scriptural Conclusion

theStudent · May 5, 2016

I totally agree. No unclean person can enter heaven.
God is the one who chooses them.

For one thing they will be judging those on th earth.

Luke 22:
28 Ye are they which have continued with me in my temptations.
29 And I appoint unto you a kingdom, as my Father hath appointed unto me;
30 That ye may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

Matthew 19:
28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

Zmouth · May 5, 2016

JustWhoIAm said:

Kinda ironic the king being furious considering free will and all...

JustWhoIAm said:

I gave my unawares to the one who said he was called to the wedding and didn't have anything to wear...

theStudent · May 5, 2016

But if persons go to heaven to be judges, who are the twelve tribes of Israel that they will be judging?

theStudent · May 5, 2016

Zmouth said:

But I think you would be furious if you hired someone to paint your house cream, and you came back and found a deep blue house. I would be furious, and I wouldn't recommend him to anyone.

theStudent · May 5, 2016

Did any one find it interesting that persons are taken to heaven, yet they will be judging persons on the earth.

They will also rule the earth as kings, and serve the people as priest.

Revelation 5:
10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

Revelation 20:
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Willie-T · May 5, 2016

theStudent said:

This is one of the chief reasons I cannot just take many things at the "face value" of our human interpretation... such as "Heaven" being a literal "Location", a huge mansion on a cloud somewhere.

garee · May 5, 2016

theStudent said:

I would offer, because it is the saints that are here that are reigning with Christ and not the saints in heaven asleep, the judgement or salt is the truth of God that we offer to one another. It is represented by the twelve tribes. Twelve as a metaphor in that sense represent the bride of Christ. Just as in the same way would the twelve apostles represent the same bride. Twelve seems to represent the authority of God in lieu of what is in view.

theStudent · May 5, 2016

Willie-T said:

garee said:

This is exactly what I was talking about guys, Nobody used a scripture.

theStudent · May 5, 2016

If it's an interpretation, we should be able to use scripture to challenge it. Don't you agree?

Willie-T · May 5, 2016

theStudent said:

You shouldn't even have to in many cases such as this.

We all know of the many times Jesus spoke of the kingdom either "being now", being here", "being upon us" or a number of other things like that..... yet we will seize upon a verse we think is describing a habitat of metal and jewels, and claim we have found the city God lives in. This is kind of dangerously childish in its approach.

I, long ago, learned to cease thinking only in selected verses, but rather to think in full, coordinated concepts put forward by a compilation of numerous passages. We have a tendency to search for individual verses that will state a "fact" to us in a documented , declarative statement. Oftentimes such things just do not exist... or if we find something we force to mean a particular thing, we have often done so in the error of our ignorance of many other times that same subject was alluded to in other passages.

theStudent · May 5, 2016

Willie-T said:

I would prefer to use scripture to make a point, than to use none at all.
Isn't that how Jesus' disciples did it.

When the Jews got angry with Jesus, and wanted to stone him, it was because he used scripture.
Many times they could not say a reply to him, yet they refused to learn from him.

What got Stephen killed?
It was his ability to use scripture. If says:
Acts 6:
10 And they were not able to resist the wisdom and the spirit by which he spake.

And they got angry and stoned him to death.

They stoned Paul and others, because they spoke the truth from scripture.

Didn't that reveal, what was really in their hearts?

notuptome · May 5, 2016

What shall I call a place of outer darkness where there is weeping and wailing and gnashing of teeth? A place where the worm dieth not.

Mat 22:18, Mark 9:44

I go to be where Jesus is so what shall I call that place?

How shall I contrast these two vastly different places?

For the cause of Christ
Roger

John 14

theStudent · May 5, 2016

notuptome said:

Good scripture, and good question, bro.

Mark 9:
42 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
44 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
45 And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
46 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
47 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
49 For every one shall be salted with fire, and every sacrifice shall be salted with salt.ites?

Magenta made refference to Gehenna earlier.

I could give you the information, but it would be better if you researched Gehenna for yourself.
When you are finished, you could ask the question - Which fire in the bible is not quenched, and what is that fire? Is it not the lake of fire, where everything that is bad in God's eyes, goes?

An earlier post referred to that.
I will get those scriptures for you.

theStudent · May 5, 2016

Revelation 20:
10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Matthew 25:
45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.
46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

theStudent · May 5, 2016

We got this question cleared then.

The purpose for going to heaven is to be kings, priest and judges, with the great king, judge, and high priest Jesus Christ. Jesus chose them to be with him, because of their faithfully sticking to him.

When Jesus rules the earth he will have persons who have been taken from the earth, beside him who are just like him.

Hebrews 4:
14 Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession.

Revelation reveal who the twelve tribes of Israel are.
It's not a literal nation, but it is a spiritual nation.
After showing that the ones who go to heaven are taken out of this nation, it says:

Revelation 7:
9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;
10 And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb.
11 And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God,
12 Saying, Amen: Blessing, and glory, and wisdom, and thanksgiving, and honour, and power, and might, be unto our God for ever and ever. Amen.
13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?
14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
15 Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them.
16 They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat.
17 For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.
Revelation 21:1-4

Daniel 7:
13 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him.
14 And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.
27 And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.

The twelve tribes of Israel then are the nations God promised to bless by means of Abraham.
Genesis 22:
18 And in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice.

And the blessings are described in one of my previous post, "What will happen to the earth?",
where the bible described how the earth will be blessed, returning to the state the garden of Eden was before Adam and Eve sinned.

Isaiah 11:
6 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.
7 And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together: and the lion shall eat straw like the ox.
8 And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the cockatrice' den.
9 They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord, as the waters cover the sea.

Isaiah 65:
21 And they shall build houses, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and eat the fruit of them.
22 They shall not build, and another inhabit; they shall not plant, and another eat: for as the days of a tree are the days of my people, and mine elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands.
23 They shall not labour in vain, nor bring forth for trouble; for they are the seed of the blessed of the Lord, and their offspring with them.
24 And it shall come to pass, that before they call, I will answer; and while they are yet speaking, I will hear.
25 The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust shall be the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the Lord.

Psalms 37:
9 For evildoers shall be cut off: but those that wait upon the Lord, they shall inherit the earth.
10 For yet a little while, and the wicked shall not be: yea, thou shalt diligently consider his place, and it shall not be.
11 But the meek shall inherit the earth; and shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace.

So that we would no longer need to pray as Jesus told us at Matthew 6:10, 11, because God's will will be done on earth, as it is in heaven. Heaven, and earth will be one, completely under God's control.
Ephesians 1:
9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:
10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:

With Satan and his partners gone, people will no longer be at war, but the whole earth will rest in peace. This is what God will do.

Isn't that something wonderful to look forward to.
I am eagerly looking forward to it, and working towards it.

NayborBear · May 5, 2016

theStudent said:

Tis been my expierience, and, from what I've seen/read from being on this particular site, that several "posters" (myself included), have (if I may use the term) "landed" here, from having been on "other" christian sites. And, yanno?.......It's like leading a horse to water, inasmuch as I can tell you a thing is real, I can show you how I got to a certain place, or conclusion. Some of these "conclusions" (if you will) are of a quite "meaty" nature. Not for "milky" christians. which is just one reason why a person who visits here, might come away with not much help, and may well end up being more confused, then when they came here. This particular site, is much more "tolerant", of these (in some cases) widely varied "conclusion/s" (I, myself, like to refer to conclusions, as "connecting dots") Methinks, an "illustration" may be in order. The Apostle Paul, tells us, that we are "to be Priests, of Jesus Christ". (if a quote like this, in your eyes, mandates "the chapter and verse reference", then, read no further, cuz ya ain't even gonna get this next part). In the Psalms, does not God the Father, say unto God the Son, that He IS a Priest, forever, after the order of Melchizedek? So, in connecting this dot, with Paul's "dot", of being priest's OF Jesus Christ, the connecting OF these two dots, sez (to me, anyways), that we are also priests after this same order of Melchizedek! correct? NOW, I can say this, and I showed ya that it is indeed biblical, however, I cannot aid you further in your "talent" to "see" that! Only the Father can do this! And, the only way to the Father, is by way of His only begotton Son, Jesus Christ.

Even Paul himself, didn't chew this up for "believers", although, this same reference is made more then a coupla times in the New Testament! Are ya wondering why? Cuz, I know ya didn't quit reading

. Cuz, they weren't even grasping that the Covenant had changed! Even though Paul talked till he was blue in the face, trying to teach this. They didn't get it. Yet, they were wanting to know more! And, Paul gave them more, yet, he wouldn't crunch that up for them.

Some things, are common for believer's, and acceptors of Jesus Christ. Other things, like eyes to see and ears to hear, things that are not common, must be earned! High/er level "security issues", not to mention one's person, or family, are at stake! Or? "How can one stop an avalanche, when a single snowball knocks ya over?"

This is the way I view this particular Christian site! I suspect, I am not alone.

If one visits here seeking reassurance, and/or comfort? There are rooms on this site for precisely that. If ya wanna talk politics?....Ya, there's a room for that also. If ya wanna talk/discuss the Bible, and its teachings? OH!!.......That's this room, isn't it?

thepsalmist · May 5, 2016

theStudent said:

- or if you will, A Scriptural Challenge.
That what I want to put forth.

Often people visit these Bible Study; Bible Discussion; Bible Board... etc., forums and leave disappointed.
Why? Because, a question seldom ends with a Bible conclusion.
They continue, and continue, with many conclusions that do not mention one scipture. And if a scripture is mentioned, it's sometimes followed by more than 50 words - half of which do not even refer to the scripture given.
Then a person has to dig through a multitude of post only to realize they can't find the topic that was started.

Are we really interested in the word of God, or how long we can debate?
People visit these forums everyday, looking for answers..., and go away with nothing.
Do we realize how many lost souls come looking to you guys for help?
I was on a thread where someone was asking for scripture to back up statements, and you know, that was warming to my heart.
Sometimes, though, sad to say, a person demands a scripture, and when given, they ignore it.
How pleasant it would be to a tired soul, if the Bible spoke more than we did.
I'm sure at the end of the day, more people would go away satisfied - either because they learned something, got something cleared up, taught someone something, or just basically comforted or reasusred someone.
Or are we like those priest that starved the people?

I want to put this challenge out to all who are so into Christ. (He said feed his little sheep.)
I have a number of questions.
Can you use the Bible to answer, and give a brief explanation for using that scripture?
Can you if challenging that explanation, use a scripture, along with a brief explanation, without being un-Christ-like?
Can you if challenged, use a scripture, along with a brief explanation, without being un-Christ-like?

Here is my first question:

What is Hell, and Who created it?

Hell is a complete absence of God.

theStudent · May 5, 2016

NayborBear said:

You said so much. I am not sure what to say. Priest of Christ?
And the gospel must first be published among all nations. - Mark 13:10
Even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many. - Matthew 20:28

But regarding milk and meat.
I have seen parents feed their babies meat (physical), as soon as they had teeth.
Of course they broke it down for them.

I have also seen parents break down spiritual meat, and feed it to the children, and they digested it so well, that they had no need of milk anymore.

1 Corinthians 3:
And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
2 I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?

Hebrews 5:
11 Of whom we have many things to say, and hard to be uttered, seeing ye are dull of hearing.
12 For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.
13 For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe.
14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

Children - imagine that!

Zmouth · May 5, 2016

Willie-T said:

That's rich, seems one would drop right through a cloud like a lead zeppelin if they build their mansion on a cloud. Heck I hear that building one on sand isn't much better. I don't see too good but it looks like there are other planets out there. So one of those planets is where I would think the Mansion would be build upon if we are to be resurrected in the flesh anew.

As far a literal 'heaven' I don't know how you get much more literal than the scriptural references given in Genesis 1.

All you have to do is look up at the sky at night all that space is the expanse called heaven in Genesis 1:1.
Check out the verse about the night sky in the Eagles song "Already Gone'

Now the cloud that the LORD covered the earth with like a garment according to the Book of Job is the firmament Genesis 1:8 was also called Heaven. Of course good luck breathing without one.
That would be more an Isley Bro. song

Willie-T · May 5, 2016

Zmouth said:

That's rich, seems one would drop right through a cloud like a lead zeppelin if they build their mansion on a cloud. Heck I hear that building one on sand isn't much better. I don't see too good but it looks like there are other planets out there. So one of those planets is where I would think the Mansion would be build upon if we are to be resurrected in the flesh anew.

As far a literal 'heaven' I don't know how you get much more literal than the scriptural references given in Genesis 1.

All you have to do is look up at the sky at night all that space is the expanse called heaven in Genesis 1:1.
Check out the verse about the night sky in the Eagles song "Already Gone'

Now the cloud that the LORD covered the earth with like a garment according to the Book of Job is the firmament Genesis 1:8 was also called Heaven. Of course good luck breathing without one.
That would be more an Isley Bro. song

The Mormons have already identified the planet their god lives on, and have given it a name.

A Scriptural Conclusion

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