Repentance: A Boast in the Flesh

[BenFTW]

I have a simple question for you who think repentance is simply a turning from sin. VVhen you pray to the Lord and tell Him, "Lord I'm sorry for what I've done. I won't do it again, ever. I am so so sorry." are you capable of fulfilling this promise? This oath? Or is it empty? How often have you repented of a particular sin but you continue to repeat it again and again? So then, tell me, what good does your form of repentance serve you when you're still stuck in the same sin over and over again? VVhere is the power in this repentance? VVhat good are the tears, sulking, and show when you are incapable in your flesh to fulfill this promise to God?

That is the way I see your repentance. People have been attacking hyper-grace and saying that its a license to sin (which is false) and also disagreeing with its presentation of repentance ("a change of mind"). Yet, my question is, what good is your repentance? Hasn't history shown the fruit of the traditional concept of repentance? It is void of confidence before the Lord, assurance in salvation, and the love of God (and the grace of God). In some ways it actually completely ignores what Jesus accomplished at the cross. Confession of sin for the sake of forgiveness? Has Christ died in vain? Did not His shed blood give you the remission of your sins?

There is so much more than meets the eye when it comes to repentance. It is tainted with religion and self righteousness. It tries to acknowledge Jesus, but treats His blood as if common. Incapable of doing that which God set out to do. Granting us forgiveness, taking our sins away and justifying us before God. Jesus being able as our High Priest to save us completely. All of this is tossed aside for a concept of repentance that deals with sin confession as if it maintains salvation. That is where people should truly repent. Change your mind about sin confession for forgiveness because it misses the mark that is Christ Jesus on that cross paying for your sins. You are forgiven, it is not something you seek. It is found in Christ.

This could go on for another couple paragraphs to define repentance, but I will keep it short. Repentance happens daily, it is through mind renewal. It is, after all, a change of mind. It is coming into agreement with God (yes, even about your sins) and then coming into the reality that Jesus has set you free from sin because you're a new creation. Also too, under grace sin's dominion is broken. So the accusation of licentiousness (license to sin) is unfounded because people are explicitly stating that we are set free from it and are dead to it. VVe don't ignore sin. VVe turn to God for His strength. VVe repent in that of growing in the grace and knowledge of Jesus Christ. In Him is victory found.

 

[BenFTW]

There may be a sense of annoyance in the first paragraph because I am tired of people making accusations of licentiousness to God loving and righteous Christians. They accuse them of living like heathens with a license to sin, and defame them, accusing them of disobeying God and ignoring the Holy Spirit. That is tiring and wrong, they even dismiss them as brethren saying their father is the devil.

These things go unchecked and then we have groups opposing one another instead of being unified. How can we even find common ground when we consider one another to not even be in Christ? Fellow children of God, albeit one part may be sincerely wrong? VVhere is the meekness and correction there? Forget teaching in meekness, just toss them aside. Is that the witness we want to give off to others?

 

[GraceDefined]

I agree that we cannot use grace as a "cloak of maliciousness". Actually, I agree with pretty much everything you said. However, I believe that we should confess our "trespasses" as directed by the Lord in His example of prayer in the Gospels. We are told that if we sin to be instant in prayer. I believe this is the reason Christ acts as our advocate.
No Debate, Nothing Complicated,

GraceDefined.

 

[mpaper345]

As long as a person is led of the Spirit,they are right with God.

I say that because we tend to come across as if our disagreements,cause some to not be able to led of the Spirit.

As long as a person has the capacity to be led of the Spirit,they can be led of the Spirit,if they desire,and then they would be right with God.

An example is people that go back and forth with not saved by works,and saved by works,but both despite what position they take has the capacity to be able to be led of the Spirit,and if so they can be led of the Spirit,despite their disagreement,so their disagreement does not hinder either one from being saved,for if you are led of the Spirit,you are going to take the right position,regardless of what you believe.

If you believe not saved by works,if you are led of the Spirit,you are going to to the works anyway,which are of the Spirit,they just do not believe it will save them,but they will do them anyway,for they are led of the Spirit.

No man comes to the Son unless the Father draws them.

No man can say Jesus is Lord,except by the Holy Spirit.

When Peter said to Jesus,you are the Christ,the Son of the living God,Jesus said that flesh and blood did not reveal that to Peter,but the Father.

The Bible says whoever confesses Jesus is come in the flesh is of God.

Which whatever people believe,if it is in error,and they believe these things stated above,which means it can only happen by the Holy Spirit,and is of God,would have to have the capacity to be able to be led of the Spirit,therefore they can be saved.

Because both people that believe not saved by works,and saved by works,believe those things stated above,so both have the capacity to be able to be led of the Spirit,which this is an example,and some beliefs we might have in error does not hinder us from being able to be led if the Spirit,so why look at each other like it is not possible for the other to have the Spirit,which is all you need to be saved.

We would not be this far to be able to confess Jesus is come in the flesh,that He is Lord,God manifest in the flesh,and the Savior of the world,if God was not operating in our life,and if God is operating in our life,then we can have the Spirit,for no one says Jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit,and Jesus is Christ,which can only be revealed by the Father.

So if we believe those things above,then we should not let our little disagreements get in the way of not getting along,and looking at other people that believe the above,as if they cannot be right with God,sometimes we just do not get certain things in the Bible,but not all wrong beliefs have an impact on our not being able to be saved,that is why the Bible says to study the Bible,and search the scriptures,for if we knew all,we would not have to do those things.

Rev 2:24 But unto you I say, and unto the rest in Thyatira, as many as have not this doctrine, and which have not known the depths of Satan, as they speak; I will put upon you none other burden.
Rev 2:25 But that which ye have already hold fast till I come.

These people could not get to an understanding of some things in the Bible,but Jesus said hold fast to whatever you do have.

There is denominations preaching conflicting doctrines,that cause people to disagree with each other,and some might not be able to understand the truth of some things,for that denomination made it so convincing of their doctrine,and they never could come across it on their own,but Jesus said hold fast to what you do have,and we believe the main things concerning the Bible,that cause us to be able to receive the Spirit,so our little differences should not separate us.

As long as we have those beliefs stated above,we have the capacity to be able to be led of the Spirit.

 

[ladylynn]

As long as a person is led of the Spirit,they are right with God.

I say that because we tend to come across as if our disagreements,cause some to not be able to led of the Spirit.

As long as a person has the capacity to be led of the Spirit,they can be led of the Spirit,if they desire,and then they would be right with God.

An example is people that go back and forth with not saved by works,and saved by works,but both despite what position they take has the capacity to be able to be led of the Spirit,and if so they can be led of the Spirit,despite their disagreement,so their disagreement does not hinder either one from being saved,for if you are led of the Spirit,you are going to take the right position,regardless of what you believe.

If you believe not saved by works,if you are led of the Spirit,you are going to to the works anyway,which are of the Spirit,they just do not believe it will save them,but they will do them anyway,for they are led of the Spirit.

No man comes to the Son unless the Father draws them.

No man can say Jesus is Lord,except by the Holy Spirit.

When Peter said to Jesus,you are the Christ,the Son of the living God,Jesus said that flesh and blood did not reveal that to Peter,but the Father.

The Bible says whoever confesses Jesus is come in the flesh is of God.

Which whatever people believe,if it is in error,and they believe these things stated above,which means it can only happen by the Holy Spirit,and is of God,would have to have the capacity to be able to be led of the Spirit,therefore they can be saved.

Because both people that believe not saved by works,and saved by works,believe those things stated above,so both have the capacity to be able to be led of the Spirit,which this is an example,and some beliefs we might have in error does not hinder us from being able to be led if the Spirit,so why look at each other like it is not possible for the other to have the Spirit,which is all you need to be saved.

We would not be this far to be able to confess Jesus is come in the flesh,that He is Lord,God manifest in the flesh,and the Savior of the world,if God was not operating in our life,and if God is operating in our life,then we can have the Spirit,for no one says Jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit,and Jesus is Christ,which can only be revealed by the Father.

So if we believe those things above,then we should not let our little disagreements get in the way of not getting along,and looking at other people that believe the above,as if they cannot be right with God,sometimes we just do not get certain things in the Bible,but not all wrong beliefs have an impact on our not being able to be saved,that is why the Bible says to study the Bible,and search the scriptures,for if we knew all,we would not have to do those things.

Rev 2:24 But unto you I say, and unto the rest in Thyatira, as many as have not this doctrine, and which have not known the depths of Satan, as they speak; I will put upon you none other burden.
Rev 2:25 But that which ye have already hold fast till I come.

These people could not get to an understanding of some things in the Bible,but Jesus said hold fast to whatever you do have.

There is denominations preaching conflicting doctrines,that cause people to disagree with each other,and some might not be able to understand the truth of some things,for that denomination made it so convincing of their doctrine,and they never could come across it on their own,but Jesus said hold fast to what you do have,and we believe the main things concerning the Bible,that cause us to be able to receive the Spirit,so our little differences should not separate us.

As long as we have those beliefs stated above,we have the capacity to be able to be led of the Spirit.

I agree that even when we born again believers (sons and daughters) are off on our Bible knowledge and even our faith., Jesus is still our Advocate and He continues forever that way regardless of our stupidity. But it matters big time for us and our walk here on earth and our rewards when we do get to heaven.

Believing 'rightly' has an impact on how much peace and joy and victory we walk in while here on our "Pilgrim journey". There are many sour Christians who, although they got saved, they have yet to learn about the love (grace) of God in Christ. It effects everything they see and do and say and HAVE. Just as much as those who are off on their own man made religious happiness cloud without knowledge of the truth of doctrine since proper doctrine will properly align with the kind of gracious love God has in Christ for them. And it will hold them up during times of the fiery darts getting thrown at them from the enemy. sin., and the world. God wants us to be equipped and on a solid foundation of the truth.



But I will go along with what the Bible says in 1 Corinthians 13 about love. Without that MAJOR KEY ingredient., the Christian is lacking big time. Because if we have that right., all the rest will fall into place. Marriages and families here on earth are made to function this way too. If the family has learned about what having a sort of unconditional love for each other means., and the kids are raised in that kind of love., that child can grow up with a healthy advantage over someone who didn't have that kind of instruction on loving in a family. We all know how the loved child is able to over come many obstacles life will throw their way when they have the love of family. And that is just a cheap 'knock off' of what God's love (grace) is.

Imagine what the real love of God in Christ can do for a life!! That is why i believe there is not much power in some of the churches today to walk in wisdom and knowledge having the gifts Jesus gave the church and meant for us to have. People don't believe God loves them that much and will actually do what His Word says. In religion., we make excuses for "God" not answering our prayers. If the Bible truth we read isn't coming out in our lives the way we think it should., we change the meaning of the verses so not to be disappointed in God.

We don't ask Him for things for fear we will be disappointed. It always comes down to man looking at himself first and not to God first in Christ. Love is why He came and all we have and do comes from God's love to us and in us and through us. I posted this in another thread but it also applies here too.
1 Corinthians 13:1-13

13 If I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but have not [SUP][a][/SUP]love [for others growing out of God’s love for me], then I have become only a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal [just an annoying distraction]. [SUP]2 [/SUP]And if I have the gift of prophecy [and speak a new message from God to the people], and understand all mysteries, and [possess] all knowledge; and if I have all [sufficient] faith so that I can remove mountains, but do not have love [reaching out to others], I am nothing. [SUP]3 [/SUP]If I give all my possessions to feed the poor, and if I surrender my body [SUP][b][/SUP]to be burned, but do not have love, it does me no good at all.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Love endures with patience and serenity, love is kind and thoughtful, and is not jealous or envious; love does not brag and is not proud or arrogant. [SUP]5 [/SUP]It is not rude; it is not self-seeking, it is not provoked [nor overly sensitive and easily angered]; it does not take into account a wrong endured. [SUP]6 [/SUP]It does not rejoice at injustice, but rejoices with the truth [when right and truth prevail]. [SUP]7 [/SUP]Love bears all things [regardless of what comes], believes all things [looking for the best in each one], hopes all things [remaining steadfast during difficult times], endures all things [without weakening].
[SUP]8 [/SUP]Love never fails [it never fades nor ends]. But as for prophecies, they will pass away; as for tongues, they will cease; as for the gift of special knowledge, it will pass away. [SUP]9 [/SUP]For we know in part, and we prophesy in part [for our knowledge is fragmentary and incomplete]. [SUP]10 [/SUP]But when that which is complete and perfect comes, that which is incomplete and partial will pass away. [SUP]11 [/SUP]When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child; when I became a man, I did away with childish things. [SUP]12 [/SUP]For now [in this time of imperfection] we see in a mirror dimly [a blurred reflection, a riddle, an enigma], but then [when the time of perfection comes we will see reality] face to face. Now I know in part [just in fragments], but then I will know fully, just as I have been fully known [by God]. [SUP]13 [/SUP]And now there remain: faith [abiding trust in God and His promises], hope [confident expectation of eternal salvation], love [unselfish love for others growing out of God’s love for me], these three [the choicest graces]; but the greatest of these is love.



If we are standing on the truth of His love for us in Christ and know it is because of Jesus we have anything and everything., God will honor that in our lives and bring us and give us more truth.

 

[ladylynn]

I have a simple question for you who think repentance is simply a turning from sin. VVhen you pray to the Lord and tell Him, "Lord I'm sorry for what I've done. I won't do it again, ever. I am so so sorry." are you capable of fulfilling this promise? This oath? Or is it empty? How often have you repented of a particular sin but you continue to repeat it again and again? So then, tell me, what good does your form of repentance serve you when you're still stuck in the same sin over and over again? VVhere is the power in this repentance? VVhat good are the tears, sulking, and show when you are incapable in your flesh to fulfill this promise to God?

That is the way I see your repentance. People have been attacking hyper-grace and saying that its a license to sin (which is false) and also disagreeing with its presentation of repentance ("a change of mind"). Yet, my question is, what good is your repentance? Hasn't history shown the fruit of the traditional concept of repentance? It is void of confidence before the Lord, assurance in salvation, and the love of God (and the grace of God). In some ways it actually completely ignores what Jesus accomplished at the cross. Confession of sin for the sake of forgiveness? Has Christ died in vain? Did not His shed blood give you the remission of your sins?

There is so much more than meets the eye when it comes to repentance. It is tainted with religion and self righteousness. It tries to acknowledge Jesus, but treats His blood as if common. Incapable of doing that which God set out to do. Granting us forgiveness, taking our sins away and justifying us before God. Jesus being able as our High Priest to save us completely. All of this is tossed aside for a concept of repentance that deals with sin confession as if it maintains salvation. That is where people should truly repent. Change your mind about sin confession for forgiveness because it misses the mark that is Christ Jesus on that cross paying for your sins. You are forgiven, it is not something you seek. It is found in Christ.

This could go on for another couple paragraphs to define repentance, but I will keep it short. Repentance happens daily, it is through mind renewal. It is, after all, a change of mind. It is coming into agreement with God (yes, even about your sins) and then coming into the reality that Jesus has set you free from sin because you're a new creation. Also too, under grace sin's dominion is broken. So the accusation of licentiousness (license to sin) is unfounded because people are explicitly stating that we are set free from it and are dead to it. VVe don't ignore sin. VVe turn to God for His strength. VVe repent in that of growing in the grace and knowledge of Jesus Christ. In Him is victory found.

If we could just get out of God's way, life would be awesome! Our man made religion and ideas about God and how we perceive Him to be - bigger versions of "us" . THIS is another stumbling block for us. God is bigger than what we first heard about Him even though we may respect and admire the Christians that brought us to the truth of the Gospel. We may feel so much awe for that man or woman of God that shared Christ with us and lived and is living a good Christian life that we can't imagine they are wrong about something.

Getting ourselves and our ideas (and other people's) ideas about Jesus out of the way would sure make major head-way in our Christian lives. Religion is so afraid to presume upon God's amazing love for us. So much so that GRACE is a foreign concept to most Christians even. Repentance to most believers is just as you posted here in your opening Ben.
Can we BE sorry enough to rid ourselves of our prone-ness to wander and sin? NOOO. God isn't impressed with our tears or our wailing in regret and remorse. That is such a religious idea. As a catholic, we were taught to admire and imitate people that bloodied their knees and suffered and whipped themselves sort of like Jesus was flogged by the Roman soldiers. Actually i think many of us Christians have a lot of catholic in us.

We can't obey in our own effort. We NEED the power of the Holy Spirit to change into the sons Christ made us to be. It's a co-laboring effort with us and the Holy Spirit. Sure, many people can diet or make life style changes but in order to really be a different person doing things with a right heart, it has to be due to the inner working of the Holy Spirit as we properly "repent" of our old ways and actually walk INTO what Christ died to give and make us. Sons.

We already ARE Sons. Now we have to work OUT what Jesus worked IN. We work from a place of victory. Many believers don't grasp this because they are sooooooo afraid dare see themselves as already made righteous IN Christ. Christians don't all know that righteousness is a GIFT.,to take what is freely given. We humans have such a hard time actually believing Jesus did THAT MUCH FOR US. Not only did He save us from judgment but HE already MADE US NEW CREATIONS. The problem is many believers lack the understanding of who we have been made INTO. So we can't possibly walk it out because we are and have been too busy working FOR IT.

Oh what a mess the human mind is. But God made a way of escape for THAT TOO!!! He gave us POWER and LOVE and a SOUND MIND. But we have to believe He first gave it to us in order to try and walk it out. The average Christian will fight tooth and nail for the right to be unworthy of His love.
(grace) Even to the degree of denying the love of God (grace) in Christ. Calling it lasciviousness.

They say don't you realize how dangerous that kind of 'grace' is? grace just cannot be what God gave us and since the Bible has so much to say about God's judgment on sin., they won't believe judgment is gone!!, there is TOOOOOO much at stake! our SOULS!!

But many believers have yet to step out on to the water and begin walking on it believing JESUS PAID IT ALL and He will hold them up while we walk on water (sort of speak) Walking in the FREEDOM of their redemption! Our souls are already safe because of Him.

We will only gain if we believe He took all our sins and judgment on Himself when He died on the cross. God is pleased when we honor His Son this way and put NO confidence in our flesh. Repentance is agreeing with God and the exercise of putting on the mind of Christ each day and putting off our own minds ideas each day. This is NOT easy when we first begin. It IS like walking on water because we feel so out of our element. But in reality we are right in His and when we make the bread from "religion" of men on to FAITH., things will begin to work.

 

[disciplemike]

your title is not good. are you saying to repent is a boast in the flesh? that is certainly not Biblical, if that is what you are saying.

 

[ladylynn]

your title is not good. are you saying to repent is a boast in the flesh? that is certainly not Biblical, if that is what you are saying.

This kind of repentance that the OP is talking about is of the lasting and real kind. As sheep of His pasture., the Good Shepherd does it all and we follow as sheep. It is not our job to find the green pastures., it's not our job to meet our own needs. It's HIS The Good Shepherd.

He has already secured for us forgiveness IN Him. We have it. Now we walk IN this newness of life through the power of the Holy Spirit each day by following our Good Shepherd Jesus who clears the way for us daily. Read Psalm 23 and be blessed. When we repent., it means we agree to believe His way and not our flesh's way. That is true repentance that comes from the HolySpirit that brings lasting and real change because we are walking out who we are IN Christ.

 

[seed_time_harvest]

your title is not good. are you saying to repent is a boast in the flesh? that is certainly not Biblical, if that is what you are saying.

When we got saved,GOD forgave us of our sins and when HE forgave us,It only took one time.

Remember the spirit was made perfect(Hebrews 12:23),not the flesh.So then when we ask for forgiveness again after GOD has forgiven us,the spirit that GOD Is looking at was not participating In that sin,because It was made perfect.

but If the person wants to continue asking for forgiveness when they sin after GOD has forgiven them,then they are not being conscious of their right standing before GOD but being more conscious of their fleshy feelings.

The person wants to feel forgiven Instead of believing they are forgiven and thats why asking over and over Is fleshy.

IMO people have the wrong Interpretation of
1st John 1:9
King James Version(KJV)

9.)If we confess our sins, HE is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
+++
GOD died once and for all and those that were forgiven,their spirits were made perfect.

 

[p_rehbein]

It will take too long to explain my thoughts on this, and I'd just get in trouble again for doing so (with some of my friends) .

Maybe later, when my thoughts are more organized than they currently are, as they are sporadic at best currently due to the medications I am taking, I will post my thoughts.

But, I have enjoyed reading the comments already posted, and I do think this is a worthwhile discussion, but, I do not believe any minds/hearts here will be changed to any great degree, simply because most here are steadfast in their belief and understanding of Scripture as is.

Not saying that is right or wrong, or good or bad, just saying.......

 

[Willie-T]

My congregation did this little video on "Communion Misconceptions" a few years back...... but the part Sgt. D. Ceiver does at the end of the video can well apply to the morbid ritual we have made of repentance.
[video=youtube;Ph8hdlHmzpU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ph8hdlHmzpU[/video]

 

[UnderGrace]

I share in your annoyance Ben, the annoyance I feel is not personal, it stems from the assault that is taking place on Jesus and the absolute clear truth of scripture.

If one thinks repentance is crying and weeping in some corner and feeling contrite for your sins, well that may not be enough contrition because look how much Jesus endured perhaps some self-flagellation is order!

Does anyone think they can add to what Jesus has done? It is absolutely a boast in the flesh!

I do not need to know Greek to understand that repentance it not about contrition, but the Catholic Church of which I was a former member has done a good job making that and it just keeps coming back through the years even after the reformation, thereby keeping people in bondage to guilt and shame.

Feeling sorrow and contrite is basing your walk on your emotions, not on what God said He has done and certainly not on His Grace.
What pleases God is agreeing with Him that He did it all.

Our sorrow does not release God' grace in our lives it is believing on the finished work on the cross that pleases God.

Thank you Ben!

There may be a sense of annoyance in the first paragraph because I am tired of people making accusations of licentiousness to God loving and righteous Christians. They accuse them of living like heathens with a license to sin, and defame them, accusing them of disobeying God and ignoring the Holy Spirit. That is tiring and wrong, they even dismiss them as brethren saying their father is the devil.

These things go unchecked and then we have groups opposing one another instead of being unified. How can we even find common ground when we consider one another to not even be in Christ? Fellow children of God, albeit one part may be sincerely wrong? VVhere is the meekness and correction there? Forget teaching in meekness, just toss them aside. Is that the witness we want to give off to others?

 

[UnderGrace]

Beautiful Sister. Just beautiful!

This kind of repentance that the OP is talking about is of the lasting and real kind. As sheep of His pasture., the Good Shepherd does it all and we follow as sheep. It is not our job to find the green pastures., it's not our job to meet our own needs. It's HIS The Good Shepherd.

He has already secured for us forgiveness IN Him. We have it. Now we walk IN this newness of life through the power of the Holy Spirit each day by following our Good Shepherd Jesus who clears the way for us daily. Read Psalm 23 and be blessed. When we repent., it means we agree to believe His way and not our flesh's way. That is true repentance that comes from the HolySpirit that brings lasting and real change because we are walking out who we are IN Christ.

 

[WarriorForChrist]

I have a simple question for you who think repentance is simply a turning from sin. VVhen you pray to the Lord and tell Him, "Lord I'm sorry for what I've done. I won't do it again, ever. I am so so sorry." are you capable of fulfilling this promise? This oath? Or is it empty? How often have you repented of a particular sin but you continue to repeat it again and again? So then, tell me, what good does your form of repentance serve you when you're still stuck in the same sin over and over again? VVhere is the power in this repentance? VVhat good are the tears, sulking, and show when you are incapable in your flesh to fulfill this promise to God?

That is the way I see your repentance. People have been attacking hyper-grace and saying that its a license to sin (which is false) and also disagreeing with its presentation of repentance ("a change of mind"). Yet, my question is, what good is your repentance? Hasn't history shown the fruit of the traditional concept of repentance? It is void of confidence before the Lord, assurance in salvation, and the love of God (and the grace of God). In some ways it actually completely ignores what Jesus accomplished at the cross. Confession of sin for the sake of forgiveness? Has Christ died in vain? Did not His shed blood give you the remission of your sins?

There is so much more than meets the eye when it comes to repentance. It is tainted with religion and self righteousness. It tries to acknowledge Jesus, but treats His blood as if common. Incapable of doing that which God set out to do. Granting us forgiveness, taking our sins away and justifying us before God. Jesus being able as our High Priest to save us completely. All of this is tossed aside for a concept of repentance that deals with sin confession as if it maintains salvation. That is where people should truly repent. Change your mind about sin confession for forgiveness because it misses the mark that is Christ Jesus on that cross paying for your sins. You are forgiven, it is not something you seek. It is found in Christ.

This could go on for another couple paragraphs to define repentance, but I will keep it short. Repentance happens daily, it is through mind renewal. It is, after all, a change of mind. It is coming into agreement with God (yes, even about your sins) and then coming into the reality that Jesus has set you free from sin because you're a new creation. Also too, under grace sin's dominion is broken. So the accusation of licentiousness (license to sin) is unfounded because people are explicitly stating that we are set free from it and are dead to it. VVe don't ignore sin. VVe turn to God for His strength. VVe repent in that of growing in the grace and knowledge of Jesus Christ. In Him is victory found.

Hi Ben,

I use to run with the Grace crowd but have had a slight change. I can tell you from experience there are a lot of Hyper Grace people who do believe you can do whatever you want because they are covered no matter what. I'm not saying it is this way with all but a number of them do believe this.

I don't see anything wrong with confessing our sins to God. Yes he has already forgiven us but for me I feel if I don't confess them then I might start feeling insensitive to my sins, if that makes any sense.

 

[Grace777x70]

I agree that we cannot use grace as a "cloak of maliciousness". Actually, I agree with pretty much everything you said. However, I believe that we should confess our "trespasses" as directed by the Lord in His example of prayer in the Gospels. We are told that if we sin to be instant in prayer. I believe this is the reason Christ acts as our advocate.
No Debate, Nothing Complicated,

GraceDefined.

I agree that we should feel free to talk over everything with our Lord which includes "sins" we have done.

Here is what I do when I sin..

I love to kneel quickly and tell my Father how I trust in Him..how what I did was wrong..sometimes I use the word sin..sometimes I don't..I think that is irrelevant...I run to my Father and tell Him how that His Son..my Lord is my life..my righteousness,..Jesus Blood has secured my redemption and forgiveness of sins....I confess what God says about me...I tell Him I love Him and trust in Him...

I have not asked for forgiveness in order to be forgiven for quite some time now...but I always talk with my Lord about what I do or don't do...

You know ...He always loves on me and tells me He loves me and that He is my life and strength. Sometimes I have felt a warm liquid like feeling of pure love fall on me..and I just sit there in His presence and weep..I can't move a muscle..He is so mighty in power yet His love and total acceptance is the most overwhelming aspect of His presence.

But most times I have no experiences like the above but I still accept the truth of what Christ has already done for me by faith and I don't go by how "I feel". I have the inward witness of the Spirit - the complete acceptance, peace and love of God in my spirit.


To me..all sin is relational. All sin is a failure to see the life of Christ in me. I am ignorant of His life in me. To me..most outward sin is just a "fruit" of the real sin.

For example..If I steal something..that is a sin..but the real sin behind that is the failure to recognize my Father will take care of me. I am operating in the flesh. I want to take things into my own hand and "do" things. ( I don't steal....well I haven't since I was a kid...not that I can remember anyway..it's just an example )

The other part is when you see how horrid it really is when we mess up....sin....transgress.... whatever term you want to use....

...what I see is my unbelief in the goodness and love of my Father and Lord Jesus for me. That is the horrid part because I know that is not Their character nor is it really my true nature now and what He has made me in Christ.

 

[Grace777x70]

Hi Ben,

I use to run with the Grace crowd but have had a slight change. I can tell you from experience there are a lot of Hyper Grace people who do believe you can do whatever you want because they are covered no matter what. I'm not saying it is this way with all but a number of them do believe this.

I don't see anything wrong with confessing our sins to God. Yes he has already forgiven us but for me I feel if I don't confess them then I might start feeling insensitive to my sins, if that makes any sense.

I understand what you are saying and I agree too. I personally have never heard a teacher of grace say that you are under grace so go do what you want and just "sin away". I have listened to over a hundred of them so far - but I may have missed one or two that actually do say such a thing.

I too agree with confessing sins to our Father and Lord and like you - not "in order to be forgiven" but to talk everything over with Him. I always find that whenever I sin - it means I am trying to "get something" outside of the life and kingdom of God , so I want to know where I am missing it in my faith towards God so that I can have a change of mind and repent to rely on Christ alone for all things.

The other thing si that f no one says to us when we preach the gospel .."What?..are you saying we can sin all we want?" If no one says that when we preach the gospel then we have not preached the true gospel yet like Paul did.

He was accused of being antinomian by religious people and he said he was slanderously reported to say things that he did not say about going out and sinning however you want. Sounds a lot like what is happening today in some people's minds.

 

[God4me]

I have a simple question for you who think repentance is simply a turning from sin. VVhen you pray to the Lord and tell Him, "Lord I'm sorry for what I've done. I won't do it again, ever. I am so so sorry." are you capable of fulfilling this promise? This oath? Or is it empty? How often have you repented of a particular sin but you continue to repeat it again and again? So then, tell me, what good does your form of repentance serve you when you're still stuck in the same sin over and over again? VVhere is the power in this repentance? VVhat good are the tears, sulking, and show when you are incapable in your flesh to fulfill this promise to God?

That is the way I see your repentance. People have been attacking hyper-grace and saying that its a license to sin (which is false) and also disagreeing with its presentation of repentance ("a change of mind"). Yet, my question is, what good is your repentance? Hasn't history shown the fruit of the traditional concept of repentance? It is void of confidence before the Lord, assurance in salvation, and the love of God (and the grace of God). In some ways it actually completely ignores what Jesus accomplished at the cross. Confession of sin for the sake of forgiveness? Has Christ died in vain? Did not His shed blood give you the remission of your sins?

There is so much more than meets the eye when it comes to repentance. It is tainted with religion and self righteousness. It tries to acknowledge Jesus, but treats His blood as if common. Incapable of doing that which God set out to do. Granting us forgiveness, taking our sins away and justifying us before God. Jesus being able as our High Priest to save us completely. All of this is tossed aside for a concept of repentance that deals with sin confession as if it maintains salvation. That is where people should truly repent. Change your mind about sin confession for forgiveness because it misses the mark that is Christ Jesus on that cross paying for your sins. You are forgiven, it is not something you seek. It is found in Christ.

This could go on for another couple paragraphs to define repentance, but I will keep it short. Repentance happens daily, it is through mind renewal. It is, after all, a change of mind. It is coming into agreement with God (yes, even about your sins) and then coming into the reality that Jesus has set you free from sin because you're a new creation. Also too, under grace sin's dominion is broken. So the accusation of licentiousness (license to sin) is unfounded because people are explicitly stating that we are set free from it and are dead to it. VVe don't ignore sin. VVe turn to God for His strength. VVe repent in that of growing in the grace and knowledge of Jesus Christ. In Him is victory found.

Hyper grace does give people the licence to sin, The hyper grace teachers tell porkies by saying it doesn't give us a licence to sin, But the very teaching encourages people to live how they want to.
We are living in a day when people have been living as they want to, Only now the devil has introduced the false grace teaching that give the people the licence to carry on living how they want to and how they have been living.
The devil saw the perfect timing to raise up false grace teachers, [The hyper grace teachers].

One leading HG teacher said,
"When I sin, I am blessed, because God isn't counting my sins against me, all my sins, past, present and future, have been forgiven".

And that gives 1000s of his followers the licence to sin.

This same man said,
"When I sin, I confess I'm the righteousness of God", SORRY, but God said when we sin, we confess we have sinned.

As for repentance,
A change of mind, will result in a change of actions, as Paul tells us in 2 Cor 7: 9--11.

 

[God4me]

When we got saved,GOD forgave us of our sins and when HE forgave us,It only took one time.

Remember the spirit was made perfect(Hebrews 12:23),not the flesh.So then when we ask for forgiveness again after GOD has forgiven us,the spirit that GOD Is looking at was not participating In that sin,because It was made perfect.

but If the person wants to continue asking for forgiveness when they sin after GOD has forgiven them,then they are not being conscious of their right standing before GOD but being more conscious of their fleshy feelings.

The person wants to feel forgiven Instead of believing they are forgiven and thats why asking over and over Is fleshy.

IMO people have the wrong Interpretation of
1st John 1:9
King James Version(KJV)

9.)If we confess our sins, HE is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
+++
GOD died once and for all and those that were forgiven,their spirits were made perfect.

The false grace teachers have wrongly interpreted 1 Jn 1: 9, They says it's not for the believer, But the say that about all the scriptures that prove them wrong.
You are saying John has deceived us, See 1 Jn 1: 8--10--1 Jn 2: 1--2, John says if we sin and confess it and repent, Then Jesus pleads to God for our forgiveness, cleansing and restoration back to righteousness.

Mankind is a Spirit who has a souls and lives in a body, Only the Spirit is born again, The souls has to be renewed, Rom 12: 2.
And the body is still waiting redemption, Rom 8: 23.
The most powerful part of our makeup, is the soul, [The mind WILL and emotions], and if we WILL to side in with our spirit, we will be spirit minded, but if we will to side in with our fleshly desires, we are carnally minded and fall into sin.
And when we sin we have to confess it and repent, THEN we are forgiven, cleansed and restored.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

They accused Paul of teaching the same thing - that it was okay to sin. But they don't understand that the law of the Spirit in us is MORE exacting than following outwardly.

There may be a sense of annoyance in the first paragraph because I am tired of people making accusations of licentiousness to God loving and righteous Christians. They accuse them of living like heathens with a license to sin, and defame them, accusing them of disobeying God and ignoring the Holy Spirit. That is tiring and wrong, they even dismiss them as brethren saying their father is the devil.

These things go unchecked and then we have groups opposing one another instead of being unified. How can we even find common ground when we consider one another to not even be in Christ? Fellow children of God, albeit one part may be sincerely wrong? VVhere is the meekness and correction there? Forget teaching in meekness, just toss them aside. Is that the witness we want to give off to others?

 

[God4me]

Hi Ben,

I use to run with the Grace crowd but have had a slight change. I can tell you from experience there are a lot of Hyper Grace people who do believe you can do whatever you want because they are covered no matter what. I'm not saying it is this way with all but a number of them do believe this.

I don't see anything wrong with confessing our sins to God. Yes he has already forgiven us but for me I feel if I don't confess them then I might start feeling insensitive to my sins, if that makes any sense.

You are right, I have seen and heard them say we can do what we want to and still be blessed, because grace has covered every sin we do.
They also said we can live how we want to and God will still use us, Because it's not what we do or don't do, It's all by grace.

Joseph Prince said the only qualification we need to go up in the rapture, Is to be alive on earth at the time, Then he said,
"We don't have to be faithful or holy, just here at the time".
He is a deceiver.