Is being gay a sin?

[wwjd_kilden]

God makes allowance for divorce (physical/sexual abuse and adultery). He does NOT make allowance for someone to turn gay and try to live as a christian. Apples and oranges..

People divorce for other reasons than that
so i repeat: Are they not Christians?

What about a Christian who sometimes lie?
one who is sometimes jealous?
do they stop being Christians?

Are we to "stone" one group of sinners and then run to God and ask Him to forgive OUR sins because they are "lesser"?

 

[blue_ladybug]

People divorce for other reasons than that
so i repeat: Are they not Christians?

What about a Christian who sometimes lie?
one who is sometimes jealous?
do they stop being Christians?

Are we to "stone" one group of sinners and then run to God and ask Him to forgive OUR sins because they are "lesser"?

No sin is lesser than another. They are all equal in God's eyes. Thing is, some gay people don't/won't repent that lifestyle but still try to be a christian anyway.. They don't see anything wrong with being gay, so they don't feel they need to repent..

 

[Lady4theLord]

No sin is lesser than another. They are all equal in God's eyes. Thing is, some gay people don't/won't repent that lifestyle but still try to be a christian anyway.. They don't see anything wrong with being gay, so they don't feel they need to repent..

You said it yourself. That's the same with ANY sin in ANY circumstance. Some people think they can be Christians but they continue to struggle with the issue of pride thinking they are better than their brothers and sisters but they end up looking more arrogant and selfish which is a sin in and of itself.

Same sex attraction isn't as easy to "get rid of" as most people expect. It's not a thought problem that goes away overnight just like the problem of lust or gluttony doesn't go away overnight. It takes TIME and it takes PATIENCE. Our only rescue from our flesh is our Savior but even then we still have these same issues after being saved/repentant. Jesus promised that our eternal curse would not hold us bondage as long as we followed him...our eternal curse being Hell itself. But he did NOT promise a life during our walk with him where we did not have struggles.

 

[willfollowsGod]

Being attracted to the same sex is not a sin, allowing yourself to dwell on homosexual thoughts and/or engaging in homosexual sex and/or even being in a homosexual marriage, which is not marriage according to Jesus as written in Matthew and Mark is a sin. For a story of a person who left a lesbian lifestyle due to the power of Christ in her life, read Secret Thoughts of an Unlikely Convert by Rosaria Butterfield. While I do not agree with her on everything, she does have valid points. But you cannot be a gay Christian, you are either a Christian or you are not. When I say this I am not diminishing their struggle, I am saying what God says, you cannot serve two masters, you can only serve one master. Either the master is your homosexual desire, lust, stealing, etc or it is God. Everyday you must choose who will be your master, the one who has bought from the life of sin that you were living or to go back to a lifestyle and a thought process that is not of God. What I am saying also applies to me. Change is possible for the homosexual, contrary to what culture, society, the media, etc is currently preaching. God bless. Have a beautiful day!

 

[Ahwatukee]

People divorce for other reasons than that
so i repeat: Are they not Christians?

What about a Christian who sometimes lie?
one who is sometimes jealous?
do they stop being Christians?

Are we to "stone" one group of sinners and then run to God and ask Him to forgive OUR sins because they are "lesser"?

Hello wwjd_kilden,

Blue_ladybug is correct. Your comparison is not valid. If someone who is in Christ, when they become jealous, or have lied, or have been sexually immoral, etc., they have a repentant heart and confess their sins, keeping watch over themselves to bring their actions under control and they pray for God's help regarding these weaknesses. For those who are willfully living a same-sex life style, they have no intention of repenting. They say "God loves us just as we are." And so they intend to continue living that life style while calling themselves Christians. What many are doing is that, instead of recognizing it as sin they are justifying and embracing this sin. Regarding those other sins that you mention, if those people are justifying and embracing those sins then they are in the same boat. They are willfully living according to the sinful nature. In regards to those willfully living same-sex life styles who have no intention of repenting, they are still in their sins. In the same way, if there are those who call themselves Christians are willfully living in according to the sinful nature, they too need repent, because those willful acts lead to death.

Paul speaking to the Galatians:

"The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions and envy; drunkenness, wild parties, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God."

So the bottom line is, all who come to Christ must repent. And someone who comes to Christ who is living a same-sex life style, they also need to repent and not justify and embrace that life style. The true person in Christ is wrestling to overcome the acts of the sinful nature, not embrace them.

 

[Maglost]

I think I should steer it back a bit... The point made in the OP was that they choose to live a celibate life because they think it's a sin to be with someone of the same sex... They are repenting when they've wrong thoughts (prayed with them multiple times about it), so why is this something that is condemning them to hell (according to some of you), while other more common things in Christianity aren't? So to be very clear they are NOT acting on desires they have because they know that's against Gods will...

If anyone could post a scripture verse(s) where is stated that that is wrong: be my guest. But I've never encountered it so far. Yes I know about texts like: "When a man lies with another man he should be stoned" and stuff like that, but none that actually describes being gay as sinful.....

 

[Ahwatukee]

I think I should steer it back a bit... The point made in the OP was that they choose to live a celibate life because they think it's a sin to be with someone of the same sex... They are repenting when they've wrong thoughts (prayed with them multiple times about it), so why is this something that is condemning them to hell

If this is a persons attitude, then they are doing right by recognizing those desires as sin and are repenting of them. It is when they attempt to justify and embrace them that there is a problem, which is what many who are living same-sex life styles are doing and which is why we have so-called gay churches.

 

[Mitspa]

I think I should steer it back a bit... The point made in the OP was that they choose to live a celibate life because they think it's a sin to be with someone of the same sex... They are repenting when they've wrong thoughts (prayed with them multiple times about it), so why is this something that is condemning them to hell (according to some of you), while other more common things in Christianity aren't? So to be very clear they are NOT acting on desires they have because they know that's against Gods will...

If anyone could post a scripture verse(s) where is stated that that is wrong: be my guest. But I've never encountered it so far. Yes I know about texts like: "When a man lies with another man he should be stoned" and stuff like that, but none that actually describes being gay as sinful.....

Why would they call themselves "gay" if they think its a sin and are not acting on those lust? Don't make sense ? If they say they have some wicked thoughts or ungodly desires ..we can all understand that ...but trying to define oneself as a sexual deviant and a "Christian" in some way to try and justify that deviant behavior, is not biblical and cannot be accepted, because it shames Christ and His Holy Name.

 

[nzlotrfan]

Some interesting perspectives here. I've read a few books now on the topic talking about both sides of the argument, so I shall offer my thoughts.

Firstly, the word 'Gay' needs to be defined here. Typically calling someone gay implies that they are living a gay lifestyle. So to differentiate, let's refer to Christians who experience homosexual feelings as Same Sex Attracted[ion] (SSA).

I personally have experienced SSA since I was about 13, but I (now since becoming a Christian) identify myself first and foremost as a Christian who is defined by Christ, I am not a gay Christian. But rather I am a Christian who experiences SSA while denying to act upon those desires.

It is not a sin to experience SSA, SSA is a result of the fall. In fact, it seems to me that we should expect to see people with immoral and perverse sexual desires and the like, because of our sinful flesh and nature. God didn't make me gay, like he didn't create me with the desire to lust, desires to steal, lie, or covet..... these are rather the consquences of sin. But it is what one does with those desires that is important. If you are SSA and you unrepentedly decide to lust after other men, or have sexual relations with another man, then you are committing sin. However, like Jesus calls us to do with other sinful desires, he calls us to deny ourselves and to pick up our cross and follow him. We are to deny the flesh.

So to the question. No, it is not a sin to experience SSA. But yes, - it is a sin to embrace a gay lifestyle, and to even expand that further it is a sin to partake in any sexual activity outside of marriage. ... then what is marriage? It is by definition the joining together of a man and a woman before God. There cannot be gay marriage, because marriage is between a man and a woman only. Man is similar yet different to woman in the right way, like the church is similar yet different to Jesus in the right way. Marriage is also meant to reflect the grace that God shows to his people in Christ:

“Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh.” This mystery is profound, and I am saying that it refers to Christ and the church. - Eph 5:31-32

Paul is saying that marriage is about the relationship Jesus has with the church. It too, is a union between two different yet complementary entities. The church is not the same as Christ, and Christ is not the same as the church. Human marriage is a reflection of this supreme, heavenly marriage between Christ and his people. A man and a man, or a woman and a woman, cannot reflect the union of Christ and the church; instead these only reflect Christ and Christ, or church and church.

Anyway, while I do indeed battle with SSA, by God's grace I am now attracted to women (since 2013).

My 2 cents.

 

[Depleted]

Well... I think the title is pretty clear Just to clarify what I mean with that question: I'm talking about being gay, not about being in a relation with other man (or woman for the ladies here ). Because I know people who are gay and Christian but who choose to not start a relationship with someone from the same sex because they believe what the bible says about it. Can answer it for me please?

Thanks in advance,
Maglost

Jesus clarified that even thinking of a woman in lust is adultery. Does it matter if we're thinking about adultery in opposite-sex or same-sex? Yes. It's sin.

And, yes. It is in our nature to sin.

There is freedom from sin areas. Even this one. His name is Jesus. This is one of many reasons we need to seek Jesus often.

I know a ministry that helps people with all forms of sexual sin, and people are released from the sin areas.

"Just don't do it" is short-changing God. He can give us more than that.

 

[Adstar]

The Bible declares clearly that the sexual act of homosexuality is an abomination to God..
And Jesus made it clear that just thinking about committing a sexual sin is the same as doing it..
The Message of Jesus is clear that all sins that people may commit will be forgiven them if they believe Jesus and trust in the Atonement He secured for the forgiveness of their transgressions..

 

[Depleted]

Let's just say that they don't want to be gay... They've been praying for years about it alone and with others asking God to change them. So they certainly did NOT choose it So because they want to change, but can't (because this stuff is 90%of the time determined with birth), ask God to help them, live a good christian life and resist the temptation they aren't/can't be Christian? That's something that doesn't sound right...

You've been properly indoctrinated to believe the modern take on homosexuality. 90% now? This is new. Unlearn it. It's poppycock.

And then trust what God's word says.

And yeah, we can't change. But again, God changes us.

 

[Depleted]

People CHOOSE to turn gay at some point in their life. We are NOT BORN gay. God does NOT create gay babies. So whether or not someone turns gay in the future is NOT determined at birth. That's baloney. Ever heard of free will? We all have it. Free will to stay straight, go gay, do drugs, get drunk, etc.. So nope, if a person is gay, they aren't truly a christian.

I disagree. People are born into sin and then excel at it. And, until recently, no one would actually choose to be homosexual. That would be kin to choosing to smell like Asiago cheese.

Here's an article that gives hints as to what might have gone wrong, but even there, maybe not. Each one of us has at least one sin area we went to that gave us some kind of comfort. Homosexuality is merely one of them.

And again, you are trying to tell me I couldn't be stupid enough to be a Christian and then get into drugs. I seriously think you underestimate the stupidity of Man -- and me!

I have heard of free will. I just see no connection between it and the gospel.

 

[Depleted]

Amen and we also choose to love or to hate or to forgive,... You cannot be a christian and a abomination unto God. Choose the right way or go to hell.

God does not save abominations. And you might want to have a bit more sympathy considering occult practices is an abomination to. Should you be labeled by who you were too?

 

[Depleted]

Well, this question has already been answered, and I am glad to see that AuntieAnt has also brought up that there are men that are simply not attracted to women (but not necessarily attracted to men either), and that this situation also presents its own challenges.

I find myself in the "not attracted to anybody whatsoever" camp, and because I do and always have for as long as I can remember, I feel that the only thing I can do to not be seen as abominable is to be completely celibate for the rest of my life.

I'm confused. If you're not attracted to anyone, won't you naturally be celibate for the rest of your life? It doesn't sound like it would be a struggle at all, anymore than I struggle against robbing banks. I'm just not interested in robbing banks, so I don't. No struggle at all.

 

[Depleted]

God makes allowance for divorce (physical/sexual abuse and adultery). He does NOT make allowance for someone to turn gay and try to live as a christian. Apples and oranges..

That possible misunderstanding of what you thought Maglost said shipped long ago. Maglost is NOT talking about "Turning gay" after becoming a believer. So why keep on with that topic?

 

[Depleted]

Hello wwjd_kilden,

Blue_ladybug is correct. Your comparison is not valid. If someone who is in Christ, when they become jealous, or have lied, or have been sexually immoral, etc., they have a repentant heart and confess their sins, keeping watch over themselves to bring their actions under control and they pray for God's help regarding these weaknesses. For those who are willfully living a same-sex life style, they have no intention of repenting. They say "God loves us just as we are." And so they intend to continue living that life style while calling themselves Christians. What many are doing is that, instead of recognizing it as sin they are justifying and embracing this sin. Regarding those other sins that you mention, if those people are justifying and embracing those sins then they are in the same boat. They are willfully living according to the sinful nature. In regards to those willfully living same-sex life styles who have no intention of repenting, they are still in their sins. In the same way, if there are those who call themselves Christians are willfully living in according to the sinful nature, they too need repent, because those willful acts lead to death.

Paul speaking to the Galatians:

"The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions and envy; drunkenness, wild parties, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God."

So the bottom line is, all who come to Christ must repent. And someone who comes to Christ who is living a same-sex life style, they also need to repent and not justify and embrace that life style. The true person in Christ is wrestling to overcome the acts of the sinful nature, not embrace them.

Using the very verse you quoted, then you shall not inherit the kingdom of God because of discord, fits of rage, dissention, and factions? (I have seen you arguing what you prescribe to as the proper End Time beliefs too.)

 

[blue_ladybug]

That possible misunderstanding of what you thought Maglost said shipped long ago. Maglost is NOT talking about "Turning gay" after becoming a believer. So why keep on with that topic?

Because he's talking about someone who is living as a gay person, though not acting on it, while trying to be a christian at the same time. A homo cannot profess to be a christian if they are gay.

 

[blue_ladybug]

I disagree. People are born into sin and then excel at it. And, until recently, no one would actually choose to be homosexual. That would be kin to choosing to smell like Asiago cheese.

Here's an article that gives hints as to what might have gone wrong, but even there, maybe not. Each one of us has at least one sin area we went to that gave us some kind of comfort. Homosexuality is merely one of them.

And again, you are trying to tell me I couldn't be stupid enough to be a Christian and then get into drugs. I seriously think you underestimate the stupidity of Man -- and me!

I have heard of free will. I just see no connection between it and the gospel.

We ALL have free will. Some use it, some don't.. As for being born gay, I don't believe that God creates gay babies in heaven and sends them to earth. That's ridiculous. As for God saving abominations, he most certainly does too. After all, WE are abominations, and by that I mean we are all horrible, evil ugly sinners. Yet He chose to save us. It is JMO that a practicing (or not) gay person cannot be a true christian. Especially if they don't repent. Repentance is key.

 

[chickwithsticks]

Because he's talking about someone who is living as a gay person, though not acting on it, while trying to be a christian at the same time. A homo cannot profess to be a christian if they are gay.

"A Homo" ....Blue c'mon.

That saddens me.