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gb9 said:
take a little Titus, a little Romans, a little 2nd Corinthians, mix it together, and what comes out? false works salavtionism teaching.

one should not just pluck out verses and build theology around them
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pilgrims theology is based on scripture after scripture after scripture. consistantly saying the same exact stuff. shes not the one plucking romans 8:1 and then denying v 12-13 in the same chapter, thats how you get the "gospel of grace" theology by using 1 verse or 2 ommiting the next chapter finding another verse that can be added to support the first one plucked from among the chapter. its all about repenting because Jesus died for the things we are commanded to repent of.

anytime the false doctrine of gog comes out, it hates even the mention of repentance. it works hard in minds so muich that it leads to ommitting the words of the very one who suffered and died. who Himself tells people plainly the truth about repenting and obeying the gospel.
 
gb9 said:
take a little Titus, a little Romans, a little 2nd Corinthians, mix it together, and what comes out? false works salavtionism teaching.

one should not just pluck out verses and build theology around them
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Have you tried looking at the context? Try a couple of verses earlier in 2 Cr 10:4-5 (which I quoted) seeing that is the verse ISIT was speaking of (which you twisted on him)

Try a couple of verses earlier 2Cr 10:2 (and there you will also find the context to be speaking of walking according to the flesh)

2 Cr 10:2 But I beseech you, that I may not be bold when I am present with that confidence, wherewith I think to be bold against some, which think of us as if we walked according to the flesh.

And Romans 8:13 I quoted pertains to living after the flesh

Romans 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

Since you were laying it on ISIT's strength (since neither he nor the places he quotes speaks of doing so in ones own strength (but rather not walking according to the flesh) and that God is the strength I would think it wouldnt be difficult to see that YE ((through the Spirit) mortify the deeds of the body (verses living after the flesh) all agree.

Its not that difficult to see each place is speaking of Grace, His Spirit, His power, His Strength and not living after the flesh, that is all sound doctrine.

What ever you were trying to do is sort of screwed up since its muddied up with your strawmen against the words he posted (which was not even on what he posted) but lies. I am simply saying I agree with the verses he posted and are confirming them (just not your strawmen) and I dont need to cherry pick anything to do it I am quoting in the places ISIT posted on and showing what it says plainly there (and how it agrees elsewhere) with both him and agreeing in each place. I was not confirming your strawmen (which are not really confirmable because he didnt say what you said he said neither does the place where he is quoting the same from) as I showed.


 
it is not a " strawman " argument to say one should use verses in context.

this is what you guys do- you pluck out and post verses, then expect others to " refute " them. this is attempting to set Scripture against Scripture. the Bible does not contradict, it compliments. when you properly use it.
 
gb9 said:
it is not a " strawman " argument to say one should use verses in context.

this is what you guys do- you pluck out and post verses, then expect others to " refute " them. this is attempting to set Scripture against Scripture. the Bible does not contradict, it compliments. when you properly use it.
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I actually thought you were the poster who wrote the first post I was adressing (as I was speaking to the first posts strawmen)

And the context was adressing ISIT's actual words (thats the context) and where his words were found (that was my context) and how those words all agree in various places (in the context of the grace of God, what it teaches us as it pertainns to the flesh and the Spirit.

You would have to show how they contradict or violate the context and your problem with showing how they all agree but we been through this before.

You can remove verses from their contexts without violating where they were taken from.

The Holy Ghost shows just this in Paul's writings

As shown in the Footnotes of Romans 10:5-21


  1. Romans 10:5 Lev. 18:5
  2. Romans 10:6 Deut. 30:12
  3. Romans 10:7 Deut. 30:13
  4. Romans 10:8 Deut. 30:14
  5. Romans 10:11 Isaiah 28:16 (see Septuagint)
  6. Romans 10:13 Joel 2:32
  7. Romans 10:15 Isaiah 52:7
  8. Romans 10:16 Isaiah 53:1
  9. Romans 10:18 Psalm 19:4
  10. Romans 10:19 Deut. 32:21
  11. Romans 10:20 Isaiah 65:1
  12. Romans 10:21 Isaiah 65:2
Found here

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...ch=Romans%2010
 
InSpiritInTruth said:
Mr twister is his name, and twisting scriptures is his game,.... Mr. Twister. (sung to the old Roto-Rooter gingle) LOL :)
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what people don't understand the call it names! it is not surprising to me to see people who think they have mastered the scriptures to the extend that they label their fellow brother "mr twister"! This attitude reminds me of the pharisees and the scribes who thought they had mastered the Scriptures to the extend that when the ONE to whom the very scriptures were pointing to, stood in their mist, they couldn't see him! And this is what the messiah said to them, "you search the scriptures thinking that in them you will obtain salvation"! He is still saying that very same thing today to those of his children who think that their works and obedience can earn them salvation! A lot of people will be surprise when we get to stand in the presence of our Savior!
 
followjesus said:
pilgrims theology is based on scripture after scripture after scripture. consistantly saying the same exact stuff. shes not the one plucking romans 8:1 and then denying v 12-13 in the same chapter, thats how you get the "gospel of grace" theology by using 1 verse or 2 ommiting the next chapter finding another verse that can be added to support the first one plucked from among the chapter. its all about repenting because Jesus died for the things we are commanded to repent of.

anytime the false doctrine of gog comes out, it hates even the mention of repentance. it works hard in minds so muich that it leads to ommitting the words of the very one who suffered and died. who Himself tells people plainly the truth about repenting and obeying the gospel.
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That's nonsense.. and is a complete and total mis-representation of the truth. ....here below is what we say about repentance so perhaps now the truth can be spoken without all the malice and slander being said. ( this has been shown so many times and yet these lies are still spoken of as if they are true - what kind of a spirit would be doing that? )

Personally I love repentance as I see new things about he Lord Jesus Christ.

Hyper-Grace Preachers Don’t Believe in Repentance
Not only do we believe in repentance, but we seek to understand and teach it thoroughly and accurately. In the New Testament, “to repent” is a translation of the Greek verb “metanoeo” meaning “to change one’s mind or perspective.” Obviously, when we receive Christ, we have repented in the genuine sense of the term – changing our minds about our need of a Savior and receiving Christ.

Before Christ, we lived as self-sufficiently as possible, thinking that God would probably grade on a curve and accept us at least partly on the basis of our own best efforts and self-generated goodness.

When we came to understand our spiritual bankruptcy and our desperate need for Christ’s forgiveness and new life, we repented (had a change of perspective) and received Christ by trusting in Him alone to rescue us.

Beyond this initial experience of “getting saved” (as we often call it), repentance is a daily lifestyle in which an ongoing “renewal of the mind” process is taking place within us. As we grow in faith and in our understanding of God through His Word and our union with His Holy Spirit (1 Cor. 6:17), we begin to replace old thinking with new thinking and false thinking with true thinking. This renewal of the mind (Rom. 12:1-3) is an integral part of the transformative process of the Spirit’s work in our lives.

This is the essence of a lifestyle of repentance – taking false thoughts captive, making them obedient to (in conformity with) Christ (2 Cor. 10:5).

Paul affirmed in no uncertain terms that God’s kindness (His expressed grace toward us) is what leads to repentance (Rom. 2:4).

Far from being anti-repentance, hyper-grace theology affirms repentance and the ongoing renewal of the mind as an integral part of what it means to follow Jesus under His New Covenant.

So, please have some integrity and speak the truth from now on about what we speak in regards to repentance. Christians should be repenting from all things once they see the truth and yes - that includes sin and any other way of thinking that is contrary to the life of Christ that is in us.

 
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Originally Posted by InSpiritInTruth

Mr twister is his name, and twisting scriptures is his game,.... Mr. Twister. (sung to the old Roto-Rooter gingle) LOL :)


heavenly_bound said:
what people don't understand the call it names! it is not surprising to me to see people who think they have mastered the scriptures to the extend that they label their fellow brother "mr twister"! This attitude reminds me of the pharisees and the scribes who thought they had mastered the Scriptures to the extend that when the ONE to whom the very scriptures were pointing to, stood in their mist, they couldn't see him! And this is what the messiah said to them, "you search the scriptures thinking that in them you will obtain salvation"! He is still saying that very same thing today to those of his children who think that their works and obedience can earn them salvation! A lot of people will be surprise when we get to stand in the presence of our Savior!
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You are new here to CC. This is what some do when their religion has been exposed for what it I really is. They go to mocking as the same thing was done in post #86. They love to mock others together - that is their MO.

That's the way these types work - we usually just ignore them. We do however get the word of Christ out so that the new people do not be led astray by their works-based doctrine which really denies the work of Christ in our lives.
 
gb9 said:
it is not a " strawman " argument to say one should use verses in context.

this is what you guys do- you pluck out and post verses, then expect others to " refute " them. this is attempting to set Scripture against Scripture. the Bible does not contradict, it compliments. when you properly use it.
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I agree...the stringing of out of context scriptures together is common.

One thing to keep in mind is that it is possible to post a "string" of scriptures that are all taken out of context from both the OT and the NT to "prove" a teaching.

I like to use Exodus 32:33 as an example. Let's say I have this "theory" that we must be sinless all of our lives to get to heaven.

I start with the below scripture from Moses and from the start it's not looking good for us...:(...

Exodus 32:33 (NASB)
[SUP]33 [/SUP] The LORD said to Moses, "Whoever has sinned against Me, I will blot him out of My book.

I then can go on to post scriptures from Moses to David to Jesus all about sin and what it does. Then I end up with the book of Revelation 21:8 where it says that all immoral people will be thrown in the lake of fire.

All of these scriptures are true but none of them take into consideration the finished work of Christ and how that Jesus' blood has redeemed sinners.

Jesus' truths trump ( sorry to the Americans for using "trump" as that word can be a stumbling block to some ) all those scriptures that were "strung" together to prove my above theory in the first place.

The finished work of Christ is what all other scriptures need to be interpreted through before IMO they can be legitimately used to support a teaching. ( works-based salvationists violate this constantly )

I find it fascinating to read a scripture I have known all my Christian life and then one day - the Holy Spirit illuminates that scripture and I am amazed at how I didn't see that before.

I maintain that we are just as dependent on the Holy Spirit to reveal Jesus to us in the scriptures as Mary was dependent on the Holy Spirit to conceive Jesus in her womb.

We can read the scriptures through the lens of our natural minds whether we know all the Greek words and structure or not and come away with the wrong reality of spiritual truths.
 
Grace777x70 said:
quote_icon.png
Originally Posted by InSpiritInTruth

Mr twister is his name, and twisting scriptures is his game,.... Mr. Twister. (sung to the old Roto-Rooter gingle) LOL :)




You are new here to CC. This is what some do when their religion has been exposed for what it I really is. They go to mocking as the same thing was done in post #86. They love to mock others together - that is their MO.

That's the way these types work - we usually just ignore them. We do however get the word of Christ out so that the new people do not be led astray by their works-based doctrine which really denies the work of Christ in our lives.
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yes i am beginning to see that. and i am aslo beginning to understand that its a form of distraction( the name callings)- to distract us from presenting the gospel consistently. Thanks for informing me about these tricks. From now on, i will ignore them and carry on with the work of the Lord. blessed
 
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PilgrimPassingThru said:
Have you tried looking at the context? Try a couple of verses earlier in 2 Cr 10:4-5 (which I quoted) seeing that is the verse ISIT was speaking of (which you twisted on him)

Try a couple of verses earlier 2Cr 10:2 (and there you will also find the context to be speaking of walking according to the flesh)

2 Cr 10:2 But I beseech you, that I may not be bold when I am present with that confidence, wherewith I think to be bold against some, which think of us as if we walked according to the flesh.

And Romans 8:13 I quoted pertains to living after the flesh

Romans 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

Since you were laying it on ISIT's strength (since neither he nor the places he quotes speaks of doing so in ones own strength (but rather not walking according to the flesh) and that God is the strength I would think it wouldnt be difficult to see that YE ((through the Spirit) mortify the deeds of the body (verses living after the flesh) all agree.

Its not that difficult to see each place is speaking of Grace, His Spirit, His power, His Strength and not living after the flesh, that is all sound doctrine.

What ever you were trying to do is sort of screwed up since its muddied up with your strawmen against the words he posted (which was not even on what he posted) but lies. I am simply saying I agree with the verses he posted and are confirming them (just not your strawmen) and I dont need to cherry pick anything to do it I am quoting in the places ISIT posted on and showing what it says plainly there (and how it agrees elsewhere) with both him and agreeing in each place. I was not confirming your strawmen (which are not really confirmable because he didnt say what you said he said neither does the place where he is quoting the same from) as I showed.
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Thanks girlfriend, as you know, and many can see, when they cannot refute the multitudes of scripture I post they then have to bring on the straw man accusations of "self righteousness", as usual. I have made my points very clear by scripture, that the grace of God empowers us to over come sin, the Devil, and the ways of the world. It is His Spirit that gives us the ability to be transformed and be renewed in our minds, and purify our hearts and be Christ minded.

So why would they be so opposed to this Truth? It is because when they look inside themselves they see darkness, and not the Light of the Lord purifying their hearts and minds. But rather, still being in bondage to sin they still dwell on lustful and evil thoughts being powerless to overcome not having God's Spirit.

They need to remember, God resists the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.

Hope all is well with you and yours, Peace. :)
 
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PilgrimPassingThru said:
It works well with the jingle

[video=youtube;vmpMYtdDPIc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vmpMYtdDPIc[/video]
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Mr twister is his name, and twisting scriptures is his game,.... Mr. Twister.
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Yes, it flows quit nicely. LOL :) Beware of those who have to constantly say those words of God are not for us, or to us, by saying they are out of context, which really means they do not apply to them. Or those who constantly have to redefine words and meanings, those who reinterpret, misrepresent, and "twist" plain meanings of words and verses in order to try to force their own false doctrine to fit somehow into their own "twisted" cult versions and beliefs.

This is called handling the word of God deceitfully.
 
heavenly_bound said:
yes i am beginning to see that. and i am aslo beginning to understand that its a form of distraction( the name callings)- to distract us from presenting the gospel consistently. Thanks for informing me about these tricks. From now on, i will ignore them and carry on with the work of the Lord. blessed
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Exactly...very astute of you to perceive what is really happening here and the whole purpose is to try to get people into a distraction by their tactics but we are used to them and have dealt with this kind before.

Just ignore their mockings as we know what the purpose of them is.

All is well - just keep giving out the glorious gospel of the grace of Christ and lift up Jesus' finished work on the cross and resurrection and people will see what "spirit" is really behind things. Bless you...:)
 
followjesus said:
there actually is a command/ teaching that keps a repentant and obedient person "perfect" and likens Him to the Father...but you have to accept and obey it.

matthew 5:43-48 "You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’44But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,45that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous.46If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that?47And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that?48Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect."

which the teaching isnt "be perfect" the teaching is to be like God, be merciful even to enemies, forgive, actually treat those who wrong you with mercy, with Loving actions. in obeying this He actually" likens us to be as the Father" God has been merciful to forgive our prior lives, we have all wronged one another, which is a transgression of the Law. therefore we have sinned against God. He has poured mercy out from The body of Jesus Christ upon even the worst, and as all of the gospel, we are to return the same Love He gave. His commands are about treating other people with Loving actions, and in Christ, this is what "perfects" repentance is a command, that is found also in repenting of inward evil like lust, greed pride ect because thats where the actions are born and come forth from.

Perfection is found in " forgiving others when they offend you, in Loving those who dont love us, Just as God has Loved us, who did not Love Him. There will be no sin in eternal Life, there will be nothing but sin in eternal torment, repentance is a wonderful thing, its a gift to submit to God and resist satan, never fails
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It's teaching you, you have to be perfect, as perfect as the Father in Heaven. Now if you don't try to water that down as you do, and try to make it say something less than what it does, then it will do its work by pointing you to the One who is saying it, as your only hope...the perfect One Jesus Christ.
 
The Lord looks upon the heart, and it is the evil thoughts of the heart that defile a man. So why are so many opposed to the purification of the heart/mind, unless of course they have been taught differently that it does not matter by false teachers.

Clean first the inside of the vessel, so that the outsides may become clean.

Matthew 15:18-20

[SUP]18 [/SUP]But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man.

[SUP]19 [/SUP]For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:

[SUP]20 [/SUP]These are the things which defile a man: ...."

To lust in your heart after a woman is considered adultery....


Matthew 5:28
But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

It is the lusts of the flesh and lusts of the eyes that is of the world.


1 John 2:16
For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

If you are still lusting in the heart and thinking evil thoughts it is because you are still of the spirit of the world.



2 Peter 2:14
Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:
 
InSpiritInTruth said:
Will smart quirky comments and short little one liners cleanse your heart from evil?
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telling yourself that you do not sin will not cleanse you from evil either. coming clean with God, confessing ( daily ) what you did wrong, this will draw you to Jesus, telling everyone what a good person you are, how sinful they are, does nothing but feed pride, which, you know, got satan kicked out heaven.
 
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