So you are holding to "instant perfectionism" by "self proclamation" that JP and "hyper grace" teach. And why would you have to be made holy by a purification process if you are already made perfect in an instant??? DOH!
Building upon a lie
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So you are holding to "instant perfectionism" by "self proclamation" that JP and "hyper grace" teach. And why would you have to be made holy by a purification process if you are already made perfect in an instant??? DOH!
So here is a believer who says people are saved no matter their future faith or position
concerned about young believers and their faith.
Now I am concerned about your believers and the slow walk of sanctification, working
through issues and points that need to change. So this is important, but what we have
here is the belief that setting a goal of walking in purity and holiness is impossible so will
break their spirits, when all they need to know is it is ok.
But this is where personal testimony comes in. These believers are defeated and are
shipwrecked, and it is ok, because of grace. So they want young believers who equally find
themselves shipwrecked to be reassured that is how it is meant to be.
But this is the point, this is not how it is going to be if you walk with Jesus in the Spirit.
And the condemnation, which again is unnecessary as those who are saved are saved by God
and not anything we do, but again they do not believe this, and think these "evil" believers need
to be exposed and excluded. These are double minded people which creates lots of confusion
in both their intentions and language.
Sin does not turn a son of God into not being a son. ( If it did - not of us would be a child of God if we were even half way honest - there is no such thing as "sinless perfection in the flesh" )
All sin is destructive to us and ...that includes slander and malice - those are just as deadly as living a homosexual lifestyle. Only the religious mindset which is a Pharisee doesn't even recognize these as being sins.
People sinning means that they are young Christians who have not grown up yet. There are also the so-called self-proclaiming mature ones that slander people and leaders in the body of Christ that they don't agree with one some points.
These are really baby Christians too - even if they can read all the Greek and Hebrew scriptures - or even if they can quote 1/2 the bible or pray in tongues for 5 hours a day. Their slandering, hatred and malice filled words reveal their age in the Lord. 1 Peter 2:1-3
The son does remain forever in the house.
John 8:35-36 (NASB)
[SUP]35 [/SUP] "The slave does not remain in the house forever; the son does remain forever.
[SUP]36 [/SUP] "So if the Son makes you free, you will be free indeed.
Once we are in Christ - we become sons/daughters of God.
Galatians 3:26 (NASB)
[SUP]26 [/SUP] For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus.
Galatians 4:6-7 (NASB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] Because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into our hearts, crying, "Abba! Father!"
[SUP]7 [/SUP] Therefore you are no longer a slave, but a son; and if a son, then an heir through God.
1 John 3:1-2 (KJV)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.
[SUP]2 [/SUP] Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
I encourage us to start to believe in the gospel of the grace of Christ. It is "good news".
If we see ourselves as children of God that we truly are - we will walk as children of our Father and our true nature in our new creation will transform our minds to reflect that nature outwardly in our behavior powered by the Spirit of God inside of us.
All sin is destructive to us and ...that includes slander and malice - those are just as deadly as living a homosexual lifestyle. Only the religious mindset which is a Pharisee doesn't even recognize these as being sins.
People sinning means that they are young Christians who have not grown up yet. There are also the so-called self-proclaiming mature ones that slander people and leaders in the body of Christ that they don't agree with one some points.
These are really baby Christians too - even if they can read all the Greek and Hebrew scriptures - or even if they can quote 1/2 the bible or pray in tongues for 5 hours a day. Their slandering, hatred and malice filled words reveal their age in the Lord. 1 Peter 2:1-3
The son does remain forever in the house.
John 8:35-36 (NASB)
[SUP]35 [/SUP] "The slave does not remain in the house forever; the son does remain forever.
[SUP]36 [/SUP] "So if the Son makes you free, you will be free indeed.
Once we are in Christ - we become sons/daughters of God.
Galatians 3:26 (NASB)
[SUP]26 [/SUP] For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus.
Galatians 4:6-7 (NASB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] Because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into our hearts, crying, "Abba! Father!"
[SUP]7 [/SUP] Therefore you are no longer a slave, but a son; and if a son, then an heir through God.
1 John 3:1-2 (KJV)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.
[SUP]2 [/SUP] Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
I encourage us to start to believe in the gospel of the grace of Christ. It is "good news".
If we see ourselves as children of God that we truly are - we will walk as children of our Father and our true nature in our new creation will transform our minds to reflect that nature outwardly in our behavior powered by the Spirit of God inside of us.
We are sanctified by the Truth and by the Spirit, but perfection is not reached in an instant by self proclamation as "hyper grace" teaches. Also notice that these who fell away from the faith by sinning wilfully were sanctified, meaning they were sealed by the Spirit but later fell away from the faith. This truth OSAS followers try to twist and distort by saying these people were not saved believers, which is totally false.
Hebrews 10:29
Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
Hebrews 10:29
Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
Mankind is all "sanctified/set apart" for the gospel as far as God is concerned. It's up to us to believe it to receive the gospel of the grace of Christ.
Hebrews 10:29 is stating this fact that all man-kind has been set apart or sanctified for the gospel of Christ. Reject Christ sacrifice and there remains no more sacrifice for sins.
Remember the word "sanctified" means to be set apart for use - not sinning as we have been religiously brain-washed into thinking.. I'll prove this out in my next post.
Here Paul is taking about being the husband who is an unbeliever as being sanctified because of the wife.
1 Corinthians 7:14 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] For the unbelieving husband is sanctified through his wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified through her believing husband; for otherwise your children are unclean, but now they are holy.
Hebrews 10:29 is stating this fact that all man-kind has been set apart or sanctified for the gospel of Christ. Reject Christ sacrifice and there remains no more sacrifice for sins.
Remember the word "sanctified" means to be set apart for use - not sinning as we have been religiously brain-washed into thinking.. I'll prove this out in my next post.
Here Paul is taking about being the husband who is an unbeliever as being sanctified because of the wife.
1 Corinthians 7:14 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] For the unbelieving husband is sanctified through his wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified through her believing husband; for otherwise your children are unclean, but now they are holy.
Sanctification is instantaneous while Godliness is progressive.
Sanctification means separated from profane use and set apart for holy use.
That's why in the OT, people and items were sanctified once and set apart unto the Lord. while godliness is the believer's daily walk in God-likeness and manifesting the true nature of the new man in Christ - the new creation - created in righteousness and holiness.
There were garments that were holy - does that mean they were "progressively" getting holy?....No, of course not - they were "set apart" for use.
There were holy days - does that mean the were "progressively" being sanctified? The gold was sanctified in the temple. Lot's of examples of the real use of the term "set apart/sanctified".
Godliness is a better way of describing the process of "working out what already is in us in Christ in our inner man" - the new creation in Christ - created in righteousness and holiness.
Hebrews 10:14 says "we are sanctified" and it is in the present passive - which means we are being "set apart" and it is all done passively to us because we are in Christ and we are being "transformed" by the Holy Spirit as we behold the glory of the Lord as in a mirror. 2 Cor 3:17-18.
We already are sanctified ( set apart ) because we are in Christ now as these scriptures clearly show. Sometimes our religious teachings are ingrained in our minds and when we hear something "different" we balk at them and of course it's heresy to us...as usual...
Christ is our sanctification:
1 Corinthians 1:30 (NASB)
[SUP]30 [/SUP] But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption,
Acts 20:32 ; Acts 26:18; Rom. 15:16; 1 Cor. 1:2; 1 Cor. 6:19; Heb. 10:10; Jude 1:1 - all these scriptures say that we as Christians are already sanctified/set-apart. There are either in the Greek perfect tense or the past tense and they are passive which means it is something done to us - not us doing it.
Now, I believe as we work out the sanctification and life of Christ that is in us in our new creation that is in Christ now - we are then set apart/sanctified for use by the Lord here in this earth.
This is where godliness has great gain not only in this life but in the world to come. God rewards us for the work that He does through and in us. What a great salvation and awesome Lord we belong to!
Sanctification means separated from profane use and set apart for holy use.
That's why in the OT, people and items were sanctified once and set apart unto the Lord. while godliness is the believer's daily walk in God-likeness and manifesting the true nature of the new man in Christ - the new creation - created in righteousness and holiness.
There were garments that were holy - does that mean they were "progressively" getting holy?....No, of course not - they were "set apart" for use.
There were holy days - does that mean the were "progressively" being sanctified? The gold was sanctified in the temple. Lot's of examples of the real use of the term "set apart/sanctified".
Godliness is a better way of describing the process of "working out what already is in us in Christ in our inner man" - the new creation in Christ - created in righteousness and holiness.
Hebrews 10:14 says "we are sanctified" and it is in the present passive - which means we are being "set apart" and it is all done passively to us because we are in Christ and we are being "transformed" by the Holy Spirit as we behold the glory of the Lord as in a mirror. 2 Cor 3:17-18.
We already are sanctified ( set apart ) because we are in Christ now as these scriptures clearly show. Sometimes our religious teachings are ingrained in our minds and when we hear something "different" we balk at them and of course it's heresy to us...as usual...
Christ is our sanctification:
1 Corinthians 1:30 (NASB)
[SUP]30 [/SUP] But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption,
Acts 20:32 ; Acts 26:18; Rom. 15:16; 1 Cor. 1:2; 1 Cor. 6:19; Heb. 10:10; Jude 1:1 - all these scriptures say that we as Christians are already sanctified/set-apart. There are either in the Greek perfect tense or the past tense and they are passive which means it is something done to us - not us doing it.
Now, I believe as we work out the sanctification and life of Christ that is in us in our new creation that is in Christ now - we are then set apart/sanctified for use by the Lord here in this earth.
This is where godliness has great gain not only in this life but in the world to come. God rewards us for the work that He does through and in us. What a great salvation and awesome Lord we belong to!
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Here we have the dilemma.
We are not anti-christians, we are baby christians full of slandering, hatred and malice.
This is odd language because it is the result of a different view of faith and our walk with
the Lord.
I suppose this is an improvement, but still full of condemnation.
And we are saying walking in faith is our life blood but sin leads to the destruction of our faith.
And without faith we have nothing.
It is why David was regarded as righteous even though he sinned, and Abraham was righteous
because He had faith in God regarding Issac. It is our faith which is a revelation from God that
keeps us true to Christ. Because of our faith we can call out to God and trust Him for our
forgiveness through the cross. If we loose this faith we loose everything.
Those that slander others in the body of Christ and are hate and malice filled - are baby Christians and their behavior proves it. If people are offended by this - then let's all grow up in the Lord!
1 Peter 2:1-2 (NASB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] Therefore, putting aside all malice and all deceit and hypocrisy and envy and all slander,
[SUP]2 [/SUP] like newborn babies, long for the pure milk of the word, so that by it you may grow in respect to salvation,
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Your pride is a black hole that dominates your soul.my body is full of God's Light, this the Lord can also do for you if you will only believe in His Word.
Mt 26:41 Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.
Romans 7:9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.
12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.
13 Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.
14 ¶ For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
As long as we are in the body of flesh we will sin. Because of the presence of the Holy Spirit we will be convicted about our sin and confess it to Christ for forgiveness. Chastisement is in store for those who do not heed the Holy Spirits urging to come clean and repent. Never are we condemned a second time for to allow such would mean that the blood of Christ was insufficient to save us eternally.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
Romans 7:9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.
12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.
13 Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.
14 ¶ For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
As long as we are in the body of flesh we will sin. Because of the presence of the Holy Spirit we will be convicted about our sin and confess it to Christ for forgiveness. Chastisement is in store for those who do not heed the Holy Spirits urging to come clean and repent. Never are we condemned a second time for to allow such would mean that the blood of Christ was insufficient to save us eternally.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
Wow Mr Twister you sure twisted that one REAL GOOD! LOL Again, this proves my points in the OP as to what great lengths these deceivers will go to in order to uphold the false doctrines of men. Now Mr. Twister claims all mankind is sanctified in order to dismiss the fact that these persons being spoken of in Hebrews 10 were in fact at one time sanctified by the Holy Spirit but fell away from the faith back to wilful sinning!
They were sanctified by the Spirit....
1 Corinthians 6:11
And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.
Hebrews 10:29
Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
So sorry to hear of the passing of a beloved family member.
Blessings to you and your family in this time of grief and mourning.
Blessings to you and your family in this time of grief and mourning.
Guys who can't bench press 70lbs are often good at condescending people from the safety of cyberspace anonymity.
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Grace777x70 again. (#331)
Ah! I don't mind debating with you because of your attitude! I sure don't always agree, but you are amiable (usually! and reasonable (mostly! and Biblical -- well - on the Biblical part - not all of the time . . . LOL!
Ah! I don't mind debating with you because of your attitude! I sure don't always agree, but you are amiable (usually!
and reasonable (mostly! and Biblical -- well - on the Biblical part - not all of the time . . . LOL!
This is exactly what you are doing to others. We never started with the issues about HG
believers, it is they who set out continually to label people legalists.
I have never condemned legalists or HG believers except for the sin of judging and continual
slander about not believing in Christ for salvation but working for it.
This is why it is so odd to be accused of this sin, when it is the very people who commit it
try to use it against others when they are pointed out as the guilty party.
This is why it is such a double faced position, claiming grace but condemning people of faith.