Avenged Sevenfold

[RickShafer]

Well, it is a mark is it not?
It is a mark under the skin that is permanent.
I can see the resemblance to the mark of the beast. (Though I think that is spiritual)
Tattoos are like a societal sign of - "We are ready to be marked".
I remember when they got popular. They weren't always.
'Tattoo You' by the Rolling Stones came out, shortly later people were being marked.
I'm not saying the song had anything to do with causing it to become a fad, and then a way of life for some.
I think it was more of a secular prophecy.
Believe it or not, there was a time in the not to distant past when only sailors and fourth world savages had tattoos.

 

[zaoman32]

Regardless of where tattoos originated or how they became a fad, what was once, is not what is. There is very little scriptural support to call them evil, and it was written at a time when it was practiced as a sign of worship to other gods. Again, what was is not the same was what is. Tattoos can be used as a vehicle to minister to others, and even one Pentecostal Christian stated that he had no desire to tattoo himself until he became a Christian, and as he did get tattoos of bible verses he always found what he needed to help him through addiction. Tattoos are not evil, they're not a sign of paganism, and they're not a one way ticket to hell

 

[Nautilus]

Avenged Sevenfold?
Tattoos and steroids.
- Two ensigns of men minding the spirit and not the flesh.
- - I'm sure they love the Lord though.

Steroids? Where is that from?

 

[RickShafer]

I never said they were a one way ticket to hell.
I just said they are a sign. That's all.
Read the literal greek word for 'mark' as used in the scripture referencing the mark of the beast and it is rendered as
a subdermal brand-(as in a cowbrand).
It's literally translates as tattoo.
Now, this is just the word they use for a spiritual reality, that being that the soul is marked or branded.
So do I think tattoos are the mark of the beast? No!
But they are a sign of a society that is outward in it's judgements, and skin oriented.
Arguments?
There is a reason why primitive tribes pierce and tattoo themselves.
If I had to tattoo the Bible on myself to remember it I'd be in trouble, because there is not enough room, and I couldn't read it all if there was.
It's called books.
It's called civilization.
It's called sowing to the spirit.

 

[zaoman32]

Steroids? Where is that from?

Yet another good point.

 

[RickShafer]

No, I guess they aren't on steroids.
My bad on that.
But the spiritual reality of tattoos as a marker of a society that is barbarous stands.

 

[zaoman32]

Where in the world is there any statement of tattoos having any spiritual significance?

 

[RickShafer]

Here's a plain verse in many translations - (so none of them are lost):

New International Version (©2011)
"'Do not cut your bodies for the dead or put tattoo marks on yourselves. I am the LORD.
New Living Translation (©2007)
"Do not cut your bodies for the dead, and do not mark your skin with tattoos. I am the LORD.
English Standard Version (©2001)
You shall not make any cuts on your body for the dead or tattoo yourselves: I am the LORD.
New American Standard Bible (©1995)
'You shall not make any cuts in your body for the dead nor make any tattoo marks on yourselves: I am the LORD.
King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD.
Holman Christian Standard Bible (©2009)
You are not to make gashes on your bodies for the dead or put tattoo marks on yourselves; I am Yahweh."
International Standard Version (©2012)
"You are not to make incisions in your flesh on account of the dead nor submit to cuts or tattoos. I am the LORD.
NET Bible (©2006)
You must not slash your body for a dead person or incise a tattoo on yourself. I am the LORD.
GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
Never slash your body to mourn the dead, and never get a tattoo. I am the LORD.
King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
You shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor tattoo any marks upon you: I am the LORD.
American King James Version
You shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks on you: I am the LORD.
American Standard Version
Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am Jehovah.
Douay-Rheims Bible
You shall not make any cuttings in your flesh, for the dead, neither shall you make in yourselves any figures or marks: I am the Lord.
Darby Bible Translation
And cuttings for a dead person shall ye not make in your flesh, nor put any tattoo writing upon you: I am Jehovah.
English Revised Version
Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD.
Webster's Bible Translation
Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD.
World English Bible
"'You shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor tattoo any marks on you. I am Yahweh.
Young's Literal Translation
And a cutting for the soul ye do not put in your flesh; and a writing, a cross-mark, ye do not put on you; I am Jehovah.

Oh.....but that's just the law that was done away with right?

Also look up the Greek word for 'mark' in Revelations, "Stigma" - prick.
and "Charagma" - etching.

 

[zaoman32]

So that automatically means all tattoos have a dark spiritual relevance?

 

[RickShafer]

It is what it is.
I've said my piece and shown you in the Bible.
I don't think tattoos are the mark of the beast. -That is Spiritual.
But I do think they are a sign of a society that is based on outward markings as a signifier of who they are.
Much like uniforms.
Instead of inward.
Flesh - Outward
Spirit- Inward

 

[ObsidianJM]

These guys really confuse me...they have so much Christian themed lyrics, yet I was at one of their concerts and they were selling shirts that said "god hates us". Not sure what to think of that...its obviously wrong but I dont get why they would be praying one minute and then telling the world that God hates everyone the next...kinda messed up.

I'm not saying I condone the lyrics to God Hates Us, because I don't. But they wrote that song after Jimmy "The Rev" Sullvian's death. It was kind of an outcry of "Why did this happen?" I mean, I think we all go through times in our lives when we question why God would allow something, even though the truth is that He doesn't.

That being said, Avenged Sevenfold's members have all had backgrounds based in faith. I think they just got hurt somewhere and it twisted their views on the subject. I love this band, and I think they need prayer. A lot of prayer.

 

[Grey]

I like them when I was a theist, and still like them a bit now. But FYI its pretty clear they have christian themes, but they certainly do drugs, I mean sadly look at how the Rev died of a Oxycodone overdose.

 

[Exoaria]

They got their name from Genesis. That's it.
They have religious themed songs, but they don't use their music to bring glory to God or Jesus. Therefore they are not a Christian band, just a band that has influence in their music towards Abrahamic and Jewish religion.
I mean they had a whole album dedicated to Sodom and Gomorrah.

Having said that, I enjoy their music from time to time. Not a huge fan anymore. They're talented and are good at writing songs which are both catchy and energetic.

 

[Rolnik]

I used to like them but saddly won't recommand them as I've seen the clip from "a little piece from heaven" who contained some horrible and cruel scene !

 

[everyonesfriend4life]

The drummer "the Rev" was about to die anyway from an enlarged heart and didn't want to suffer. I agree they have Christian themes in some songs like "Dear God" and "Chapter Four" from the Cain and Abel story.

 

[SandraSevenfold]

I saw them way back in the day shortly after waking the fallen. There's a line in the song unholy confessions, "I know the way to go, but there's no God in me." I don't know how much clearer you can get. I'm not going to say they're all evil and you should never listen to that garbage, but use some wisdom too. If they've made it clear in their lyrics they don't follow God, and they constantly use themes of sexual immorality, violence, and anger, then it's pretty clear they're not christians regardless of how many christian themed references they have. Machine Head has a song called Be Still and Know, of which the lyrics are very bible based, but they also have a song on the same CD stating that God never answered them, and a song on a previous album stating "This lifetime of sorrow, God let the angels die". Again, pretty obvious they're not christians. Contemplating whether or not a band is "christian" despite the band making it very clear they aren't only leads to self-deception and delusion.

The lyrics are not "I know the way to go, but there's no God in me". The lyrics are "I know the way to go, no one's guiding me". Please check the lyrics before posting what you think you heard, because that can be very misleading.
Though the band is not a religious band they still have some very good songs referring to biblical texts. What I do as a christian is to avoid listening to songs that contradict the way Jesus wants me to live.

 

[Nautilus]

That really wasn't worth resurrecting a thread that had been dead for over a year and a half.

 

[Rodiack98]

I myself am not a Christian, but I'm not here to bash on Christianity. Before I begin I think Christianity is a wonderful thing, it brings people together and helps people through hard times and helps people to better themselves. I myself do not like organized religion as you have to sect off peoples different believes of god into different precincts of the same belief. But anyway, a7x has been one of my favorite bands for about 4 years now and I dokt understand the people on here who will go as far as to say they are not acceptable because of song names and that you won't listen to the music because it's "un Christian". My father is a devout follower of Christ and always has been. And I grew up with him listening to Metallica, slipknot, korn, pantera, and many other heavy metal bands. I myself listen to much heavier music, my favorite band being Lamb of God (and they are far from Christian btw, despite the name) and they talk about murder and drugs and they have tattoos and curse a lot and scream in almost every song. Their most famous song is actually called "walk with me in hell". But I don't have any desire to go out and do any of these things, I think they're wrong, but when life knocks you down then kicks you while you're on the floor, you're not a happy person. I've had problems with depression and thoughts of suicide for a long time but anytime I'm in a rough spot (almost always), I turn on the heaviest, darkest, violent music I have and it helps me fell better. Because these people get out your aggression for you through music. Basically what I'm saying is, you can listen to heavy metal, no matter how blasphemic the lyrical content, and still be a devout and loving Christian. It's your actions and love for the god you believe in that make you a Christian, not what kind of music you enjoy. Keep that in mind when you try to mark lovers of heavy metal like myself as heathens. \m/

 

[Ahwatukee]

Hello Rodiack98,

I myself am not a Christian, but I'm not here to bash on Christianity. Before I begin I think Christianity is a wonderful thing, it brings people together and helps people through hard times and helps people to better themselves.

Regarding the above, though being in Christ does result in those things that you mentioned, you left out the most important result of being in Christ, which is escaping condemning judgment, which is guaranteed for those not in Christ. Jesus said that the road that leads to destruction is broad and the gate is wide and many enter in. The reason for this is that, everyone who comes into the world is already on that road to destruction by default and that because of sin i.e. You don't have to do anything to get on it. However, you do have to do something to get off of it, which God provided through faith in Christ. My point being is that, for the person who is not in Christ, condemning judgment is guaranteed. Once the individual takes that last breath, their record is sealed. But I'm sure that you have heard all of this from your dad, but I just needed to say it anyway.

I pray that you will make a decision for Christ before you do take that last breath.

 

[Rodiack98]

Hello Rodiack98,



Regarding the above, though being in Christ does result in those things that you mentioned, you left out the most important result of being in Christ, which is escaping condemning judgment, which is guaranteed for those not in Christ. Jesus said that the road that leads to destruction is broad and the gate is wide and many enter in. The reason for this is that, everyone who comes into the world is already on that road to destruction by default and that because of sin i.e. You don't have to do anything to get on it. However, you do have to do something to get off of it, which God provided through faith in Christ. My point being is that, for the person who is not in Christ, condemning judgment is guaranteed. Once the individual takes that last breath, their record is sealed. But I'm sure that you have heard all of this from your dad, but I just needed to say it anyway.

I pray that you will make a decision for Christ before you do take that last breath.[/COLOR]

I have been taught through years of church camps, going to church, talking to preists, and catholic schools, that god is all forgiving if you repent. But regardless, is god really going to condemn us for enjoying music that talks about things he doesn't like? Doesn't that seem a bit harsh? To shut out all things in life that people wrote in a book and said god doesn't allow us to enjoy. That may sound like god bashing but I mean no disrespect to the religion. But I drink, smoke, have premarital sex (with partners of both genders I may add), and listen to heavy metal music every day. Does this mean that I'm going to hell? Is god going to banish me to the depths of Satan because I enjoy the pleasures of what his children have created? If we are his children shouldn't he love us and everything we've created and all the ways we've found to express ourselves, especially in music?