Word of Faith - a Look at what the Bible says!

[LaurenTM]

Are you able to find even one?

haha

for some reason, the hospital staff will not allow me to plunder their records

don't know why...........

 

[1ofthem]

it's a log

pull the LOG out of your own eye

can't see the forest for the trees!

during this 'festive' season that some like to call demonic, logs can also be made out of cake with fancy decorations

well, some versions have a plank or a beam

here's the new American standard which features the 'log'

You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother's eye.

Matthew 7:5

LOL...ok you got me...I went off memory and it failed me a little cause a log is much bigger than a stick and would definitely cause a bigger problem with one's vision...

So I'm sorry about that...I guess I'll have to say what I just said in my other post, but too a much bigger extent...

 

[garee]

Would you believe it if you saw it?

I have a friend who had a metal rod in his arm. He used to put magnets on it, completely dissolved after prayer. His eyesight was greatly restored and his body greatly healed. That's just one miracle I know of, but would you believe it if you saw it?

Seeing something does not mean God performed it.We walk by the faith of Christ which comes from hearing God, not by sight.

The Son of man experienced seeing all the kingdoms of the world and all the glory of them without moving one inch. He said again, it is written, the father of lies, the god of this world, fled. .

Any healing is considered a miracle. Miracles are simply miracles,nothing more and nothing less.God is God nothing less.

Because God is no longer bringing any new revelations to confirm His purpose it would be a evil generation (natural man) that does seek them, as to that in which scriptures calls lying signs and wonders.

I would suggest we must be careful and prayerful as to how we hear God, many false prophets are in the world, as many antichrists.

 

[LaurenTM]

LOL...ok you got me...I went off memory and it failed me a little cause a log is much bigger than a stick and would definitely cause a bigger problem with one's vision...

So I'm sorry about that...I guess I'll have to say what I just said in my other post, but too a much bigger extent...

I do that to entertain myself with a joke and meme insertion

I'm not at all trying to nit pick...no worries!

I have the proverbial memory like an elephant ... no trunk though!

 

[LaurenTM]

I would suggest we must be careful and prayerful as to how we hear God, many false prophets are in the world, as many antichrists.

just so!

there really is no 'safe' place where we just let it all hang out and we know all that goes on is God IMO

but many believe that it is ok to do so

deception is already rampant and not going to get better

hang on to your Bible

 

[garee]

Next, we will look at the sin and sickness connection. This doesn't mean sick people sinned. It does mean sickness entered the world through sin. But now we are the righteousness of God in CHRIST.

Yes still living in a body of death that God corrupted. The righteousness we do have of Christ is not in respect to the flesh.The rate of corruption remains the same.

Iniquity and healing:

Psalm 103:2Bless the Lord, O my soul,
and forget not all his benefits,
3who forgives all your iniquity,
who heals all your diseases,

James 4:14Is anyone among you sick? Let him call for the elders of the church, and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord. 15And the prayer of faith will save the one who is sick, and the Lord will raise him up. And if he has committed sins, he will be forgiven. 16Therefore,confess your sins to one another and pray for one another, that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person has great power as it is working.

We know James is talking about healing (not spiritual healing in this context) and he links it to confessing sins to each other.

I do not think we can separate the spiritual from the physical. Either one can help relieve the suffering of other. If one part suffers (the physical or spiritual )the whole suffers. A broken spirit dries up the bone, the blood factory.

Neither of the spiritual or the physical is attributed to the hands of men. We have the power or authority of Christ in us but that power is not of us .

 

[trofimus]

haha

for some reason, the hospital staff will not allow me to plunder their records

don't know why...........

Of course not But the healed ones have their medical records. Can you find the healed person, at least one, who is able to show it?

 

[wanderer6059]

Nobody has responded to my question about medical evidence of healing in the WoF movement... so what should I think of it?

That you are believing in a theory that actually does not work in the real life?

There should be hundreds of thousand miracles if what we can see in the mass healing sessions is true and not just suggestion or trick.

hear are a few sites that talk about medical evidence of healing and prayer.

Best Documented Healing site!! , Studies Prove the Healing Power of Prayer , Ten healing miracles , Can Prayer Heal? .

and here is a video of Todd Whites on healing. there are more of his and otheres.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VDKLYFYc40Q

 

[Depleted]

Nobody has responded to my question about medical evidence of healing in the WoF movement... so what should I think of it?

That you are believing in a theory that actually does not work in the real life?

There should be hundreds of thousand miracles if what we can see in the mass healing sessions is true and not just suggestion or trick.

I'm not a WoFer. I despise it. But even I see that fallacy of that request.

God does heal. I've experienced it and have received it. I was healed of recurring UTI. My doctor easily agreed, but he was also a Christian. (His wife was my matron-of-honor.) He never recorded it because... why? We both know God heals, and then suddenly I stopped calling him every other month for antibiotics, because I didn't need them anymore.

And, God does heal. Hubby laid hands on his roommate in the hospital the night hubby broke his back, because God told him to and his roommate was groaning LOUDLY in the grips of pain from goat. Hubby laid hands on him and prayed, and the guy went to sleep. Next morning hubby is woken up by some guy shouting in the hallways that God healed him from the pain. And God did. The guy still had the goat, but it no longer hurt. IF the doctors bought that he was healed miraculously, how do they record it? AND, if they recorded it, it's private information, so they can't really announce it to the world.

Last November, hubby had such a bad heart attack, he remembers being wheeled to another hospital for something -- he doesn't remember what, but I told him -- and heard someone say, "This one isn't going to make it." Earlier, I heard his ER doctor telling him he's dying. I can still see the expressions on two doctors' faces when they braced me for his eminent death. I believed them. I knew what was going on and hubby should be dead. And I still remember the shock in the voice of the ambulance driver, (probably the guy who said hubby wasn't going to make it to surgery), when they realized that guy in that bed was the same guy they transported six weeks earlier. All they did was transport patients a block away every day, all day. So, the only reason they'd remember him is because "he's one we lost."

Lots of miracles since then. He wasn't supposed to get past catheters, but did after 18 hours. He wasn't supposed to get past baby food. Never had any, (everyone grounded real food for him lol), but he's eating eggs and sausage behind me. He was going to be stuck somewhere between walker and cane. The cane is gathering dust and he danced for his PTs. Everyone who treated him early on recognized him as we walk through the hallways. They all come running up and hug him, because they're so surprised to see him. Doctors have read his files and told him he's not supposed to be alive. And he credits it all to God.

And they blast me for smoking, (I've tried. God knows I've tried), but God gave him one special gift. He had no choice but to quit, since he was sedated for the first six weeks. BUT, he has no desire to smoke. That is HUGE! And he tells them God lifted that desire from him.

The doctors just smile empathetically. They have no idea how to deal with God or miracle.

So, exactly how does one get accredited proof? Because God does heal, even when the medical community does or doesn't believe it. And if they do? Confidentiality means something big to them too.

 

[LaurenTM]

Of course not But the healed ones have their medical records. Can you find the healed person, at least one, who is able to show it?

I don't go looking to tell the truth

I would think that is up to the person to have the records...before and after...to show for 'proof'

at any rate, why are you asking me this? I'm not a WOF'er

I do believe God heals..I have seen Him do so...I don't need documented evidence if I see it with my own eyes

God is merciful..

 

[trofimus]

I'm not a WoFer. I despise it. But even I see that fallacy of that request.

God does heal. I've experienced it and have received it. I was healed of recurring UTI. My doctor easily agreed, but he was also a Christian. (His wife was my matron-of-honor.) He never recorded it because... why?

I am not sure what you mean by "he never recorded it... why".

Every visit to doctor must be documented with the results of examination. And you get the paper with the result or you can demand one.

Also, your doctors have your full medical history with all changes you had.

Or is it different in the USA?

 

[notuptome]

Would you believe it if you saw it?

I have a friend who had a metal rod in his arm. He used to put magnets on it, completely dissolved after prayer. His eyesight was greatly restored and his body greatly healed. That's just one miracle I know of, but would you believe it if you saw it?

Really? I think you got played. The steel that is used in surgery is stainless steel and sometime titanium. Neither of these metals are magnetic. Stainless steel or titanium would need to be of a very low grade to produce the results you claim.

God heals or none are healed. God does not do parlor tricks for the amusement of children.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[stonesoffire]

[video]https://youtu.be/8KQ2NWKcD3s[/video]

 

[Depleted]

I am not sure what you mean by "he never recorded it... why".

Every visit to doctor must be documented with the results of examination. And you get the paper with the result or you can demand one.

Also, your doctors have your full medical history with all changes you had.

Or is it different in the USA?

If he recorded it, what is he recording? I didn't call for more antibiotics? (I had it so often, he didn't make me come into his office, since the only place I felt safe was a couple of feet away from the bathroom.)

Doctors record "Temperature is..." "BP = XXX/XX," "Patient came in complaining of...." They don't record, "99.9% of my patients didn't come to see me today."

Your doctor has not put something in your file for every day you haven't seen him/her. Just a waste of space. In like kind, he didn't record that I never showed up again for another UTI. The only reason he found out was because we were friends, and I've been bragging on what God did ever since.

And, yes. Maybe the US is different than where you live. I can't prove I had a goiter in the 1990's because our doctors delete records that old from the system. I couldn't even prove the same hospital has been doing my mammograms for the last 25 years, because they delete their records after seven years. My old doctor? I haven't seen him in 30 years. He moved away to a place 1500 miles from here that didn't use computers. But, unless he retired young, he did end up requiring a computer. He had a whole wall of files for his patients the last time I saw him. Add 30 years to that, and you begin to see a need for computer space over paper space.

 

[trofimus]

Hm, maybe our european system is more centralized and more documented.

That could explain why there are so many health preachers and churces with millions of members and huge shows in the USA and virtually none in the EU.

I understand your post, though. You are talking about a health problem that is quite subjective - complains, pains etc. Of course such things can be "healed" by some preacher suggestion or just with changed lifestyle.

Thats why I am talking rather about organs healing. Eyes, heart, brain, broken bones etc. Something that does not go away after some good tea or hypnosis

Such medical records should be very easy for the healed ones to show.

 

[Angela53510]

hear are a few sites that talk about medical evidence of healing and prayer.

Best Documented Healing site!! , Studies Prove the Healing Power of Prayer , Ten healing miracles , Can Prayer Heal? .

and here is a video of Todd Whites on healing. there are more of his and otheres.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VDKLYFYc40Q

First, I see no medical proof in the article you posted, just testimonials. Have you ever heard of placebo effect? Very interesting phenomena. I heard the head of the rheumatology department speak about this. When the first double blind studies of Remicade were started at his university, one group got the drug (a biologic) and the other group didn't. Neither the patients nor the medical staff knew who got the drug (hence double blind). Another control was xraying the hands of all the patients in the study.

After a year, 52% of the people in the placebo group felt "significant" improvement in their RA. But the second xrays told a different story. These people who literally thought they were better, showed further joint erosions and deformities. In fact, the study had to be discontinued because it was not ethical to leave people thinking they were better, when they weren't.

So how many of these placebo effects are in these un-medically documented healings, I might ask?

As for people being healed, no one is saying that people are not. I do know people who do not believe in healing at all, but they are not on this thread. So, beware your arguments. We are arguing againt the entitlement that says "name it and claim it, " not that God never heals. He heals when it is his will, not because we command it, or speak it into existence, or whatever slight of hand these shysters are trying to make us believe.

I remember back when I was a young Christian, I was leading the worship at a revival meeting. There was an East Indian Hindu couple that came with their 4 year old son for prayer, who had been to the doctor and diagnosed as completely deaf in one ear, and almost deaf in the other ear.

The evangelist prayed, and the next day, the young boy could hear. They took him immediately to the doctor, who had him retested. He could hear perfectly in both ears. That was not coincidence or placebo effect!

The family came back to the meeting, to share their son had been healed, and the evangelist led them to the Lord. The next day, they brought more and more of the extended family, and they all got saved. Last I heard the child had grown up and was still serving God, along with his whole family.

So that glorified God! And that is the purpose of miracles - to be a sign to the unbelieving. These people did not believe in Jesus till he reached down and did an undeniable miracle. Of course, God also heals Christians when it is is will. But sometimes he has a much better plan for our lives. Physical sickness is not the worst thing that can happen to us. Sometimes, physical sickness results in a healing of our souls, and growth in character. That lasts for eternity, whereas this shallow WoF doctrine doesn't hold up to scrutiny at all.

 

[Depleted]

Hm, maybe our european system is more centralized and more documented.

That could explain why there are so many health preachers and churces with millions of members and huge shows in the USA and virtually none in the EU.

I understand your post, though. You are talking about a health problem that is quite subjective - complains, pains etc. Of course such things can be "healed" by some preacher suggestion or just with changed lifestyle.

Thats why I am talking rather about organs healing. Eyes, heart, brain, broken bones etc. Something that does not go away after some good tea or hypnosis

Such medical records should be very easy for the healed ones to show.

Yet hubby should be dead, shouldn't be able to chew and swallow whole food, we should still have a porch stacked with walkers and a wheelchair, and I should be able to place in a catheter doesn't do it for you?

Yeah, pretty much the problem I said the first time I responded to your request. Even files of proof doesn't prove anything. I get that with non believing medical professionals. It baffles me from someone who proclaims to be a believer though.

 

[LaurenTM]

As for people being healed, no one is saying that people are not. I do know people who do not believe in healing at all, but they are not on this thread. So, beware your arguments. We are arguing againt the entitlement that says "name it and claim it, " not that God never heals. He heals when it is his will, not because we command it, or speak it into existence, or whatever slight of hand these shysters are trying to make us believe.

exactly

disinformation is like slight of hand only with words

 

[garee]

I'm not a WoFer. I despise it. But even I see that fallacy of that request.

God does heal. I've experienced it and have received it. I was healed of recurring UTI. My doctor easily agreed, but he was also a Christian. (His wife was my matron-of-honor.) He never recorded it because... why? We both know God heals, and then suddenly I stopped calling him every other month for antibiotics, because I didn't need them anymore.

And, God does heal. Hubby laid hands on his roommate in the hospital the night hubby broke his back, because God told him to and his roommate was groaning LOUDLY in the grips of pain from goat. Hubby laid hands on him and prayed, and the guy went to sleep. Next morning hubby is woken up by some guy shouting in the hallways that God healed him from the pain. And God did. The guy still had the goat, but it no longer hurt. IF the doctors bought that he was healed miraculously, how do they record it? AND, if they recorded it, it's private information, so they can't really announce it to the world.

Last November, hubby had such a bad heart attack, he remembers being wheeled to another hospital for something -- he doesn't remember what, but I told him -- and heard someone say, "This one isn't going to make it." Earlier, I heard his ER doctor telling him he's dying. I can still see the expressions on two doctors' faces when they braced me for his eminent death. I believed them. I knew what was going on and hubby should be dead. And I still remember the shock in the voice of the ambulance driver, (probably the guy who said hubby wasn't going to make it to surgery), when they realized that guy in that bed was the same guy they transported six weeks earlier. All they did was transport patients a block away every day, all day. So, the only reason they'd remember him is because "he's one we lost."

Lots of miracles since then. He wasn't supposed to get past catheters, but did after 18 hours. He wasn't supposed to get past baby food. Never had any, (everyone grounded real food for him lol), but he's eating eggs and sausage behind me. He was going to be stuck somewhere between walker and cane. The cane is gathering dust and he danced for his PTs. Everyone who treated him early on recognized him as we walk through the hallways. They all come running up and hug him, because they're so surprised to see him. Doctors have read his files and told him he's not supposed to be alive. And he credits it all to God.

And they blast me for smoking, (I've tried. God knows I've tried), but God gave him one special gift. He had no choice but to quit, since he was sedated for the first six weeks. BUT, he has no desire to smoke. That is HUGE! And he tells them God lifted that desire from him.

The doctors just smile empathetically. They have no idea how to deal with God or miracle.

So, exactly how does one get accredited proof? Because God does heal, even when the medical community does or doesn't believe it. And if they do? Confidentiality means something big to them too.

There is no outward sign that proves a person has the Spirit of Christ. Attributing the work of God to the apostles is to blaspheme the name by which we are called . Making gods in the likeness of men for a work the Holy Spirit performs is forbidden.

The laying on of hands is symbolic used in various parables. God is not served (does not heal ) in respect to human hands as If Christ needed something form the clay he is forming Christ in. He satisfies all needs but has no needs of His own.

 

[Depleted]

There is no outward sign that proves a person has the Spirit of Christ. Attributing the work of God to the apostles is to blaspheme the name by which we are called . Making gods in the likeness of men for a work the Holy Spirit performs is forbidden.

The laying on of hands is symbolic used in various parables. God is not served (does not heal ) in respect to human hands as If Christ needed something form the clay he is forming Christ in. He satisfies all needs but has no needs of His own.

I bet you could slice the frog hair in four if you sharpened your scalpel even more.

(In case the reference wasn't clear, I'm referencing "slicing it finer than frog hair.")

Your nitpicking past reality before you even selected "Reply with Quote." Most morons would have caught on to laying on of hands as something God has us do for him to show forth his glory.