Why Don’t We See Miracles Like the Apostles Did?

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88

Senior Member
Nov 14, 2016
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Apostles are part of the ministries to perfect the Church (Ephesians 4)---- the Apostles of the Lamb are the Churches foundation--- there were other Apostles in Acts--- check it out----the Word says these signs will follow those who believe---signs have a purpose today---- try preaching to Muslims overseas without miracles----a large amount of Muslims are getting converted through the Supernatural----- dreams and visions...a guy I know from school raised a baby from the dead in Africa...
 
Nov 12, 2015
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Apostles are part of the ministries to perfect the Church (Ephesians 4)---- the Apostles of the Lamb are the Churches foundation--- there were other Apostles in Acts--- check it out----the Word says these signs will follow those who believe---signs have a purpose today---- try preaching to Muslims overseas without miracles----a large amount of Muslims are getting converted through the Supernatural----- dreams and visions...a guy I know from school raised a baby from the dead in Africa...

What ones have you had in your life personally? I know sometimes they were huge for us but we think they will sound silly so we don't share them, but hey, no one scoffed at mine. :)
 
Nov 12, 2015
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What are you advocating? Believing God that when His word is preached men will be convicted of sin, righteousness and judgment to come? Give up all the theatrics and just declare the word of God in the church? Disciple believers to serve the Lord as a witness and testimony to His saving grace? Live holy and pure lives like they did in the fifties?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Grumpy cat, grumpy cat. Why are you always so grumpy?
 
D

Depleted

Guest
I have a funny miracle, believe it or not.

A few days after I believed, I prayed to God about a friend who had come to my house crying the night before, very upset about something involving her children and a neighbor. I had just so recently believed that I did not know how to pray for her so I just asked Him to show me what I could do or say for Him, to her.

The next morning I was driving to work and an odd thing happened. I suddenly understood many things at once. I knew why what had happened to her happened, why the man did what he did to her sons, what she should do, and a whole lot more. I wasn't even thinking about her. All this information and knowledge just dumped into my brain from somewhere.

At the same time, I felt waves washing over me and extreme goosebumps even though it was very hot outside. This happened simultaneously with the information. I didn't even have time to be shocked or wonder at this new thing I'd never felt before in my life that had me crying and laughing at the same time. I just said, without any thought: okay, I'll tell her!

I continued down the road and was marveling over what this feeling was. It kept washing over me very strongly and I just basked in it. At some point, I was thinking I couldn't wait to get home to tell her what God had given me to tell her, and a crash happened (not a car crash) in which I began to think: oh...she will think I am crazy. Who just walks up to a person and says, God explained such and such to me and wants you to know thus and thus?

So I said, God, I know that was You just then. But I DON'T know for sure that I am supposed to tell her all this. I don't even know if she believes in you because I haven't even told anyone that I do now. So unless you specifically let me know I'm supposed to tell her, I'm not going to.

At that exact second, traffic stopped and I was sitting under an underpass, thinking hard about how foolish I would look or even how insane I would look. So I said again, yeah, I won't do it unless you specifically tell me I should. Then traffic started forward and I saw the license plate in front of me. It was: HVN SNT. And the waves, that had stopped, began again, with goosebumps and tears.

I know it sounds funny, but that was my miracle. HVN SNT...heaven sent. :)
Something like that the time hubby prayed for his hospital roommate with the gout. The man was screaming in pain, which interfered with hubby sleeping. So hubby asked God to quiet the guy so he could sleep, and God told him to pray for him.

Hubby got embarrassed, but got out of his bed, (still Quasimoto, with his broken back, but he wasn't paralyzed), and told the guy he would pray for him. The guy said, "Okay."

Hubby goes out to the waiting room, lights up a cigarette, and prays for the guy. 15 minutes of earnest prayer for the guy with the gout.

When he returns, the guy is still screaming in pain, and hubby says to God, "But I prayed!"

God said, "Lay hands on him and pray."

Hubby's embarrassed, but tells the guy. And the guy says, "Good. I've been waiting."

All kinds of embarrassed then, but he lays hands on him and prays... out loud!

The guy was asleep before the prayer was done.

And then woke hubby up the next day because he was yelling in the hallway, "God healed me. God healed me! No more pain!"

(Hubby had a terrible time sleeping that night. lol)
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
12,170
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What are you advocating? Believing God that when His word is preached men will be convicted of sin, righteousness and judgment to come? Give up all the theatrics and just declare the word of God in the church? Disciple believers to serve the Lord as a witness and testimony to His saving grace? Live holy and pure lives like they did in the fifties?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
what i am advocating is miracles happen all the time and Salvation is one. The Bible says : Ps 62:7
"In God is my salvation and my glory: the rock of my strength, and my refuge, is in God."

Ps 74:12 " For God is my King of old, working salvation in the midst of the earth."

in Jonah 2:9 the word salvation means "yĕshuw`ah"

IN the New Testamant "Saved " means sō'-zō in the Greek .

saved means to : save , make whole be healed and to save a suffering one (from perishing), i.e. one suffering from disease, to make well, heal, restore to health.
now look at the word

Miracle :

Old testament

Exd 7:9 When Pharaoh shall speak unto you, saying, Shew a miracle for you: then thou shalt say unto Aaron, Take thy rod, and cast itbefore Pharaoh, and it shall become a serpent.


" wonder (as a special display of God's power)

New testament

John 6:14
"Then those men, when they had seen the miracle that Jesus did, said, This is of a truth that prophet that should come into the world."

the word Miracle means :
a sign, mark, token of miracles and wonders by which God authenticates the men sent by him, or by which men prove that the cause they are pleading is God's.

[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans serif] In both the Old and NEW Testament the synopsis of healing, Miracle, and salvation are closely knitted.

So as I see in the Bible God is performing miracles , works, and wonders each day.

God is able to keep this world moving , the seas from over taking land, God is able to save delivery, and set free. HE our Lord is still calling , still saving, and still healing SOZO!!!

i am advocating the God I serve is the same God yesterday today and forever amen.
[/FONT]
 
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Depleted

Guest
I had something similar happen to me, although what I went through is nothing like the cancer treatments you are enduring.

Someone physically assaulted me. They had me backed into a corner, hitting me, and I was panicked. I got free and fled. I went to a Walgreens parking lot and sat in my car.

I wasn't distressed, and I wasn't crying, but I was...confused. And I said, where WERE you, Lord? Where were you?
And He spoke to me strongly, like you describe. He said: I was right there. You didn't hit her back, did you?
And his response to me after I was gang raped was, "Your head is still attached and you're home."

(One of the guys raised an ax, and then a bat over my head, and I kept moving my hood off my neck so he'd get a clear accurate shot.)
 
Nov 12, 2015
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I didn't understand that whole story the first time I read it when you posted it earlier! It's pretty funny.
It reminds me of Teresa of Avila when she was complaining to God about something and He said to her, I treat all my friends this way. And she said, yes, Lord, it is a wonder you have any.
 
Nov 12, 2015
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And his response to me after I was gang raped was, "Your head is still attached and you're home."

(One of the guys raised an ax, and then a bat over my head, and I kept moving my hood off my neck so he'd get a clear accurate shot.)
Wow, lynn...
I find myself marveling more and more over being able to endure things that before, I would have fallen apart over, but since I met Him and have come to know Him more, they don't destroy me. It's a miracle in itself...
I become more upset at things that happen to others than I do at some things that happen to me...
 

Desertsrose

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2016
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what i am advocating is miracles happen all the time and Salvation is one. The Bible says : Ps 62:7
"In God is my salvation and my glory: the rock of my strength, and my refuge, is in God."

Ps 74:12 " For God is my King of old, working salvation in the midst of the earth."

in Jonah 2:9 the word salvation means "yĕshuw`ah"

IN the New Testamant "Saved " means sō'-zō in the Greek .

saved means to : save , make whole be healed and to save a suffering one (from perishing), i.e. one suffering from disease, to make well, heal, restore to health.
now look at the word

Miracle :

Old testament

Exd 7:9 When Pharaoh shall speak unto you, saying, Shew a miracle for you: then thou shalt say unto Aaron, Take thy rod, and cast itbefore Pharaoh, and it shall become a serpent.


" wonder (as a special display of God's power)

New testament

John 6:14
"Then those men, when they had seen the miracle that Jesus did, said, This is of a truth that prophet that should come into the world."

the word Miracle means :
a sign, mark, token of miracles and wonders by which God authenticates the men sent by him, or by which men prove that the cause they are pleading is God's.

In both the Old and NEW Testament the synopsis of healing, Miracle, and salvation are closely knitted.

So as I see in the Bible God is performing miracles , works, and wonders each day.

God is able to keep this world moving , the seas from over taking land, God is able to save delivery, and set free. HE our Lord is still calling , still saving, and still healing SOZO!!!

i am advocating the God I serve is the same God yesterday today and forever amen.

GLORY HALLELUJAH - AMEN!
 
M

MattTooFor

Guest
You are confusing the meaning of the word "gift" - there are different Greek words which convey different meanings.
I'm not quite clear on what your argument is here. As far as I can tell, my argument still stands: If someone, for example, has the biblically-specified "gift of hospitality", they can implement that gift at will.

1 Peter 4:9-10 - "Open your homes to each other without complaining. Each one, as a good manager of God’s different gifts, must use for the good of others the special gift he has received from God."

In the following passage, we see someone with the gift of healing, using that gift at their discretion:

"Then Peter said, Silver and gold have I none; but such as I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up and walk." (Acts 3:6)
 
Nov 22, 2015
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I'm not quite clear on what your argument is here. As far as I can tell, my argument still stands: If someone, for example, has the biblically-specified "gift of hospitality", they can implement that gift at will.

1 Peter 4:9-10 - "Open your homes to each other without complaining. Each one, as a good manager of God’s different gifts, must use for the good of others the special gift he has received from God."

In the following passage, we see someone with the gift of healing, using that gift at their discretion:

"Then Peter said, Silver and gold have I none; but such as I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up and walk." (Acts 3:6)
Yes....Peter had the Healer inside of him and the Holy Spirit chose that time to heal this man. Peter had walked by that man multiple times in the past.

Why would the Holy Spirit chose that time to heal him? I don't know because Jesus Himself would have walked by that same man sitting at the temple gate multiple times in His 3 and 1/2 years of ministry. He was there every day at the temple entrance.

Acts 3:2 (NASB)
[SUP]2 [/SUP] And a man who had been lame from his mother's womb was being carried along, whom they used to set down every day at the gate of the temple which is called Beautiful, in order to beg alms of those who were entering the temple.


It is as the Spirit wills the scripture says and that's why there are different meanings for the word "gift". One is a "charisma - grace done" by the Holy Spirit that "works" and this is the word used in describing "the gifts of healings".

But we are allowed to think however we want but I believe the evidence is clearly showing it is as the Spirit wills just like Paul said in 1 Cor. 12.

Man cannot on his own will heal others altho the gifts of healings can operate through him as the Spirit wills IF the human vessel cooperated with Him.

Jesus even did the same thing - Jesus said that in was His Father doing the works through Him ( by means of the Holy Spirit ). No works of miracles or healings were done until after the Holy Spirit came and rested on Him in the river Jordan.

Here is an example of the power of the Lord that was present to heal. Sometimes people's faith drew out this power that was in Him as in the woman with the issue of blood. Jesus felt power come out of him even though He didn't know who touched Him.

Cool eh? ( you can tell I'm Canadian - eh? )

Luke 5:17 (KJV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Andit came to pass on a certain day, as he was teaching, that there were Pharisees and doctors of the law sitting by, which were come out of every town of Galilee, and Judaea, and Jerusalem: and the power of the Lord was present to heal them.
 
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Desertsrose

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2016
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Since I am going through cancer of the mouth at this point, with treatments harsh and cruel (chemo and radiation and surgery), many people are praying for a miracle to happen. Not to mention that I have strong faith for one.

But today as I was praying about a miracle to happen, the Lord spoke to me very strongly "YOU are the miracle". "It is how you are going through this with my grace upon you, with my joy always seen in you, with my peace never leaving".

It has been a revelation. We always look for God to do this and do that - take that away - change this, change that - heal instantly, etc. before we see the miracle. Not ever seeing that WE could be the miracle. It has given me much strength to know that.
Hi Joldevivre,

I'm sorry you're struggling with cancer. :( I will lift you up in prayer.

And amen! You are a miracle and God does give us the grace we need each and every day. Sometimes it's moment by moment.


God is still your healer, even if you're not healed right away or maybe not at all. He heals us of things we probably don't even know about.

But the most important healing is our heart. When God carved away the hard heart and gave us a heart of flesh, that's a miracle.

When I can sit in my chair in so much pain and at times, not able to get up out of it, and then I read a scripture and pray and God gives me the strength to carry on with my day with the ability to get out of my chair, that's a miracle.

So many times I just want to go back to bed, but God's power is with me every moment of my day and He supernaturally helps me to endure a bad day.

You have such a sweet spirit, Joldevivre!!! HUGS!!!

fullsizeoutput_51.jpeg
 
Nov 12, 2015
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I'm not quite clear on what your argument is here. As far as I can tell, my argument still stands: If someone, for example, has the biblically-specified "gift of hospitality", they can implement that gift at will.

1 Peter 4:9-10 - "Open your homes to each other without complaining. Each one, as a good manager of God’s different gifts, must use for the good of others the special gift he has received from God."

In the following passage, we see someone with the gift of healing, using that gift at their discretion:

"Then Peter said, Silver and gold have I none; but such as I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up and walk." (Acts 3:6)
I don't think it is as simplified as this. A sister testified that she prayed for healing. God gave her understanding of what He was doing and what His purpose was, and no healer on earth is going to trump Gods' will with his or her own will. She encouraged us all and I know God has some specific people in her life and around her that He is using her to reach, encourage and help. He told her this. So...it's not always as simplified as this. Maybe with some gifts it is more simple, but...
 

Desertsrose

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2016
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Re: Why Don’t We See Miracles Like the Apostles Did?


In a word: Unbelief.

I don't agree. We can't stop God from working His miracles.

If one of us doesn't believe in miracles He moves on to someone else, somewhere else - just as we saw in the NT when Jesus healed and did miracles. Jesus even healed unbelievers who had no faith.

Nothing can stop God from working His will on this earth.
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
9,054
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Since I am going through cancer of the mouth at this point, with treatments harsh and cruel (chemo and radiation and surgery), many people are praying for a miracle to happen. Not to mention that I have strong faith for one.

But today as I was praying about a miracle to happen, the Lord spoke to me very strongly "YOU are the miracle". "It is how you are going through this with my grace upon you, with my joy always seen in you, with my peace never leaving".

It has been a revelation. We always look for God to do this and do that - take that away - change this, change that - heal instantly, etc. before we see the miracle. Not ever seeing that WE could be the miracle. It has given me much strength to know that.
Awesome testimony, Joidevive

I'm hearing
I know God can heal me of cancer. but even if he doesn't, I will still be joyful in him.


just like
DANIEL 3:17 If we are thrown into the blazing furnace, the God we serve is able to deliver us from it, and he will deliver us from Your Majesty’s hand.
DANIEL 3:18 But even if he does not, we want you to know, Your Majesty, that we will not serve your gods or worship the image of gold you have set up."
 
M

MattTooFor

Guest
Yes....Peter had the Healer inside of him and the Holy Spirit chose that time to heal this man. Peter had walked by that man multiple times in the past.
Well, no...I would say you are contradicting a very plainly-worded scripture. Peter made a decision. He made the decision to implement his ability to heal. Just as someone else can implement a gift of hospitality.

Is God still sovereign in the midst of this person's decision to be hospitable or to heal? OF COURSE God is sovereign in all of these matters. There is a mysterious interworking of God and man in all these things.

But the question here is: Can someone with a spiritual gift implement that gift at will? The scripture that I have produced provides solid indication that a person (Peter, in this case) made a decision to use the gift. This isn't rocket science. Come on now. But yes, God sovereignly oversees all things.

I love the verse in Proverbs 16:9 which describes this mysterious duality:

"The mind of man plans his way, But the Lord directs his steps." Two things going on at the same time. There may have been some exceptional occasions, where God directed someone away from performing a miracle. Afterall, there was that time when Peter carefully prayed before commencing with a miracle (Acts 9:40).

But the same is equally true of any other "gift" scenario. I might have the intention of hospitably receiving someone into my home for dinner...but God might somehow intervene and prevent that from happening (for whatever reason).

Anyway, there many other gargantuan problems for Charismatic doctrines. I had previously referred to the spectacularly conspicuous absence of hundreds and thousands of Charismatic missionaries who have been able to go to all the countries of the world and spontaneously speak in all the foreign languages without the benefit of a language institute...in the same way they were able to do in the early Christian era. These 'sign gifts' are obviously gone.
 

Desertsrose

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2016
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If someone came to you to pray for his knees, he's 400 pounds, eating a whole box of ice cream, and then says the doctor says his knees are bad because he's too heavy, what you tell him? I might pray for his knees. But I might also ask for more details about what the doctor said and confirm to him the doctor's likely advice that he have a better diet and do some appropriate exercises for his physical condition.

Was being healed important to you, or seeing God heal others through you? We are certainly allowed to pray for healing, and to call for the elders of the church.

As far as wanting to heal others, I believe sometimes God sometimes gives people a passion for a ministry because that is an area where He wants to use them. Paul did not squash the enthusiasm of Christians for spiritual gifts. Instead, he told them to eagerly desire spiritual gifts. So it is good if someone wants to be used in a gifts of healing and minister to the sick. We should encourage that.



I don't know why this would have to be limited to a very specific period of time. But the Bible doesn't warn us that the Devil might do signs through us if we are new creatures in Christ Jesus. False prophets will arise and will deceive many, and the lawless one will be accompanied by lying signs and wonders. But true saints with good fruit doing signs and wonders should not concern us.

The apostles prayed for God to do signs and wonders in Acts 4.

As far as your own healing is concerned, keep continuing to believe God and receiving prayer. Call for elders who can pray the prayer of faith.
[/SIZE][/FONT]
Hi Presidente,

I'm just saying that in the last of the last days, Satan will be doing miracles and the bible says that they will be such great miracles that if it were possible, even the elect would be deceived. The intensity of the miracles will surpass anything satan has every done before.

Yes, it can happen today and it does happen where Satan does a miracle or a healing, but it will be unbelievably astounding to the world as they see Satan's mighty acts at the end of days so as to deceive as many as possible to keep them from repenting so that they might enter the kingdom of God.

I was simply warning us to not be so zelous of the gift, the healing, the miracle, the signs that we miss out on God because He didn't show up as we thought He would. We can end up worshipping the gifts instead of the giver of the gifts.

I hope that made it more clear as to what I was saying. So I'm not against the gifts at all.

My husband had a serious kidney infection each year that he had to be hospitalized for 1-2 weeks each year. We kept praying for him to be healed along with friends and the people in our church. He was anointed with oil by the elders and still no healing.

But all of a sudden, one year he didn't get it. And the next year he didn't and the next.......God healed him!!! Praise the Lord!!! You can't imagine how grateful and excited we were because he was so so sick with high fever and he even talked out of his head (delirious) for a couple of days before they could get the fever down each time.

As for myself, I've been prayed for so many times by elders, anointed with oil and I even thought I heard God tell me He would heal me. That was over 35 years ago.

At one point in my relationship with God after praying to Him, I believe that He told me, like Paul that His grace would be sufficient. And it is!

If God wanted me healed, I'd be healed. I believe, I have faith and I do need healing, but He has chosen to say His grace is sufficient. If God is for me, I can live with His grace without the healing. It's His perfect gift to me and it's what I need in my life. Nothing is a mistake.

Will He heal me someday? Maybe, but I'm trusting Him each day for what I need. I have His joy, His strength, His endurance, His overflowing loving kindness, His mercy and His grace! He keeps drawing me to Himself. And I see miracles each day that others might not call a miracle.

 
Nov 22, 2015
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Well, no...I would say you are contradicting a very plainly-worded scripture. Peter made a decision. He made the decision to implement his ability to heal. Just as someone else can implement a gift of hospitality.

Is God still sovereign in the midst of this person's decision to be hospitable or to heal? OF COURSE God is sovereign in all of these matters. There is a mysterious interworking of God and man in all these things.

But the question here is: Can someone with a spiritual gift implement that gift at will? The scripture that I have produced provides solid indication that a person (Peter, in this case) made a decision to use the gift. This isn't rocket science. Come on now. But yes, God sovereignly oversees all things.

I love the verse in Proverbs 16:9 which describes this mysterious duality:

"The mind of man plans his way, But the Lord directs his steps." Two things going on at the same time. There may have been some exceptional occasions, where God directed someone away from performing a miracle. Afterall, there was that time when Peter carefully prayed before commencing with a miracle (Acts 9:40).

But the same is equally true of any other "gift" scenario. I might have the intention of hospitably receiving someone into my home for dinner...but God might somehow intervene and prevent that from happening (for whatever reason).

Anyway, there many other gargantuan problems for Charismatic doctrines. I had previously referred to the spectacularly conspicuous absence of hundreds and thousands of Charismatic missionaries who have been able to go to all the countries of the world and spontaneously speak in all the foreign languages without the benefit of a language institute...in the same way they were able to do in the early Christian era. These 'sign gifts' are obviously gone.
Peter cooperated with the Holy Spirit at the time that the Spirit wanted that person to be healed. Why? I don't know. I'm not God. This will never happen today to those that reject that the gifts are still in operation by the Spirit of God today.


I can understand your position and the real reason why some people reject it is as the Spirit wills as Paul says clearly is.....

If man can heal whenever he chooses then why doesn't he go into a hospital and heal everyone there? No one can do this. Then that would "prove" that there are no gifts of healings today which is complete nonsense.

It is a faulty argument built upon a false foundation as scripture clearly shows that there are different word meanings for "gifts" as well as it is definitely as the Spirit wills and he is the one that "works" these gifts. - Not man governed by his own will and emotions.

1 Corinthians 12:11 (NASB)
[SUP]11 [/SUP] But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually just as He wills.


Jesus Himself went to the pool of Bethsaida and only healed that one man there. Why didn't He heal them all at the pool that day? Why did the Spirit of the Lord send Him to just that one man? Why didn't Jesus just heal everyone there that day? Jesus operated in this earth by His Father doing His "works" in and through Him by the Holy Spirit.

The Spirit of the Lord is upon Me because He has anointed Me....

As I said before - you are free to dis-believe in the gifts of the Spirit for today but it is extremely unwise to try to put a stumbling block up for others.

Have a good night.
 
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MattTooFor

Guest
I don't think it is as simplified as this. A sister testified that she prayed for healing. God gave her understanding of what He was doing and what His purpose was, and no healer on earth is going to trump Gods' will with his or her own will. She encouraged us all and I know God has some specific people in her life and around her that He is using her to reach, encourage and help. He told her this. So...it's not always as simplified as this. Maybe with some gifts it is more simple, but...
Well...you're looking directly at a scripture and saying 'it's not as simple as this'?

I think I see the issues getting mixed up on this thread. If someone is praying for healing...that is absolutely biblical. Actually, the exact advisory in the Bible is...to have the "elders" pray over you and anoint you with oil:

James 5:14 -- "Is anyone among you sick [not paralyzed, not blind since birth, not with a severed spinal cord, not dead]...only "sick"]? Then he must call for the elders of the church and they are to pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord..."

But having elders pray over you and you praying over a sickness...

...is a whole different ballgame than someone who had an actual "gift of healing" and could, as Peter did, walk up to a person at will and heal them, not just from a "sickness"...but from life-long paralysis, life-long blindness, and even deliver someone from death.