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Gospel = good news
The gospel to the Jew is " messiah has come"
The gospel to the gentiles is "messiah has come,and we are included through invitation to the very table and family of God"
But it is many many many,things. All good. All wonderful.
In fact,if you ever really see it,it takes your breath away.
His beauty alone is disarming. That something that beautiful and glorious and wonderful desires an awful snake such as myself,makes me wilt and bow down in awe
The gospel to the Jew is " messiah has come"
The gospel to the gentiles is "messiah has come,and we are included through invitation to the very table and family of God"
But it is many many many,things. All good. All wonderful.
In fact,if you ever really see it,it takes your breath away.
His beauty alone is disarming. That something that beautiful and glorious and wonderful desires an awful snake such as myself,makes me wilt and bow down in awe
Ariel - I ask for a little patience. I express my faith simply, and connect each concept
with biblical theology. I am then told I am a works salvationist and need to repent,
and believe differently. The words I use are repeated back at me, and then I realise
the theology is the same except they imagine differences and decide to say I am anti-Christ.
Now I have no clue what they are, just playing games with words, denying one set of ideas,
and then including them back in a different context. So it is just about antagonism and authority,
which they believe they deserve and others like myself should be excluded as we are leading
people to hell.
In their world I hope they are happy but this double speak has nothing to do with me,
and I will still share and witness to the reality in my heart.
What is obvious is as a group they deny walking righteously, and continually go back to
sin which is impossible to be free from. God bless them, for they sit in a prison of their
unbelief. The cross is about impossible victory and fulfilled dreams of knowing love working
through our whole being. This is what the gifts of the spirit are for and how we minister
one to another.
For a group not under condemnation, and not aware of sin but righteousness, is it not totally
hypocritical when all their preaching is about the failure of others "legalists", how evil they
are and how they totally fail. And when you ask them about their walk, it is always sin
which they are aware of, because without this condemnation, they would not know they needed
Christ so much. Now if you understand this total failure you know what walking in Christ is.
And that is the problem, they are attacking the people of God.
Now when I walk with Christ I know I need Him because He is love and I desire to express this
love to others. When I see need, my heart opens and wish to meet it, to bring healing and hope,
to lift up the broken hearted and offer a future with Jesus and His ways.
Notice the difference, and our calling in Christ.
with biblical theology. I am then told I am a works salvationist and need to repent,
and believe differently. The words I use are repeated back at me, and then I realise
the theology is the same except they imagine differences and decide to say I am anti-Christ.
Now I have no clue what they are, just playing games with words, denying one set of ideas,
and then including them back in a different context. So it is just about antagonism and authority,
which they believe they deserve and others like myself should be excluded as we are leading
people to hell.
In their world I hope they are happy but this double speak has nothing to do with me,
and I will still share and witness to the reality in my heart.
What is obvious is as a group they deny walking righteously, and continually go back to
sin which is impossible to be free from. God bless them, for they sit in a prison of their
unbelief. The cross is about impossible victory and fulfilled dreams of knowing love working
through our whole being. This is what the gifts of the spirit are for and how we minister
one to another.
For a group not under condemnation, and not aware of sin but righteousness, is it not totally
hypocritical when all their preaching is about the failure of others "legalists", how evil they
are and how they totally fail. And when you ask them about their walk, it is always sin
which they are aware of, because without this condemnation, they would not know they needed
Christ so much. Now if you understand this total failure you know what walking in Christ is.
And that is the problem, they are attacking the people of God.
Now when I walk with Christ I know I need Him because He is love and I desire to express this
love to others. When I see need, my heart opens and wish to meet it, to bring healing and hope,
to lift up the broken hearted and offer a future with Jesus and His ways.
Notice the difference, and our calling in Christ.
Yes.....
....for sure the Law doesn't save and that it reveals the truth that without Christ we are not righteous. It reveals our need for a Savior which we know is Christ Himself.We don't need the law of Moses now. We live in the New Covenant now. God doesn't preach us the Law of Moses once we come to Christ - He preaches to us the "gospel - the good news of His Son and what He has done".
Colossians 3:16 (NASB)
[SUP]16[/SUP] Let the word of Christ richly dwell within you, with all wisdom teaching and admonishing one another with psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with thankfulness in your hearts to God.
Well how do we live now if we don't live by the Law of Moses? That is a good question.
People often say to those that speak of the grace of God and that they are not under the law of Moses anymore that they believe they are without "laws" now.
We do have laws in the New Covenant. They are exciting laws that bring life and wholeness to us all - because these are all Christ Himself in us.
We now live by:
1) The law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus. ( Romans 8:2 )
2) The law of love ( Romans 13:10 James 2:8 )
3) The law of faith ( Romans 3:27 and the law of Moses is NOT of faith - Gal. 3:12 )
4) The law of liberty ( James 1:25 )
5) The law of Christ - which is Christ Himself in us. ( Gal. 6:2 )
We can trust the Holy Spirit in us to lead us in all affairs of life. We don't go back to the law of Moses that were a shadow of the real thing which is Christ in us.. Jesus is more then enough.
Yes...we glory in the laws that we have in the New Covenant because they are all Christ Himself living in and through us. ( Gal.2:20 and Col. 3:3 )
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Repentance, confession and walking righteously is law.
Gospel is the knowledge that all the Power and Blessing contained in the law is freely given by the Lord Jesus Christ.
Most people kind of blur the lines between cause and effect causing the proverbial cart to be placed before the horse.
If you are saved do you repent? Yes...
If you are saved do you confess? Yes...
If you are saved do you walk righteously? Yes...
So they are obviously part of Salvation and therefore the gospel. No... They are the product of Salvation. Fruit.
The Law is only part of the gospel in that it brings us to Christ and the knowledge that He is All-Sufficient. Otherwise, law can be and is, anti-gospel.
Gospel is the knowledge that all the Power and Blessing contained in the law is freely given by the Lord Jesus Christ.
Most people kind of blur the lines between cause and effect causing the proverbial cart to be placed before the horse.
If you are saved do you repent? Yes...
If you are saved do you confess? Yes...
If you are saved do you walk righteously? Yes...
So they are obviously part of Salvation and therefore the gospel. No... They are the product of Salvation. Fruit.
The Law is only part of the gospel in that it brings us to Christ and the knowledge that He is All-Sufficient. Otherwise, law can be and is, anti-gospel.
BINGO!!! To deny sanctification as part and parcel to the Gospel will cause those who do so to fall under 2 Timothy 3:5 as it is what they are doing - denying the transforming power of the Gospel, which is godliness, and leaves these as only having a "form of godliness". It is to deny the truth of the Gospel and preach a truncated version. Note 2 Timothy 3:12 as well.
Those who preach "believe" and leave it at that, and, reject other passages that show evidence of salvation, and reject passages that qualify what a true believer looks like are preaching again, a curtailed message and another gospel. This is why churches are in trouble, not because of those who preach the whole Gospel. Conflating the true Gospel with legalism is a misnomer and blatantly false.
Those who preach "believe" and leave it at that, and, reject other passages that show evidence of salvation, and reject passages that qualify what a true believer looks like are preaching again, a curtailed message and another gospel. This is why churches are in trouble, not because of those who preach the whole Gospel. Conflating the true Gospel with legalism is a misnomer and blatantly false.
The above is what happens when one assumes what others have said, and are not addressing what was actually said. It is so sad to see this over and again on this forum, the perpetual knee jerk accusatory reaction. It is hardly Christian in wisdom or response...
As soon as someone mentions the entire Gospel, such as evidence, the walk, sanctification, fruit the knee jerk response and false accusation is "WORKS SALVATION!!!". Utterly ridiculous, callow, short-sighted and false. No wonder there is little real dialog with this talking past one another nonsense. This is what takes place with the truncated gospel crowd, and it is sad.
As soon as someone mentions the entire Gospel, such as evidence, the walk, sanctification, fruit the knee jerk response and false accusation is "WORKS SALVATION!!!". Utterly ridiculous, callow, short-sighted and false. No wonder there is little real dialog with this talking past one another nonsense. This is what takes place with the truncated gospel crowd, and it is sad.
The above is what happens when one assumes what others have said, and are not addressing what was actually said. It is so sad to see this over and again on this forum, the perpetual knee jerk accusatory reaction. It is hardly Christian in wisdom or response...
As soon as someone mentions the entire Gospel, such as evidence, the walk, sanctification, fruit the knee jerk response and false accusation is "WORKS SALVATION!!!". Utterly ridiculous, callow, short-sighted and false. No wonder there is little real dialog with this talking past one another nonsense. This is what takes place with the truncated gospel crowd, and it is sad.
As soon as someone mentions the entire Gospel, such as evidence, the walk, sanctification, fruit the knee jerk response and false accusation is "WORKS SALVATION!!!". Utterly ridiculous, callow, short-sighted and false. No wonder there is little real dialog with this talking past one another nonsense. This is what takes place with the truncated gospel crowd, and it is sad.
One person runs up and asks, Jesus, do you do good things?
Would he say no, I just believe in good things, or ofcourse good things flow
from me because that is what goodness is, the seeing and doing good things.
Now if this is true for Christ it is also true for His followers who take Him
as their example. And if they are Christ on earth to the world one expects
no less.
Some random thoughts about "good works" themselves. We all know that they do not create nor maintain righteousness as righteousness comes as a gift because of Christ's finished work on the cross and resurrection.
People that I personally have heard that believe in the gospel of the grace of God in Christ are quick to say that we are saved unto good works.
Where the "conflict" arises is from the nature and origin of the work - self-effort or from the life of Christ.
Outwardly they look the same. Abraham tried to "do the will" of God in his own self-effort and created an Ishmael.God doesn't recognize our own efforts in the flesh even when trying to fulfill the words of God.
God told Abraham "Take your son, your only son..."
God didn't recognize Ishmael as a son of the promise which Abraham had made from his own self-effort of the flesh to "fulfill" God's will and word that was spoken to him.
God only recognizes what He does has established and that He has empowered to bring it about in our lives. Unless the Lord build the house - they labor in vain that build it.
Resting in the Lord is not a passive, lazy existence. When we know that God has already provided everything we need in Christ and we access His wisdom, provision, strength, and protection by faith, we'll be governed by the Holy Spirit in a highly strategic and active lifestyle.
Rest is not an inactive lifestyle. It's a Spirit-led lifestyle where we flow in the good works that God had planned for us all along.
Resting in Christ is our warfare.
Resting in Christ is our obedience to the faith.
Resting in Christ is our faith in action.
People that I personally have heard that believe in the gospel of the grace of God in Christ are quick to say that we are saved unto good works.
Where the "conflict" arises is from the nature and origin of the work - self-effort or from the life of Christ.
Outwardly they look the same. Abraham tried to "do the will" of God in his own self-effort and created an Ishmael.God doesn't recognize our own efforts in the flesh even when trying to fulfill the words of God.
God told Abraham "Take your son, your only son..."
God didn't recognize Ishmael as a son of the promise which Abraham had made from his own self-effort of the flesh to "fulfill" God's will and word that was spoken to him.
God only recognizes what He does has established and that He has empowered to bring it about in our lives. Unless the Lord build the house - they labor in vain that build it.
Resting in the Lord is not a passive, lazy existence. When we know that God has already provided everything we need in Christ and we access His wisdom, provision, strength, and protection by faith, we'll be governed by the Holy Spirit in a highly strategic and active lifestyle.
Rest is not an inactive lifestyle. It's a Spirit-led lifestyle where we flow in the good works that God had planned for us all along.
Resting in Christ is our warfare.
Resting in Christ is our obedience to the faith.
Resting in Christ is our faith in action.
Some more thoughts about "good works".
Just as Jesus said it is the Father that does His works in Him - that it was not Jesus doing the works. So, we too live by Christ living and doing His works through us.
These are the true works of the Spirit. We are one in the spirit with Him. Without Christ we can do nothing.
There is a massive difference between doing things by our own self-effort or doing good works by the Spirit of God within us.
We participate in them as being sons that are one with Christ. All good works that originate from the Spirit of God in us is really a manifestation of the life of Christ in us.
Again - these "good works" do not create nor maintain righteousness because that only comes through the free gift from Christ's finished work on the cross and resurrection. Rom. 5:17
The grace to do good works is a fruit of already having righteousness because we are in Christ and He is in us. Grace rules/reigns through righteousness.
Romans 5:21 (NASB)
[SUP]21 [/SUP] so that, as sin reigned in death, even so grace would reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Just as Jesus said it is the Father that does His works in Him - that it was not Jesus doing the works. So, we too live by Christ living and doing His works through us.
These are the true works of the Spirit. We are one in the spirit with Him. Without Christ we can do nothing.
There is a massive difference between doing things by our own self-effort or doing good works by the Spirit of God within us.
We participate in them as being sons that are one with Christ. All good works that originate from the Spirit of God in us is really a manifestation of the life of Christ in us.
Again - these "good works" do not create nor maintain righteousness because that only comes through the free gift from Christ's finished work on the cross and resurrection. Rom. 5:17
The grace to do good works is a fruit of already having righteousness because we are in Christ and He is in us. Grace rules/reigns through righteousness.
Romans 5:21 (NASB)
[SUP]21 [/SUP] so that, as sin reigned in death, even so grace would reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
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Not all good works are necessarily originating from Christ. That is humanistic thinking - all religions operate from the same principles.
Paul talks about it here.
1 Corinthians 13:2-3 (NASB)
[SUP]2 [/SUP] If I have the gift of prophecy, and know all mysteries and all knowledge; and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing.
[SUP]3 [/SUP] And if I give all my possessions to feed the poor, and if I surrender my body to be burned, but do not have love, it profits me nothing.
God only sees the good works that originate from Him as can be seen in the life of Abraham.
Our works will be judged by fire and that which came from His life in us will be the works that are left and they are gold, silver and precious stones. Others from ourselves by our own flesh and self-effort will be wood, hay and stubble.
God doesn't recognize the good deeds in the flesh. There is good flesh and bad flesh but it is all flesh.
No flesh shall glory in His presence.
Paul talks about it here.
1 Corinthians 13:2-3 (NASB)
[SUP]2 [/SUP] If I have the gift of prophecy, and know all mysteries and all knowledge; and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing.
[SUP]3 [/SUP] And if I give all my possessions to feed the poor, and if I surrender my body to be burned, but do not have love, it profits me nothing.
God only sees the good works that originate from Him as can be seen in the life of Abraham.
Our works will be judged by fire and that which came from His life in us will be the works that are left and they are gold, silver and precious stones. Others from ourselves by our own flesh and self-effort will be wood, hay and stubble.
God doesn't recognize the good deeds in the flesh. There is good flesh and bad flesh but it is all flesh.
No flesh shall glory in His presence.
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Hidden realities. Now the idea is religion people will hate the truth so hide it.
Good works are the point of judgement because sin has been removed, so evil works
are ones done not from the spirit, so they must be of the self.
So the odd thing is, good things then become evil. How can we go from the normal
world with obvious definitions into this alien world with non moral judgements or
conclusions, and ways that are just absurd.
Followers of this way end up trying to diagnose reasons why they do everything,
double guessing stuff but without any guide or sense. So not surprisingly most
of what they do they now regard as evil. No condemnation is a pretty mean
place in their world.
Good works are the point of judgement because sin has been removed, so evil works
are ones done not from the spirit, so they must be of the self.
So the odd thing is, good things then become evil. How can we go from the normal
world with obvious definitions into this alien world with non moral judgements or
conclusions, and ways that are just absurd.
Followers of this way end up trying to diagnose reasons why they do everything,
double guessing stuff but without any guide or sense. So not surprisingly most
of what they do they now regard as evil. No condemnation is a pretty mean
place in their world.
God does love good works from the heart to be done to others as can be seen in the life of Cornelius. His alms and giving were seen before God and then God send Peter to show him the way to go - which was to rely on Christ now.
The motive of the heart can only be seen by God as outwardly "good works" look the same to us men.
The motive of the heart can only be seen by God as outwardly "good works" look the same to us men.
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So now the flesh, which Paul is talking about the lusts and passion of life, is
both good and bad.
This is all outside the christian faith and into fantasy world.
This is what happens when you say sin is not involved, everything is about works.
It is just another religious moral framework, except there are no reference points,
so people go, oh it is so wise, I did that because I was feeling selfish, or I was hurt,
or I wanted revenge, or glory or whatever. You get what you look for rather than
seeing how to love people and walk with the prompting of the Holy Spirit.
It just ends up as a massive entanglement which blinds the believer from seeing
simple need and helping meet it. That is the way of the good samaritan and the
way of Jesus.
both good and bad.
This is all outside the christian faith and into fantasy world.
This is what happens when you say sin is not involved, everything is about works.
It is just another religious moral framework, except there are no reference points,
so people go, oh it is so wise, I did that because I was feeling selfish, or I was hurt,
or I wanted revenge, or glory or whatever. You get what you look for rather than
seeing how to love people and walk with the prompting of the Holy Spirit.
It just ends up as a massive entanglement which blinds the believer from seeing
simple need and helping meet it. That is the way of the good samaritan and the
way of Jesus.
The flesh manifests itself in a few forms in scripture. One common one is it is just talking about the body itself. Other times it is talking about doing things from our own self-effort and will-power.
Here we see that it has a "will".
John 1:13 (KJV)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
We can judge after the flesh - which is by "outward appearance".
John 8:15 (KJV)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] Ye judge after the flesh; I judge no man.
Doing righteous deeds by the flesh such as the keeping of the Law of Moses does not make one righteous in God's sight. This is a manifestation of "good looking flesh".
Romans 3:20 (KJV)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
Nothing good dwells in the flesh.
Romans 7:18 (NASB)
[SUP]18 [/SUP] For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me, but the doing of the good is not.
The mind set on the things of the flesh bring death.
Romans 8:6 (NASB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace,
No flesh shall glory in God's presence - thus we have wisdom, righteousness, sanctification and redemption because of Christ alone and it is all God's doing - not anything we do or don't do in the flesh.
1 Corinthians 1:29-30 (KJV)
[SUP]29 [/SUP] That no flesh should glory in his presence.
[SUP]30 [/SUP] But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:
Some think that we can be perfected by the flesh - which is foolishness. This is talking about our own self-effort and will-power to "do things" - like the keeping of Laws and doing "good deeds". Galatians is full of this truth. Again this is "good looking flesh".
Galatians 3:3 (KJV)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
Paul says that he puts no confidence in the flesh.
Philippians 3:3 (NASB)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] for we are the true circumcision, who worship in the Spirit of God and glory in Christ Jesus and put no confidence in the flesh,
Here we see that it has a "will".
John 1:13 (KJV)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
We can judge after the flesh - which is by "outward appearance".
John 8:15 (KJV)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] Ye judge after the flesh; I judge no man.
Doing righteous deeds by the flesh such as the keeping of the Law of Moses does not make one righteous in God's sight. This is a manifestation of "good looking flesh".
Romans 3:20 (KJV)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
Nothing good dwells in the flesh.
Romans 7:18 (NASB)
[SUP]18 [/SUP] For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me, but the doing of the good is not.
The mind set on the things of the flesh bring death.
Romans 8:6 (NASB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace,
No flesh shall glory in God's presence - thus we have wisdom, righteousness, sanctification and redemption because of Christ alone and it is all God's doing - not anything we do or don't do in the flesh.
1 Corinthians 1:29-30 (KJV)
[SUP]29 [/SUP] That no flesh should glory in his presence.
[SUP]30 [/SUP] But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:
Some think that we can be perfected by the flesh - which is foolishness. This is talking about our own self-effort and will-power to "do things" - like the keeping of Laws and doing "good deeds". Galatians is full of this truth. Again this is "good looking flesh".
Galatians 3:3 (KJV)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
Paul says that he puts no confidence in the flesh.
Philippians 3:3 (NASB)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] for we are the true circumcision, who worship in the Spirit of God and glory in Christ Jesus and put no confidence in the flesh,