RIDICULOUS CHRISTIAN CLAIMS AND SHAMING JESUS

[sparkman]

One of the biggest causes for doubt of Christianity for me is the ridiculous claims of a small number of Christians, which bring shame to Jesus.

As an example, one woman in chat claims that a cat spoke to her, and that she resurrected the dead from a morgue. Over time there have been tons of other ones which made similar claims about healings they performed, etcetera.

Yeah, right, I'm sure she bypassed multiple levels of security and raised a dead person in a morgue and it escaped the news..not..

Another claimed Michelle Obama was a guy and he knew it FOR SURE.

But, even more worrisome than ridiculous claims is the fact that such people are considered gurus on the site by a significant number. People flock to them for advice.

Having come from a cult who claimed to have all their i's dotted and their t's crossed doctrinally, and accused other Christians of being ignorant, I sometimes have to consider whether they may be right about a huge segment of Christianity. They themselves had poor theology, but their assessment of the gullibility of some other Christians seems to be on target.

I am guessing a full third of Christians would find such an individual as mentioned above to be plausible as a source of truth, even though they make outlandish claims.

Anyways, I am considering keeping a running list of ridiculous claims that people make in the chatroom, and bringing them up on a regular basis. Maybe that will shame them into not shaming Christ by making such outlandish claims.

Luckily, Christians in my real life are not so foolish or I'd likely abandon Christianity.

 

[sparkman]

Save the comments about me being judgmental. Do you think that such individuals should just be allowed to say such things that bring shame on Jesus? Some sectors of Christianity have lost reasoning capabilities and don't seem to care how much shame is brought to Christianity by such individuals.

 

[Veteran]

One of the biggest causes for doubt of Christianity for me is
the ridiculous claims of a small number of Christians, which bring shame to Jesus.

It's so wonderful that you know everything ... e.g. what is ridiculous, and what is not.
There are plenty of your types on Christian forums, which is NOT so wonderful.

 

[LanceA]

Save the comments about me being judgmental. Do you think that such individuals should just be allowed to say such things that bring shame on Jesus? Some sectors of Christianity have lost reasoning capabilities and don't seem to care how much shame is brought to Christianity by such individuals.

You know I'm only going to comment on resurrection and healing. What would it take for you to believe people are being healed or rising from the dead? I'm pretty sure if someone provided video you would disclaim that as well and need to be there in person. Then when you were there in person you would find some other reason to not believe it.

 

[sparkman]

I don't think it's a far stretch to apply these verses as a warning to those who are making false claims. Ananias and Sapphira were punished by God with death for lying.

Acts 5: But a man named Ananias, with his wife Sapphira, sold a piece of property, [SUP]2 [/SUP]and with his wife's knowledge he kept back for himself some of the proceeds and brought only a part of it and laid it at the apostles' feet. [SUP]3 [/SUP]But Peter said, “Ananias, why has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit and to keep back for yourself part of the proceeds of the land? [SUP]4 [/SUP]While it remained unsold, did it not remain your own? And after it was sold, was it not at your disposal? Why is it that you have contrived this deed in your heart? You have not lied to man but to God.” [SUP]5 [/SUP]When Ananias heard these words, he fell down and breathed his last. And great fear came upon all who heard of it. [SUP]6 [/SUP]The young men rose and wrapped him up and carried him out and buried him.[SUP]7 [/SUP]After an interval of about three hours his wife came in, not knowing what had happened. [SUP]8 [/SUP]And Peter said to her, “Tell me whether you[SUP][a][/SUP] sold the land for so much.” And she said, “Yes, for so much.” [SUP]9 [/SUP]But Peter said to her, “How is it that you have agreed together to test the Spirit of the Lord? Behold, the feet of those who have buried your husband are at the door, and they will carry you out.” [SUP]10 [/SUP]Immediately she fell down at his feet and breathed her last. When the young men came in they found her dead, and they carried her out and buried her beside her husband. [SUP]11 [/SUP]And great fear came upon the whole church and upon all who heard of these things.

Better be careful how you are representing the Lord in order to exalt yourself by making claims concerning healings and raising the dead, or things that did not happen.

The games that some within Christianity are playing do not amuse God.

 

[LanceA]

I don't think it's a far stretch to apply these verses as a warning to those who are making false claims. Ananias and Sapphira were punished by God with death for lying.

Acts 5: But a man named Ananias, with his wife Sapphira, sold a piece of property, [SUP]2 [/SUP]and with his wife's knowledge he kept back for himself some of the proceeds and brought only a part of it and laid it at the apostles' feet. [SUP]3 [/SUP]But Peter said, “Ananias, why has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit and to keep back for yourself part of the proceeds of the land? [SUP]4 [/SUP]While it remained unsold, did it not remain your own? And after it was sold, was it not at your disposal? Why is it that you have contrived this deed in your heart? You have not lied to man but to God.” [SUP]5 [/SUP]When Ananias heard these words, he fell down and breathed his last. And great fear came upon all who heard of it. [SUP]6 [/SUP]The young men rose and wrapped him up and carried him out and buried him.[SUP]7 [/SUP]After an interval of about three hours his wife came in, not knowing what had happened. [SUP]8 [/SUP]And Peter said to her, “Tell me whether you[SUP][a][/SUP] sold the land for so much.” And she said, “Yes, for so much.” [SUP]9 [/SUP]But Peter said to her, “How is it that you have agreed together to test the Spirit of the Lord? Behold, the feet of those who have buried your husband are at the door, and they will carry you out.” [SUP]10 [/SUP]Immediately she fell down at his feet and breathed her last. When the young men came in they found her dead, and they carried her out and buried her beside her husband. [SUP]11 [/SUP]And great fear came upon the whole church and upon all who heard of these things.

Better be careful how you are representing the Lord in order to exalt yourself by making claims concerning healings and raising the dead, or things that did not happen.

The games that some within Christianity are playing do not amuse God.

And you are the authority on these games Christians are playing? I don't see healing as a game.

 

[JIMBO43]

Save the comments about me being judgmental. Do you think that such individuals should just be allowed to say such things that bring shame on Jesus? Some sectors of Christianity have lost reasoning capabilities and don't seem to care how much shame is brought to Christianity by such individuals.

I would say that one can have an outerbody experinence and actually do things in the spirit and it can seem real..

Its happend to me a few times... once i even walked on water in an outer body experience and no i wasnt on meds lol.

I was stood there in front of the small lake of water hoping and praying i could walk on water and then hey presto there i was walking on water after saying please God let me leave my Body... its a true story..

 

[sparkman]

You know I'm only going to comment on resurrection and healing. What would it take for you to believe people are being healed or rising from the dead? I'm pretty sure if someone provided video you would disclaim that as well and need to be there in person. Then when you were there in person you would find some other reason to not believe it.

God does heal. I do not discount healings. I would not even discount a raising of the dead if the source was credible. I don't believe that these gifts are possessed by a person today. The sick person should go to the elders of the church and have the elders pray for them.

My position is that some of the gifts pertained to the apostolic era and served the purpose of validating apostles and prophets. No apostles or prophets exist today. The ones who claim it are loons, from my experience.

I am certainly not going to believe some individual in a chat room who lacks credibility, such as a woman who is plainly not in submission and wants to dominate and teach over men. If there was a trustworthy individual in my congregation that I had known for years who told me he had prayed over someone and they were healed or even revived, I'd be disinclined to contest his claim. I know God can heal or raise from the dead.

Chat room claims are CHEAP. I am not impressed by the claims of such individuals.

 

[LanceA]

I would say that one can have an outerbody experinence and actually do things in the spirit and it can seem real..

Its happend to me a few times... once i even walked on water in an outer body experience and no i wasnt on meds lol.

I was stood there in front of the small lake of water hoping and praying i could walk on water and then hey presto there i was walking on water after saying please God let me leave my Body... its a true story..

Oh Oh, I think Sparky is going to claim you are a silly Christian and will add your experience to his not so nice list

 

[LanceA]

God does heal. I do not discount healings. I would not even discount a raising of the dead if the source was credible. I don't believe that these gifts are possessed by a person. The sick person should go to the elders of the church and have the elders pray for them.

I am certainly not going to believe some individual in a chat room who lacks credibility, such as a woman who is plainly not in submission and wants to dominate and teach over men. If there was a trustworthy individidual in my congregation that I had known for years who told me he had prayed over someone and they were healed or even revived, I'd be disinclined to contest his claim. I know God can heal or raise from the dead.

Then stop attacking people you don't know. Just because you don't know someone doesn't mean it didn't happen. You sure in the heck don't know Paul, Peter, John etc... Are you saying they didn't heal anyone?

 

[sparkman]

Oh Oh, I think Sparky is going to claim you are a silly Christian and will add your experience to his not so nice list

I'm not going to comment. I knew the thread would bring out some loons.

 

[sparkman]

Then stop attacking people you don't know. Just because you don't know someone doesn't mean it didn't happen. You sure in the heck don't know Paul, Peter, John etc... Are you saying they didn't heal anyone?

Scripture records those events. Scripture is God-breathed. The words of chat room people AREN'T. I wasn't born yesterday.

I'll be interested to see what kind of outlandish claims are made on this thread.

 

[LanceA]

I'm not going to comment. I knew the thread would bring out some loons.

Ok, now you are resorting to name calling. I'm not even going to take you serious with this topic.

 

[Ugly]

Most chat roomers don't visit the forums and vice versa, so there's a good chance they won't even see these threads.
But do you really think you're going to shame them by posting what they said? Or are they more likely to be defensive? Shaming really never brings about positive change, it just makes people feel more alone and isolated. No one will change, just become hurt and angry. Is that really the best way to combat these claims?

 

[BeyondET]

Have you heard of the story of Jesus and His two childhood friends one was a brick layer the other was a roofer.
when they were around 20 years old, they went on a adventure to Asia and met a old wise man on a mountain.

 

[sparkman]

Most chat roomers don't visit the forums and vice versa, so there's a good chance they won't even see these threads.
But do you really think you're going to shame them by posting what they said? Or are they more likely to be defensive? Shaming really never brings about positive change, it just makes people feel more alone and isolated. No one will change, just become hurt and angry. Is that really the best way to combat these claims?

Good question. What do you suggest is the appropriate response to individuals who make such claims? Simply say nothing and give social approval to their behavior? Would you do the same if the person is trying to teach heretical doctrines? Are you ok with God being shamed by lies?

 

[Willie-T]

Good question. What do you suggest is the appropriate response to individuals who make such claims? Simply say nothing and give social approval to their behavior? Would you do the same if the person is trying to teach heretical doctrines? Are you ok with God being shamed by lies?

To many people, some of what you claim or teach may be heretical. Does them thinking that make their assumptions true?

 

[Angela53510]

Biblical ignorance, poor teaching, lack of community in a real life church or small group, and let's face it, various types of mental illness can account for a lot of this unbiblical nonsense.

There is such a wrong emphasis on feelings and experience in the modern church. And if a church doesn't make you "feel" God, then it is somehow a dead church! As if preaching the Word of God could ever be dead!!

Certainly, there is room for experience. The Bible is clear we receive joy, peace love and the other fruits of the Spirit as we walk with God. But those "feelings" have to be experienced within a framework of truth, which is the Bible.

Further, there is a woeful level of education these days. Both here, and in political forums I am in on FB (For Canada, not the US!) it appalls me the complete lack of education people have! I'm not just talking typos and grammar, but a complete inability to express themselves. On FB, that comes in the form of degradation and swearing. I have had to leave many groups over that! In CC, it comes in the form of people coming up with nonsense like visions from their cat, or just plain visions that conflict with the Bible

We have an elderly friend, who is from Jamaica and was sick growing up, and was unable to go to school. He is a wonderful kind and and caring man. But he gets sucked into cults so easily, because he is unable to think critically about anything a charismatic leader says. He was brainwashed by the Oneness movement and it tars all his theology into nothing more than nonsense. He had all these visions he wrote down on how to interpret the Bible. The entire Bible! I went through (before Seminary) and pointed out the theological mistakes he made, and showed him what the bible said. This was not hard, as some things were so grandiose and so far beyond the pale, a child could have done it.

So, he became a teacher, and had large groups of people coming to his home, to follow his books, which he said were interpreting the bible, when in fact, they were just a total fabrication! Sigh!

Nothing surprises me about the internet. And I am not a believer at all in end times escapist fantasies like the Rapture. Yet, when I look at the ignorance which has resulted in outright apostasy, I sincerely wonder! I also wonder how it must grieve the heart of God to see the name of Jesus being shamed and lied about and dragged by any vision or dream or ill wind of change that people can imagine! The sky is the limit, when it comes to claims about God. Unverified claims, I am talking about!

 

[JIMBO43]

Oh Oh, I think Sparky is going to claim you are a silly Christian and will add your experience to his not so nice list

Lol i hope not as that would be disbelieving in my book.. Its true we have Gifts and the bible speaks of people being able to hear conversations in another room in the old t to... God also reward people and let them see hevenly wonders to show them he is real..

Tell me why should my gift that i had at the time be so untrue if God truly loved me and wanted me to know he was there after being bullied almost killed and raped as a child ?

 

[JIMBO43]

To me God can let any of his chidren leave there Body to see wonders..