Give us these kind of men

[preacher4truth]

It's saddening to watch a few here with little if any Biblical acumen attempting to pit other Scriptures against Scriptures which give the clear mandate to rebuke, reprove and expose false teachers.

Yes, little Biblical acumen on the part of several of you, which is why you abuse Scripture and make contradicting misapplications, pitting Scripture against Scripture. 2 Timothy 2:15, try it, it doesn't say pit Scripture itself, it says rightly handle it, or, be ashamed. You few fall into the latter group and that's a fact. No wonder our churches are so unsound in doctrine.

"Oh, wait, I think I found a verse that goes against all those verses you're showing us!!!!" Utterly ignorant and ridiculous.

 

[PeterJens]

Oh no, another mysterious "they" post.....,(they have long since lost the "amuse" factor for me. Now I just find them annoying. Referring to the post that vague accuses people and slaps a label on "then").

In case you haven't noticed PeterJens folks are divided on if MacArthur is a false teacher or not.

So who is your "they"?

Does anyone actually refute that Joel Osteen teaches a false prosperity gospel?

Ariel - Here is a thread who support Joel and feel he is a blessing

http://christianchat.com/christian-family-forum/148305-lakewood-church.html

Where I come from is a house church that grew out of a student christian union.
I knew the minister well.

He got into the prosperity gospel, open heaven, Benny Hinn, God TV, and though
they claim the church has left this circle, he still preaches in it.

Funny or ironic people criticized me for using the word I in my testimonies.

http://christianchat.com/christian-news-forum/98751-osteen-predicament-mere-happiness-cannot-bear-weight-gospel.html

I wonder why people try and attack leaders personally, surely the foundations
of their faith, and the problems of the prosperity gospel are the issue, not a
teacher who is rich because of it. He will fall to be replaced by another, because
it is the belief system that is the problem not the peddler.

 

[Ariel82]

Ariel - Here is a thread who support Joel and feel he is a blessing

http://christianchat.com/christian-family-forum/148305-lakewood-church.html

Where I come from is a house church that grew out of a student christian union.
I knew the minister well.

He got into the prosperity gospel, open heaven, Benny Hinn, God TV, and though
they claim the church has left this circle, he still preaches in it.

I wonder why people try and attack leaders personally, surely the foundations
of their faith, and the problems of the prosperity gospel are the issue, not a
teacher who is rich because of it. He will fall to be replaced by another, because
it is the belief system that is the problem not the peddler.

Point taken. Only read a page of that thread.

I agree we should attack the false doctrines taught and not make personal attacks.

We should pray that the false teachers realise their false doctrines and repent.

I don't believe God calls us to crucify people or burn witches.

He says our enemy is not flesh and blood but spiritual wickeness.

We need to focus on tearing down spiritual strongholds and that can't be done if we resort to lies and false accusations about certain preachers.
.
It can only be done by presenting what they preach and showing how their preaching is unbiblical and lies about God and His promises.

 

[Ariel82]

Me confused....

I skipped clicking on the link because I wrongly thought it was to your testimony, Peter.

Funny or ironic people criticized me for using the word I in my testimonies.

http://christianchat.com/christian-...mere-happiness-cannot-bear-weight-gospel.html
"

Folks criticise the "I" in your post because you don't stop at just "I" but put a "them" and makes its about how "they" are against "me"


Angela refute the false doctrine of Joel Osteen, so I don't get your comments after posting a link to her thread.

 

[preacher4truth]

because it is the belief system that is the problem not the peddler.

Yes, you just make up doctrine as you go along, right? Let's see how Scripture denies your teaching in order to flatter those who agree with you instead of standing upon truth:

2 Peter 2:3, concerning false teachers: "whose damnation is just" The teachers, not just the teachings.

Matthew 7:21-23, concerning false teachers; "Depart from me...I never knew you" The teachers, not just the teachings.

Ezekiel 13; “‘Therefore this is what the Sovereign Lord says: Because of your false words and lying visions, I am against you, declares the Sovereign Lord. My hand will be against the prophets who see false visions and utter lying divinations. They will not belong to the council of my people or be listed in the records of Israel, nor will they enter the land of Israel. Then you will know that I am the Sovereign Lord. -- The teachers, not just the teachings.

How you have divorced the teachers from responsibility is irresponsible on your part PeterJens. You're clearly in error here.

But here is more from the Spirit of God, judgment upon the teachers, not just the teachings:

2 Peter 2:4ff; For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to chains of gloomy darkness to be kept until the judgment; if he did not spare the ancient world, but preserved Noah, a herald of righteousness, with seven others, when he brought a flood upon the world of the ungodly; if by turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah to ashes he condemned them to extinction, making them an example of what is going to happen to the ungodly; and if he rescued righteous Lot, greatly distressed by the sensual conduct of the wicked (for as that righteous man lived among them day after day, he was tormenting his righteous soul over their lawless deeds that he saw and heard); then the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from trials, and to keep the unrighteous under punishment until the day of judgment, and especially those who indulge in the lust of defiling passion and despise authority. Bold and willful, they do not tremble as they blaspheme the glorious ones, whereas angels, though greater in might and power, do not pronounce a blasphemous judgment against them before the Lord. But these, like irrational animals, creatures of instinct, born to be caught and destroyed, blaspheming about matters of which they are ignorant, will also be destroyed in their destruction, suffering wrong as the wage for their wrongdoing. They count it pleasure to revel in the daytime. They are blots and blemishes, reveling in their deceptions, while they feast with you. They have eyes full of adultery, insatiable for sin. They entice unsteady souls. They have hearts trained in greed. Accursed children! Forsaking the right way, they have gone astray. They have followed the way of Balaam, the son of Beor, who loved gain from wrongdoing, but was rebuked for his own transgression; a speechless donkey spoke with human voice and restrained the prophet's madness.


Yep, it's the false teachers that will be judged, and that is the context of the above. No need to wonder if PeterJens or Scripture is correct here. Some of you all need to stop teaching and start studying, you're way off track and simply are making up false doctrine on a whim. Shameful. Again, 2 Timothy 2:15.

 

[PeterJens]

Me confused....
I skipped clicking on the link because I wrongly thought it was to your testimony, Peter.
Folks criticise the "I" in your post because you don't stop at just "I" but put a "them" and makes its about how "they" are against "me"
Angela refute the false doctrine of Joel Osteen, so I don't get your comments after posting a link to her thread.

I was being a bit lazy. The prosperity gospel is about self prospering, doing things
to enrich oneself, having dreams and speaking them forth, because greed and self
indulgence are what God really wants for His children.

I was mirroring this with the idea if I testify to God doing things in my spirit, I am
somehow boasting and evil. Go figure.

 

[Ariel82]

I was being a bit lazy. The prosperity gospel is about self prospering, doing things
to enrich oneself, having dreams and speaking them forth, because greed and self
indulgence are what God really wants for His children.

I was mirroring this with the idea if I testify to God doing things in my spirit, I am
somehow boasting and evil. Go figure.

Wait, I do love and respect you Peter but I don't see how making this conversation about you helps anyone.

Your statement makes no sense.

Are you saying....you mirror the ideas of the prosperity gospel?

Because that is how your statement reads.

If you are feeling lazy, do yourself a favor and don't post.

Because right now if you are saying that then it is boasting and evil for the prosperity gospel is evil.

Trying to make yourself look good by accusing others of attacking you is also wrong, but that is a whole nother conversation.

Sorry for the derailment,,but i would like some clarification.

 

[BeyondET]

Sounds like Larry King was trying to get Joel to condemn people, in the preacher vid his just jealous of the fame and money Joel has, hahaha....

 

[Muzungu256]

why is it when we see someone smile, we need to bring them down?
let joel osteen smile i have not listen much of him but lets say this he is very positive i think a lot of people (many!!!!) will be cheered in their life because of his message!!!!! lets not bring condemnation!!!! Christ saved humanity joel osteen included!!!!!

love will never fail God bless you all!!!!

 

[preacher4truth]

Another pesky verse that the teachers are judged:

Not many of you should become teachers, my brothers, for you know that we who teach will be judged with greater strictness. James 3:1

Interesting isn't it, all the false assertions made on here? Then the fighting against Scripture that proves folks wrong? And you all are in church I take it, teaching these falsities to others, right?

 

[preacher4truth]

why is it when we see someone smile, we need to bring them down?
let joel osteen smile i have not listen much of him but lets say this he is very positive i think a lot of people (many!!!!) will be cheered in their life because of his message!!!!! lets not bring condemnation!!!! Christ saved humanity joel osteen included!!!!!

love will never fail God bless you all!!!!

oh...lolzzzzzzzzz. If they smile, and are positive, it's all good. Goodness sake. Got a verse for that?

The above is the epitome of the problem, absolutely no Biblical standard whatsoever.

 

[PeterJens]

Wait, I do love and respect you Peter but I don't see how making this conversation about you helps anyone.

Your statement makes no sense.

Are you saying....you mirror the ideas of the prosperity gospel?

Because that is how your statement reads.

If you are feeling lazy, do yourself a favor and don't post.

Because right now if you are saying that then it is boasting and evil for the prosperity gospel is evil.

Trying to make yourself look good by accusing others of attacking you is also wrong, but that is a whole nother conversation.

Sorry for the derailment,,but i would like some clarification.

Ok. I was criticised for using the word "I" or talking about myself in context with
the Lord. Some feel self is evil, or any reference to it.

The prosperity gospel is all about self, so is ironic often the same critics who want
to look to Jesus are so concerned about prosperity and blessing for themselves.

 

[notuptome]

2Co 6:17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,

The people will seek out the kind of preacher they want. If people sought good biblically sound preachers these others would fade from the marketplace.

We know that they will heap to themselves teachers with itching ears. I have not seen much success in browbeating folks over guys like this so perhaps a better method would be to exhort from the word of God the simple truth that we are to desire the sincere milk of the word of God and our interest should be in growth in Christ.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[BeyondET]

oh...lolzzzzzzzzz. If they smile, and are positive, it's all good. Goodness sake. Got a verse for that?

The above is the epitome of the problem, absolutely no Biblical standard whatsoever.

Smile your on candid camera...

Proverbs 15:30
A cheerful look brings joy to the heart; good news makes for good health.

 

[PeterJens]

How you have divorced the teachers from responsibility is irresponsible on your part PeterJens. You're clearly in error here.

Are you are judge in a court? Do you hold the right over someone? And do you have
real evidence?

It appears your summary is actually someone elses, Steve Lawson.
His evidence was not very concrete.
And the interview, not condemning people and not standing up for Jesus, is not heresy
or apostacy, it is liberalism.

A fair percentage of people I know would fall into this catagory. Not exactly news.

 

[Grace777x70]

Smile your on candid camera...

Proverbs 15:30
A cheerful look brings joy to the heart; good news makes for good health.

My goodness...The Lord does have a great sense of humor...

Whatever we do let's not give people a hope that God loves them and that they can trust Him no matter what lies have been spoken about Him .

Let's not give people any hope who have been beaten down all their life by the things of the world, the flesh , the devil and by hateful church people........Let's not encourage them to trust God again.

I say - let's encourage them. He can sort out the carnal desires from the desires He puts in their heart.

 

[SovereignGrace]

His way is not to judge other's salvation.

In that point I agree with him.

Huh? Larry King asked him pointedly do ppl who do not believe in Jesus Christ, make it to heaven. Again, another paraphrase from me. He said 'I don't know, It's not for me to judge.' Osteen would not take a stand, but buckled at the knees. There's a saying that if you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything. Jesus said I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life, and no one comes to the Father except by Me.[John 14:6] He also said He was the Gate to the Sheep pen in John 10, and ppl can go in and out and find pasture.

Muslims who die as Muslims die and go to hell because they worshipped an idol.
Jews who die as Jews go to hell because they did not believe Jesus was/is the Son of God.

That's not judging ppl. That's properly exegeting biblical texts and telling ppl the truth of God's word.

He says he agrees with what the woman says that the only way to heaven is through Jesus.

Then why did he say 'I don't know?' He's a good motivational speaker, very poor preacher and pastor.

Again the video clip just shows his unwillingness to become God and judge other's.

Telling ppl the truth that there is no salvation outside of Christ is not becoming God or judging ppl, but telling ppl the truth.

He claims to "just state the truth and let God judge"

Nope. His spine is made of jelly.

Does he preach that Jesus is the only way?

Maybe, maybe not.

If he preaches, he'll preach Jesus. If not, it's babbling. That goes for all of God's preachers, including myself. Jesus said to preach the gospel to every one. Paul, whilst in prison, told Timothy to preach the word. Joel and Victoria speak for 55 minutes and might quote 5 verses. The rest is a 'rah rah' speech.

Does he preach that Muslims or Hindus will be in heaven?

That video clip doesn't show it.

In their idolatrous state, if they die in that state, won't make it to heaven. That's not judging ppl, just speaking the truth. 1 Corinthians 6:9-11 tells us what can't make it to heaven. Adultery, IDOLATRY, sexual immorality, h0m0sexuality, &c can not enter into heaven. But Paul said such WERE(past tense) some of them.

People have jumped to that conclusion, but the evidence is not there.

Clearly, the evidence is there. Ppl just refuse to believe it.

 

[preacher4truth]

Smile your on candid camera...

Proverbs 15:30
A cheerful look brings joy to the heart; good news makes for good health.

"Oh, I found a verse!!!!! Here it is!!!!" lolzzzzzzzzzz...

You're simply ripping another verse out of context because your teaching is also false.

So, that verse is there, given by God to support Osteen and the prosperity gospel, correct? And I see at least one false teacher on this forum loves how you take God's word and wrest it out of proportion and context. It is no wonder, he too preaches error.

 

[Muzungu256]

oh...lolzzzzzzzzz. If they smile, and are positive, it's all good. Goodness sake. Got a verse for that?

The above is the epitome of the problem, absolutely no Biblical standard whatsoever.

do you feel spiritual knocking people down? i think God loves joel osteen and you too mr frowny face
its agape love. let it in, let it light your soul, give you peace and joy.

 

[Stephen63]

Hypocrites..... they seem to be a dime a dozen on here.

Don't attack the heretic! In the mean time they will attack you, & it's okay.

There are some that are laughably entertaining that act like they're interviewing you or picking your brain when all the while they're hunting for chinks in your armor to expose to all their friends.

I could almost agree not to bother all those rich televangelists out there, really. I mean, if somebody wanted to do a real witch hunt, they have plenty of them riding their brooms right here on CC. Why go out in the fields to hunt when there's a fenced-in preserve right here?