Not By Works

[FranC]

I see Cain as being the first example of a non believer, who was trying to be made righteous his own way.

Today you see two groups of people.... believers and non believers.... those who have faith in the work of Jesus to save them & then those who try to add their own works to the work of Jesus.

Abel & Cain are like the two contrasting sides mentioned throughout the scriptures...

Narrow & Broad road
Sheep & goats
Wheat & tares

Those who try to "add their own works" are non-believers as far as YOU are concerned?

A Dcon-follower.

You should just start all over again.
You're off base on everything.

But hand with Dcon.
He'll teach you.
NOT Jesus.

 

[FranC]

hey bud,

i disagree, brothers and sisters are not dividing each other here, they are not fighting here, they are dividing each other in threads like how old is the earth, is there a rapture or not, when is God going to return, tongues threads, prophesy threads, and the like

in this thread we have two gospels being fought very good and evil being discussed, and false teachers trying to stand up to Gods people, while Gods people are holding firm to his gospel.

in this thread you have people screaming God has given us victory over sin, yet deny that power, you have people screaming God has the power to save, yet deny that power, that God has the power to change people yet deny that power,

the fighting is because Gods people are fighting for all to know that power, that God is able to change, he is able to save completely that which was or is lost,

close this thread, and 5 more just like it will open up,

Hey cutie,

§God has given us victory over sin???

WHY do YOU keep insulting people?
Is this "victory over sin"?

Sure don't seem like it.

 

[gb9]

Those who try to "add their own works" are non-believers as far as YOU are concerned?

A Dcon-follower.

You should just start all over again.
You're off base on everything.

But hand with Dcon.
He'll teach you.
NOT Jesus.

it bothers you that dcon proves you wrong daily , doesn't it??

 

[FranC]

thanks mr. perfect one. must be nice to be sinless and perfect like you, so you can shout down and look down on us lowlifes who are not perfect. or , you could be a self-decived liar. probably the second one.

Funny.

I never read peter Jens call anyone a derogatory name.

Much as I hear from "your side".

Wonder why that is?
Wonder WHO is following the word of God?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Those who try to "add their own works" are non-believers as far as YOU are concerned?

A Dcon-follower.

You should just start all over again.
You're off base on everything.

But hand with Dcon.
He'll teach you.
NOT Jesus.

in order to be saved, yes,
that makes you a Christ follower

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Hey cutie,

§God has given us victory over sin???

WHY do YOU keep insulting people?
Is this "victory over sin"?

Sure don't seem like it.

the truth hurts, I had to be given truth that hurt many times to change my thinking.

try receiving some in hmulity some day, you ma find it enlightening

 

[FranC]

can you move to the truth that good works do not save nor prove salvation, but are a RESULT of being saved. Titus 3, whole chapter.

Sure they PROVE SALVATION.

Titus 3. Whole chapter.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Funny.

I never read peter Jens call anyone a derogatory name.

Much as I hear from "your side".

Wonder why that is?
Wonder WHO is following the word of God?

Lol,, I got guess this just proved you do not read what Peter says.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Sure they PROVE SALVATION.

Titus 3. Whole chapter.

no, they are a result of salvation, they do not save or maintain salvation.


not by works which we have done, but by his mercy he saved us.

why is it so hard for people to ignore the true meaning of faith?

 

[FranC]

he is saying people who who walk in our churches, who are hearers of the word but not doers, who have done no work which would even lead someone to think they are saved, who claim to have faith, but have zero zip nada works, are you really saved (can your claimed faith save you)

well of course not, faith which is not followed by works is dead, a dead faith will never save anyone.

What he is not saying

works will save you, lack of work will cause loss of salvation

Dcon needs a lot of help.
He can't seem to quote scripture.

Let's see what HE has to say...

 

[FranC]

Do we pick grapes from a thorn bush, or figs from thistles?
The fruit shows the tree from which it comes.

AMEN!

I do not see fruit from some here.

 

[FranC]

FranC I saw your post to me and I disagree we are not justified or proven God's children by our works.

God tells us some will say "Lord did we not do miracles in your name?" and be rejected. Its not our outward works that matter but the inward change GOD WORKS within our hearts and minds that really matter.

It is when we learn from the Holy Spirit to add to our faith these things do we become fruitful and purified unto good works God has created us for. God will test our works but if we have Christ as our foundation we will be saved even if all are works & doctrines prove hay and stubble.

What matters is a true saving faith in Jesus....not a heathen faith in God to reward good deeds and punish evil ones (works salvation). Not a demon's faith that gives mental assent to who Jesus is but no real trust of love for Him (this is your dead faith you and others keep referring to which does not save). Not the faith of disciples when He physically walked with them before the cross: able to do miracles but not understanding or completely trusting in the finished work of the cross or Jesus plan for salvation by faith alone (old covenant thinking)

Faith and NOT works seems to be a ray of light some will hide from but it's clearly found in the Bible.

Saving faith is more than mental assent, more than trust in a just God, more than the old covenant. It is Faith in Jesus finished work on the cross for the remission of sins, His resurrection, ascension to heaven.

Salvation begins when He sends the Holy spirit to seal us and allow us to cry out Abba father. Until then folks may claim to be Christian but are just fooling themselves and others and going through the motions.

The Holy spirit with transform the heart and mind. God chastens every child and fruit will become evident in the lives of each born again child of God: love, joy, peace, patience, gentleness, kindness and self control.

God will fed His Kids milk until their wounds are healed and they are made strong in His love. He will embraces us and tell us we are new creations in Christ. He holds up a mirror and shows us who He has made us to be. He shows us what true love is and then tells us to love others as He has lived us. He tells us to be a light in this dark world, to be His ambassadors and preach His truth in love.

Nothing above do I count as "good works" or our "works of righteousness". They are just a part of who God has made us and happen as naturally for God's kids as breathing or learning to walk beside our Father.

It is not work. It is abiding in Him.


The good works start when we interact with the world and have to live the lessons God reaches us.

It happens when we learn to tame our tongues, when we encourage our siblings, when we operate in the spiritual gifts given us to minister to the Church and the world. When we feed the poor, visit orphans and clothe the naked. One hopes we feed them with spiritual food that points to the Bread of life, Jesus Christ the Manna from Heaven. One hopes we tell orphans that They have a heavenly father as well as care for their physical needs in this life. One hopes we show them how We once were naked too but have since been clothed in Christ's righteousness and white robes of His mercy and grace...that we learn to us the Spiritual armor God has placed upon us to allow us to stand against the wiles of the devil.

Yet I doubt you will read this page long post.

If I answer you simply you find fault or twist simple words by adding your own to make it mean what was not intended.

If I answer you fully, you say it's too long,

I read every post to me.
I wish you'd use quotes.

i say it's to long on answers when someone has to go on and on explaining things that could be expalined in one sentence because they need to twist words in the bible around.

This does not mean I don't read posts.

I find it very simple to say this:

GOD DEMADS THAT WE OBEY HIM.

See. it didn't take a Whole page.
Why do you find it necessary to explain simple concepts to me?
Do I sound simple to you?

Did you ever condsider that I may have gone a step or two Beyond you?
Maybe you make everthing tooo simple?

Does God REQUIRE OBEDIENCE OR NOT?

THAT is the question at hand.

 

[FranC]

FranC I saw your post to me and I disagree we are not justified or proven God's children by our works.

God tells us some will say "Lord did we not do miracles in your name?" and be rejected. Its not our outward works that matter but the inward change GOD WORKS within our hearts and minds that really matter.

It is when we learn from the Holy Spirit to add to our faith these things do we become fruitful and purified unto good works God has created us for. God will test our works but if we have Christ as our foundation we will be saved even if all are works & doctrines prove hay and stubble.

What matters is a true saving faith in Jesus....not a heathen faith in God to reward good deeds and punish evil ones (works salvation). Not a demon's faith that gives mental assent to who Jesus is but no real trust of love for Him (this is your dead faith you and others keep referring to which does not save). Not the faith of disciples when He physically walked with them before the cross: able to do miracles but not understanding or completely trusting in the finished work of the cross or Jesus plan for salvation by faith alone (old covenant thinking)

Faith and NOT works seems to be a ray of light some will hide from but it's clearly found in the Bible.

Saving faith is more than mental assent, more than trust in a just God, more than the old covenant. It is Faith in Jesus finished work on the cross for the remission of sins, His resurrection, ascension to heaven.

Salvation begins when He sends the Holy spirit to seal us and allow us to cry out Abba father. Until then folks may claim to be Christian but are just fooling themselves and others and going through the motions.

The Holy spirit with transform the heart and mind. God chastens every child and fruit will become evident in the lives of each born again child of God: love, joy, peace, patience, gentleness, kindness and self control.

God will fed His Kids milk until their wounds are healed and they are made strong in His love. He will embraces us and tell us we are new creations in Christ. He holds up a mirror and shows us who He has made us to be. He shows us what true love is and then tells us to love others as He has lived us. He tells us to be a light in this dark world, to be His ambassadors and preach His truth in love.

Nothing above do I count as "good works" or our "works of righteousness". They are just a part of who God has made us and happen as naturally for God's kids as breathing or learning to walk beside our Father.

It is not work. It is abiding in Him.


The good works start when we interact with the world and have to live the lessons God reaches us.

It happens when we learn to tame our tongues, when we encourage our siblings, when we operate in the spiritual gifts given us to minister to the Church and the world. When we feed the poor, visit orphans and clothe the naked. One hopes we feed them with spiritual food that points to the Bread of life, Jesus Christ the Manna from Heaven. One hopes we tell orphans that They have a heavenly father as well as care for their physical needs in this life. One hopes we show them how We once were naked too but have since been clothed in Christ's righteousness and white robes of His mercy and grace...that we learn to us the Spiritual armor God has placed upon us to allow us to stand against the wiles of the devil.

Yet I doubt you will read this page long post.

If I answer you simply you find fault or twist simple words by adding your own to make it mean what was not intended.

If I answer you fully, you say it's too long,

BTW, My name is Fran. Do I call you Ariel82?

 

[Ariel82]

BTW, My name is Fran. Do I call you Ariel82?

It matters not to me, my name isn't Ariel, but I will try and remember to address you as Fran.

 

[Ariel82]

I read every post to me.
I wish you'd use quotes.

i say it's to long on answers when someone has to go on and on explaining things that could be expalined in one sentence because they need to twist words in the bible around.

This does not mean I don't read posts.

I find it very simple to say this:

GOD DEMADS THAT WE OBEY HIM.

See. it didn't take a Whole page.
Why do you find it necessary to explain simple concepts to me?
Do I sound simple to you?

Did you ever condsider that I may have gone a step or two Beyond you?
Maybe you make everthing tooo simple?

Does God REQUIRE OBEDIENCE OR NOT?

THAT is the question at hand.

God requires more than obedience.

Matthew 9:13 ►
New International Version
But go and learn what this means: 'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.' For I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners."
....

How is that?

 

[Zmouth]

I don't believe in the dead faith of demons will save.,,mental accent is not enough.

Isn't death faith when a person believes yet their belief has no substance in truth?

Neither is the heathen faith of works salvation or faith in the old covenant.

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father. John 14:12

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Isn't death faith when a person believes yet their belief has no substance in truth?







Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father. John 14:12

amen

so why are people. Here saying a person can have faith, but not have any works?

it does not follow what the e faith means does it?

 

[FranC]

Yeah, I know. Funny isn't it.
Paragraph after paragraph of Christians defending the case for dead faith. The dead faith that James says won't save, yet is being so vehemently defended here. But I know that is where the church is at in this time of human history. We've got it in our heads that we don't have to do anything or <gasp!> we'd be guilty of trying to earn our own salvation. We got a lot of people thinking God is going to heap praise on them when they give Christ back his One Talent when he returns because God is just so loving and gracious that way! I can hear their voices already...."let me in, let me in!"

Amen.

God is Love and mercy.
But God is also JUST.

Some seem to refuse the Holiness of God, His purity, His Almighty nature.

Throughout the O.T. and the N.T. God has given us a choice. Even through His covenants. IF we choose HIm, He will bless us, IF we do not choose to follow His covenants He will curse us.

Deuteronomy 29:20-21
Deuteronomy 30:15, 19
Joshua 24:14-16

We are to choose whom we will SERVE. Serve is the word. Call it works, call it what you will, but the God who created the universe gives us the choice and we are to serve HIM. With no questions attached...

 

[Ariel82]

Zmouth, I would call that a false faith, but a dead one.

A dead one has the gospel message, calls Jesus the Son of God but has no love of Jesus in their heart. No inward change even though an outward confession of who Jesus is and what He did.


James 2:19New King James Version (NKJV)
19 You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble!

 

[FranC]

Apparently not



0 Pleaaase.....I already have a teacher.

Whew!

I was worried there for a moment ...