Not By Works
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You are using verses in response to the Messiah's teaching... don't try The you don't believe John thing... i just don't replace a Teaching because all affirms to one and other... the Word mixed with Faith.
You are continuing to state work v Faith questions and let me say that.. I love the New wine.. it is better.
E
so John 3 is in response to messiahs teaching? I thought it was messiahs teaching?
And john 1 is not the inspired words of God? Ephesians 1 is not inspired. Titus 3 is not inspred?
The bible can not contradict. If it does, it is untrustworthy.
WHy do you never have an answer to anything I say, only an excuse?
PS, I love new wine also. I love works, I love my savior, and I love to obey him.
so what is different about you and me? What seperates us?
N
i never once said i believe in eternal security
so false accusation
and "beliefs aside
im speaking of the false accusations
dirt flinging
spiteful words
disgusting cowardly passive aggression
self image bleeding through every word...
a DESIRE to argue
with zero intention to act as God intends his children to act
no desire to help a brother a sister a neighbor or an enemy
only desire to be correct
to be the winner
to esteem themself
its not of God"
so false accusation
and "beliefs aside
im speaking of the false accusations
dirt flinging
spiteful words
disgusting cowardly passive aggression
self image bleeding through every word...
a DESIRE to argue
with zero intention to act as God intends his children to act
no desire to help a brother a sister a neighbor or an enemy
only desire to be correct
to be the winner
to esteem themself
its not of God"
Luke 6 46“Why do you call Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ and do not do what I say? 47“Everyone who comes to Me and hears My words and acts on them, I will show you whom he is like: 48he is like a man building a house, who dug deep and laid a foundation on the rock; and when a flood occurred, the torrent burst against that house and could not shake it, because it had been well built. 49“But the one who has heard and has not acted accordingly, is like a man who built a house on the ground without any foundation; and the torrent burst against it and immediately it collapsed, and the ruin of that house was great.”
Isn't Jesus saying something about obedience here?
We must obey according to what we have heard, or it is nothing.
Isn't Jesus saying something about obedience here?
We must obey according to what we have heard, or it is nothing.
E
lol.. ok, we must stop here. My God is not an indian giver, and he does snot make mistakes.
No loving human father who is flawed would kick their child out, and disown them,
so you must think God is worse than a human father who is flawed.
If God kicks a person out, He is not a person we can trust, he is a liar. He said he would never lose anyone, He would leave the flock to find his sheep. and they know his voice and follow him (one who does not follow him was never his sheep to begin with)
I pray you will never judge yourself worthy, if you even think you are. you are in trouble.
No loving human father who is flawed would kick their child out, and disown them,
so you must think God is worse than a human father who is flawed.
If God kicks a person out, He is not a person we can trust, he is a liar. He said he would never lose anyone, He would leave the flock to find his sheep. and they know his voice and follow him (one who does not follow him was never his sheep to begin with)
I pray you will never judge yourself worthy, if you even think you are. you are in trouble.
N
last i was asked about "osas"
this is how i answered
________________________
i dont think "once saved always saved" is correct in the sense you say the sinners prayer and youre good
but ... ok
first heres an example im sure you know
Luke 15:11-32
11 And he said, A certain man had two sons:
12 And the younger of them said to his father, Father, give me the portion of goods that falleth to me. And he divided unto them his living.
13 And not many days after the younger son gathered all together, and took his journey into a far country, and there wasted his substance with riotous living.
14 And when he had spent all, there arose a mighty famine in that land; and he began to be in want.
15 And he went and joined himself to a citizen of that country; and he sent him into his fields to feed swine.
16 And he would fain have filled his belly with the husks that the swine did eat: and no man gave unto him.
17 And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger!
18 I will arise and go to my father, and will say unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and before thee,
19 And am no more worthy to be called thy son: make me as one of thy hired servants.
20 And he arose, and came to his father. But when he was yet a great way off, his father saw him, and had compassion, and ran, and fell on his neck, and kissed him.
21 And the son said unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and in thy sight, and am no more worthy to be called thy son.
22 But the father said to his servants, Bring forth the best robe, and put it on him; and put a ring on his hand, and shoes on his feet:
23 And bring hither the fatted calf, and kill it; and let us eat, and be merry:
24 For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found. And they began to be merry.
25 Now his elder son was in the field: and as he came and drew nigh to the house, he heard musick and dancing.
26 And he called one of the servants, and asked what these things meant.
27 And he said unto him, Thy brother is come; and thy father hath killed the fatted calf, because he hath received him safe and sound.
28 And he was angry, and would not go in: therefore came his father out, and intreated him.
29 And he answering said to his father, Lo, these many years do I serve thee, neither transgressed I at any time thy commandment: and yet thou never gavest me a kid, that I might make merry with my friends:
30 But as soon as this thy son was come, which hath devoured thy living with harlots, thou hast killed for him the fatted calf.
31 And he said unto him, Son, thou art ever with me, and all that I have is thine.
32 It was meet that we should make merry, and be glad: for this thy brother was dead, and is alive again; and was lost, and is found.
______________
now, the younger son NEEDED to return to his father and repent EVEN though before he left he was still his son
just feeling sorry
and regretting didnt save him..
his father did
but HE had to return .... and his father was happy to RUN to him while he was still on his way back, and recieve him with open arms
________________
this is where confusion hits
___________
Romans 8:2
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
_______________
Proverbs 24:16
16 For a just man falleth seven times, and riseth up again: but the wicked shall fall into mischief.
__________________
limited to seven?
no
Matthew 18:21-22
21 Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?
22 Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.
_________________
its not a matter of how much we fall
its not a matter of our works
its not a matter of us HAVING salvation
its a matter of belief in Jesus
and LIVING according to the Holy spirit
now someone can have experienced the Holy spirit
heard Gods call
then depart from the faith
but these people will show it in their fruits
Romans 1:27-28
28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
____________
1 Timothy 4
4 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
this is how i answered
________________________
i dont think "once saved always saved" is correct in the sense you say the sinners prayer and youre good
but ... ok
first heres an example im sure you know
Luke 15:11-32
11 And he said, A certain man had two sons:
12 And the younger of them said to his father, Father, give me the portion of goods that falleth to me. And he divided unto them his living.
13 And not many days after the younger son gathered all together, and took his journey into a far country, and there wasted his substance with riotous living.
14 And when he had spent all, there arose a mighty famine in that land; and he began to be in want.
15 And he went and joined himself to a citizen of that country; and he sent him into his fields to feed swine.
16 And he would fain have filled his belly with the husks that the swine did eat: and no man gave unto him.
17 And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger!
18 I will arise and go to my father, and will say unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and before thee,
19 And am no more worthy to be called thy son: make me as one of thy hired servants.
20 And he arose, and came to his father. But when he was yet a great way off, his father saw him, and had compassion, and ran, and fell on his neck, and kissed him.
21 And the son said unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and in thy sight, and am no more worthy to be called thy son.
22 But the father said to his servants, Bring forth the best robe, and put it on him; and put a ring on his hand, and shoes on his feet:
23 And bring hither the fatted calf, and kill it; and let us eat, and be merry:
24 For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found. And they began to be merry.
25 Now his elder son was in the field: and as he came and drew nigh to the house, he heard musick and dancing.
26 And he called one of the servants, and asked what these things meant.
27 And he said unto him, Thy brother is come; and thy father hath killed the fatted calf, because he hath received him safe and sound.
28 And he was angry, and would not go in: therefore came his father out, and intreated him.
29 And he answering said to his father, Lo, these many years do I serve thee, neither transgressed I at any time thy commandment: and yet thou never gavest me a kid, that I might make merry with my friends:
30 But as soon as this thy son was come, which hath devoured thy living with harlots, thou hast killed for him the fatted calf.
31 And he said unto him, Son, thou art ever with me, and all that I have is thine.
32 It was meet that we should make merry, and be glad: for this thy brother was dead, and is alive again; and was lost, and is found.
______________
now, the younger son NEEDED to return to his father and repent EVEN though before he left he was still his son
just feeling sorry
and regretting didnt save him..
his father did
but HE had to return .... and his father was happy to RUN to him while he was still on his way back, and recieve him with open arms
________________
this is where confusion hits
___________
Romans 8:2
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
_______________
Proverbs 24:16
16 For a just man falleth seven times, and riseth up again: but the wicked shall fall into mischief.
__________________
limited to seven?
no
Matthew 18:21-22
21 Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?
22 Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.
_________________
its not a matter of how much we fall
its not a matter of our works
its not a matter of us HAVING salvation
its a matter of belief in Jesus
and LIVING according to the Holy spirit
now someone can have experienced the Holy spirit
heard Gods call
then depart from the faith
but these people will show it in their fruits
Romans 1:27-28
28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
____________
1 Timothy 4
4 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
Unfortunately, I agree.
However, I will remain here as long as necessary.
And not to be the winner...
But to proclaim the truth.
God demands to be obeyed. This cannot be denied.
So why not just admit it.?
Because some here have incorrect doctrine which is very damaging to the body of Christ.
You don't have to join if the spirit does not lead you.
I have no problem being here.
God and I are good.
All evil needs to flourish
Is for good to do nothing.
However, I will remain here as long as necessary.
And not to be the winner...
But to proclaim the truth.
God demands to be obeyed. This cannot be denied.
So why not just admit it.?
Because some here have incorrect doctrine which is very damaging to the body of Christ.
You don't have to join if the spirit does not lead you.
I have no problem being here.
God and I are good.
All evil needs to flourish
Is for good to do nothing.
You referenced John in regard to what the Messiah taught So have a word with yourself.. nothing is void but affirms... so we need not carry on this.. deny or recieve is your decision.
your last question is quite leading..
Do you want me to say I'm saved and you are not or you are saved and iam not and become the judge.
You say im not worthy of eternal life... and I guess you deem you are so that seperates us.
You may think you rely completely on the work of the cross and believe I don't...
I Trust in GOD who is the power of the cross... and if accusations warranted then so be it.
What say you?
You can't live your life of faith by dead faith. It's impossible.
But someone will say, "You have faith; I have deeds." Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds.
New Living Translation
Now someone may argue, "Some people have faith; others have good deeds." But I say, "How can you show me your faith if you don't have good deeds? I will show you my faith by my good deeds."
English Standard Version
But someone will say, “You have faith and I have works.” Show me your faith apart from your works, and I will show you my faith by my works.
Berean Study Bible
But someone will say, "You have faith and I have deeds." Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds.
New American Standard Bible
But someone may well say, "You have faith and I have works; show me your faith without the works, and I will show you my faith by my works."
Those that "say" they have faith can't prove it.
"Saying" faith is dead faith.
James 2:18
New International VersionBut someone will say, "You have faith; I have deeds." Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds.
New Living Translation
Now someone may argue, "Some people have faith; others have good deeds." But I say, "How can you show me your faith if you don't have good deeds? I will show you my faith by my good deeds."
English Standard Version
But someone will say, “You have faith and I have works.” Show me your faith apart from your works, and I will show you my faith by my works.
Berean Study Bible
But someone will say, "You have faith and I have deeds." Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds.
New American Standard Bible
But someone may well say, "You have faith and I have works; show me your faith without the works, and I will show you my faith by my works."
Those that "say" they have faith can't prove it.
"Saying" faith is dead faith.
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Not everyone who says to Me Lord, Lord will enter the kingdom of God.
It is evident that Jesus is talking about false prophets in Matt. 7:15. These are not born-again believers because "inwardly" they are wolves. Christians are NOT wolves. They have a new heart in Christ.
Matthew 7:15 (NASB)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] "Beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves.
Notice that in Matt 7:19-33..Jesus said in verse 21:
"I never knew you "...these people were not believers...
( Jesus never said " I used to know you once.". He said I NEVER knew you at all...).
Everyone when they see Jesus will call Him Lord.....because He is Lord and will be for eternity.
Jesus said that He "knows" His sheep so those in Matt. 7:19-33 are not true Christians.
John 10:14 (KJV)
[SUP]14[/SUP]I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.
Jesus did the "will of God"...and delivered us from this present evil world
Galatians 1:4 (KJV)
[SUP]4[/SUP] Who gave himself for our sins, that he might deliver us from this present evil world, according to the will of God and our Father:
It is God in us that gives us the will and the ability to do His will.
Philippians 2:13 (NASB)
[SUP]13[/SUP] for it is God who is at work in you, both to will and to work for His good pleasure.
The Will of the Father is to believe on Jesus.
John 6:39-40 (NASB)
[SUP]39 [/SUP] "This is the will of Him who sent Me, that of all that He has given Me I lose nothing, but raise it up on the last day.
[SUP]40 [/SUP] "For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day."
1 John 3:23-24 (NASB)
[SUP]23[/SUP] This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us.
[SUP]24[/SUP] The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. We know by this that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.
The good works we do are from "being in Christ"..being led by the Holy Spirit. Notice God has prepared them for us. We walk them out as we live our lives dependent on Him. It is His fruit that bears in and through us.
Ephesians 2:8-10 (NASB)
[SUP]8[/SUP] For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;
[SUP]9[/SUP] not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.
[SUP]10[/SUP] For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.
It is evident that Jesus is talking about false prophets in Matt. 7:15. These are not born-again believers because "inwardly" they are wolves. Christians are NOT wolves. They have a new heart in Christ.
Matthew 7:15 (NASB)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] "Beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves.
Notice that in Matt 7:19-33..Jesus said in verse 21:
"I never knew you "...these people were not believers...
( Jesus never said " I used to know you once.". He said I NEVER knew you at all...).
Everyone when they see Jesus will call Him Lord.....because He is Lord and will be for eternity.
Jesus said that He "knows" His sheep so those in Matt. 7:19-33 are not true Christians.
John 10:14 (KJV)
[SUP]14[/SUP]I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.
Jesus did the "will of God"...and delivered us from this present evil world
Galatians 1:4 (KJV)
[SUP]4[/SUP] Who gave himself for our sins, that he might deliver us from this present evil world, according to the will of God and our Father:
It is God in us that gives us the will and the ability to do His will.
Philippians 2:13 (NASB)
[SUP]13[/SUP] for it is God who is at work in you, both to will and to work for His good pleasure.
The Will of the Father is to believe on Jesus.
John 6:39-40 (NASB)
[SUP]39 [/SUP] "This is the will of Him who sent Me, that of all that He has given Me I lose nothing, but raise it up on the last day.
[SUP]40 [/SUP] "For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day."
1 John 3:23-24 (NASB)
[SUP]23[/SUP] This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us.
[SUP]24[/SUP] The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. We know by this that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.
The good works we do are from "being in Christ"..being led by the Holy Spirit. Notice God has prepared them for us. We walk them out as we live our lives dependent on Him. It is His fruit that bears in and through us.
Ephesians 2:8-10 (NASB)
[SUP]8[/SUP] For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;
[SUP]9[/SUP] not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.
[SUP]10[/SUP] For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.
