Not By Works

[eternally-gratefull]

Okay, I read the rest of your post EG.

I look at the verse about poor in spirit in a different way. You say we must become poor in spirit/spiritually bankrupt. I think we already ARE poor in spirit but just haven't realized it yet sometimes. That's how it went with me anyway. I had to keep trying to be good because I couldn't see or admit yet that I had nothing with which to accomplish being good. I just thought He had saved me and I owed it to Him to do as He said.. (There were some other motivations mixed up in that too, but the main one was a desire to actually BE good after what He'd done for me.)

the Pharisee did not realize it that's why he always Preachd work work work, and declaired those who did not were sinners who loved their sin, and boasted of their rightiosuness

he tax collector realized it, that's why he fell unable to even look up in shame. And asked God to show mercy,

while your right, we all are spiritually bankrupt, unless we actually believe it, like th tax collector, we will continue to fail to come to saving faith, Because we will still think we have something to offer

 

[Limey410v2]

First I want to address your first sentence, then I'll read the rest, I promise!

Well...I didn't have the capacity to fully understand, yet I received Him. And not like one of the people who slowly come to an awareness of the Holy Spirit in them either - my receiving was dramatic and unmistakable! But I didn't even fully understand that Jesus was God - not sure when I realized it. I didn't go to a church to realize it either - He taught me just fine with Himself and the scriptures I read. I didn't fully understand ANYTHING. I'm serious. All I could keep repeating over and over was: I'm so sorry, I didn't know, I didn't know. In one moment of time I saw that God WAS where before I hadn't seen that ever. And it all happened by reading the gospel. The only thing I fully understood was that what I read was true and that I'd ignored God all my life. But within the next few days, I rented Mel Gibsons movie, and came to think I loved Jesus but did not care much for God because He could have found a better way than to kill this man I now loved! Can you believe He would save someone as stupid as me??

Hence your CC user name I love hearing peoples raw testimony.

When my wife got saved she had a very similar experience. (Stunned by Grace)

She was a straight up atheist, wanted NOTHING to do with God.

She was gardening one day and she looked at a small stem of a tomato plant that was just breaking the surface of the ground.

Suddenly the whole world became much brighter, like for real, not metaphorically, and slowed down for her, and she realized at that moment that God was real.

She said to herself, "I know you are real but I'm not sure about Jesus.".

She went to a bible believing church that weekend and Jesus surely was confirmed to her then.

That is her story of conversion. I believe her. She has walked with Jesus every day since, 14 years later.

 

[Bogadile]

Yes, I see your derogatory slam.

For all the ladies and gentlemen out there, it was an oversight unintended. Obviously, as a "calvinist" I full well believe in the foreknowledge of God. No Calvinist denies this, so the intended slander is noted.

For the record, the man whom we just bought property from, whom we just talked to suddenly died in front of his wife. They live in front of where we are building.

My apologies for my lapse, probably a bit distracted, and I own my mistake.

Nevertheless you always get at least one person filled with malice, disdain and discord who will go on the attack.

Well, the reason I pointed it out is because I see a lot of calvinists also not highlight it in speech, they use their tone of voice to really highlight the predestine part, and quickly run through the foreknew part.
Sorry for your loss if you knew the man.
As for derogatory slam, read your own post, you accused me of malice disdain and discord, pot meet kettle. If you really thought that what I said was an "attack", wowee, you are really sensitive.
Is this the "bold-hearted" man being "mean-spirited"?

But lets leave it at that. If you want to keep arguing we can do it in PM. No need to waste time on this, if your feelings were hurt I apologize.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

" Oh you, we who have so little faith...xox...That comes to my mind...xox...

Ahh...I missed that post by EG! I thought I NEVER missed a post!
There is something I saw the other day too, I think it was a preacher I listened to, which I don't do often but this man just grabbed me and I listened to a lot of his videos. I was reminded of it when EG said He saved Peter even after that massive fail in faith on top of a huge leap of faith!

It's where the apostle is speaking to men who were having relations with temple prostitutes. He didn't call them unsaved, pull their hair, kick them out, or tell them they were now unsaved or never saved! He said: don't you realize who you are?? You're the temple of the Holy Spirit! (My paraphrase).

 

[Cee]

Salvation is the doorway into the Kingdom of God. We are reborn into His Kingdom. He gives us spiritual eyes to see according to the Spirit. He tells us what He sees. And we by faith agree with Him and begin to see as He does.

Here's how this plays out:

If we don't believe we are saved, the only eyes we have left to see out of are fleshly and carnal. This is being conformed to the world. The world determines what believe, what is true, and who we are in this state of mind.

If we believe we are not a new creation, our eyes are on ourselves to try to be something we are not. This is a very religious mindset, it's the older brother who worked in the fields without joy. He waited for his Father to throw the party for him. Even though he had access to what the Father did through his inheritance.

If we don't believe other people are a new creation in Christ, we will tear them down instead of building them up. We will see them by the flesh instead of by the Spirit. Satan was the first accuser. God was the first Redeemer. Which Spirit are we of? This is something I am myself working out through relationship with God. Because I do value truth so much, I have a tendency to come against lies with a hammer of truth, but Paul tells us that it is love that never fails.

I believe there is a higher truth than simply principles we argue about. I believe the higher truth is who Christ is in us and who we are in Him. Speaking to one another and in truth is correcting people back to who they truly are. Getting their minds off the carnal only option and back to being renewed by His truth about them.

This is something I'm growing in myself. Not reacting to lies, but respond to His truth.

 

[preacher4truth]

it also appears there is some gang stalking members on this forum,

No one is gang stalking, but I'll tell you this: your lies on others have been called out. Go prove your false accusations.

Never mind, apologize for them, you can't prove them because no one here believes what you've claimed.

they seem to despise holiness and obedience, and seek to silence those that expose their false doctrines for what they are, (smoke and mirrors) masquerading as truth

No one here despises holiness. In context of this immediate discussion what is despised are the lies you've perpetrated on others.

 

[Limey410v2]

The lost are not the unbelieving, are they?

But the unbelieving are lost. I don't think they are mutually exclusive.

 

[Rosemaryx]

the Pharisee did not realize it that's why he always Preachd work work work, and declaired those who did not were sinners who loved their sin, and boasted of their rightiosuness

he tax collector realized it, that's why he fell unable to even look up in shame. And asked God to show mercy,

while your right, we all are spiritually bankrupt, unless we actually believe it, like th tax collector, we will continue to fail to come to saving faith, Because we will still think we have something to offer

They are nothing but white washed tombs...Beautiful on the outside but rotten within, we can be like that sometimes, that`s why we need our beautiful Lord...xox...

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

the Pharisee did not realize it that's why he always Preachd work work work, and declaired those who did not were sinners who loved their sin, and boasted of their rightiosuness

he tax collector realized it, that's why he fell unable to even look up in shame. And asked God to show mercy,

while your right, we all are spiritually bankrupt, unless we actually believe it, like th tax collector, we will continue to fail to come to saving faith, Because we will still think we have something to offer

And yet, here I am, telling you that I received the Spirit and had no idea I was so poor. I was very self-righteous at times. I saw everyone elses mistakes but never my own. I could go on and on telling you of how bad I was when He saved me and of how little I understood. No one receives the Spirit and has failed to come to saving faith. That would mean I could have lost His Spirit, which you, by your own admission, do not believe is possible.

 

[preacher4truth]

Well, the reason I pointed it out is because I see a lot of calvinists also not highlight it in speech

This isn't true and is unsubstantiated drivel.

But lets leave it at that. If you want to keep arguing we can do it in PM.

You can leave it at that, but I'm not going to. How about that?

I'll pass on the PM thing and take you on publicly concerning your slander of others and false representations.

If you want schooled on foreknowledge by this "calvinist" then accept the challenge after you admit your false representations and I'll be more than glad to oblige.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

They are nothing but white washed tombs...Beautiful on the outside but rotten within, we can be like that sometimes, that`s why we need our beautiful Lord...xox...

Amen to that, we may be tax collectors in heart, and act like Pharisees.. lol

 

[eternally-gratefull]

And yet, here I am, telling you that I received the Spirit and had no idea I was so poor. I was very self-righteous at times. I saw everyone elses mistakes but never my own. I could go on and on telling you of how bad I was when He saved me and of how little I understood. No one receives the Spirit and has failed to come to saving faith. That would mean I could have lost His Spirit, which you, by your own admission, do not believe is possible.

​did you believe God could save you completely, or that you had to continue to try to help him?

 

[preacher4truth]

The lost are not the unbelieving, are they?

Seriously?

Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God. John 3:18.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

No one is gang stalking, but I'll tell you this: your lies on others have been called out. Go prove your false accusations.

Never mind, apologize for them, you can't prove them because no one here believes what you've claimed.



No one here despises holiness. In context of this immediate discussion what is despised are the lies you've perpetrated on others.

​it's ok bro, I asked a mod what to do, let him handle it, let's continue to talk in peace.

 

[Rosemaryx]

And yet, here I am, telling you that I received the Spirit and had no idea I was so poor. I was very self-righteous at times. I saw everyone elses mistakes but never my own. I could go on and on telling you of how bad I was when He saved me and of how little I understood. No one receives the Spirit and has failed to come to saving faith. That would mean I could have lost His Spirit, which you, by your own admission, do not believe is possible.

SBG...You have the Holy Spirit in you now, right now, this moment in time...There is a reason why we must always CLING to Him, if we don`t then we walk in darkness, but remember Jesus said " I will never leave you nor forsake you ", we are one in Christ as long as we abide...xox...

 

[preacher4truth]

​it's ok bro, I asked a mod what to do, let him handle it, let's continue to talk in peace.

Thanks bro, I appreciate it.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

​did you believe God could save you completely, or that you had to continue to try to help him?

LOL! Did you read what I shared??
No...I knew I was saved. I knew He had saved me. I said it was a dramatic receiving of the Spirit, not quiet and gradual awareness as with some.

But I worked really hard to try to be good for a really long time before I gave up the ruse. (And during that time, I encouraged others to try really hard also).

And prior to that, I thought I was quite holy and humble for a really long time. That finally involved a crash that will live forever in infamy.

And He didn't abandon me through any of that. For many years.

 

[Limey410v2]

Salvation is the doorway into the Kingdom of God. We are reborn into His Kingdom. He gives us spiritual eyes to see according to the Spirit. He tells us what He sees. And we by faith agree with Him and begin to see as He does.

Here's how this plays out:

If we don't believe we are saved, the only eyes we have left to see out of are fleshly and carnal. This is being conformed to the world. The world determines what believe, what is true, and who we are in this state of mind.

If we believe we are not a new creation, our eyes are on ourselves to try to be something we are not. This is a very religious mindset, it's the older brother who worked in the fields without joy. He waited for his Father to throw the party for him. Even though he had access to what the Father did through his inheritance.

If we don't believe other people are a new creation in Christ, we will tear them down instead of building them up. We will see them by the flesh instead of by the Spirit. Satan was the first accuser. God was the first Redeemer. Which Spirit are we of? This is something I am myself working out through relationship with God. Because I do value truth so much, I have a tendency to come against lies with a hammer of truth, but Paul tells us that it is love that never fails.

I believe there is a higher truth than simply principles we argue about. I believe the higher truth is who Christ is in us and who we are in Him. Speaking to one another and in truth is correcting people back to who they truly are. Getting their minds off the carnal only option and back to being renewed by His truth about them.

This is something I'm growing in myself. Not reacting to lies, but respond to His truth.

I bolded the statement that gave me goosebumps Punch, counter punch!! Love it.

 

[stonesoffire]

First I want to address your first sentence, then I'll read the rest, I promise!

Well...I didn't have the capacity to fully understand, yet I received Him. And not like one of the people who slowly come to an awareness of the Holy Spirit in them either - my receiving was dramatic and unmistakable! But I didn't even fully understand that Jesus was God - not sure when I realized it. I didn't go to a church to realize it either - He taught me just fine with Himself and the scriptures I read. I didn't fully understand ANYTHING. I'm serious. All I could keep repeating over and over was: I'm so sorry, I didn't know, I didn't know. In one moment of time I saw that God WAS where before I hadn't seen that ever. And it all happened by reading the gospel. The only thing I fully understood was that what I read was true and that I'd ignored God all my life. But within the next few days, I rented Mel Gibsons movie, and came to think I loved Jesus but did not care much for God because He could have found a better way than to kill this man I now loved! Can you believe He would save someone as stupid as me??

well, seeing as how He actually has saved the world with all the sin in it, (unless received personally,) I guess We all are included no matter how stupid we may be.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

LOL! Did you read what I shared??
No...I knew I was saved. I knew He had saved me. I said it was a dramatic receiving of the Spirit, not quiet and gradual awareness as with some.

But I worked really hard to try to be good for a really long time before I gave up the ruse. (And during that time, I encouraged others to try really hard also).

And prior to that, I thought I was quite holy and humble for a really long time. That finally involved a crash that will live forever in infamy.

And He didn't abandon me through any of that. For many years.

so if I read right you worked because you wanted to please God, not to maintain your salvation, right?