Not By Works

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Nov 12, 2015
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I am in a total FIT of laughter right now. My dog was begging as usual, so I gave him some of my midnight snack, a saltine with peanut butter on it. Have you ever seen this??! He got it stuck on the roof of his mouth and can't stop sticking his tongue in and out. He is still doing it.

If you have a dog and some peanut butter, you have to see it! If I laugh any harder I'll have an aneurysm, I swear!
 
W

willybob

Guest
It's very clear in the scriptures.

For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes. – Romans 10:4
this is true, however many define "believe" much different than the biblical definition,
which means steadfast obedience from heart purity...
 
Nov 22, 2015
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Thanks G777. Always able to add some clarity for me:cool:
You are welcome....:)..


This truth of Christ's work and that we are circumcised from our body of flesh by the circumcision of Christ is paramount in growing up in Him and seeing the true new creation which has been created in righteousness and holiness.

This is another truth about that we are safe in the Lord because we are in Christ - even if our minds get screwed up from wrong belief. True faith is of the heart and not the head when we hear the gospel message of Christ. Rom. 10:9-10.

Once we are circumcised - we cannot go back to being uncircumcised. This truth is reality in the natural as the old skin dies and becomes no more ( just like the old man did on the cross with Jesus ) - it is true for us in Christ too. The new man in Christ is righteousness because we are one spirit with the Lord. 1 Cor. 6:17

Romans 8:10 (NASB)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness.

Here is a great teaching that speaks to this subject of "Why do we still sin?" - if interested.

[video=youtube;Bi-oq5qBkWA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bi-oq5qBkWA[/video]
 
Nov 12, 2015
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As an aside, do you think that they escalate in importance from moral excellence to love?
Hmm...
I have found that growth in virtue is not strictly linear, like that list. If you increase in one virtue, you have increased in all of them. To grow in humility makes me love others more, to grow in patience means I HAVE grown in humility, to grow in longsuffering means I HAVE grown in love, etc., etc.

Of course, a man has no way to speak or write about the virtues in other than a linear way, but...if you've increased in one virtue, you have increased in all of them in some measure.
 

Desertsrose

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2016
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As an aside, do you think that they escalate in importance from moral excellence to love?

I think they all describes agape (love). Agape doesn't rely on emotional or good feelings like fondness or love, but instead it chooses to act out of self-sacrifice to serve others with humility.

Agape love is the ultimate. It's God's love as we look at Jesus sacrificing Himself on our behalf to serve us with humility.....He being God, He humbled Himself to the form or being a servant to the point of death of a cross so that we would be reunited to our Heavenly Father. There's no great love.

I remember an elderly man once saying to a group of younger Christians that we really don't fathom the depths of God's love for us. And the more I grow in knowledge and truth, the more I believe and understand what that man said 40 years ago when I was a baby Christian was spot on.

I really believe the more we grow in understanding His love and experiencing His love, the kinder and more gentle we'll be with one another here in this forum.

Agape is the highest kind of love, it's the noblest type of devotion.....a conscious choice - and it's intentional.

This agape love is.........
patient
kind
is not jealous
does not brag
not arrogant
does not act unbecomingly
it does not seek its own
is not provoked
does not take into account a wrong suffered
does not rejoice in unrighteousness
but rejoices with the truth
bears all things
believes all things
hopes all things
endures all things

agape never fails
......love covers over a multitude of sins.

I don't really know if they escalate from moral excellence all the way to the last one which is love. What do you think?

As I read this section, Peter is telling us to make haste, to supply these things. Was he intending that we add them in order?

I haven't gotten that far in the study, so maybe you can help me here. :)
 
Dec 12, 2013
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so what causes positional sanctification, and what empowers conditional?
Positional is based upon salvation and being born of the spirit....obviously the conditional aspect is based upon the power of God working through us as we yield as a living sacrifice, remaining in the light as he is in the light and remaining in fellowship by faithful service....
 
Dec 12, 2013
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you mean like the ones who slander Job and Daniel and say they were just sinners?
Maybe you should read where Daniel clearly states he was CONFESSING HIS SINS....or do you reject that part of the word like you reject the imputed righteousness of Christ as spoken of by David and mentioned by Paul??
 
Dec 12, 2013
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I'd like to address the idea that the other 11 disciples simply sat in the boat in fear while Peter got out.

The truth is that Peter is the ONLY disciple who was invited to come. Peter said, If you ask ME, I will be able to come out to you. And the Lord said, "Come."

Please notice that first we ask Him. And then we walk on His response in faith.

The lesson here is that we must trust His responses and not look at our circumstances like Peter did.

The key to faith though is being fully persuaded in our heart. And this comes from remembering who He is, what He has said and what He is saying in our life. And finally not letting the voice of the wind in our circumstances takes us away into doubting what He promises us.
Excellent point Cee....thanks for your insight bro
 

loveme1

Senior Member
Oct 30, 2011
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Revelation 2

[h=1]Revelation 2King James Version (KJV)[/h]2 Unto the angel of the church of Ephesus write; These things saith he that holdeth the seven stars in his right hand, who walketh in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks;
2 I know thy works, and thy labour, and thy patience, and how thou canst not bear them which are evil: and thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars:
3 And hast borne, and hast patience, and for my name's sake hast laboured, and hast not fainted.
4 Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love.
5 Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent.
6 But this thou hast, that thou hatest the deeds of the Nicolaitanes, which I also hate.
7 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God.
8 And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive;
9 I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.
10 Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life.
11 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.
12 And to the angel of the church in Pergamos write; These things saith he which hath the sharp sword with two edges;
13 I know thy works, and where thou dwellest, even where Satan's seat is: and thou holdest fast my name, and hast not denied my faith, even in those days wherein Antipas was my faithful martyr, who was slain among you, where Satan dwelleth.
14 But I have a few things against thee, because thou hast there them that hold the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balac to cast a stumblingblock before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed unto idols, and to commit fornication.
15 So hast thou also them that hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitanes, which thing I hate.
16 Repent; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will fight against them with the sword of my mouth.
17 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth it.
18 And unto the angel of the church in Thyatira write; These things saith the Son of God, who hath his eyes like unto a flame of fire, and his feet are like fine brass;
19 I know thy works, and charity, and service, and faith, and thy patience, and thy works; and the last to be more than the first.
20 Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols.
21 And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.
22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.
23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.
24 But unto you I say, and unto the rest in Thyatira, as many as have not this doctrine, and which have not known the depths of Satan, as they speak; I will put upon you none other burden.
25 But that which ye have already hold fast till I come.
26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:
27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father.
28 And I will give him the morning star.
29 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.
 
Dec 12, 2013
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Let me say this. :) To walk away from pure love just cannot happen. If one turns back to sin, it speaks to me that there's an idol yet reigning. Does God leave us in this state when we are born of His very own seed? Spiritually within the heart of our being. And are we ever at rest in our soul? I say no. Eventually we will break for He will pursue us and literally cause us to see how much He loves, and won't let us go.

That is how I see Him chastening. Also, a taste of spiritual living, and the miracles? What compares? Absolutely nothing!
You cannot walk away from something Jesus starts and FINISHES....HE COMPLETES THE GOOD WORK HE BEGINS IN EVERYONE!!
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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I too believe that the more we get a revelation that we are not in the flesh but really in the spirit because the real us is in Christ - the new creation - then "the influence" of sin loses it's power because of walking by the Spirit which is all based on the grace of Christ alone.


Grace 777 said the above in one of his posts on this thread. I believe this short statement is the key to a victorious walk with the Lord. Thank you Grace777. The whole post was great but this struck me as key.



 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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You cannot walk away from something Jesus starts and FINISHES....HE COMPLETES THE GOOD WORK HE BEGINS IN EVERYONE!!
Meggido was saying we still have choice. While that is true, would not the fact that when we first chose to believe and was sealed in spirit, that God is declaring His having made His choice of us?

Can our choices override Gods? I would think not. It's done.
 

loveme1

Senior Member
Oct 30, 2011
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Revelation 3

3 And unto the angel of the church in Sardis write; These things saith he that hath the seven Spirits of God, and the seven stars; I know thy works, that thou hast a name that thou livest, and art dead.
2 Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain, that are ready to die: for I have not found thy works perfect before God.
3 Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.
4 Thou hast a few names even in Sardis which have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with me in white: for they are worthy.
5 He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.
6 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.
7 And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write; These things saith he that is holy, he that is true, he that hath the key of David, he that openeth, and no man shutteth; and shutteth, and no man openeth;
8 I know thy works: behold, I have set before thee an open door, and no man can shut it: for thou hast a little strength, and hast kept my word, and hast not denied my name.
9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.
10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.
11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.
12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.
13 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.
14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;
15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.
16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.
17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.
19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.
20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.
21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.
22 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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Abide in Me reminds me to always CLING , to hold on with both hands and not let let go...Abide is to trust, lean and rely, just as Jjesus said...We should abide with everything we got for our dear pathetic life`s...xox...Just said pathetic because that is what we are if we do not abide in Him...xox...
But, wouldn't this be putting the burden of being kept on yourself Rosemary? This is a kind of fear. He holds us. It's His keeping power not ours. We will tire if we think this way. Just believe His promises that He keeps us as His own even to the end.
 

loveme1

Senior Member
Oct 30, 2011
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[TABLE="class: passage-cols"]
[TR]
[TD="class: passage-col col-xs-12 first last"]Galatians 3King James Version (KJV)

3 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?
2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
4 Have ye suffered so many things in vain? if it be yet in vain.
5 He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.
7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham.
8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.
9 So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.
13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
15 Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man's covenant, yet if it be confirmed, no man disannulleth, or addeth thereto.
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
20 Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.
21 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.




May no one try to revive the Old husband but continue in Faith of our Messiah.

Children of GOD need not the law.. for they live by Faith in Christ.

obey the Truth my dears.






[/TD]
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mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
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this is true, however many define "believe" much different than the biblical definition,
which means steadfast obedience from heart purity...
Faith is believing and obedience which follows is works. The word translated believe is from the greek word pisteuō (Strong's #4100) which means "to have faith (in, upon, or with respect to, a person or thing), that is, credit; by implication to entrust (especially one’s spiritual well being to Christ).
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
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It's very clear in the scriptures.

For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes. – Romans 10:4
Amen! The word "believe" in Romans 10:4 goes beyond mere "mental assent" belief in the existence and historical facts about Christ. We must believe/entrust our spiritual well being to Christ; have faith/reliance upon Christ for salvation. Unfortunately, many people merely believe "mental assent" in the existence and historical facts about Christ, yet their trust and reliance is in works for salvation, instead of in Christ alone.
 

Rosemaryx

Senior Member
May 3, 2017
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But, wouldn't this be putting the burden of being kept on yourself Rosemary? This is a kind of fear. He holds us. It's His keeping power not ours. We will tire if we think this way. Just believe His promises that He keeps us as His own even to the end.
Hi SOF...Yes i agree with you...So glad i looked back on post to catch this and thank you:)...xox...