Not By Works
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If I've done something wrong publicly on this forum I think it is biblical to address that issue publicly. Because there will be more than 2 witnesses. For example if you don't appreciate the music video's that I post occasionally here then tell me publicly you don't like the music. If you want me to leave this thread I can do that as well. My point is why can you not ask me your question right here, whats wrong with that. people make silly comments and crack joke's and carry on as they wish on this thread for as long as I have been here. I Don't want to upset you I just wish you would say what you wish to say publicly.
And thank you for this post, I do hope you keep the good memories of your uncle close. You must remember or at least heard how unwelcome Viet Vets were when we returned home as part of the troupe withdrawals. It was required to wear our dress uniforms home all the way, so when I arrived at LAX I was sneered at and you could hear people making snide comments. So when this Cracker Jack box guy shows up today it was like a flash back to 1971. I wanted to put his head where the sun don't shine, ya know. Thanks for you back up and Semper Fi.......
No worries. I work nightshift in a hospital lab as a lab tech. I stay up real late on my nights off to keep the same sleep schedule. I may be up after you lay down, and you are three hrs behind me.
During my 6 months of chemo, (dreadful stuff) I had to go to our local hospital once a week for blood draws so that when I received the chemo the oncologist would make sure everything was safe. I have alway's been grateful to everyone I come in contact with. My best friend told me this one day, he said ya know, now that I am old all of my friends have the same first name. And I said what's that, and he said, Doctor.
Spiritual realities
1. Righteousness is imputed or reconned through faith in God.
Our lives need to reflect obedience to God, but it is the relationship that makes us righteous.
We have been saying that Abraham’s faith was credited to him as righteousness.
Rom 4:9
This is not Christs imputed righteousness put on a sinner, but the relationship, faith,
Abraham had with the Father, which was imputed as righteousness.
2. Behaviour
We are called to walk in Gods ways, to be worthy of His deeds on the cross, to put off the
old self and put on the new self as an act of will and obedience.
As a prisoner for the Lord, then, I urge you to live a life worthy of the calling you have received.
Eph 4.1
You were taught, with regard to your former way of life, to put off your old self, which is being corrupted by its deceitful desires; 23 to be made new in the attitude of your minds; 24 and to put on the new self, created to be like God in true righteousness and holiness.
Eph 4:22-24
3. Reasons
Because Christ has redeemed us as a free gift through the cross to save us.
We are not earning it, or justifying Gods gift, but if we do not honour Christ by putting into action
His new life we are not believing Him.
Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God’s people and also members of his household, 20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone.
Eph 2:19-20
If a road is not safe to cross you do not cross it.
If you believe it is safe you show your belief by crossing the road.
If you stay were you are, there is no result in your faith and it is not real because you are
staying dead in your sins.
There are no excuses. We are called to walk in righteousness and holiness.
If you have deep seated issues in your life, seek counselling, confession, fellowship.
In truth many in the faith cannot cope with this level of personal openness so you will have
to look far and wide to find someone who can help you. Jesus is always there, but it takes much
longer when you do not have fellowship of another brother and sister close by.
God bless you all, for in Christ we are being built into His body and witness to the world, Amen.
1. Righteousness is imputed or reconned through faith in God.
Our lives need to reflect obedience to God, but it is the relationship that makes us righteous.
We have been saying that Abraham’s faith was credited to him as righteousness.
Rom 4:9
This is not Christs imputed righteousness put on a sinner, but the relationship, faith,
Abraham had with the Father, which was imputed as righteousness.
2. Behaviour
We are called to walk in Gods ways, to be worthy of His deeds on the cross, to put off the
old self and put on the new self as an act of will and obedience.
As a prisoner for the Lord, then, I urge you to live a life worthy of the calling you have received.
Eph 4.1
You were taught, with regard to your former way of life, to put off your old self, which is being corrupted by its deceitful desires; 23 to be made new in the attitude of your minds; 24 and to put on the new self, created to be like God in true righteousness and holiness.
Eph 4:22-24
3. Reasons
Because Christ has redeemed us as a free gift through the cross to save us.
We are not earning it, or justifying Gods gift, but if we do not honour Christ by putting into action
His new life we are not believing Him.
Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God’s people and also members of his household, 20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone.
Eph 2:19-20
If a road is not safe to cross you do not cross it.
If you believe it is safe you show your belief by crossing the road.
If you stay were you are, there is no result in your faith and it is not real because you are
staying dead in your sins.
There are no excuses. We are called to walk in righteousness and holiness.
If you have deep seated issues in your life, seek counselling, confession, fellowship.
In truth many in the faith cannot cope with this level of personal openness so you will have
to look far and wide to find someone who can help you. Jesus is always there, but it takes much
longer when you do not have fellowship of another brother and sister close by.
God bless you all, for in Christ we are being built into His body and witness to the world, Amen.
Dismissiveness
I have seen many who get indoctrinated through the habit of being dismissive.
An idea or position is not even considered, it is just labelled and ignored if it comes close
to something not liked.
Now in a world where we are failed sinners, and the calling is just to recognise this and trust
God will sort it out at the resurrection, then to claim a life can be resolved and transformed sounds
like a lie.
Add to this the idea people who preach resolution are evil legalists, burdening people with
a bad conscience and failure, you have a complete mindset that condemns Gods word and His followers
without even openning ones heart to the healing power of the Holy Spirit.
This explains why I am deemed evil, satans tool, by just saying a few words.
One preacher summed this up by preaching if people talk "you" rather than "Jesus" they are not preaching
the gospel but works salvation, the evil alternative gospel.
Following Jesus can be polluted and distorted by simple ideas, held up and then changed slightly.
It is little wonder how hard it is for us to find God.
We will justify everything and anything in our lives rather than submit to His ways as the best, the
ways of life. You know this is what people are following when they say to hear Jesus preach in the
sermon on the mount just brings condemnation. Without the Spirit this is true. But from eternity,
He has always provided a way for those who are prepared to lay their lives down and follow.
It is going from death to life, it is the mortal becoming the eternal, so ofcourse it is the hardest thing
that any human can ever do. And everything in life and humanity will scream against it, because
this is going from the natural to the supernatural, taking that which cannot be defeated and putting
it within a person, God dwelling with man.
To become a dwelling in which God lives by his Spirit.
Eph 2:22
Amen
God has no part of sin, He does not abide in it or be contaminated by it.
So we are to become Holy vessels of the Lord of glory.
I have seen many who get indoctrinated through the habit of being dismissive.
An idea or position is not even considered, it is just labelled and ignored if it comes close
to something not liked.
Now in a world where we are failed sinners, and the calling is just to recognise this and trust
God will sort it out at the resurrection, then to claim a life can be resolved and transformed sounds
like a lie.
Add to this the idea people who preach resolution are evil legalists, burdening people with
a bad conscience and failure, you have a complete mindset that condemns Gods word and His followers
without even openning ones heart to the healing power of the Holy Spirit.
This explains why I am deemed evil, satans tool, by just saying a few words.
One preacher summed this up by preaching if people talk "you" rather than "Jesus" they are not preaching
the gospel but works salvation, the evil alternative gospel.
Following Jesus can be polluted and distorted by simple ideas, held up and then changed slightly.
It is little wonder how hard it is for us to find God.
We will justify everything and anything in our lives rather than submit to His ways as the best, the
ways of life. You know this is what people are following when they say to hear Jesus preach in the
sermon on the mount just brings condemnation. Without the Spirit this is true. But from eternity,
He has always provided a way for those who are prepared to lay their lives down and follow.
It is going from death to life, it is the mortal becoming the eternal, so ofcourse it is the hardest thing
that any human can ever do. And everything in life and humanity will scream against it, because
this is going from the natural to the supernatural, taking that which cannot be defeated and putting
it within a person, God dwelling with man.
To become a dwelling in which God lives by his Spirit.
Eph 2:22
Amen
God has no part of sin, He does not abide in it or be contaminated by it.
So we are to become Holy vessels of the Lord of glory.
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TT - I apologize if you feel I was being unfair to you.
The problem with empathy, is you look at both sides of a discussion or point.
I have seen people here get very hurt about how others have responded. This has then come
out in paranoid comments, as if people know much more than they do, and have wrong intentions.
So what I try and do is recognise the feelings and expressions from both sides and give a bit of
background. When Jesus calls us to love our enemies and pray for them, it is this, seeing beyond
the accusation to the pain being shown.
I was friends with a believer who used to be a terrorist and as a teenager blew people up with bombs.
Some would say he was lying, I know he was not. He had grown up as an orphan in the orange lodges
of glasgow where hatred of Roman Catholics was passed on generation to generation.
Over a year of so the Lord moved in his heart and softened him so he could see people who needed a
saviour and not the label.
Another relative of mine who was a 2nd world war vet, I got to know over the years. He seemed a nice
guy. One time, the last time I ever spoke to him, he mentioned he admired Himmler. Himmler was one
reason for the Holocaust, which is one of the worst acts within humanity one group against another.
What made it so bad is it is within our culture. After this I found it hard to ever want to talk with this
man again. At his funeral some other relatives wanted to think he may have had some christian leanings.
It takes time to get to know people, and each thing always needs to be balanced out.
So my friend, God bless you, and pray for those who speak too rashly and often from a hurt heart, that
they might know Christs love and acceptance.
Please forgive me if I hurt you, because I have no intention of doing so and respect the faith you hold
in Christ, however it is expressed.
The problem with empathy, is you look at both sides of a discussion or point.
I have seen people here get very hurt about how others have responded. This has then come
out in paranoid comments, as if people know much more than they do, and have wrong intentions.
So what I try and do is recognise the feelings and expressions from both sides and give a bit of
background. When Jesus calls us to love our enemies and pray for them, it is this, seeing beyond
the accusation to the pain being shown.
I was friends with a believer who used to be a terrorist and as a teenager blew people up with bombs.
Some would say he was lying, I know he was not. He had grown up as an orphan in the orange lodges
of glasgow where hatred of Roman Catholics was passed on generation to generation.
Over a year of so the Lord moved in his heart and softened him so he could see people who needed a
saviour and not the label.
Another relative of mine who was a 2nd world war vet, I got to know over the years. He seemed a nice
guy. One time, the last time I ever spoke to him, he mentioned he admired Himmler. Himmler was one
reason for the Holocaust, which is one of the worst acts within humanity one group against another.
What made it so bad is it is within our culture. After this I found it hard to ever want to talk with this
man again. At his funeral some other relatives wanted to think he may have had some christian leanings.
It takes time to get to know people, and each thing always needs to be balanced out.
So my friend, God bless you, and pray for those who speak too rashly and often from a hurt heart, that
they might know Christs love and acceptance.
Please forgive me if I hurt you, because I have no intention of doing so and respect the faith you hold
in Christ, however it is expressed.
Paranoia and mental disorders
God is very gracious and loves all who come to him.
Some have a problem with rejection and things that contradict what they express.
They take the rejection and cope with demolishing the proposer in their mind, and find
excuses why they are wrong, which have nothing to do with the points being raised.
So people become evil, deceived by satan, liars, hypocrites, the illuminati, paid agents,
trolls.
Now in part this is all possible, except the illuminati idea, but our response should be
consistent gentleness, humbleness, self control. It takes time, and we all learn more
everyday.
When you realise some here are flat earthers, we are not necessarily among the sane.
Some will argue how can I say that about flat earthers.
Well you have to be the opposite of open minded, analytical, have critical thinking, know
some physics and electonics, be university educated, to realise the flat earth is 100%
impossible. There is no margin of doubt, unless reality itself is an illusion, the earth is not
flat.
I would argue if you want a test of someones ability to be real, a flat earth idea means no.
So we need a real exercise of grace, to get to know each other gently because many are
carrying heavy burdens, which need respect and support. I praise God for His grace to me in
all I have done and continue to do, and would encourage all to deal with others likewise.
Amen.
God is very gracious and loves all who come to him.
Some have a problem with rejection and things that contradict what they express.
They take the rejection and cope with demolishing the proposer in their mind, and find
excuses why they are wrong, which have nothing to do with the points being raised.
So people become evil, deceived by satan, liars, hypocrites, the illuminati, paid agents,
trolls.
Now in part this is all possible, except the illuminati idea, but our response should be
consistent gentleness, humbleness, self control. It takes time, and we all learn more
everyday.
When you realise some here are flat earthers, we are not necessarily among the sane.
Some will argue how can I say that about flat earthers.
Well you have to be the opposite of open minded, analytical, have critical thinking, know
some physics and electonics, be university educated, to realise the flat earth is 100%
impossible. There is no margin of doubt, unless reality itself is an illusion, the earth is not
flat.
I would argue if you want a test of someones ability to be real, a flat earth idea means no.
So we need a real exercise of grace, to get to know each other gently because many are
carrying heavy burdens, which need respect and support. I praise God for His grace to me in
all I have done and continue to do, and would encourage all to deal with others likewise.
Amen.
One small chink in the armour
When the enemy comes and accuses us of sin, we respond, of these things I have repented
and been healed by Christ blood within.
But people cry, no I sin and know it is so, but our enemy is false because Christ blood washes
me still even though I have not repented of the sin spoken of or feel sorrow about such rebellion,
I am free.
But surely the conviction is actually from God because He wishes we repent and walk in His ways
with a clean and pure heart, kept right in His wonderful way.
So people say, we repent generally, but never deal with the real issues or work through the
reactions and truths within our hearts. But in this is the reality of Gods grace cleansing and
purifying our hearts of the enemy within.
When the enemy comes and accuses us of sin, we respond, of these things I have repented
and been healed by Christ blood within.
But people cry, no I sin and know it is so, but our enemy is false because Christ blood washes
me still even though I have not repented of the sin spoken of or feel sorrow about such rebellion,
I am free.
But surely the conviction is actually from God because He wishes we repent and walk in His ways
with a clean and pure heart, kept right in His wonderful way.
So people say, we repent generally, but never deal with the real issues or work through the
reactions and truths within our hearts. But in this is the reality of Gods grace cleansing and
purifying our hearts of the enemy within.
P
But you have been calling anyone who 'continues to believe' a works salvationist. But for some reason your 'continuing to believe' does not constitute a works gospel.
See what I mean? Now all of a sudden my continuing to believe is me trying to save myself while your's is applauded as the true gospel.
See what I mean? Now all of a sudden my continuing to believe is me trying to save myself while your's is applauded as the true gospel.
Matthew 11
25At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes. 26Even so, Father: for so it seemed good in thy sight. 27All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.
28Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 29Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. 30For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.
25At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes. 26Even so, Father: for so it seemed good in thy sight. 27All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.
28Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 29Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. 30For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.
P
You seem oblivious to the fact that you are directly contradicting plainly worded passages of scripture. Do you think we do not notice how what you say directly contradicts these passages?:
If you look deep into yourself, it is this 'the words don't really mean what they say' argument that is probably the reason you can't 'see' those scriptures. That's how indoctrinations work. They teach a person to instantly gloss over plain words of scripture because they've been taught (erroneously) from another part of scripture that these particular passages 'don't really' mean what they say, so the person just glosses right over them until, eventually, they fall from the pages of the Bible in the readers mind.
"23Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for He who promised is faithful" (Hebrews 10:23 NASB)
"you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you" (1 Corinthians 15:2 NASB)
"24As for you, let that abide in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, you also will abide in the Son and in the Father." (1 John 2:24 NASB)
"He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach— 23if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard" (Colossians 1:22-23 NASB)
"Christ was faithful as a Son over His house—whose house we are, if we hold fast our confidence and the boast of our hope firm until the end." (Hebrews 3:6 NASB)
"14For we have become partakers of Christ, if we hold fast the beginning of our assurance firm until the end" (Hebrews 3:14 NASB)
"9Anyone who goes too far (thrusting the word of the gospel behind them) and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God; the one who abides in the teaching, he has both the Father and the Son." (2 John 1:9 NASB)
"22Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off." (Romans 11:22 NASB)
What is "satanic at it's core and false" (your quote) is teaching that it is wrong to tell people to abide in the gospel. It's wrong because the scriptures I posted above plainly tell us to do that. No reasonable person would argue with that. The passages don't need any interpretation. They aren't parables. No mysterious, esoteric writings. They plainly say what they say. And they're so plain that it's impossible to say other scriptures make it so they 'don't really' mean what they say, which is the common OSAS argument for ignoring plain words of scripture. "you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you" (1 Corinthians 15:2 NASB)
"24As for you, let that abide in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, you also will abide in the Son and in the Father." (1 John 2:24 NASB)
"He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach— 23if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard" (Colossians 1:22-23 NASB)
"Christ was faithful as a Son over His house—whose house we are, if we hold fast our confidence and the boast of our hope firm until the end." (Hebrews 3:6 NASB)
"14For we have become partakers of Christ, if we hold fast the beginning of our assurance firm until the end" (Hebrews 3:14 NASB)
"9Anyone who goes too far (thrusting the word of the gospel behind them) and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God; the one who abides in the teaching, he has both the Father and the Son." (2 John 1:9 NASB)
"22Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off." (Romans 11:22 NASB)
If you look deep into yourself, it is this 'the words don't really mean what they say' argument that is probably the reason you can't 'see' those scriptures. That's how indoctrinations work. They teach a person to instantly gloss over plain words of scripture because they've been taught (erroneously) from another part of scripture that these particular passages 'don't really' mean what they say, so the person just glosses right over them until, eventually, they fall from the pages of the Bible in the readers mind.
Mark 9:[SUP]23 [/SUP]Jesus said unto him, If thou canst believe, all things are possible to him that believeth. [SUP]24 [/SUP]And straightway the father of the child cried out, and said with tears, Lord, I believe; help thou mine unbelief.
John 3:[SUP]18 [/SUP]He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. [SUP]19 [/SUP]And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. [SUP]20 [/SUP]For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. [SUP]21[/SUP]But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.
John 3:18-21 does testify that even our believing in Him is a work of God the Father Himself because He knows whom would receive Him from those that prefer their evil deeds rather than come to the Son to be reproved of them.
As loveme1 as shown in the reference of Matthew 11:25-30 in post # 36958, that it is the Father that reveals His Son to us so we can believe in Him to be saved.
Even former believers are still saved, but to be received by Him, they need to go before that throne of grace for help to discern & depart from iniquity. 2 Timothy 2:18-21 which is why this faithful saying is true in 2 Timothy 2:10-13 so that those who heed the call may be prepared by Him to be received as vessels unto honor in His House at the pre trib rapture event.
Our receiving is not by works when we are being judged by our works built on that foundation. Are we trusting Jesus Christ as our Good Shepherd to help us lay aside every weight & sin in running that race to be received by Him to attend the Marriage Supper or are we not living by faith in Him as our Good Shepherd to live this reconciled relationship with God thru Jesus Christ?
So by the grace of God and faith in Jesus Christ as our Saviour, we are saved, and by the grace of God and our faith in Jesus Christ as our Good Shepherd, we shall be prepared by Him and kept by Him in living that reconciled relationship with God to be received by Him when the Bridegroom comes.
I reckon it all depends on how you place your hope on being received by Him... on Him... or on yourself? This is probably why the poor in spirit are blessed because they do not have a religious spirit that needs surrendering in accepting help from Him for everything.... even for our believing in Him.
John 3:[SUP]18 [/SUP]He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. [SUP]19 [/SUP]And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. [SUP]20 [/SUP]For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. [SUP]21[/SUP]But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.
John 3:18-21 does testify that even our believing in Him is a work of God the Father Himself because He knows whom would receive Him from those that prefer their evil deeds rather than come to the Son to be reproved of them.
As loveme1 as shown in the reference of Matthew 11:25-30 in post # 36958, that it is the Father that reveals His Son to us so we can believe in Him to be saved.
Even former believers are still saved, but to be received by Him, they need to go before that throne of grace for help to discern & depart from iniquity. 2 Timothy 2:18-21 which is why this faithful saying is true in 2 Timothy 2:10-13 so that those who heed the call may be prepared by Him to be received as vessels unto honor in His House at the pre trib rapture event.
Our receiving is not by works when we are being judged by our works built on that foundation. Are we trusting Jesus Christ as our Good Shepherd to help us lay aside every weight & sin in running that race to be received by Him to attend the Marriage Supper or are we not living by faith in Him as our Good Shepherd to live this reconciled relationship with God thru Jesus Christ?
So by the grace of God and faith in Jesus Christ as our Saviour, we are saved, and by the grace of God and our faith in Jesus Christ as our Good Shepherd, we shall be prepared by Him and kept by Him in living that reconciled relationship with God to be received by Him when the Bridegroom comes.
I reckon it all depends on how you place your hope on being received by Him... on Him... or on yourself? This is probably why the poor in spirit are blessed because they do not have a religious spirit that needs surrendering in accepting help from Him for everything.... even for our believing in Him.