Not By Works

[PHart]

David was free to have multiple wives, Because of grace, it does not mean he profited from it. He actually as they all did, suffered from it.

But his eternity had nothing to do with him having multiple wives. Or committing murder or adultry.

it had to do with his FAITH.

He repented and was in sorrow for his sin. He did not continue to live in it unabashedly and make excuses for it. If he had, he will be lost on the Day of Judgment. But as it is, he was sorry for his sin and turned away from it in brokenness of heart and Spirit. That is the spirit--the spirit of brokenness--that we do not see in the church today. Instead we see excuses and rationalizations.

 

[beastslayer1970]

Well...it seems obvious that a new can-o-worms has been opened....so..let us just get this straight...

Jesus made alcoholic wine
Jesus stated that he came eating and drinking as opposed to John the Baptist who was straight laced
Jesus drank wine
Paul told Timothy to drink wine
Proverbs speaks to wine and strong drink
It is not those things that enter into a mans mouth that defiles a man
Moderation, not getting drunk and not causing a weaker brother to stumble
There is nothing wrong with a glass of wine
END OF STORY

I would agree with you here. I get sick and tired of religion telling people Jesus made grape juice.

However, I do believe that church leaders have a higher call from God and do not feel it is a good thing for them to drink, even if their personal convictions are like what you posted and they do not cause a brother/sister to stumble.

I do not believe it wisdom for a Pastor to drink any alcohol at all and should abstain fully.

We knew a Pastor that only had a glass of wine, single beer, etc every now and then. One night he ad 2 glasses of wine and was called out to the hospital. He was pulled for speeding and charged with driving impaired and needless to say, never made it to the hospital. He was over the legal limit, because he drank 2 glasses and and forgot he had taken some Tylenol PM.

He did not lose the church, but he lost the faith of many people, who were struggling with alcohol addiction. He ended up having to leave the church, because of that. He kept his personal conviction to himself, but came clean and it caused many to stumble.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

He repented and was in sorrow for his sin. He did not continue to live in it unabashedly and make excuses for it. If he had, he will be lost on the Day of Judgment. But as it is, he was sorry for his sin and turned away from it in brokenness of heart and Spirit. That is the spirit--the spirit of brokenness--that we do not see in the church today. Instead we see excuses and rationalizations.

Wow man, David died having multiple wives. He never repented of that, He repented of Bathsheba, then took her as his wife, another adulterous affair he CONTINUED to live in.

who is the one excusing sin here my friend?

 

[stonesoffire]

He repented and was in sorrow for his sin. He did not continue to live in it unabashedly and make excuses for it. If he had, he will be lost on the Day of Judgment. But as it is, he was sorry for his sin and turned away from it in brokenness of heart and Spirit. That is the spirit--the spirit of brokenness--that we do not see in the church today. Instead we see excuses and rationalizations.

Brokenness comes from seeing His mercy. Understanding the Father nature of God, not a Judge with gavel. And from seeing the Lamb. Remember David? The Lord said to my Lord...

the judge will come with the wrath for rejecting His offer of mercy.

I have a question just for my own understanding of your belief, PHart, do you not think David is in heaven now?

 

[Issachar92]

can some calvinist answer this accusation?
that if God predestines everything how come christians still have so much sin and false doctrine in the churches?

Well we're all still waiting for the answer. A good one is never coming cause they cant answer it. Because its not of works. Some of the bible pundits and experts say that "sin humbles you", but what it really does is sin hardens.

If God does everything for people, its not of works, God sanctifies, how come folks are still living in open rebellion and churches are riddled with sins and false doctrines? Why dont God cause everyone to be reformed calvinists? Did God predestine pentecostals to be arminians just to make the calvinist brethren salty? Is God almighty playing games with church folks? Or is it more likely that this is just repackaged manichean gnosticism that entered through Augustine? Since for some odd reason everyone argues for free will for the first centuries of the church. In fact they are defending it against the heretics and saying no one is worthy of punishment or praise if they had no ability.

They always say God's glory, but looks more like its God getting all the blame for everything. Why do I sin? God. Why are churches messed up? God.

Now here are the real answers: Why do I sin? Because I fail. Why are churches messed up? Because we are dumb as a brick and live in sin which guarantees a dead church.

 

[beastslayer1970]

I thought it was pretty obvious what she was saying. That 'its just reality'.

No it is scripted by creators, scripted to gain attraction of the carnal mind, like MANY things these days. It's not a history lesson, was that REALLY their intention?

I learn from my dad, that anything filled with profanity, is not of a Godly nature, it is impure. Although unlike him, I will still watch most movies with blinkers on to profanity if the content of the movie outweighs it.

They add profanity to movies and series to attract an audience. It's maths, less risk.

In fact I've noticed on many series, especially the 1st episode (depending on the studio), that they have to include '1' F word, '1' sex scene. It's like a formula, gather the largest audience, and try not to put anyone off. I seem to recall HBO were one of these.

Maybe there is a Harvey Weinstein in charge of many things to do with media.

Back in the day did they need this? Or is it censorship going down the drain, because those who value purity in creations, are dying off, to a new generation of creators who are selfish and in it for the money, or maybe even like the thought of capturing people with sick fantasies, who are these people?

Think of the movies that you cherish, that you deem as a classic. How much profanity do they have in them? So was it ever required, or is it INSERTED? Profanity doesn't accidentally go into movies and series, it is intentionally put there.

Colossians 3:17-

[SUP]17 [/SUP]Whatever you do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks through Him to God the Father.

Either we believe verses like this or we don't.

 

[stonesoffire]

Micah 6:8, “He has declared to you, O man, what is right. And what does יהוה require of you but to do right, and to love loving-commitment, and to walk humbly with your Father?”

Old Testament way without the new birth, nor empowerment of Holy Spirit.

Hiz, you aren't even a Jew. My husband is and he certainly doesn't write like this.

 

[stonesoffire]

i wish u would stop twisting and changing the bible.
this is ridicilous

how many times have i bogadile and phil given u evidence that yahshua is not the name of Jesus in hebrew. the real israelites who speak hebrew agree.
all manuscripts agree

so why is ur messiah yahshua and who is that guy?

Whats His name Snoozy?

 

[Magenta]

I thought it was pretty obvious what she was saying. That 'its just reality'.

I plainly stated that it was fictionalized quite a bit.

I will still watch most movies with blinkers on to profanity if the content of the movie outweighs it.

Yes, we see your hypocrisy clearly.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I plainly stated that it was fictionalized quite a bit.

Yes, we see your hypocrisy clearly.

sorry your name was dragged through th mud without you here to defend yourself.

 

[Magenta]

I have been informed that Satan has been busy at work, coming against me with his lies, misrepresentations, and slander. Nothing new there, eh? For the record, I never said watching such shows with explicit content was good, and I did not speak of GoT in that thread at all. Liars and haters do what liars and haters do. We see their works.

 

[Magenta]

sorry your name was dragged through th mud without you here to defend yourself.

No worries, EG, and thank you I was quite busy on the weekend, but even so, had I not been, we know that Satan comes against those whom God loves. I would rather focus on the love of God, than the lies of Satan.

 

[stonesoffire]

Well we're all still waiting for the answer. A good one is never coming cause they cant answer it. Because its not of works. Some of the bible pundits and experts say that "sin humbles you", but what it really does is sin hardens.

If God does everything for people, its not of works, God sanctifies, how come folks are still living in open rebellion and churches are riddled with sins and false doctrines? Why dont God cause everyone to be reformed calvinists? Did God predestine pentecostals to be arminians just to make the calvinist brethren salty? Is God almighty playing games with church folks? Or is it more likely that this is just repackaged manichean gnosticism that entered through Augustine? Since for some odd reason everyone argues for free will for the first centuries of the church. In fact they are defending it against the heretics and saying no one is worthy of punishment or praise if they had no ability.

They always say God's glory, but looks more like its God getting all the blame for everything. Why do I sin? God. Why are churches messed up? God.

Now here are the real answers: Why do I sin? Because I fail. Why are churches messed up? Because we are dumb as a brick and live in sin which guarantees a dead church.

? People sin because of something that is thought to be "I can't live without". Or Christians I should say, not people. It's an idol. Idolatry. It may be hidden until something happens and it's for our sanctification. Religion will scoff at this but, we don't lay it all down at the altar at one time. Else we would be full.

I dont believe that free will is possible since since we are a creation, and not the creator.

And predestination? Jesus was predestined to be the sacrifice for man. Some are predestined from birth to do Gods will. Others are whosoever will. God knows the end from the beginning because He's outside of time.

And there is is such a thing as a spirit of error.

And churches messed up? All together they make the whole. Not one having all. We are still people learning how to be Spiritual which the finished product will be when we are with Him. We need to give each other a break now and then.

Critics think they have all the truth. Love connects the members.

And if anyone wants to have their questions answered, ask God. He has the answers. We can only repeat what we are given.

 

[BillG]

David was free to have multiple wives, Because of grace, it does not mean he profited from it. He actually as they all did, suffered from it.

But his eternity had nothing to do with him having multiple wives. Or committing murder or adultry.

it had to do with his FAITH.

Never understood why you would want more than one wife. One, Thats all I could cope with

 

[Endoscopy]

The church today has let seducing spirits in the door, mainly through what we define as modern worship.

It depends on what you call the church of today. There are denominations that for the most part have rejected Jesus as God and savior. Going to most of them you will not hear the gospel story. Gary North wrote a book Crossed Fingers that tells the story of how by 1932 secular invasion of the Presbyterian USA was accomplished by finally defrocking the last minister who controlled any pots of money. They no longer defrock a minister that publicly rejects Jesus as savior. There are a few ministers in the denomination that are trying to fight this problem. I spoke to one of them a few years ago. Most of the believing ministers followed Billy Graham's father-in-law as he created the Presbyterian Church in America denomination. This has happened across the board with all of the large denominations. Catholic and Orthodox are immune to this tactic because of their church type of government.

 

[beastslayer1970]

? People sin because of something that is thought to be "I can't live without". Or Christians I should say, not people. It's an idol. Idolatry. It may be hidden until something happens and it's for our sanctification. Religion will scoff at this but, we don't lay it all down at the altar at one time. Else we would be full.

I dont believe that free will is possible since since we are a creation, and not the creator.

And predestination? Jesus was predestined to be the sacrifice for man. Some are predestined from birth to do Gods will. Others are whosoever will. God knows the end from the beginning because He's outside of time.

And there is is such a thing as a spirit of error.

And churches messed up? All together they make the whole. Not one having all. We are still people learning how to be Spiritual which the finished product will be when we are with Him. We need to give each other a break now and then.

Critics think they have all the truth. Love connects the members.

And if anyone wants to have their questions answered, ask God. He has the answers. We can only repeat what we are given.

Free will is not free choice.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Never understood why you would want more than one wife. One, Thats all I could cope with

You and me both man, But even davids son had many wives, Most kings did. Abraham even had a harem

 

[Endoscopy]

? People sin because of something that is thought to be "I can't live without". Or Christians I should say, not people. It's an idol. Idolatry. It may be hidden until something happens and it's for our sanctification. Religion will scoff at this but, we don't lay it all down at the altar at one time. Else we would be full.

I dont believe that free will is possible since since we are a creation, and not the creator.

And predestination? Jesus was predestined to be the sacrifice for man. Some are predestined from birth to do Gods will. Others are whosoever will. God knows the end from the beginning because He's outside of time.

And there is is such a thing as a spirit of error.

And churches messed up? All together they make the whole. Not one having all. We are still people learning how to be Spiritual which the finished product will be when we are with Him. We need to give each other a break now and then.

Critics think they have all the truth. Love connects the members.

And if anyone wants to have their questions answered, ask God. He has the answers. We can only repeat what we are given.

You are getting into one of the differences between Calvinist and Armenian views. Calvinism goes more with predestination and Arminianism goes more with free will, We all are brothers and sisters in Christ. We just need to agree to disagree on peripheral issues.

 

[Endoscopy]

Never understood why you would want more than one wife. One, Thats all I could cope with

LOL
You wouldn't want to live with all of the jockeying around and bickering of the wives wanting more of your time? Sounds like heaven (or more likely the other place) to me.

 

[Magenta]