Do we Believe Jesus and/or Obey Jesus?

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Do we Believe Jesus and/or Obey Jesus?

  • We only have to believe Yahshua/Jesus and not obey Him and we will enter the kingdom

    Votes: 2 14.3%
  • We have to believe and obey Yahshua/Jesus to enter the kingdom

    Votes: 12 85.7%

  • Total voters
    14

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
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Isaiah 28:16, “Therefore thus said the Master יהוה, “See, I am laying in Tsiyon a stone for a foundation, a tried stone, a precious corner-stone, a settled foundation. He who trusts shall not hasten away.”


1 Corinthians 3:11-12, "3:11, "For no one is able to lay any other foundation except that which is laid, which is יהושע Messiah.”


John/Yahanan 4:25-26, "The woman said to Him; I know that the Messiah comes, and when He comes, He will tell us all things. Yahshua said to her: I am He speaking to you."

Matthew 21:11, “...This is יהושע, the prophet from Natsareth of Galil.” Yet the is not a Scripture foretelling a prophet or the Messiah coming from Galil John 7:53, “...Search and see that no prophet has arisen out of Galil.” And each one went to his own house.” Then why did Matt write this; Mat 2:23, “...that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophets, He shall be called a Nazarene.” Did they miss something in the Scriptures? Why would He be called a Nazerene? The city of Nazareth is not even mentioned it the OT Scriptures a single time. Let us take a deeper look.


Mat 2:23, "And he came and dwelt in a city called Nazareth: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophets, He shall be called a Nazarene."


Acts 24:5, “For we have found this man (Paul) a pestilent fellow, and a mover of sedition among all the Jews throughout the world, and a ringleader of the sect of the Nazarenes.”


Acts 28:22, “And we think it right to hear from you what you think, for indeed, concerning this sect, we know that it is spoken against everywhere.”


Isaiah 11:1, “And a Twig shall come forth from the stump of Yishai, and a Branch from his roots shall be fruitful.”


Branch is word H#5342 - netser: a sprout, shoot, Original Word: נֵ֫צֶר, Part of Speech: Noun Masculine, Transliteration: netser, Phonetic Spelling: (nay'-tser), Short Definition: branch


#H5342 נֵצֶר netser (nay'-tser) n-m., 1. a shoot., 2. (figuratively) a descendant., [from H5341 in the sense of greenness as a striking color], KJV: branch., Root(s): H5341


"Netzer" is a type of Branch, a shoot from an olive tree that grows out of its original root system but springs up at a later time from the stump, or somewhat distant from the trunk.


Netzer or Nazarenes = Branch/shoot


John (Yahanan) 15:4-6, “Abide in Me, and I in you. Just as the branch cannot produce fruit by itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in Me. I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, produces much fruit; but without Me, you can do nothing. If anyone does not abide in Me, he is thrown away like a branch, and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned.”


Epiphanius (Fourth century "church father") writes of the ancient Nazarenes: But these sectarians... did not call themselves Christians--but "Nazarenes,”


Mat 2:23, "And he came and dwelt in a city called Nazareth: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophets, He shall be called a Nazarene."









 

mcubed

Senior Member
Dec 20, 2013
1,449
218
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1. you name them.... no I can not... When Constantine took over was there any others? I am not that smart... What did they believe, if there were... It is important....
2. Y-shua is the rock that He built His church on, just like Peter said He would... there is a difference... Y-shua os the Rock not Peter... Y-shua is G-d and is the Son of G-d ... gets tricky ... probably different post...

3. Y-shua did not start a cult but NEVER but man I promise you CREATED ONE! My first husband died can I still pray or pay to get him out of purtogery? Should I pray to Mary for forgiveness?


To piggyback last question you asked....

To think He was not raised from the dead is foolishness and in vain, and we are like all men without hope!

If I pray to Mary or Peter can they save me?
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
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A "grave error?" and "sacrilege" "blasphemous at worst, and definitely taking his name in vain"

Vain is empty, removing His name would be vain.empty...

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Exodus 20:7, ""You shall not take the name of YHWH your God in vain, for YHWH will not hold him guiltless who takes his name in vain." WEB[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Exodus 20:7, "You shall not take the Name of YHWH your strength to bring it to nothing, for YHWH will not hold him guiltless who brings it to nothing."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Psalm 199:55, "We remember Your Name in the night, O YHWH, and we keep Your Law."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]7723 – shav: emptiness, vanity – Original Word: [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]שָׁוְא – [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Part of Speech: Noun Masculine – Transliteration: shav – Phonetic Spelling: (shawv) - Short Definition: vain[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]7723 – shav – NAS Exhaustive Concordance – Word Origin from an unused word – Definition: emptiness, vanity[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]7723 – shav – Brown-Driver-Briggs [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]שָׁוְא [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]noun [masculine] emptiness, vanity[/FONT][/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]7723 – shav – Hebrew Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1) emptiness, vanity, falsehood - 1a) emptiness, nothingness, vanity - 1b) emptiness of speech, lying - 1c) worthlessness (of conduct)[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Psalm 22:22, "I will declare Your Name to My brothers! In the midst of the congregation I will give You praise!"[/FONT]



The OP has a grave error that needs to be pointed out. There is no person of the Godhead named "Yahshua."

And he knows it.

For a person to take liberty and just change the proper name of God is sacrilege at best, blasphemous at worst, and definitely taking his name in vain.

It is also taking it in vain, imho, that in nearly every thread, nearly every reply the improper name is used inordinately.
Yahshua - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/yahshua
Yahshua is one proposed transliteration of the original Hebrew or Aramaic name of Jesus commonly used by individuals in the Sacred Name Movement. The English spelling Yahshua originates at least as early as 1950 with Angelo Traina' s The New Testament of our Messiah and Saviour Yahshua. The form Yahshua is ...


The proper Hebrew rendering of Jesus name is Yeshua meaning Salvation.

Jesus is the Greek transliteration of Yeshua.

Greek does not have a Y י sound so they approximate it with an Ἰη which also includes the e sound.
Greek does not have an sh שׁ sound so they approximate it with a σ.
Τhe Greek u approximates the oo sound of the וּ .
The Greek ς provides a masculine ending in place of the א.

Pointing the י yod of Yeshua with a patach יַ yah instead of a segohl יֶ Yeh changes the grammar unacceptably.

“Jesus” is word #G2424 Ἰησοῦς Iesous (yee-sous') n/p., 1. (meaning) He is Salvation, Yahweh saves (i.e. the Savior)., 2. (person) Jesus (i.e. Yeshua, Yehoshua), the name of our Lord, also called the Last Adam., 3. (person) Joshua (i.e. Yehoshua) an Israelite, the servant and successor of Moses., 4. (person) Jeshua, also called Justus, an Israelite, a coworker with Paul., 5. (NOTE) (“Jesus” is a valid English transliteration, coming from Ancient Hebrew to Koine Greek (via the Septuagint) to Latin to Old English to Modern English. It is completely acceptable to God (Yahweh) for us call upon the Savior's name as “Jesus,” or “Iesous,” or “Yeshua,” or even “Yesu” as in Christian Arabic or in the Fijian Islands, et al. God prepared for all nations to be able to trust in the Savior and to call upon his name by preparing a language dialect for international use: the Hebraic-Koine Greek. Thus, technically and formally, the pronunciation “Iesous” was intentionally established by the Savior as the common basis for Jewish and Gentile acknowledgment of his Redemption and Salvation, going forth as needed into every tribe, native tongue, people, and nation. “Yeshua” is of course delightfully acceptable to him, when it is not used as an exclusionary name. Love edifies)., 6. (NOTE) (Revelation 3:12)., [of Hebrew origin (H3442 as the shortened form of H3091)], KJV: Jesus, Root(s): H3442, See also: H3091



Root word of Jesus” is word #H3442 יֵשׁוַּע Yeshuwa` (yay-shoo'-ah) n/l., 1. he will save., 2. Jeshua, the name of ten Israelites, also of a place in Israel., [for H3091], KJV: Jeshua. , Root(s): H3091



Root word of Jesus” is word #H3091 יְהוֹשׁוּעַ YhowShuw`a (yeh-ho-shoo'-ah) n/p., יְהוֹשֻׁעַ YhowShu`a (yeh-ho-shoo'-ah), 1. Yahweh-saved.2. Jehoshua (i.e. Joshua), the Je

“Jesus” is word #G2424 Ἰησοῦς Iesous (yee-sous') n/p., 1. (meaning) He is Salvation, Yahweh saves (i.e. the Savior)., 2. (person) Jesus (i.e. Yeshua, Yehoshua), the name of our Lord, also called the Last Adam., 3. (person) Joshua (i.e. Yehoshua) an Israelite, the servant and successor of Moses., 4. (person) Jeshua, also called Justus, an Israelite, a coworker with Paul., 5. (NOTE) (“Jesus” is a valid English transliteration, coming from Ancient Hebrew to Koine Greek (via the Septuagint) to Latin to Old English to Modern English. It is completely acceptable to God (Yahweh) for us call upon the Savior's name as “Jesus,” or “Iesous,” or “Yeshua,” or even “Yesu” as in Christian Arabic or in the Fijian Islands, et al. God prepared for all nations to be able to trust in the Savior and to call upon his name by preparing a language dialect for international use: the Hebraic-Koine Greek. Thus, technically and formally, the pronunciation “Iesous” was intentionally established by the Savior as the common basis for Jewish and Gentile acknowledgment of his Redemption and Salvation, going forth as needed into every tribe, native tongue, people, and nation. “Yeshua” is of course delightfully acceptable to him, when it is not used as an exclusionary name. Love edifies)., 6. (NOTE) (Revelation 3:12)., [of Hebrew origin (H3442 as the shortened form of H3091)], KJV: Jesus, Root(s): H3442, See also: H3091


Root word of Jesus” is word #H3442 יֵשׁוַּע Yeshuwa` (yay-shoo'-ah) n/l., 1. he will save., 2. Jeshua, the name of ten Israelites, also of a place in Israel., [for H3091], KJV: Jeshua. , Root(s): H3091



Root word of Jesus” is word #H3091 יְהוֹשׁוּעַ YhowShuw`a (yeh-ho-shoo'-ah) n/p., יְהוֹשֻׁעַ YhowShu`a (yeh-ho-shoo'-ah), 1. Yahweh-saved.2. Jehoshua (i.e. Joshua), the Jewish leader., [from H3068 and H3467], KJV: Jehoshua, Jehoshuah, Joshua., Root(s): H3068, H3467, Compare: H1954, H3442

wish leader., [from H3068 and H3467], KJV: Jehoshua, Jehoshuah, Joshua., Root(s): H3068, H3467, Compare: H1954, H3442


Talmud - Mas. Yoma 39b
His brethren [that year] the priests forbore to mention the Ineffable Name (YHWH) in pronouncing the [priestly] blessing.4 Our Rabbis taught: During the last forty years before the destruction of the Temple the lot [‘For the Lord’] did not come up in the right hand; nor did the crimson-coloured strap become white/"


Numbers 6:23-27, "Speak to Aaron and his sons, saying; This is how you are to bless the children of Israyl. Say to them; YHWH BLESS YOU AND KEEP YOU. YHWH MAKE HIS FACE SHINE UPON YOU AND BE MERCIFUL TO YOU. YHWH LIFT UP HIS COUNTENANCE UPON YOU, AND GIVE YOU PEACE. So they will put MY NAME on the children of Israyl, and I will bless them."


Jeremiah 2:8, "The priests did not ask; Where is YHWH? Those who deal with the Law did not know Me! The pastors also transgressed against Me, and the prophets prophesied in the name of Baal, and walked after things of worthlessness"
the pharisee type forbade using the Nme YHWH, thus "יֵשׁוַּע Yeshuwa" was used.



However I have a hard time believeing the Messiah followed the precepts of the pharisee types:

John 5:43, "I have come in My Father's Name, but you do not follow Me. Let another come in his own name; him you will follow."


Mattithyah 23:39, "For I say to you: From this moment you will not see Me, until you say: Blessed is He Who comes in the Name of YHWH!"


Psalms 118:26, "Blessed is He who is coming in the Name of יהוה! We shall bless you from the House of יהוה."


YhowShuw`a, I simply ues a simplified form; Yahshua. I find it odd that people nitpick over this.

YHWH's Salvation.
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
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[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John 3:36, “He who believes in the Son possesses everlasting life, but he who does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of Yah remains on him.”[/FONT]



[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Hebrews 4:12-13, “For the Word of Yah is living, and working, and sharper than any two-edged sword, cutting through even to the dividing of being and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart. And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all are naked and laid bare before the eyes of Him with whom is our account.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Revelation 19:15, “And out of His mouth goes a sharp sword, that with it He should smite the nations. And He shall shepherd them with a rod of iron. And He treads the wine press of the fierceness and wrath of Strength Almighty.”[/FONT]
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
John 3:36, “He who believes in the Son possesses everlasting life, but he who does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of Yah remains on him.”



Hebrews 4:12-13, “For the Word of Yah is living, and working, and sharper than any two-edged sword, cutting through even to the dividing of being and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart. And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all are naked and laid bare before the eyes of Him with whom is our account.”


Revelation 19:15, “And out of His mouth goes a sharp sword, that with it He should smite the nations. And He shall shepherd them with a rod of iron. And He treads the wine press of the fierceness and wrath of Strength Almighty.”
" he who does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of Yah remains on him"

So how can anyone say we can have life in Yah's kingdom wihout obedience to Him?

and where does all this tossing out of Yahshua'Jesus words post cross come from? It is against what He says:

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mat 24:35, “Heaven and earth may pass away, but My teachings will not pass away.”[/FONT]

 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
3,190
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Apart from being an interesting fact, does it really matter that Jesus didn't explicitly teach Salvation by Grace?
I think its importance is that the Gospel of Jesus Christ wasn't explicitly, completely taught by the Lord Jesus Christ Himself during His Ministry.

There was more to His Gospel that NEEDED to be expounded on. Which Paul did a fine job of.

Not that we could understand Paul in the slightest before coming to Christ Himself. We have to be given Wisdom and Knowledge of Christ in order to understand Paul.

It is quite obvious when the vail is lifted from our hearts and minds how important Paul is to the Gospel of Christ.
 
Dec 14, 2017
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1. you name them.... no I can not... When Constantine took over was there any others? I am not that smart... What did they believe, if there were... It is important....

From the article linked below:


What I Wish I'd Known About the Catholic Church
Jesus is Present in the Eucharist

For all the different Protestant branches and denominations I’ve learned that no one in Protestantism takes Jesus’s words more literally than the Catholic Church.
When Jesus said, “This is my body; this is my blood,” the Catholic Church—and the whole of Christianity for 1,500 years—takes Him at His word.

Incredibly, the Catholic theology of transubstantiation says that when the priest consecrates the elements (the bread and the wine) they become the actual body and blood of Jesus through a mysterious, miraculous process. The fact that we can’t see, touch, or taste these elements are real flesh and blood is part of the miracle.This bold claim is backed up not only by a thousand and a half years of Church history but by solid exegesis of the gospels.
Jesus, from Bethlehem (which means “the house of bread”), who was laid into a manger (which is a feeding trough) when He was born is the actual manna from Heaven.
If I had known that I can actually receive Jesus in the Eucharist, I would’ve stormed the doors of my local Catholic Church a decade ago.

Read more at What I Wish I'd Known About the Catholic Church
 
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E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
1. you name them.... no I can not... When Constantine took over was there any others? I am not that smart... What did they believe, if there were... It is important....
2. Y-shua is the rock that He built His church on, just like Peter said He would... there is a difference... Y-shua os the Rock not Peter... Y-shua is G-d and is the Son of G-d ... gets tricky ... probably different post...

3. Y-shua did not start a cult but NEVER but man I promise you CREATED ONE! My first husband died can I still pray or pay to get him out of purtogery? Should I pray to Mary for forgiveness?

One thing to remember, The Roman Catholic Church ruled by the power of the State, to go against them would be a death penalty. So there would never have been another denomination, the state would have snuffed it out.

So people who ask what other denomination was there are drawing at straws, as if that proves they are right.. Its actually quite sad.
 
Dec 14, 2017
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One thing to remember, The Roman Catholic Church ruled by the power of the State, to go against them would be a death penalty. So there would never have been another denomination, the state would have snuffed it out.

So people who ask what other denomination was there are drawing at straws, as if that proves they are right.. Its actually quite sad.

Yeah right ... and what "state" would that be, which "controlled" and dictated to EVERY COUNTRY ON EARTH, for 1500 consecutive years?
 
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Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
3,190
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From the article linked below:


What I Wish I'd Known About the Catholic Church
Jesus is Present in the Eucharist

For all the different Protestant branches and denominations I’ve learned that no one in Protestantism takes Jesus’s words more literally than the Catholic Church.
When Jesus said, “This is my body; this is my blood,” the Catholic Church—and the whole of Christianity for 1,500 years—takes Him at His word.

Incredibly, the Catholic theology of transubstantiation says that when the priest consecrates the elements (the bread and the wine) they become the actual body and blood of Jesus through a mysterious, miraculous process. The fact that we can’t see, touch, or taste these elements are real flesh and blood is part of the miracle.This bold claim is backed up not only by a thousand and a half years of Church history but by solid exegesis of the gospels.
Jesus, from Bethlehem (which means “the house of bread”), who was laid into a manger (which is a feeding trough) when He was born is the actual manna from Heaven.
If I had known that I can actually receive Jesus in the Eucharist, I would’ve stormed the doors of my local Catholic Church a decade ago.

Read more at What I Wish I'd Known About the Catholic Church
When the priest of a false religion that worships mary and dead saints consecrates bread and wine they become the Body and Blood of Christ?

You would think they would be drawn out of that false religion and towards the True the moment they take communion. If it were, in fact, transubstantiation.
 
Apr 15, 2017
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Jesus said partake of the communion in remembrance of Him,and has nothing to do with the bread and wine,becoming the body and blood of Jesus,and Jesus gave us His human life once for all.

If they say it becomes the body and blood of Jesus they are saying that it is a sacrifice that they do,but it is not to be viewed that way,for we do it in remembrance of Jesus of His sacrifice,not a sacrifice.
 
Dec 14, 2017
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When the priest of a false religion that worships mary and dead saints consecrates bread and wine they become the Body and Blood of Christ?

You would think they would be drawn out of that false religion and towards the True the moment they take communion. If it were, in fact, transubstantiation.

Just another false assumption, based on what "somebody said" long ago! But from my previous link, there is THIS, from a former protestant:


Catholics Don’t Worship Mary

The Catholic Church doesn’t teach the worship of Mary. Worship (and adoration) are for God alone.
As a Protestant I thought, for a long time, that Catholics worshipped Mary alongside her son, Jesus. There are plenty of churches named in her honoured, Catholics seemed obsessed with statues of the Virgin, and the Rosary, of all things, seemed to be nothing more than vain repetition of praise for Jesus’s mother.
The reality, I’ve learned, is much different. Catholics don’t worship Mary but, because of her special role in salvation history, she is venerated. How is that different? In Catholic theology, which, remember, was the theology of the whole Christian Church for 1,500 years, we ask Mary to pray for us.
Like Mary’s request to Jesus at the wedding at Cana, Catholics believe that Mary has the ear of Jesus in a special way. This is also reflected in biblical typology—the same kind of exegesis that Jesus used to explain His role in salvation to the apostles on the road to Emmaus. In the same way I can ask my best friend—a living, breathing Christian—to pray for my intentions, the Catholic Church teaches that Mary can be asked for prayer in the same way. When Catholics say they pray, “to Mary,” they don’t mean that Mary will answer our prayers. When we “pray to” Mary, we ask for her to pray for us, to Christ.
Jesus answers all prayers. We ask Mary to pray on our behalf.

Read more at What I Wish I'd Known About the Catholic Church
 
Apr 15, 2017
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Some people act as if some things that God tells us is a suggestion,and not a commandment,and Jesus is God.

There is no difference between the Old and New Testament,for God lays down the covenant,and we obey the law.

The Old Testament they had to obey,and Jesus did His job of providing salvation,and when we accept and receive the Spirit then the responsibility lies on us which is why the Bible says,work out your own salvation with fear and trembling,and if a person does not continue in the goodness of God they will be cut off like the Old Testament time.

1Sa 15:22 And Samuel said, Hath the LORD as great delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices, as in obeying the voice of the LORD? Behold, to obey is better than sacrifice, and to hearken than the fat of rams.
1Sa 15:23 For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD, he hath also rejected thee from being king.

To obey is better than sacrifice,for if you do not obey then you are rebellious and asserting your own ways,and authority,and then how is Jesus Lord in your life,and how does His sacrifice take part in your life.

2Co 10:5 Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;
2Co 10:6 And having in a readiness to revenge all disobedience, when your obedience is fulfilled.

Every thought you have in your head is to be to the obedience of Christ until it is fulfilled,so then you can revenge all disobedience.Paul said love does not think an evil thought,and does not sin,and without love you are nothing,and love is greater than faith,and hope.

Luk 6:46 And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?
Luk 6:47 Whosoever cometh to me, and heareth my sayings, and doeth them, I will shew you to whom he is like:
Luk 6:48 He is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock.
Luk 6:49 But he that heareth, and doeth not, is like a man that without a foundation built an house upon the earth; against which the stream did beat vehemently, and immediately it fell; and the ruin of that house was great.

If you are not obedient then you will fall.

Joh 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
Joh 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

If you do not obey Jesus you do not love Him.

Mat 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

The saints are to teach all that Jesus commanded in the Bible.

It is strange that it appears that some people want to take away all responsibility from the believer to where nothing can affect them in their relationship with God,for they know that there are many hypocrites among those who believe faith alone,so they have to justify their disobedience and say they are right with God,which is why they say they cannot abstain from sin,and sin does not affect their relationship with God.

But if we hate sin,and do not want sin,by the Spirit we can abstain from sin,and God is not mocked for whatever a person sows that shall they reap,and tells the saints to not be deceived by that.
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
Some people act as if some things that God tells us is a suggestion,and not a commandment,and Jesus is God.

There is no difference between the Old and New Testament,for God lays down the covenant,and we obey the law.

The Old Testament they had to obey,and Jesus did His job of providing salvation,and when we accept and receive the Spirit then the responsibility lies on us which is why the Bible says,work out your own salvation with fear and trembling,and if a person does not continue in the goodness of God they will be cut off like the Old Testament time.

1Sa 15:22 And Samuel said, Hath the LORD as great delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices, as in obeying the voice of the LORD? Behold, to obey is better than sacrifice, and to hearken than the fat of rams.
1Sa 15:23 For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD, he hath also rejected thee from being king.

To obey is better than sacrifice,for if you do not obey then you are rebellious and asserting your own ways,and authority,and then how is Jesus Lord in your life,and how does His sacrifice take part in your life.

2Co 10:5 Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;
2Co 10:6 And having in a readiness to revenge all disobedience, when your obedience is fulfilled.

Every thought you have in your head is to be to the obedience of Christ until it is fulfilled,so then you can revenge all disobedience.Paul said love does not think an evil thought,and does not sin,and without love you are nothing,and love is greater than faith,and hope.

Luk 6:46 And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?
Luk 6:47 Whosoever cometh to me, and heareth my sayings, and doeth them, I will shew you to whom he is like:
Luk 6:48 He is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock.
Luk 6:49 But he that heareth, and doeth not, is like a man that without a foundation built an house upon the earth; against which the stream did beat vehemently, and immediately it fell; and the ruin of that house was great.

If you are not obedient then you will fall.

Joh 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
Joh 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

If you do not obey Jesus you do not love Him.

Mat 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

The saints are to teach all that Jesus commanded in the Bible.

It is strange that it appears that some people want to take away all responsibility from the believer to where nothing can affect them in their relationship with God,for they know that there are many hypocrites among those who believe faith alone,so they have to justify their disobedience and say they are right with God,which is why they say they cannot abstain from sin,and sin does not affect their relationship with God.

But if we hate sin,and do not want sin,by the Spirit we can abstain from sin,and God is not mocked for whatever a person sows that shall they reap,and tells the saints to not be deceived by that.
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John 17:17, “Set them apart in Your truth – Your Word is truth.”[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Psalm 36:7, How precious is Your lovingkindness, O Yah! And the children of men take refuge in the shadow of Your wings."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mat 24:35, “Heaven and earth may pass away, but My teachings will not pass away.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]2 John/Yahanan 1:9, "Everyone who goes on ahead and does not abide in the teaching of the Messiah, does not have Yah. Whoever abides in the teaching has both the Father and the Son."[/FONT]
 

BillG

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2017
9,002
4,422
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There is no difference between the Old and New Testament,for God lays down the covenant,and we obey the law.

The Old Testament they had to obey,and Jesus did His job of providing salvation,and when we accept and receive the Spirit then the responsibility lies on us which is why the Bible says,work out your own salvation with fear and trembling,and if a person does not continue in the goodness of God they will be cut off like the Old Testament time.
Why do you think there is no difference between the OT and the NT.
Is not one the old covenant and the other the new covenant? How were people saved under the OT/OC and how are people saved in the NT/NC?

To me we are saved by faith which leads to obedience. Not by obedience which leads to faith.
The Pharisees thought they were saved by obedience. What did Jesus say to them?


You say

To obey is better than sacrifice,for if you do not obey then you are rebellious and asserting your own ways,and authority,and then how is Jesus Lord in your life,and how does His sacrifice take part in your life.
Under the OT, Jesus had not yet been sacrificed for the forgiveness of sins.

One of the most disobedient man in the Bible, who by rights should have been put to death

Psalms 51:16-17
16 For You do not desire sacrifice, or else I would give it;
You do not delight in burnt offering.
17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit,
A broken and a contrite heart—
These, O God, You will not despise.

I'm sure God did not desire the sacrifice of Jesus for the forgiveness of sins.
For me his sacrifice on the cross and the coming of the Holy Spirit in those who believe are those who have a contrite heart,
One the says "Jesus I need you, forgive me and help me to bed like you"
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
Yeah right ... and what "state" would that be, which "controlled" and dictated to EVERY COUNTRY ON EARTH, for 1500 consecutive years?
Whatever dude, Keep believing the Catholic Church is the real church.

Those in power write history. You should know better.
 

MarcR

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2015
5,486
183
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A "grave error?" and "sacrilege" "blasphemous at worst, and definitely taking his name in vain"

Vain is empty, removing His name would be vain.empty...

Exodus 20:7, ""You shall not take the name of YHWH your God in vain, for YHWH will not hold him guiltless who takes his name in vain." WEB


Exodus 20:7, "You shall not take the Name of YHWH your strength to bring it to nothing, for YHWH will not hold him guiltless who brings it to nothing."


Psalm 199:55, "We remember Your Name in the night, O YHWH, and we keep Your Law."


7723 – shav: emptiness, vanity – Original Word: שָׁוְא – Part of Speech: Noun Masculine – Transliteration: shav – Phonetic Spelling: (shawv) - Short Definition: vain


7723 – shav – NAS Exhaustive Concordance – Word Origin from an unused word – Definition: emptiness, vanity


7723 – shav – Brown-Driver-Briggs שָׁוְא noun [masculine] emptiness, vanity


7723 – shav – Hebrew Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)
1) emptiness, vanity, falsehood - 1a) emptiness, nothingness, vanity - 1b) emptiness of speech, lying - 1c) worthlessness (of conduct)


Psalm 22:22, "I will declare Your Name to My brothers! In the midst of the congregation I will give You praise!"











“Jesus” is word #G2424 Ἰησοῦς Iesous (yee-sous') n/p., 1. (meaning) He is Salvation, Yahweh saves (i.e. the Savior)., 2. (person) Jesus (i.e. Yeshua, Yehoshua), the name of our Lord, also called the Last Adam., 3. (person) Joshua (i.e. Yehoshua) an Israelite, the servant and successor of Moses., 4. (person) Jeshua, also called Justus, an Israelite, a coworker with Paul., 5. (NOTE) (“Jesus” is a valid English transliteration, coming from Ancient Hebrew to Koine Greek (via the Septuagint) to Latin to Old English to Modern English. It is completely acceptable to God (Yahweh) for us call upon the Savior's name as “Jesus,” or “Iesous,” or “Yeshua,” or even “Yesu” as in Christian Arabic or in the Fijian Islands, et al. God prepared for all nations to be able to trust in the Savior and to call upon his name by preparing a language dialect for international use: the Hebraic-Koine Greek. Thus, technically and formally, the pronunciation “Iesous” was intentionally established by the Savior as the common basis for Jewish and Gentile acknowledgment of his Redemption and Salvation, going forth as needed into every tribe, native tongue, people, and nation. “Yeshua” is of course delightfully acceptable to him, when it is not used as an exclusionary name. Love edifies)., 6. (NOTE) (Revelation 3:12)., [of Hebrew origin (H3442 as the shortened form of H3091)], KJV: Jesus, Root(s): H3442, See also: H3091



Root word of Jesus” is word #H3442 יֵשׁוַּע Yeshuwa` (yay-shoo'-ah) n/l., 1. he will save., 2. Jeshua, the name of ten Israelites, also of a place in Israel., [for H3091], KJV: Jeshua. , Root(s): H3091



Root word of Jesus” is word #H3091 יְהוֹשׁוּעַ YhowShuw`a (yeh-ho-shoo'-ah) n/p., יְהוֹשֻׁעַ YhowShu`a (yeh-ho-shoo'-ah), 1. Yahweh-saved.2. Jehoshua (i.e. Joshua), the Je

“Jesus” is word #G2424 Ἰησοῦς Iesous (yee-sous') n/p., 1. (meaning) He is Salvation, Yahweh saves (i.e. the Savior)., 2. (person) Jesus (i.e. Yeshua, Yehoshua), the name of our Lord, also called the Last Adam., 3. (person) Joshua (i.e. Yehoshua) an Israelite, the servant and successor of Moses., 4. (person) Jeshua, also called Justus, an Israelite, a coworker with Paul., 5. (NOTE) (“Jesus” is a valid English transliteration, coming from Ancient Hebrew to Koine Greek (via the Septuagint) to Latin to Old English to Modern English. It is completely acceptable to God (Yahweh) for us call upon the Savior's name as “Jesus,” or “Iesous,” or “Yeshua,” or even “Yesu” as in Christian Arabic or in the Fijian Islands, et al. God prepared for all nations to be able to trust in the Savior and to call upon his name by preparing a language dialect for international use: the Hebraic-Koine Greek. Thus, technically and formally, the pronunciation “Iesous” was intentionally established by the Savior as the common basis for Jewish and Gentile acknowledgment of his Redemption and Salvation, going forth as needed into every tribe, native tongue, people, and nation. “Yeshua” is of course delightfully acceptable to him, when it is not used as an exclusionary name. Love edifies)., 6. (NOTE) (Revelation 3:12)., [of Hebrew origin (H3442 as the shortened form of H3091)], KJV: Jesus, Root(s): H3442, See also: H3091


Root word of Jesus” is word #H3442 יֵשׁוַּע Yeshuwa` (yay-shoo'-ah) n/l., 1. he will save., 2. Jeshua, the name of ten Israelites, also of a place in Israel., [for H3091], KJV: Jeshua. , Root(s): H3091



Root word of Jesus” is word #H3091 יְהוֹשׁוּעַ YhowShuw`a (yeh-ho-shoo'-ah) n/p., יְהוֹשֻׁעַ YhowShu`a (yeh-ho-shoo'-ah), 1. Yahweh-saved.2. Jehoshua (i.e. Joshua), the Jewish leader., [from H3068 and H3467], KJV: Jehoshua, Jehoshuah, Joshua., Root(s): H3068, H3467, Compare: H1954, H3442

wish leader., [from H3068 and H3467], KJV: Jehoshua, Jehoshuah, Joshua., Root(s): H3068, H3467, Compare: H1954, H3442


Talmud - Mas. Yoma 39b
His brethren [that year] the priests forbore to mention the Ineffable Name (YHWH) in pronouncing the [priestly] blessing.4 Our Rabbis taught: During the last forty years before the destruction of the Temple the lot [‘For the Lord’] did not come up in the right hand; nor did the crimson-coloured strap become white/"


Numbers 6:23-27, "Speak to Aaron and his sons, saying; This is how you are to bless the children of Israyl. Say to them; YHWH BLESS YOU AND KEEP YOU. YHWH MAKE HIS FACE SHINE UPON YOU AND BE MERCIFUL TO YOU. YHWH LIFT UP HIS COUNTENANCE UPON YOU, AND GIVE YOU PEACE. So they will put MY NAME on the children of Israyl, and I will bless them."


Jeremiah 2:8, "The priests did not ask; Where is YHWH? Those who deal with the Law did not know Me! The pastors also transgressed against Me, and the prophets prophesied in the name of Baal, and walked after things of worthlessness"
the pharisee type forbade using the Nme YHWH, thus "יֵשׁוַּע Yeshuwa" was used.



However I have a hard time believeing the Messiah followed the precepts of the pharisee types:

John 5:43, "I have come in My Father's Name, but you do not follow Me. Let another come in his own name; him you will follow."


Mattithyah 23:39, "For I say to you: From this moment you will not see Me, until you say: Blessed is He Who comes in the Name of YHWH!"


Psalms 118:26, "Blessed is He who is coming in the Name of יהוה! We shall bless you from the House of יהוה."


YhowShuw`a, I simply ues a simplified form; Yahshua. I find it odd that people nitpick over this.

YHWH's Salvation.
Jesus name is derived from יְשׁוּעָ֑ה the feminine passive participle of the verb יָשַׁע. By dropping the ה and changing the יְ to יֶ, and by changing the accent from an atnah under the ayin ע֑ to a megeth under the vahv וּֽ we make it both masculine and active. Hence we have יֶשׁוּֽעַ , which is Jesus' Hebrew name. If you learn a little bit about Hebrew grammar and othography instead of cutting and pasting from concordances, which you obviously don't know how to use properly; you might spare yourself some embarassment.
 
Dec 14, 2017
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Some people act as if some things that God tells us is a suggestion,and not a commandment,and Jesus is God.

There is no difference between the Old and New Testament,for God lays down the covenant,and we obey the law.

Which law(s) are you referring to ... all 613 of them?


All 613 Commandments in the Old Testament Law of Moses
www.gods-word-first.org/bible-study/...
There are a whole lot more than only 10 Commandments found in the Old Testament, there are 613 Commandments! ... And every oblation of thy meat offering shalt thou season with salt; neither shalt thou suffer the salt of the covenant of thy God to be lacking from thy meat offering: with all thine offerings thou shalt offer salt.
 
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When the priest of a false religion that worships mary and dead saints consecrates bread and wine they become the Body and Blood of Christ?

You would think they would be drawn out of that false religion and towards the True the moment they take communion. If it were, in fact, transubstantiation.

Wow! Didn't anyone pay attention to what Jesus Himself said at His last supper? What do you suppose Jesus MEANT by "This IS my body?" Something OTHER THAN what He SAID?


New International Version
and when he had given thanks, he broke it and said, "This is my body, which is for you; do this in remembrance of me."

New Living Translation
and gave thanks to God for it. Then he broke it in pieces and said, "This is my body, which is given for you. Do this to remember me."

English Standard Version
and when he had given thanks, he broke it, and said, “This is my body, which is for you. Do this in remembrance of me.”

Berean Study Bible
and when He had given thanks, He broke it and said, "This is My body, which is for you; do this in remembrance of Me."

Berean Literal Bible
and having given thanks, He broke it and said, "This is My body, which is for you; do this in remembrance of Me."

New American Standard Bible
and when He had given thanks, He broke it and said, "This is My body, which is for you; do this in remembrance of Me."

King James Bible
And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
gave thanks, broke it, and said, "This is My body, which is for you. Do this in remembrance of Me."

International Standard Version
gave thanks for it, and broke it in pieces, saying, "This is my body that is for you. Keep doing this in memory of me."

NET Bible
and after he had given thanks he broke it and said, "This is my body, which is for you. Do this in remembrance of me."

New Heart English Bible
When he had given thanks, he broke it, and said, "This is my body, which is for you. Do this in memory of me."

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
And he blessed and he broke and he said, “Take eat; this is my body, which is broken for your persons; thus you shall do for my Memorial.

GOD'S WORD® Translation
and spoke a prayer of thanksgiving. He broke the bread and said, "This is my body, which is given for you. Do this to remember me."

New American Standard 1977
and when He had given thanks, He broke it, and said, “This is My body, which is for you; do this in remembrance of Me.”

Jubilee Bible 2000
and when he had given thanks, he broke it and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you; this do in remembrance of me.

King James 2000 Bible
And when he had given thanks, he broke it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.

American King James Version
And when he had given thanks, he broke it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.

American Standard Version
and when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, This is my body, which is for you: this do in remembrance of me.

Douay-Rheims Bible
And giving thanks, broke, and said: Take ye, and eat: this is my body, which shall be delivered for you: this do for the commemoration of me.

Darby Bible Translation
and having given thanks broke [it], and said, This is my body, which [is] for you: this do in remembrance of me.

English Revised Version
and when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, This is my body, which is for you: this do in remembrance of me.

Webster's Bible Translation
And when he had given thanks, he broke it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.

Weymouth New Testament
and after giving thanks He broke it and said, "This is my body which is about to be broken for you. Do this in memory of me."

World English Bible
When he had given thanks, he broke it, and said, "Take, eat. This is my body, which is broken for you. Do this in memory of me."

Young's Literal Translation
and having given thanks, he brake, and said, 'Take ye, eat ye, this is my body, that for you is being broken; this do ye -- to the remembrance of me.'
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
Jesus name is derived from יְשׁוּעָ֑ה the feminine passive participle of the verb יָשַׁע. By dropping the ה and changing the יְ to יֶ, and by changing the accent from an atnah under the ayin ע֑ to a megeth under the vahv וּֽ we make it both masculine and active. Hence we have יֶשׁוּֽעַ , which is Jesus' Hebrew name. If you learn a little bit about Hebrew grammar and othography instead of cutting and pasting from concordances, which you obviously don't know how to use properly; you might spare yourself some embarassment.
I am not embarrased, in the post you quoted both names were sohown, Yeshua and Yahushua, Yeshua was commonly used after 586 BCE because a pharisee ban on the name YHWH. Bfore that Yahushua was used. Since ther Messiah came in His Father's name I dont think He came in a name that removed the YHWH at the command of the pharisee types... but to each their own.

Also can you quote any ancient manuscript that uses Yeshua? Because there are hebrew versions of NT books that use:

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהושוע[/FONT]