The politics of Gay rights.

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K

kaylagrl

Guest
While I'm one on the other side of the debate, or other side of the anti, I observe that many Christians seem concerned with problems, and focusing on problems, and how it is a problem, and how it is causing a problem.

So what is your personal solution to homosexuality? Or is it just about highlighting a problem, that is a problem based on your perception of the problem?

It's very easy to focus on problems, and make problems. It's another thing making solutions.

If the problem of the homosexuality, is that the problem is getting bigger, what is your solution to making it smaller?

Some tangible and sensible answers would be nice.


​There's a song a Christian singer sings that says "the answer is Jesus,period".
 

Dude653

Senior Member
Mar 19, 2011
12,348
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God commanded mankind to be fruitful and multiply. Can any homosexuals obey that command without surgical intervention today?
So everyone who doesn't multiply is wrong? Not everyone wants kids
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
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The SOLUTION to homosexuality ... is to CORRECT
the nutritional deficiencies that TRIGGER HOMOSEXUALITY!
I previously posted evidence of that on this very thread!

there was no evidence for this that you posted,
just someone giving there view about hair samples.


There is no way homosexuality is caused by [nutrition deficiencies]
of the mother, or the child.
 
T

toinena

Guest
How do we love the gays without judging them, but to correct and guide them away from their sinful ways?

Do we pray, do we confront them or do we just let them be the masters of their own lives?
 

Dude653

Senior Member
Mar 19, 2011
12,348
1,045
113
How do we love the gays without judging them, but to correct and guide them away from their sinful ways?

Do we pray, do we confront them or do we just let them be the masters of their own lives?
I don't get bent out of shape when people are doing things I disagree with because I understand that I can't control everything.
Most Christian seem to want control over every aspect of society and if they can't have that control they think they're being persecuted
 

Dude653

Senior Member
Mar 19, 2011
12,348
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Side note... try living in Egypt or Christians are actually being beheaded... but waaah we're we're so persecuted
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
So everyone who doesn't multiply is wrong? Not everyone wants kids



I've heard this stupid argument used too. Its not a matter of not wanting kids,or not being able to have kids.Its a matter of we were created to have children,our bodies were made for each other. God made man and women to have relations together.Not man on man,or woman on woman. And He was serious about it.

"If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them."


Now,we are living under grace,but that does not mean we accept perversion as normal. Read the post I shared with the stats. Homosexual marriage is about breaking down the traditional family.And I believe that is the whole purpose.


 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
How do we love the gays without judging them, but to correct and guide them away from their sinful ways?

Do we pray, do we confront them or do we just let them be the masters of their own lives?

God has judged homosexuality as wrong,not me. So if I tell someone what they are doing is sin,that is not judging them,that is telling them the truth. People are so PC brainwashed these days they are scared to death to offend anyone,except God.

Ive told before the story of when we were in ministry.My father is an evangelist and one night he began preaching on how homosexuality was sin that would lead to death. He moved on and it seemed rather odd that he just added that admonishment. Well a young man was there that was gay and he was headed for surgery to get a sex change. He came forward and gave his heart to the Lord. The people in the church had been praying that he would come. He told my father later that he didn't know that homosexuality was a sin and he was no longer going to have the surgery.The last we heard he was still in church and serving the Lord. People want to make it complicated because they don't want to be seen as a bigot,they don't want the worlds disapproval. They'd rather have the worlds approval that Gods disapproval. The lower the church goes,the further down the world goes. We are to be salt and light and thats not going to get us a pat on the back from the world.
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
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Originally Posted by Adstar
So if a pedophile dad wants to marry his 5 year old daughter
it is discrimination to take a stand against that in your book...

False equivalency
That's why we have statutory rape laws
Get Ready:people Are Trying to Normalize Pedophilia now

A major argument of the homosexual lobby is that same-sex attraction is genetically
determined—that people are born homosexual. Because that is the case, the argument
follows, then if you say homosexuality is wrong, you are as hateful and bigoted as if
you were condemning someone for their skin color.

Homosexual activists decry any effort to change someone’s sexual orientation as
morally reprehensible (reprehensible, that is, if it is a change toward heterosexuality
—I have never heard them argue that it would be wrong to persuade a heterosexual
to become homosexual). After all, how can you try to change someone from his genetic
destiny? They believe that the morally right thing is a full, unrestricted expression of
that supposed inborn tendency.

Well, if genetics do determine morality, that notion has some serious implications

Today’s homosexual special interest juggernaut started as a small movement. Now, there
is another small movement that is growing stronger—a movement that wants to extend
this same kind of morality-is-genetic argument to a new group of people: pedophiles.
People who are sexually attracted to children.

Michael L. Brown, author of the book A Queer Thing Happened to America, wrote this
in the Christian Post: “ome psychiatric leaders who were instrumental in removing
homosexuality from the American Psychiatric Association’s list of mental disorders
in 1973 have been fighting to remove pedophilia as a disorder as well, not to justify
the abuse of children but rather to say that being sexually attracted to children is not
a mental disorder” (September 28).
https://www.amazon.com/Queer-Thing-...=8-1&keywords=queer+thing+happened+to+america

-
“Many Researchers Taking a Different View of Pedophilia” the Los Angeles Times
reported on Jan. 14, 2013. “Pedophilia once was thought to stem from psychological
influences early in life. Now, many experts view it as a deep-rooted predisposition
that does not change.”
Many researchers taking a different view of pedophilia - latimes

“Scientists at the [Center for Mental Health and Addiction in Toronto] have uncovered
a series of associations that suggest pedophilia has biological roots,” the Times reports,
adding that more and more people are taking the view that pedophilia is “a sexual orientation
as immutable as heterosexuality or homosexuality.” It quotes a man who was arrested for
child pornography saying that a court ordered him to go to therapy. “‘These people felt they
could snuff out the desire, or shame me into denying it existed,’ he said. ‘But it’s as intrinsic
as the next person’s heterosexuality.’”

In his book, Michael Brown documents how the main arguments that have successfully
normalized homosexuality are now supporting the normalization of pedophilia.
The Christian Post report lists eight of them:

1) Pedophilia is innate and immutable; people are born this way and cannot change.

2) Pederasty is richly attested in many different cultures throughout history.

3) The claim that adult-child sexual relationships cause harm is greatly overstated
and often completely inaccurate.

4) Consensual adult-child sex can actually be beneficial to the child.

5) Pederasty should not be classified as a mental disorder, since it does not cause distress
to the pederast to have these desires and since the pederast can function as a normal,
contributing member of society.

6) Many of the illustrious homosexuals of the past were actually pedophiles.

7) People are against inter-generational intimacy because of antiquated social standards
and puritanical sexual phobias.

8) This is all about love and equality and liberation.

Look again at each of those arguments and replace pedophilia or pederasty with homosexuality.
This is exactly the line of reasoning that has successfully normalized and vaunted homosexuals.

You might think, That practice could never become legal, let alone popular. But in 2005, how many
people thought they’d ever see the White House bathed in the colors of the homosexual flag?

With pedophilia, however, there is a twist to the argument. It isn’t simply, We’re born this way,
so don’t judge us. They add this: And don’t worry—we’re not a threat to your children.

This is the argument that appeared in a September 21 Salon.com article headlined,
“I’m a Pedophile, But Not a Monster.” The author, a man named Todd Nickerson, wrote:

I’ve been stuck with the most unfortunate of sexual orientations, a preference for a group of
people who are legally, morally and psychologically unable to reciprocate my feelings and desires.
..Yet, I’m not the monster you think me to be. I’ve never touched a child sexually in my life and
never will, nor do I use child pornography.

-
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
5,977
400
83
63
In still another example, this past Sunday’s edition of British paper the Independent contained an article by a prominent psychologist, Dr. Glenn Wilson. The title: “Not All Pedophiles Are Bad People—We Need to Have a Sense of Proportion.” The article reads:
Not all paedophiles are bad people - we need to have a sense of proportion | The Independent

In my studies of the Pedophile Information Exchange in the 1980s, many members admitted sexual feelings for children which they had been able to contain or turn to social good. Some gravitated toward occupations such as schoolteacher or social worker, where they could enjoy the company of children without plotting abuse. … It is possible to be attracted to children as a sexual orientation without acting upon those desires.

So—in this man’s view, these feelings can apparently be turned to social good. This psychologist
spoke to the Telegraph, and said that “pedophilia should be viewed as a type of ‘sexual orientation’
which is not necessarily acted upon” (emphasis added).

Ask yourself: Does the idea that pedophiles won’t necessarily act on their desire to have sex
with children comfort you? Would you support a pedophile who wants to be your child’s teacher
or social worker so he can “enjoy the company of children”?
Does it reassure you that “it is possible” to be attracted to children without acting on that?

This Salon.com article is aimed at helping you sympathize with a celibate man who
is attracted to children. But even he says that anyone who acts on those feelings is
a “monster.” The psychologist in Britain says everything is OK because pedophiles
probably won’t prey on children.

But think about this: If genetics determine morality, then why would it be wrong
for a pedophile to gratify his desires?

How does it make sense to label a “born that way” pedophile who fulfills his desires
a “monster”—but then to say that a “born that way” homosexual should fulfill his
desires and even marry, because he was “born that way”?

Add to that the “pedophilia epidemic” in Hollywood, exposed this past summer
in the film An Open Secret. These are people with enormous social influence.

You can’t have it both ways. Either genetics determines morality or it doesn’t.
And the truth is—it doesn’t.

Hollywood’s Pedophilia Epidemic Exposed in ‘An Open Secret’
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...hilia-epidemic-exposed-in-an-open-secret.html#

Many researchers taking a different view of pedophilia - latimes

As Selwyn Duke recently wrote,

Today, mainly due to the effort to legitimize homosexuality, the notion that “it’s okay if I was born that way” has taken hold. Often articulated as “God doesn’t make mistakes,” it’s rhetorically very effective.
Of course, whether an atheist who considers the world naturally flawed or a theist believing it supernaturally fallen, cleft lip, Spina bifida, Down syndrome, club foot, Tay-Sachs disease, and other abnormalities make clear that God’s perfection isn’t enjoyed by man. And is it logical to consider the brain the one organ immune from this imperfection? Note also that the same psychologists telling us homosexuality is innate also say that psychopaths are born and not made. Now, if some people were born with homicidal instincts, would it be alright for them to commit murder?

In truth, if it is wrong to condone pedophilia despite some people supposedly being born
with it, then it is also wrong to justify homosexuality for that reason.

Get Ready:people Are Trying to Normalize Pedophilia now
https://www.thetrumpet.com/article/13207.2.0.0/get-ready-people-are-trying-to-normalize-pedophilia
 
Last edited:
K

kaylagrl

Guest
Side note... try living in Egypt or Christians are actually being beheaded... but waaah we're we're so persecuted
You know Dude persecution starts slowly. And this is what American Christians are saying. First God was taken out of the schools,we let that slide. Then God was taken out of public places,the ten commandments and nativity scenes,we let that slide.Then people were told if they say Merry Christmas that was offensive so we need to say happy holidays,we let that slide. Now we need to accept transgender bathrooms,homosexuality,and we can't say he or she. No,no one is being beheaded,it hasn't gotten that bad yet. But we inch our way along until we have a Godless society where Christians are not free to speak his name.I have many missionary friends and some in Muslim countries where it is so dangerous they cannot each their own children the Gospel for fear they may get caught and have their child taken away. It happens step by step.
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
Thank you for the rep. And I want you to know that no matter what people say,how dark it seems,Jesus still saves.And that is why it is so important to share the truth in love. There is a way that you can share the truth with anyone and still let that person know you love them.The Bible says that His Word does not return void and we have to stand on that and believe it. We were all headed for death due to sin one time until someone shared the truth with us and we believed.

I can tell you story after story of loved ones,friends and people Ive met in ministry that came to the Lord that we just never thought possible. My mothers brother accepted the Lord when he was on his deathbed,literally. It is never too late and we must never give up hope. God can break the chains and deliver the lost from bondage. But we must share the truth for them to see the light. Be blessed and do not stop believing your son will come.

 

Dude653

Senior Member
Mar 19, 2011
12,348
1,045
113
You know Dude persecution starts slowly. And this is what American Christians are saying. First God was taken out of the schools,we let that slide. Then God was taken out of public places,the ten commandments and nativity scenes,we let that slide.Then people were told if they say Merry Christmas that was offensive so we need to say happy holidays,we let that slide. Now we need to accept transgender bathrooms,homosexuality,and we can't say he or she. No,no one is being beheaded,it hasn't gotten that bad yet. But we inch our way along until we have a Godless society where Christians are not free to speak his name.I have many missionary friends and some in Muslim countries where it is so dangerous they cannot each their own children the Gospel for fear they may get caught and have their child taken away. It happens step by step.
Religion doesn't belong in schools.
That's to be taught at home.
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
Religion doesn't belong in schools.
That's to be taught at home.

If we can teach kids sex ed they can handle religion. And if others want to teach their religion,thats fine by me with one stipulation,Christianity must be allowed to be taught in their schools in their own countries.
 
S

Society

Guest
Originally Posted by Adstar
So if a pedophile dad wants to marry his 5 year old daughter
it is discrimination to take a stand against that in your book...



Get Ready:people Are Trying to Normalize Pedophilia now

A major argument of the homosexual lobby is that same-sex attraction is genetically
determined—that people are born homosexual. Because that is the case, the argument
follows, then if you say homosexuality is wrong, you are as hateful and bigoted as if
you were condemning someone for their skin color.

Homosexual activists decry any effort to change someone’s sexual orientation as
morally reprehensible (reprehensible, that is, if it is a change toward heterosexuality
—I have never heard them argue that it would be wrong to persuade a heterosexual
to become homosexual). After all, how can you try to change someone from his genetic
destiny? They believe that the morally right thing is a full, unrestricted expression of
that supposed inborn tendency.

Well, if genetics do determine morality, that notion has some serious implications

Today’s homosexual special interest juggernaut started as a small movement. Now, there
is another small movement that is growing stronger—a movement that wants to extend
this same kind of morality-is-genetic argument to a new group of people: pedophiles.
People who are sexually attracted to children.

Michael L. Brown, author of the book A Queer Thing Happened to America, wrote this
in the Christian Post: “ome psychiatric leaders who were instrumental in removing
homosexuality from the American Psychiatric Association’s list of mental disorders
in 1973 have been fighting to remove pedophilia as a disorder as well, not to justify
the abuse of children but rather to say that being sexually attracted to children is not
a mental disorder” (September 28).
https://www.amazon.com/Queer-Thing-...=8-1&keywords=queer+thing+happened+to+america

-
“Many Researchers Taking a Different View of Pedophilia” the Los Angeles Times
reported on Jan. 14, 2013. “Pedophilia once was thought to stem from psychological
influences early in life. Now, many experts view it as a deep-rooted predisposition
that does not change.”
Many researchers taking a different view of pedophilia - latimes

“Scientists at the [Center for Mental Health and Addiction in Toronto] have uncovered
a series of associations that suggest pedophilia has biological roots,” the Times reports,
adding that more and more people are taking the view that pedophilia is “a sexual orientation
as immutable as heterosexuality or homosexuality.” It quotes a man who was arrested for
child pornography saying that a court ordered him to go to therapy. “‘These people felt they
could snuff out the desire, or shame me into denying it existed,’ he said. ‘But it’s as intrinsic
as the next person’s heterosexuality.’”

In his book, Michael Brown documents how the main arguments that have successfully
normalized homosexuality are now supporting the normalization of pedophilia.
The Christian Post report lists eight of them:

1) Pedophilia is innate and immutable; people are born this way and cannot change.

2) Pederasty is richly attested in many different cultures throughout history.

3) The claim that adult-child sexual relationships cause harm is greatly overstated
and often completely inaccurate.

4) Consensual adult-child sex can actually be beneficial to the child.

5) Pederasty should not be classified as a mental disorder, since it does not cause distress
to the pederast to have these desires and since the pederast can function as a normal,
contributing member of society.

6) Many of the illustrious homosexuals of the past were actually pedophiles.

7) People are against inter-generational intimacy because of antiquated social standards
and puritanical sexual phobias.

8) This is all about love and equality and liberation.

Look again at each of those arguments and replace pedophilia or pederasty with homosexuality.
This is exactly the line of reasoning that has successfully normalized and vaunted homosexuals.

You might think, That practice could never become legal, let alone popular. But in 2005, how many
people thought they’d ever see the White House bathed in the colors of the homosexual flag?

With pedophilia, however, there is a twist to the argument. It isn’t simply, We’re born this way,
so don’t judge us. They add this: And don’t worry—we’re not a threat to your children.

This is the argument that appeared in a September 21 Salon.com article headlined,
“I’m a Pedophile, But Not a Monster.” The author, a man named Todd Nickerson, wrote:

I’ve been stuck with the most unfortunate of sexual orientations, a preference for a group of
people who are legally, morally and psychologically unable to reciprocate my feelings and desires.
..Yet, I’m not the monster you think me to be. I’ve never touched a child sexually in my life and
never will, nor do I use child pornography.

-


There needs to be a new logical fallacy for right wing Christians who equate sexually abusing children with same sex attraction. Oh wait, there is:

https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Poisoning_the_well

and

https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Balance_fallacy#False_equivalence

The scientific studies on this issue merely say pedophilia may be rooted in neurological disorders and not solely a result of environment. It doesn't say it's okay.

But then, that would require you actually reading.

Michael L. Brown has a doctorate in theology, not sociology, biology or political science so his opinion is worthless in the issue of gay rights, pedophilia or biology.
 
S

Society

Guest
You know Dude persecution starts slowly. And this is what American Christians are saying. First God was taken out of the schools,we let that slide. Then God was taken out of public places,the ten commandments and nativity scenes,we let that slide.Then people were told if they say Merry Christmas that was offensive so we need to say happy holidays,we let that slide. Now we need to accept transgender bathrooms,homosexuality,and we can't say he or she. No,no one is being beheaded,it hasn't gotten that bad yet. But we inch our way along until we have a Godless society where Christians are not free to speak his name.I have many missionary friends and some in Muslim countries where it is so dangerous they cannot each their own children the Gospel for fear they may get caught and have their child taken away. It happens step by step.

"I am persecuted, because I cannot force society to conform to my beliefs against their will."
 

Dude653

Senior Member
Mar 19, 2011
12,348
1,045
113
You know why it's dangerous to teach Christianity in Muslim countries?
Because they are Theocratic governments. A secular law system protects everyone's rights
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
5,977
400
83
63
You know why it's dangerous to teach Christianity in Muslim countries?
Because they are Theocratic governments. A secular law system protects everyone's rights
you mean like the laws that a woman has no rights in several muslim countries,
like some can not even show there faces uncovered in public?