Not By Works

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Locutus

Locutus

Senior Member
#53,102
Feb 10, 2017
5,928
685
113
#53,102
Another major Peterism is "ofcourse" (no space) this is a physical marker/oddity with Pete the Chaptist, which he can't avoid without conscious effort - the f and c lie next to one another on the keyboard.


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stonesoffire

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
#53,103
Nov 24, 2013
10,665
1,829
113
#53,103
Ralph- said:
It's true that the law can not cancel sin in a person. But that's hardly an excuse to not cancel sin at all, and that it is okay if you don't because of 'once saved always saved', and 'that would be works if you tried'.

Sin is canceled in a person's behavior by submitting to the Holy Spirit. The problem seems to be in getting believers to know they have to do that as an obligation to the Spirit, and teaching them how to do it.

I have found that Christian growth seems to be about God getting us to WANT to cancel our sin-having our minds changed about sin. And so it is true what Paul says,"We must go through many hardships to enter the kingdom of God"-Acts 14:22. We go through many hardships and beatings before we get convinced that we need to start submitting to the power of God in us to stop sinning. This pattern of growing up shows we really do have the Holy Spirit inside of us in salvation.
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and you miss His love this way. Bitterness is a result of law Ralph. For that is still what you labor under. The kingdom of God is given to us on the inside. And He works in us from the inside out, not the other way around.

We go through hardships and trials only only because of our testimony of Jesus, for the enemy hates Him. It's not so much us, but wants to destroy Jesus in us. And uses people and law.

The joy,of the Lord will keep us in any problem, when our center has been full of seeing Him as He is. And that takes intimacy with Holy Spirit. He alone is our freedom. And time is not an issue with God. He's patient with us more than we are with others.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#53,105
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,402
113
#53,105
joefizz said:
(sends 100 baby grand pianos to D's address)
There D paid in full!
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You forgot the "mob style" interest rates of 300% compounded hourly.....we need your first born son, your dog, two cats, left arm and your car with the trunk full of cash.......
 
J

joefizz

Guest
#53,106
#53,106
dcontroversal said:
You forgot the "mob style" interest rates of 300% compounded hourly.....we need your first born son, your dog, two cats, left arm and your car with the trunk full of cash.......
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How about The Sims game,(which contains my first born children,a dog and 2 cats),Grand theft auto games(that contain at least 50 cars and lots of money)and the left arm of exodia the forbidden!?(which is worth as much as a trunk full of cash with all four other cards)
 
N

NoNameMcgee

Guest
#53,108
#53,108
joefizz said:
Are you sure,I never do much hear the audience,I see lots of posters though,figured people ought to know they are "still there".
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wait....

what do you mean?


do you mean a group outside of CC views all the posts?
 
7777pinacled

7777pinacled

Banned
#53,111
Dec 4, 2017
906
35
0
#53,111
stonesoffire said:
and you miss His love this way. Bitterness is a result of law Ralph. For that is still what you labor under. The kingdom of God is given to us on the inside. And He works in us from the inside out, not the other way around.

We go through hardships and trials only only because of our testimony of Jesus, for the enemy hates Him. It's not so much us, but wants to destroy Jesus in us. And uses people and law.

The joy,of the Lord will keep us in any problem, when our center has been full of seeing Him as He is. And that takes intimacy with Holy Spirit. He alone is our freedom. And time is not an issue with God. He's patient with us more than we are with others.
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Bringing us closer every day, i believe it is the same intimacy the Lord provides in a schoolmaster while being cleansed through the Holy Spirit in that the Counselor will always remind you of our Lord and Savior.

Something that saul(paul) spoke of as the letter of the law kills.
Today i was given into a though of this while leaning on the Lord in the spirit of understanding.

While peering at the letter a person is closely examining a part of something that they just cant quite make out with their eyes.
Till someone comes along and ask them.
"Why are you looking from there.
"Step back for a moment so that you can see the whole picture.
 
J

joefizz

Guest
#53,112
#53,112
NoNameMcgee said:
thats originally what i thought you meant

i was making sure

thanks for clearin that up
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You are quite welcome,now anyone know what we are talking about in this thread again? hahaha hahaha.
 
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E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#53,114
#53,114
joefizz said:
You mean we don't have to speculate and overanalyze to figure this out?
Awesome!
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It is hard to figure out. The op says “Not by works” and if you read the first post.

Well here, Lets look at that first. Not just take my word for it (in case I would be accused of lying)
dcontroversal said:
It does not get any plainer..........Our righteous works have ZERO to do with Salvation!

English Standard Version
he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,

Berean Study Bible
He saved us, not by the righteous deeds we had done, but according to His mercy, through the washing of new birth and renewal by the Holy Spirit.

Berean Literal Bible
He saved us, not by works in righteousness that we did, but according to His mercy, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit,

New American Standard Bible
He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,

King James Bible
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
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And although that post got 52 likes. It seems it has also garnered enough hates that we now are on page 2656 and on post number 53114 (if no one posts between you and I) and people are still saying the op is about works in general NOT works for salvation.

even though the op specifically says, this post is about works which people ar doing to EARN salvation. Not works of sanctification or christian growth.


 
V

valleyofdecision

Guest
#53,115
#53,115
Budman said:
Name a good work that a Christian does that an unbeliever can't do, Ralph.

(Matthew 7:24)
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An Atheist dresses up as a clown and goes to the Children's cancer hospital to cheer up kids going through Chemo therapy.

A youth pastor dresses up as a clown and goes to the Children's cancer hospital to cheer up kids going through Chemo therapy.

A believer, visiting his child with cancer helps his sick child encourage the other kids and their families. they both also pray for other kids and their families if they want a prayer. When things get tough and sad for others they shade those going through the hard time with their own shield of faith. At home the Believe continues praying for all those kids and families. WHen his child dies from cancer, he goes back to the cancer ward and shares how at peace his child and their friend was with their death and he shares the peace that passes understanding.

At Judgment the Atheist will come to Jesus and say, I spent 5 years dressing as clown. I cheered up kids with cancer. I made them laugh. I saved some of them. I was thanked. I.....

At Judgment the Youth Pastor will come to Jesus and say, I spent 5 years dressing as clown. I cheered up kids with cancer. I made them laugh. I saved some of them. I was thanked. I....

At Judgment the believer will join his child and Jesus will say, I was sick and you came and saw me, enter in my good and faithful servant.

To the world and the church they all did a good work. The differentiation then becomes what was the motive for doing the good work and who it brought glory and honor to.

A unbelievers and a religious workers motivation for doing good in the world is not remotely even close to what motivates a believer to do good works.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#53,116
#53,116
valleyofdecision said:
An Atheist dresses up as a clown and goes to the Children's cancer hospital to cheer up kids going through Chemo therapy.

A youth pastor dresses up as a clown and goes to the Children's cancer hospital to cheer up kids going through Chemo therapy.

A believer, visiting his child with cancer helps his sick child encourage the other kids and their families. they both also pray for other kids and their families if they want a prayer. When things get tough and sad for others they shade those going through the hard time with their own shield of faith. At home the Believe continues praying for all those kids and families. WHen his child dies from cancer, he goes back to the cancer ward and shares how at peace his child and their friend was with their death and he shares the peace that passes understanding.

At Judgment the Atheist will come to Jesus and say, I spent 5 years dressing as clown. I cheered up kids with cancer. I made them laugh. I saved some of them. I was thanked. I.....

At Judgment the Youth Pastor will come to Jesus and say, I spent 5 years dressing as clown. I cheered up kids with cancer. I made them laugh. I saved some of them. I was thanked. I....

At Judgment the believer will join his child and Jesus will say, I was sick and you came and saw me, enter in my good and faithful servant.

To the world and the church they all did a good work. The differentiation then becomes what was the motive for doing the good work and who it brought glory and honor to.

A unbelievers and a religious workers motivation for doing good in the world is not remotely even close to what motivates a believer to do good works.
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I love this, if I may I would change on thing, Not that it makes what you said any btetter, I am just thinking out load.

the believer will join his child. And when Jesus asks why he should be let in, The believer says I can not offer a reason. I am guilty as charged, I deserve judgment, all I have is the hope you offered me of eternal life.So I am at your mercy.
 
BillG

BillG

Senior Member
#53,117
Feb 15, 2017
9,022
4,441
113
#53,117
eternally-gratefull said:

ie, If peter believes them they are not lies, because many believe as he does (although I have not found many to believe most of what he says, ) (the reason I call him peter, is because he is the only one in my life I have ever heard make these same arguments.

It does not matter if MANY believe other views.. According to this, If many belief, then it MUST BE TRUE.

in a nutshell, Peter is now supporting universalism, because all we need to have a belief become truth is many believe.
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Setting LLH aside here are my thoughts. Thoughts that I have posted before LLH started posting.

If a person has a belief that they walk in, then to them it's true.

Case being this thread.

How many of us had the belief that works save us?
How many of us had the belief that we must be sinless in order to be saved?
How many of us had the belief that we must work hard and be sinless in order to be loved by God?

If that was true of any of us what happened?

Notice I said "that was"

We had beliefs that were true but no longer are.

Now what was thought to be truth has been revealed as a lie.
Now that lie had been replaced with the truth.

Works do not save.
We stumble.
We seek God.
He loves us, on account of him and his nature.

As I said, lies revealed, truth then repaces lies.

That is why we must stand for the truth and bang on about it.
If people have been lied to then we must walk with them.

At some point it will become evident they have no desire to learn (side note they will say the same)
Then a call needs to be made as to whether we stop engaging or carry on.
 
BillG

BillG

Senior Member
#53,119
Feb 15, 2017
9,022
4,441
113
#53,119
dcontroversal said:
You forgot the "mob style" interest rates of 300% compounded hourly.....we need your first born son, your dog, two cats, left arm and your car with the trunk full of cash.......
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Wow your cheap.
I charge 300% compound per minute.
I insist you cease doing it. You could put me out of business.
Then I would have to lay off 500 wolves, sorry mean loan sharks
 
V

valleyofdecision

Guest
#53,120
#53,120
eternally-gratefull said:
I love this, if I may I would change on thing, Not that it makes what you said any btetter, I am just thinking out load.

the believer will join his child. And when Jesus asks why he should be let in, The believer says I can not offer a reason. I am guilty as charged, I deserve judgment, all I have is the hope you offered me of eternal life.So I am at your mercy.
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Consider this thought about what you added.

Maybe Jesus did not need to hear the believer say all that, because he "knew" the believer and the believer also knew Jesus and knew there is no condemnation to those in Christ Jesus and knew he was worthy to enter in because of the lamb who was slain and only because of the lamb who was slain.
 
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