Not By Works
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Sure, I can try. 
[the pace of this thread is much too fast, I'm falling so far behind and cannot keep up! lol]
The CONTEXT of 1Cor9 is in an entire section (chpts 9-13, at least, or even the entire epistle, actually) where Paul is vindicating his APOSTLESHIP, and that verse (you put) is in a chpt that STARTS OUT with:
1 Am I not free? Am I not an apostle? Have I not seen Jesus our Lord? Are you yourselves not my workmanship in the Lord? 2 Even if I am not an apostle to others, surely I am to you. For you are the seal of my apostleship in the Lord.
3 This is my defense to those who scrutinize me: 4 Have we no right to food and to drink? 5 Have we no right to take along a believing wife, as do the other apostles and the Lord’s brothers and Cephas? 6 Or are Barnabas and I the only apostles who must work for a living?
7 Who serves as a soldier at his own expense? Who plants a vineyard and does not eat of its fruit? Who tends a flock and does not drink of its milk?
8 Do I say this from a human perspective? Doesn’t the Law say the same thing? 9 For it is written in the Law of Moses: “Do not muzzle an ox while it is treading out the grain.” Is it about oxen that God is concerned? 10 Isn’t He actually speaking on our behalf? Indeed, this was written for us, because when the plowman plows and the thresher threshes, they should also expect to share in the harvest.
11 If we have sown spiritual seed among you, is it too much for us to reap a material harvest from you? 12 If others have this right to your support, shouldn’t we have it all the more? But we did not exercise this right. Instead, we put up with anything rather than hinder the gospel of Christ.
[note that last verse, in the bold... HERE is the crux of this context, and the verse you put forth]
[the pace of this thread is much too fast, I'm falling so far behind and cannot keep up! lol]The CONTEXT of 1Cor9 is in an entire section (chpts 9-13, at least, or even the entire epistle, actually) where Paul is vindicating his APOSTLESHIP, and that verse (you put) is in a chpt that STARTS OUT with:
1 Am I not free? Am I not an apostle? Have I not seen Jesus our Lord? Are you yourselves not my workmanship in the Lord? 2 Even if I am not an apostle to others, surely I am to you. For you are the seal of my apostleship in the Lord.
3 This is my defense to those who scrutinize me: 4 Have we no right to food and to drink? 5 Have we no right to take along a believing wife, as do the other apostles and the Lord’s brothers and Cephas? 6 Or are Barnabas and I the only apostles who must work for a living?
7 Who serves as a soldier at his own expense? Who plants a vineyard and does not eat of its fruit? Who tends a flock and does not drink of its milk?
8 Do I say this from a human perspective? Doesn’t the Law say the same thing? 9 For it is written in the Law of Moses: “Do not muzzle an ox while it is treading out the grain.” Is it about oxen that God is concerned? 10 Isn’t He actually speaking on our behalf? Indeed, this was written for us, because when the plowman plows and the thresher threshes, they should also expect to share in the harvest.
11 If we have sown spiritual seed among you, is it too much for us to reap a material harvest from you? 12 If others have this right to your support, shouldn’t we have it all the more? But we did not exercise this right. Instead, we put up with anything rather than hinder the gospel of Christ.
[note that last verse, in the bold... HERE is the crux of this context, and the verse you put forth]
Get rid of all bitterness, rage and anger, brawling and slander, along with every form of malice.
Ephesians 4:31-32
See to it that no one misses the grace of God and that no bitter root grows up to cause trouble and defile many.
Hebrews 12:15
God bless you
Rejoice in the Lord always. I will say it again: Rejoice!
Let your gentleness be evident to all. The Lord is near.
Do not be anxious about anything, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God.
Phil 4:4-6
Ephesians 4:31-32
See to it that no one misses the grace of God and that no bitter root grows up to cause trouble and defile many.
Hebrews 12:15
God bless you
Rejoice in the Lord always. I will say it again: Rejoice!
Let your gentleness be evident to all. The Lord is near.
Do not be anxious about anything, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God.
Phil 4:4-6
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Right, so why are you [seeming to be] using the verse you put forward (from THAT CONTEXT), as evidence for your "faith PLUS OBEDIENCE to be saved" doctrine?
Paul was not referring to "sins" in the last verse of that chapter (the verse you supplied), per context.
It is basically saying, no one will be willing to listen to someone who _______ [fill in the blank with anything that is not necessarily a "sin"--see verses 19-23, for better context--a "castaway" from those in his hearing, per this context]
Paul was not referring to "sins" in the last verse of that chapter (the verse you supplied), per context.
It is basically saying, no one will be willing to listen to someone who _______ [fill in the blank with anything that is not necessarily a "sin"--see verses 19-23, for better context--a "castaway" from those in his hearing, per this context]
Pentecostals emphasise the spiritual and feelings, which can easily be compromised and led astray
depending on the mood, unless one stays embedded in the word.
Reformed people are very bible focused and therefore obedient in their lives.
The debate about Holiness and our walk is as old as the church. As with all idealism, it can become
too judgemental, but its aspirations are right, if delivered in the power of the Holy Spirit and His fruit.
depending on the mood, unless one stays embedded in the word.
Reformed people are very bible focused and therefore obedient in their lives.
The debate about Holiness and our walk is as old as the church. As with all idealism, it can become
too judgemental, but its aspirations are right, if delivered in the power of the Holy Spirit and His fruit.
N
And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.
For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.
Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.
But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous
But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;
That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God
He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.
And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
He that hath the Son hath life; [and] he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.
These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.
I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
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How we stand
We are God's people, His Holy witness to His way, a city on a Hill showing His love and acceptance
is a dark lost world where love has turned into bitterness and hatred.
It teaches us to say "No" to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age,
while we wait for the blessed hope--the glorious appearing of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ,
who gave himself for us to redeem us from all wickedness and to purify for himself a people that are his very own, eager to do what is good.
Titus 2:12-14
For God, who said, "Let light shine out of darkness," made his light shine in our hearts to give us the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Christ.
But we have this treasure in jars of clay to show that this all-surpassing power is from God and not from us.
2 Cor 4:6-7
Therefore, as God's chosen people, holy and dearly loved, clothe yourselves with compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and patience.
Bear with each other and forgive whatever grievances you may have against one another. Forgive as the Lord forgave you.
And over all these virtues put on love, which binds them all together in perfect unity.
Col 3:12-14
It is by these things we show the work God can do in all those willing to repent,
have faith and follow Him, Amen.
We are God's people, His Holy witness to His way, a city on a Hill showing His love and acceptance
is a dark lost world where love has turned into bitterness and hatred.
It teaches us to say "No" to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age,
while we wait for the blessed hope--the glorious appearing of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ,
who gave himself for us to redeem us from all wickedness and to purify for himself a people that are his very own, eager to do what is good.
Titus 2:12-14
For God, who said, "Let light shine out of darkness," made his light shine in our hearts to give us the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Christ.
But we have this treasure in jars of clay to show that this all-surpassing power is from God and not from us.
2 Cor 4:6-7
Therefore, as God's chosen people, holy and dearly loved, clothe yourselves with compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and patience.
Bear with each other and forgive whatever grievances you may have against one another. Forgive as the Lord forgave you.
And over all these virtues put on love, which binds them all together in perfect unity.
Col 3:12-14
It is by these things we show the work God can do in all those willing to repent,
have faith and follow Him, Amen.
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Im not after him for saying we need to repent and walk righteous
He said he quit sinning. He dont sin no more. THATS what im going after. Seems to be a cultic person, disrespects even Luther (the guy who gave him the ability to have scriptures in english/german/french, whatever language besides latin, you know, got the reformation rolling).
He said he quit sinning. He dont sin no more. THATS what im going after. Seems to be a cultic person, disrespects even Luther (the guy who gave him the ability to have scriptures in english/german/french, whatever language besides latin, you know, got the reformation rolling).
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Pentecostals CLAIM faith alone, but they are not faith alone actually. Its persevere to the end to be saved. And depending on the brand, sometimes you have to speak in tongues to be saved too, often water baptized as well.
But I will grant you there might be some faith alone pentecostals out there, That movement cares so little for Scripture that you find all kinds of ideas there, depending on who you ask.
I said that because there might be things im doing that I dont even recognize are wrong.
But I will grant you there might be some faith alone pentecostals out there, That movement cares so little for Scripture that you find all kinds of ideas there, depending on who you ask.
I said that because there might be things im doing that I dont even recognize are wrong.
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